Jay76 Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Hi Folks, I'm converting my relatively small ISA from rapidly depreciating BOE notes into real money. Can anyone with experience of buying gold tell me if Bullionvault is a reputable company. I would hold physical gold, except the premium to be paid is a little too high IMHO. I'm sick of saving my hard earned money and getting less in an ISA than real world inflation of 8 - 12% IMO. Cheers Jamie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doahh Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 The last I heard no one from this board had actually gone to the vault that Bullion Vault uses and asked to be given their physical allocated gold so they could take it away. Other than that I apparently own a small amount but I have not as yet ever sold any and so don't really, really know for sure. In theory, as it is an allocated account, if Bullion Vault goes bust then the companies creditors do not have a right to your gold. You may need to go and arrange a new place to store it but it should, in theory, remain yours. The actual vault itself is not operated by Bullion Vault either and so I guess Via Mat, who do operate/own(?) the vault would not let any creditors in. Check out the Bullion Vault info page for more info: http://www.bullionvault.com/help/?FAQs/FAQs_vaulting.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Compounded Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Do yourself a favour. Pay watever premium and get britannias or sovereigns. Agree, get the asset in your hand otherwise a default can make it vanish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narco Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Do yourself a favour. Pay watever premium and get britannias or sovereigns. Do you think old Sovereigns and Britannias will be better than mint condition Krugerrands or Maples? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InternationalRockSuperstar Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Do you think old Sovereigns and Britannias will be better than mint condition Krugerrands or Maples? Doubt it. Britannias seem to go at quite a premium. It almost as if their value is made up of two components: 1) the gold content 2) the 'collectability' or whatever you want to call it. I can't see the 2nd component of their value holding up in a recession. I'm sticking with Maples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InternationalRockSuperstar Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 They are exempt from UK capital gain tax because they are UK legal tender. Other non-uk coins are not UK legal tender hence are subject to UK capital gain tax. Ideally, you want to obtain the gold without the gov't knowing anyway. Point taken though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narco Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 They are exempt from UK capital gain tax because they are UK legal tender. Other non-uk coins are not UK legal tender hence are subject to UK capital gain tax.http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/cg4manual/CG78307.htm http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/cg4manual/CG78308.htm Good point. That capital gains tax would be quite a hefty amount after hyperinflation kicks in. Thanks for the heads up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narco Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) Ideally, you want to obtain the gold without the gov't knowing anyway. Point taken though. Again good point. i'm not planning on declaring what gold I buy and sell. However, the government are going to want to know when the price is $5000 per ounce exactly who is trading. ***edit*** aren't the government already wanting people to declare amount over a certain value anyway? wasn't there also a story about jewellers and coin dealers being made to report transactions? hmmm Edited December 12, 2007 by narco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InternationalRockSuperstar Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Again good point. i'm not planning on declaring what gold I buy and sell. However, the government are going to want to know when the price is $5000 per ounce exactly who is trading. When it gets that bad, I'm afraid we may find that laws pertaining to gold will change somewhat! so basing your investment stratagies around todays laws could hit you with a nasty surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertyuiop Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Are these coins pure gold? I'm sure I saw something labelled as sovereign in a gold shop today but listed as 9 carats? Can someone elaborate please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narco Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Are these coins pure gold?I'm sure I saw something labelled as sovereign in a gold shop today but listed as 9 carats? Can someone elaborate please? Not sure about sovereigns but Krugerrands and Maples both contain exactly 1 ounce of 24 carat gold. However, the Krugerrands have an additional % of copper to provide durability, meaning the entire coin is actually classed as 22 carat. The Maples are smaller but completely pure. (from what i understand.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) Not sure about sovereigns but Krugerrands and Maples both contain exactly 1 ounce of 24 carat gold. However, the Krugerrands have an additional % of copper to provide durability, meaning the entire coin is actually classed as 22 carat. The Maples are smaller but completely pure. (from what i understand.) I thought Krugerands were 100% gold? EDIT Forget it- I thought 24 carat was a fraction of gold- its not- sorry chaps Edited December 12, 2007 by Bloo Loo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertyuiop Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Not sure about sovereigns but Krugerrands and Maples both contain exactly 1 ounce of 24 carat gold. However, the Krugerrands have an additional % of copper to provide durability, meaning the entire coin is actually classed as 22 carat. The Maples are smaller but completely pure. (from what i understand.) Where are the best place to purchase these coins from? Are there any cheap reputable dealerships around? