Edinbugh Latest

[ccc]

I'll Just rent it out instead...

Who would have guessed it eh.

How many months is the Scotsman behind the curve ? 9, 12 ?

My response is pretty scathing but ****** it who cares. These EA greedy chumps deserve a bit of abuse.

[ccc]

EN gets real..

Credit crunch comes home to roost as house prices fall £20k

Shock horror !!

Shouting it to the masses now. Excellent.

[geed]

EN gets real..

Credit crunch comes home to roost as house prices fall £20k

Shock horror !!

Shouting it to the masses now. Excellent.

EEN must have their fingers on the pulse, this info has been available for nearly a week now.

[Bjørn]

"If you're downsizing, then the market is not working in your favour. But if you're moving up the ladder, then the property you're moving into will cost less."

The man who said that is either a bloody fool or a bloody liar. In a downward market downsizing makes sense, to limit the gross amount of your loss. If you know that you're going to lose 50% of your investment over the next two years, then it's better to make your loss on £100,000 than on £200,000.

"They're also becoming attractive for buy-to-lets, as rents are going up."

Another bloody lie from another bloody liar.

The sooner these conmen are put out of business, the better.

[geed]

5.7litres of banker bling going cheap

A tangible sign of the times in Edinburgh?

[ccc]

5.7litres of banker bling going cheap

A tangible sign of the times in Edinburgh?

The first car I owned was a V8 5.7 litre Chevvy Van.

Cost me all of $1600 Canadian.

As for the above I reckon we may be seeing a lot of this soon. Apparently the 2nd hand car market is on its knees.

If only I had my hoose cash all saved up and a little extra. I would be firing into a bargain !! Although never spent that much on a car, never seen the point. I do like them though.

[geed]

The first car I owned was a V8 5.7 litre Chevvy Van.

Cost me all of $1600 Canadian.

As for the above I reckon we may be seeing a lot of this soon. Apparently the 2nd hand car market is on its knees.

If only I had my hoose cash all saved up and a little extra. I would be firing into a bargain !! Although never spent that much on a car, never seen the point. I do like them though.

The new car market is on its knees but I have heard the second hand market is faring better. I hope so, I am going to put my car on the market next week. Who told you this ccc?

[Scunnered]

A minor bit of good cheer in the Evening News today: Owners slash £26k off house prices in desperate bid to sell (ccc sticking the boot in in the comments, as usual).

Meanwhile over in the Sunday Herald, things aren't too good at Johnston Press: Johnston Press tumbles towards an uncertain future

In the words of Panmure analyst Alex DeGroote, the share price "absolutely crated", falling almost 20% last Tuesday, and ending the week at 7.15p, after hitting a low of 6.5p. This means that the City now values the company at only £45.8 million. Johnston paid £180m for the three Scotsman titles alone in 2006 when the share price was 454p.

...

Johnston's woes have reignited the long-running debate on the future of the The Scotsman, Scotland on Sunday and the Edinburgh Evening News.

...

The Scotsman papers are widely seen as the most likely to be sold first ...

But sources say the problem for Bowdler is that nobody - at least for the moment - will put in an acceptable offer.

The last point sounds a little familiar for some reason. Maybe we could club together and buy them - it'd give us a chance to get our own back on the ESPC.

Oh, and why's all this happening?

Reflecting the wider industry trends, classified advertising at the company between August and November had fallen sharply year-on-year. The most noteworthy figure was the 48.4% drop in revenue from property advertising.

[Bjørn]

despite the country being in the grips of a recession, it's the perfect time to buy

Nope. Wrong!

2008 is not the perfect time to buy. 2008 is an incredibly stupid time to buy.

2009 won't be any better.

The tail end of 2010 might be a good time, but we're nowhere near there yet.

[Scunnered]

Here's a minor titbit from the EN, just for the sake of posting something.

Capital most likely to feel crunch

EDINBURGH has been identified as the Scottish city most likely to feel the long-term effects of the credit crunch, according to a new report.

The Capital's dependence on financial services and construction sectors makes it the most vulnerable city in Scotland, according to national accountancy group UHY Hacker Young. Only London and Norwich are more exposed to the crisis.

