Osborne Faces Rebellion If Cgt Goes Over 25%

[lufc]

How about just raising CGT on property and not on business assets, as well as closing the loopholes around property companies? That wouldn't damage investment in the economy, in fact it would boost it by shifting investment from non-productive assets towards productive ones. Blindingly simple

Far too sensible.

The Lib Dems wanted to use CGT to raise almost £2 billion a year in extra tax revenue.

The Coalition has not put a figure on the extra revenue it will seek, and David Cameron, the Prime Minister, has said the tax increase will bring in only “modest” sums.

According to the article the fact remains that this will only raise £2 bn of extra tax revenue - that's only 4 days worth of government borrowing at present rates !!!!

Apparently 'official' borrowing went through the £800 bn mark last week.

I still can't get my head around how they plan to halve the deficit in 4 years - that's about £80 bn of spending cuts / tax rises and will still leave us at near to 100% of GDP without taking account the other 'nasties' that Brown has hidden off balance sheet.

What a mess.

[Georgia O'Keeffe]

Far too sensible.

According to the article the fact remains that this will only raise £2 bn of extra tax revenue - that's only 4 days worth of government borrowing at present rates !!!!

Apparently 'official' borrowing went through the £800 bn mark last week.

I still can't get my head around how they plan to halve the deficit in 4 years - that's about £80 bn of spending cuts / tax rises and will still leave us at near to 100% of GDP without taking account the other 'nasties' that Brown has hidden off balance sheet.

What a mess.

they plan to halve it by forecasting the economy will return to ponzi/fraudulent banking induced levels of 3%+ growth at the same time as governments worldwide introduce austerity and cut spending to the bone. Then when it doesnt happen and the country defaults it can be totally unexpected and blamed on the price of pineapples falling in Ouagadougou

[dances with sheeple]

There is a choice. Tax unearned income at standard tax rates or increase the tax rate of earned income. One affects speculators and the other would affect most of the population. The money needs to come from somewhere.

Anyone still "speculating" in the property market is not going to make much capital gains now are they so the tax is not going to raise much revenue? it is a red herring, a sweetner to the sheeple before they get stuck into real earned income.

[Dave Spart]

That chap off Moneybox was saying only 130,000 people paid CGT last year and that only 250,000 own second homes yet judging by the reaction of some newspapers you'd think this proposed hike in CGT was the end of the world.

Edited June 5, 2010 by Dave Spart

[dances with sheeple]

Well it wont, or not much anyway. If you coudnt afford one before you are not likely to do in the future just because cgt goes up.

If CGT scares people into trying to get rid of their empty BTL which is plummeting in value anyway, then surely more flats on the market with less buyers means cheaper flats which means more affordable? Just because a bunch of dummies are losing money on property it doesn`t follow that the next wave of buyers won`t be able to "afford one" surely the opposite must apply?

[lufc]

they plan to halve it by forecasting the economy will return to ponzi/fraudulent banking induced levels of 3%+ growth at the same time as governments worldwide introduce austerity and cut spending to the bone. Then when it doesnt happen and the country defaults it can be totally unexpected and blamed on the price of pineapples falling in Ouagadougou

Utter drivel, it won't be pineapples, it'll be Halal kebab meat that gets the blame ... Hmmmm Kebabs

[tennaval]

Spot on Patrick Collinson.

Why Vince and the Tory/Libs should stick to their guns on CGT.......

In todays Guardian Money

(Wanted to put on HPC front page but dont have the skills/know how)

Edited June 5, 2010 by tennaval

[live in hope]

If CGT scares people into trying to get rid of their empty BTL which is plummeting in value anyway, then surely more flats on the market with less buyers means cheaper flats which means more affordable? Just because a bunch of dummies are losing money on property it doesn`t follow that the next wave of buyers won`t be able to "afford one" surely the opposite must apply?

Its not about some dummies loosing on BTL. Its about encouraging enterpreneurs to make money and improve the economy. Who in their right mind will invest in anything if there is no profit, or it is taxed to nothing by this hike. BTL will die a death anyway now because of the aggro of renting to muppets with little return. The taxpayer will have to fund housing. But whats with taxing anyone who is savvy enough to make a gain on anything. UK plc wont recover with these policies, it will just be a nation of muppets and social chavs.

[keeprenting]

Its not about some dummies loosing on BTL. Its about encouraging enterpreneurs to make money and improve the economy. Who in their right mind will invest in anything if there is no profit, or it is taxed to nothing by this hike. BTL will die a death anyway now because of the aggro of renting to muppets with little return. The taxpayer will have to fund housing. But whats with taxing anyone who is savvy enough to make a gain on anything. UK plc wont recover with these policies, it will just be a nation of muppets and social chavs.

Straw man alert. Everyone agrees there will be "generous exemptions for entrepreneurial business activities."

The area of debate is whether CGT should be increased for NON entrepreneurial activities. The silver spoon element of the Tory party believe that it should not.

[moonriver]

Spot on Patrick Collinson.

Why Vince and the Tory/Libs should stick to their guns on CGT.......

In todays Guardian Money

(Wanted to put on HPC front page but dont have the skills/know how)

Good find...it is about time we had an article in the media supporting CGT.

Time for as many as us as possible, to make a comment at the link.

I think to make your own thread, you wil need to upgrade from a new member status, by requesting an upgrade here.

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showforum=41

[tomwatkins]

I don't get why they want to raise CGT it is quite a small tax at the end of the day.

If you just raise CGT you:

damage investment in the economy

& reduce the revenue you collect

Thankfully they know this, so it looks likely there will be some sort of taper or other relief to punish speculation but reward investment.

Just a thought but does anybody have any idea why different asset classes can't be subject to different rates of CGT? Never ever understood that, even before this latest news. I always believed it was a way of steering the country in a certain way.

[Liquid Goldfish]

Critics of the proposals are confident that the Treasury will compromise on a “taper” to reduce the tax for assets held for several years, and on an indexation rule to ensure that asset price increases due to general inflation are not taxed.

One senior Conservative source said that the focus for discussion among MPs is now the new headline rate of CGT

“We’ll be OK on a taper and OK on indexation,” the source said.

“The real issue is the rate. Anything more than 25 per cent and people are going to be seriously unhappy. If it’s under 25, we can live with it.”

So it looks like 25% with taper and indexation!!

That will mean even less CGT on second homes and BTL than under the current 18% rate

[stormymonday_2011]

I don't get why they want to raise CGT it is quite a small tax at the end of the day.

If you just raise CGT you:

damage investment in the economy

& reduce the revenue you collect

Thankfully they know this, so it looks likely there will be some sort of taper or other relief to punish speculation but reward investment.

If you do not raise CGT then the message you are sending to all the other sections of society faced with higher taxes and austerity is that certain sections of society get a pass in dealing with the so called 'Greatest National Emergency Since World War 2'. A bit like saying that landlords should have been exempted from conscription in 1939.

In addition CGT at 18% is encouraging lots of 'schemes' to convert conventional earnings to Capital Gains in order to avoid income tax . This will ultimately distort the economy. Lawson understood that process which is why he essentially wanted to treat most capital gains and earnings the same. Of course back in the Thatcher era the the aim was to reduce the general rate of taxation for everyone. Now it seems some Tories want higher taxes for some people but not themselves . They are just as interested in defending their privileges as any old school Trade Unionist. Hypocrites to a man.

Edited June 5, 2010 by realcrookswearsuits