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InternationalRockSuperstar Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I thought Krugerands were 100% gold? maples are 99.99% krugs, eagles and sovs are 22c (ie 22/24) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Boy Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) Not sure about sovereigns but Krugerrands and Maples both contain exactly 1 ounce of 24 carat gold. However, the Krugerrands have an additional % of copper to provide durability, meaning the entire coin is actually classed as 22 carat. The Maples are smaller but completely pure. (from what i understand.) Full sovereigns are the same as krugerrands but require 4 to make a troy ounce. Edited December 12, 2007 by Daft Boy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwertyuiop Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Are there any price advantages to buying say Krugers over Soveriegn giving that South Africa has gold mines and the UK very little in comparison? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InternationalRockSuperstar Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Full sovereigns are the same as krugerrands but require 4 to make a troy ounce. A sov is 0.2354 of a troy ounce - so four of them does not quite equal a krug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Boy Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Are there any price advantages to buying say Krugers over Soveriegn giving that South Africa has gold mines and the UK very little in comparison? No. Gold is around £400 an ounce at the moment. You can buy a full sovereign anywhere for about £90 at the moment which means you can get an ounce of gold for around £360. A Krugerrand sells around £395. Will gold go up or down in value ? nobody knows. I think it will but what do I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Boy Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 A sov is 0.2354 of a troy ounce - so four of them does not quite equal a krug. The difference is not justified by the price of the the more expensive Krug Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairies Wear Boots Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I've just did a bit of digging myself and taxfreegold.co.uk suggests that all bullion coins are tax free. i.e. Kruggers etc are tax free too? They also sting you 7.5 percent above the price of gold if buying small quantities. Ouch. Wonder how much they buy them back for? Anyone got any recommendations of where to So if I go buy a bar of gold and sell it for 1000 pounds more after april of next year, I'll pay £180 tax? Any other ways to avoid tax? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pluto Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) I've just did a bit of digging myself and taxfreegold.co.uk suggests that all bullion coins are tax free. i.e. Kruggers etc are tax free too? They also sting you 7.5 percent above the price of gold if buying small quantities. Ouch. Wonder how much they buy them back for? Anyone got any recommendations of where to So if I go buy a bar of gold and sell it for 1000 pounds more after april of next year, I'll pay £180 tax? Any other ways to avoid tax? Gold and silver coins are becoming harder to get hold of. APMEX has silver (large quantaties 500+ oz) delivery at January 8th (was stock), and price of Kruggers at $30 over spot (was 10). Edited December 12, 2007 by Pluto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairies Wear Boots Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 And if I buy coins I pay no tax if they go up, and if I buy a bar and make a profit I do? Sounds strange to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursus Helvetica Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 (edited) I've just did a bit of digging myself and taxfreegold.co.uk suggests that all bullion coins are tax free. i.e. Kruggers etc are tax free too? They're talking about VAT here. Due to EU law, all investment gold is VAT free on purchase, coin/bar whatever. The CGT exemption appears to be UK specific legislation applying to sterling coins only. So if I go buy a bar of gold and sell it for 1000 pounds more after april of next year, I'll pay £180 tax? Any other ways to avoid tax? No, you'll only be liable for CGT if you exceed your CGT allowance of approx £9k capital gain in a year on non sterling coins. Edited December 12, 2007 by Ursus Helvetica Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishfinger Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 Reputable dealers I've used are Chards (taxfreegold), ATS Bullion and Bairds (goldline.co.uk). If you haven't bought gold before go through dealers until you are confident after DYOR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Reputable dealers I've used are Chards (taxfreegold), ATS Bullion and Bairds (goldline.co.uk). If you haven't bought gold before go through dealers until you are confident after DYOR. Assuming I wanted to buy a few sovs it seems the age and design add a premium. Reading this it seems to be sensible to buy the newer less sought after ones: http://www.taxfreegold.co.uk/wesellsovereigns.html Is there more to it or is the extra price simply a collectors tax? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.