Edinburgh has just under 35 per cent of the workforce in these sectors. This compares to 26 per cent for Great Britain overall.

James Simmonds, partner at UHY Hacker Young, said: "When the full economic consequences of this crisis unfold, all sectors will feel the impact but financial services and construction are expected to be hit the hardest. Cities where employment is predominantly in those sectors could be the most vulnerable."

Just like we always thought, "Edinburgh is different".

[tired]

My rented flat is freezing in the winters and its not cheap. But having looked on the web, hoping rentals might be coming down in Edinburgh, I am dismayed at how stubbornly high they remain. I can see the breath in front of my face, and it's only November. How long is this crash going to take?

[tired]

feckin feckin feckin feck

[itsdave]

My rented flat is freezing in the winters and its not cheap. But having looked on the web, hoping rentals might be coming down in Edinburgh, I am dismayed at how stubbornly high they remain. I can see the breath in front of my face, and it's only November. How long is this crash going to take?

Maybe landlords are being a little aspirational with their asking prices (much like those trying to sell). A mate of mine recently negotiated £75 per month off a flat which was on the market for £850.

And you're not wrong - it is fecking freezing at the moment.

[geed]

Maybe landlords are being a little aspirational with their asking prices (much like those trying to sell). A mate of mine recently negotiated £75 per month off a flat which was on the market for £850.

And you're not wrong - it is fecking freezing at the moment.

Which would you prefer, crispy frost, calm days and winter sunshine or the ubiquitous Edinburgh grey drizzle?

It is a tad chilly though.

[blobby o mr blobby]

Edinburgh flat coming up in the next wilsons auction

http://www.wilsonsauctions.com/property_de...w.asp?id=185629

Guide price £165,000

Last sold prices where 3-Jan-2003 £235,000

24-Jul-2001 £170,000

[Scunnered]

Edinburgh flat coming up in the next wilsons auction

http://www.wilsonsauctions.com/property_de...w.asp?id=185629

Guide price £165,000

Last sold prices where 3-Jan-2003 £235,000

24-Jul-2001 £170,000

Sale by order of the MORTGAGEES IN POSSESSION

Now whatever could that mean?

Rare opportunity to purchase this modern third floor flat

These "opportunities" are going to be about as rare as, er... something not very rare, but I can't think of an example at the moment. It'll be interesting to see how much it sells for (if it sells at all).

[roblpm]

Have to say its a much more appealing prospect than all the ones down at Leith/Granton

Found this:

http://www.jennersproperty.com/tenants/detail/P00173

Which looks to be the same sort of thing for rent at £850 a month

So if you got 850 rent (doubtful) and got it for £165k thats a gross yield of 6.2%. Which isn't as bad as some I have seen. Still not the 10% that anyone sensible would be looking for.

[geed]

Have to say its a much more appealing prospect than all the ones down at Leith/Granton

Found this:

http://www.jennersproperty.com/tenants/detail/P00173

Which looks to be the same sort of thing for rent at £850 a month

So if you got 850 rent (doubtful) and got it for £165k thats a gross yield of 6.2%. Which isn't as bad as some I have seen. Still not the 10% that anyone sensible would be looking for.

I agree, near the parliament, arthurs seat, and the royal mile. Interesting to see what it goes for.

The repossession are coming....

[Bjørn]

Interesting to read the BTLers' perspective on a crappy little empty slavebox.

[roblpm]

Bjorn

I am not a BTLer. I have once had a btl flat which was our flat which we rented out while we bought another flat for a few years. Sold the lot in 2004. Might buy a flat to let out in the future, but hardly qualifies as a BTLer!

The reason I mentioned the rental yield is that as far as I can see there are 2 pointers to a property's value other than the market price. One is how much money you can borrow to buy it, ie multiples of average salaries, and the other is the rental yield.

All I know is that when I bought a flat in London for £94k in 1998 you could easily get £9400 a year in rent for it. So that leads me to believe that property is still overvalued compared to this and when the rental yield is around 10% we are at values equal to the late 90s?

