shlomo Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 7 minutes ago, Pebbles said: The British empire certainly wasn't a bad thing in the same way the Roman empire wasn't either. Like the US Empire is not really a bad thing, and the CCP empire is not going to be a bad thing lol, it depends Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shlomo Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 7 minutes ago, A.steve said: I imagine that the purpose of nation states having a Secret Service is, erm, well, secret - perhaps? I think the usual narrative is that they're overseen by the executive branch of government... and that they do the bidding of that executive branch. If, when Trump referred disparagingly to the 'Deep State' he implied the Secret Service... then that would suggest he had lost control of the executive branch of government. Do you think that was what he was intending to convey? How do you know what the secret services are really doing if anything, When I was young I was in Sweden and I met a diplomat who told me that some sections of the western secret services used to knock people off and seal all the money in their bank accounts He told me this story of an Indonesian who had stolen lots of money from indonesia the people from that country were after him but the western secret services let him put his money in Switzerland then had him taken out and they had all the means to transfer the money to themselves The Soviets were just a distraction (or doing something similar) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 Just now, shlomo said: How do you know what the secret services are really doing if anything. How would anyone know - unless they were directly involved... and, if they were directly involved, it'd probably only afford a blinkered view. The narrative of an international criminal depositing funds in Switzerland - before being bumped off by a secret service... and ill-gotten-gains misappropriated by said secret service... erm sounds a lot like a fictional spy-thriller plot. Perhaps that sort of thing happened - perhaps it's mostly fantasy. Aren't there credible stories of comparable corruption within the police? I'm reminded of Robert Maxwell... he existed; everything about his biography sounds implausible; he stole lots of money - and he died in mysterious circumstances. I imagine that there are many similarly nefarious characters... and they might be better camouflaged by not being an MP, by being less flamboyant and not being a media personality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shlomo Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 15 minutes ago, A.steve said: How would anyone know - unless they were directly involved... and, if they were directly involved, it'd probably only afford a blinkered view. The narrative of an international criminal depositing funds in Switzerland - before being bumped off by a secret service... and ill-gotten-gains misappropriated by said secret service... erm sounds a lot like a fictional spy-thriller plot. Perhaps that sort of thing happened - perhaps it's mostly fantasy. Aren't there credible stories of comparable corruption within the police? I'm reminded of Robert Maxwell... he existed; everything about his biography sounds implausible; he stole lots of money - and he died in mysterious circumstances. I imagine that there are many similarly nefarious characters... and they might be better camouflaged by not being an MP, by being less flamboyant and not being a media personality. During the 53 years of the Pahlavi dynasty, the imperial family has amassed a great fortune estimated to run into billions of dollars. One Iranian economist estimates the assets of the entire royal family at more than $20 billion, a staggering sum that would probably exceed or at least equal the wealth of any of the other royal famillies of Middle East Oil-producing states. The source termed the figure of $1 billion for the shah's personal fortune a "gross underestimate" and said it amounted to many times that. The list of wealthy royal relatives who have left Iran includes virtually all the 63 princes and princesses who make up the imperial family. It is unknown precisely where they all are now. Various reports place them in retreats from the Seychelles Islands to Brazil. then On Sunday 10 June 2001, Princess Leila was found dead in her room in Leonard Hotel in London just before 19:30 BST by her doctor.[6] She was found to have more than five times the lethal dose of Seconal, a barbiturate, which is used to treat insomnia, in her system, along with a nonlethal amount of cocaine.[7] She was found in bed, her body emaciated by years of anorexia, bulimia,[8] and food intolerances.[9] According to a report on her death, which included information from an autopsy conducted by the Westminster Coroner's Court, she stole the Seconal from her doctor's desk during an appointment and was addicted to the drug, typically taking 40 pills at once, rather than the prescribed two.[8] On 4 January 2011, her brother Ali Reza Pahlavi was found dead at his home in Boston, Massachusetts, from an apparent suicide.[11] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 2 minutes ago, shlomo said: During the 53 years of the Pahlavi dynasty, the imperial family has amassed a great fortune estimated to run into billions of dollars. One Iranian economist estimates the assets of the entire royal family at more than $20 billion, a staggering sum that would probably exceed or at least equal the wealth of any of the other royal famillies of Middle East Oil-producing states. The source termed the figure of $1 billion for the shah's personal fortune a "gross underestimate" and said it amounted to many times that. The list of wealthy royal relatives who have left Iran includes virtually all the 63 princes and princesses who make up the imperial family. It is unknown precisely where they all are now. Various reports place them in retreats from the Seychelles Islands to Brazil. I suspect that having royal status - and having billionaire oligarch means... exposes one to stresses that are alien to those with more normal lives. I can imagine it driving one to madness... and, under such circumstances, both murders and suicides seem more plausible than they otherwise would have seemed. Anorexia and cocaine use both hint at impaired decision making... so maybe the extraordinary end shouldn't be unexpected? Throughout history, the lives of those who come close to monarchy have often been high-octane... many with tragic ends. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shlomo Posted March 28 Author Share Posted March 28 10 hours ago, A.steve said: I suspect that having royal status - and having billionaire oligarch means... exposes one to stresses that are alien to those with more normal lives. I can imagine it driving one to madness... and, under such circumstances, both murders and suicides seem more plausible than they otherwise would have seemed. Anorexia and cocaine use both hint at impaired decision making... so maybe the extraordinary end shouldn't be unexpected? Throughout history, the lives of those who come close to monarchy have often been high-octane... many with tragic ends. All the money stolen from Iran was in Swiss bank accounts, now no one knows where it is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 (edited) On 26/03/2024 at 19:34, Lucky Larry said: The Empire was fueled by warfare , enslavement , rape , pillage , drug smuggling and theft , most nations under occupation have told the Brits to fukk off so the Empire has shrunk to a fraction of its former size but the "industries" that fueled it are still ongoing. It's flag is called the Butchers Apron for very good reason Sooner or later some nation or other was going to invent the Industrial Revolution. It would then build an empire with it. Any nation would do this. Previously the Roman Empire invented the legion and revolutionised warfare then did the same To the U.K. . to suggest that the U.K. is more racist than others is putting the cart before the horse. It became racist because of empire not the other way around. British thinkers from Adam Smith to George Orwell understood this. medieval Britain had no concept Of Race. Identity was much more associated with what language you speak which religion you followed etc. Portugal is one of the nicer less racist parts of Europe but I was amazed how unapologetically proud of their empire building they still are. Edited March 28 by debtlessmanc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 1 hour ago, shlomo said: All the money stolen from Iran was in Swiss bank accounts, now no one knows where it is I think this had something to do with Saddam cash personally https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annecy_shootings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Orange Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 17 minutes ago, debtlessmanc said: medieval Britain had no concept Of Race. Identity was much more associated with what language you speak which religion you followed etc. It still unfortunately led to racially motivated systematic attacks and policies (see King Edward Longshanks expelling all the registered Jews). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 1 minute ago, Big Orange said: It still unfortunately led to racially motivated systematic attacks and policies (see King Edward Longshanks expelling all the registered Jews). Even the Flemish were not popular despite being white and protestent, spoke wrong language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spitalfield_riots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 2 hours ago, shlomo said: All the money stolen from Iran was in Swiss bank accounts, now no one knows where it is Wasn't that the entire point of numbered Swiss bank accounts? Are you really trying to say that, because what happened to those funds is opaque, we should rationally presume a particular secretive organisation misappropriated them - because we've no evidence either way... and it sounds like a good story? I think there are lots of very murky transactions. I understand there were lots at BCCI prior to its collapse. I get a similar impression about FTX. With recent difficulties emerging at Credit Suisse, perhaps more scrutiny is long-overdue for banking in general? These financial institutions are all (nominally, at least) private sector businesses. In the context of the story about the missing billions... the banks will have records - if the banks are solvent. Numbered Swiss accounts was a meme before memes were invented. I always wondered, when they were brought up by 'adults', why anyone would trust the bank to ever allow access again. A few billion deposited by someone acting outside the law could provide an excellent capital base for large scale banking operations... especially if it never needs to be repaid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shlomo Posted March 28 Author Share Posted March 28 1 hour ago, debtlessmanc said: It became racist because of empire not the other way around. British thinkers from Adam Smith to George Orwell understood this. I agree A people become nice or racist depending on if they are an up nation or down How long before the Chinese become racists? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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