How would you know what a house is worth other than the market price? Which in a bubble is a bubble price? How will any of us ever decide to buy?

[geed]

Interesting to read the BTLers' perspective on a crappy little empty slavebox.

A bit of a sh1tty comment Bjorn, roblpm's contribution to the Edinburgh's sub forum is without question. His justification for comparing outright purchase price to rental price (therefore giving yield) is a valid metric. With the combination of falling IR's and falling property prices, current low rental yields may start to look more attractive. Do you think seasoned BTLer's have dissapeared forever?

In this environment, property is about as attractive as a horse with a hard-on, but it wont be forever.

Edited December 1, 2008 by geed

[guitarman001]

I'd like to add that the cold in Edinburgh is bone-chilling. I've taken to wearing two pairs of socks, fleece and heavy coat, gloves, and I'm thinking about getting one of those bi hats with the ear flaps.........

[Bjørn]

I scoff at BTL thinking for good reason. The BTL thing wasn't the only cause of the grotesquely overinflated bubble in Edinburgh, but it was a very powerful propellant of it.

The flat mentioned here is a superb example of what BTL thinking results in. A crappy little slavebox went for silly money in 2003 when BTLers could buy just about anything and could hope to get 100% LTV finance if they could fog a mirror on a cold day.

Now look at the numbers again:

Guide price £165,000

Last sold prices where 3-Jan-2003 £235,000

24-Jul-2001 £170,000

"Guide" price isn't a meaningful number. We all know that. Nevertheless, it's interesting to see a Dec'08 guideprice which is lower than the sold price in Jul'01.

BTW, when I use the word(?) BTLer, I'm not referring to somebody who rents out their own past, present, or future home. I'm talking about the multiple BTL thing, where individuals bought significant numbers of flats simply to let them out. It was BTLing on a large scale which artificially jacked up already insanely high prices in Edinburgh and forced huge numbers of honest homebuyers out of the market.

BTL is dead. Hooray!!

Edited December 2, 2008 by Bjørn

[itsdave]

A couple of encouraging signs that vendors are coming out of denial:-

West End one bed flat on the market since at least July this year, was on at Offers Over £195,000 (yes, really!), now on at Fixed Price £180,000

http://www.espc.co.uk/Buying/257722.html

Nethouseprices shows that it sold for £161,000 in 2004

Another West End 'Mews House' (more like a large shed or medium garage) , again on offer since at least July, originally at Offers Over £198,000, now on at Fixed Price £190,000

http://www.espc.co.uk/Buying/257759.html

Nethouseprices shows that it sold for £190,000 in 2006 (at least I think it's this one http://www.nethouseprices.com/scot_detail....row_id=1436774)

Curiosly, both of these large reductions are with the same Solicitor. It strikes me as significant, but I have no idea why! Any ideas?

The original asking prices, particularly for the garage with a kitchen and settee shoved in it, were mind-bogglingly ridiculous, even for Edinburgh.

Edited December 5, 2008 by itsdave

[ccc]

A couple of encouraging signs that vendors are coming out of denial:-

West End one bed flat on the market since at least July this year, was on at Offers Over £195,000 (yes, really!), now on at Fixed Price £180,000

http://www.espc.co.uk/Buying/257722.html

Nethouseprices shows that it sold for £161,000 in 2004

Another West End 'Mews House' (more like a large shed or medium garage) , again on offer since at least July, originally at Offers Over £198,000, now on at Fixed Price £190,000

http://www.espc.co.uk/Buying/257759.html

Nethouseprices shows that it sold for £190,000 in 2006 (at least I think it's this one http://www.nethouseprices.com/scot_detail....row_id=1436774)

Curiosly, both of these large reductions are with the same Solicitor. It strikes me as significant, but I have no idea why! Any ideas?

The original asking prices, particularly for the garage with a kitchen and settee shoved in it, were mind-bogglingly ridiculous, even for Edinburgh.

I think the first one was sold for 180k in 2006. That is what I get from ourproperty.co.uk.

Can't find the other one.

Looking a little more reasonable though. Once those prices are down circa. third/half from peak I will be interested.