tim123 Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Totally agree. Right now prices are being held up by agents competing for business from sellers, which they do by promising absurd prices. The incentive to distort the price up will be removed when the seller uses a direct "service" like the one Tesco planned. They will put down the price they feel is right. How many people have decided to sell, been round 5 agents only to be told by Foxton's that their house is "worth" 20K more? That won't happen if this goes ahead. Where do you think people are going to get the "idea" of the price that they should try to sell for. The no-service listing boards certainly aren't going to tell them tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork of Damocles Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 I consider those two statements to be contradictory. They are putting the squeeze on EAs by ramping up fees for unlimited postings, but private sellers only want to advertise a single property. If they introduce such an option the EAs will use it selectively instead of being ripped off for unlimited postings tim I don't imagine the single-listing fees will be cheap but they will probably look a lot cheaper to the single home seller than an EA's commission. Unless an EA has only a few on its books, I would expect the unlimited option to be cheaper to them – even if it is more expensive than it was. The balance between those two options will determine whether and how other third parties will join the fray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spork of Damocles Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Where do you think people are going to get the "idea" of the price that they should try to sell for. The no-service listing boards certainly aren't going to tell them tim Land Registry, Zoopla, Mouseprice, EPC providers who look stuff up on Zoopla and Mouseprice. They will probably look laughably expensive unless they revise their algorithms but the idea that only an EA knows for sure is also just laughable. In fact, in researching places to buy (before I gave up on that idea for the moment) I was pretty sure all a bunch of the EAs were doing was a search on Mouseprice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmf Posted September 16, 2012 Share Posted September 16, 2012 Where do you think people are going to get the "idea" of the price that they should try to sell for. The no-service listing boards certainly aren't going to tell them tim How does anyone price an object? Price history for the area, perhaps? I find this an odd objection. Luckily for you (and ebay) nobody else thinks this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porca misèria Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Interesting blog about the misdescription repeal and contentious house issues for a buyer to look out for. http://blogs.independent.co.uk/2012/09/14/property-sales-and-misleading-information-be-aware-be-very-aware/ The mainstream meeja can be useful when they get contributions from an expert in a field. This one looks the part .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koala_bear Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Halifax seem to have increased the advertising for their property search portal in the last week (both billboard and TV). I suspect they will be the first to push selling by individuals (presumably hoping for revenue by cross selling mortgages and insurance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Happy day when I can bypass that nest of vipers and deal direct with the vendor. Problem is, in a very large minority of cases, buyer and seller do not get on and spend an unnatural amount of time antagonising each other. Like it or not, and I suspect the answer is not, these sales would simply not happen if the EA were not there to 'referee' things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmf Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Problem is, in a very large minority of cases, buyer and seller do not get on and spend an unnatural amount of time antagonising each other. Like it or not, and I suspect the answer is not, these sales would simply not happen if the EA were not there to 'referee' things. Surely you would just need an electronic arbiter. Ebay manages to have buyers and sellers convene and agree on a price. Google / Tesco could have a sealed bid auction that is or is not binding on completion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Surely you would just need an electronic arbiter. Ebay manages to have buyers and sellers convene and agree on a price. Google / Tesco could have a sealed bid auction that is or is not binding on completion. Because in the vast majority of instances, ebay is not arbitrating on transactions involving hundreds of thousands of pounds, if not millions. And often agreeing the initial purchase price is the easy bit, it's all the other crap that takes the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 It's paid up front, so the people who don't sell are subsidising those that do. So, almost the precise opposite of what happens at present! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porca misèria Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 So, almost the precise opposite of what happens at present! That at least seems like a Good Thing. Stop subsidising timewasters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmf Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Because in the vast majority of instances, ebay is not arbitrating on transactions involving hundreds of thousands of pounds, if not millions. And often agreeing the initial purchase price is the easy bit, it's all the other crap that takes the time. I think it can be done. Time will tell. I certainly don't need someone with hardly any qualifications or skill arbitrating for me on anything, particularly when I'm the buyer and they are skewed towards the seller. The ebay principle of establishing a price works however many zeros are present. I'd agree the other stuff takes time, but if any of the estate agents I have met can do it then so can most of the population. If not I bet Tescos can produce a cheat-sheet for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmf Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 The very fact that when you deal with an estate agent you are at an immediate disadvantage does not help in the process. You know there is a very good chance that the EA has increased the vendor's expectations of price for the house You know they are only interested in the vendors interests You know they do not have any interest in telling the truth to the buyer You know that you are going to struggle to even get your offer made to the vendor unless it suits the EA. Bring on the changes. The boom over here in NI soon showed the true colours of EA -- feeding the gazumping -- producing ghost bidders --- helping to fuel the fire of HPI. Quite, they are unregulated. I'd rather deal with a sealed bid via Tesco's audited, transactional database where they are charging a flat-fee and have nothing to gain than some scumbag EA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrashingisles Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Because in the vast majority of instances, ebay is not arbitrating on transactions involving hundreds of thousands of pounds, if not millions. And often agreeing the initial purchase price is the easy bit, it's all the other crap that takes the time. Even with a slimmed down Internet based direct sales model for estate agency, there will still be enough revenue to support all manner of backend services delivered by human beings to facilitate the transaction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 I hope this news makes them sick to their stomachs, a$$holes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the shaping machine Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Even with a slimmed down Internet based direct sales model for estate agency, there will still be enough revenue to support all manner of backend services delivered by human beings to facilitate the transaction. Exactly, what IMO is likely to happen is that many estate agents will move from the high street to home office. A lot of people will choose to employ a consultant of some kind to assist in particular parts of the process. Overall the savings to many sellers/buyers might not be that large, but for those willing and able to DIY, the cost difference should be significant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24gray24 Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 Exactly, what IMO is likely to happen is that many estate agents will move from the high street to home office. A lot of people will choose to employ a consultant of some kind to assist in particular parts of the process. Overall the savings to many sellers/buyers might not be that large, but for those willing and able to DIY, the cost difference should be significant. It will be interesting to watch what happens when a seller disappears with the money, and turns out not to be the real owner. Or there's an ex wife sitting in the property. Sure, you can do it yourself, but the pitfalls are huge. That's the real reason people get professional help: they don't want to risk losing all their money and ending up with no house, in order to save themselves £1500. Obvious, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
porca misèria Posted September 17, 2012 Share Posted September 17, 2012 It will be interesting to watch what happens when a seller disappears with the money, and turns out not to be the real owner. Or there's an ex wife sitting in the property. Sure, you can do it yourself, but the pitfalls are huge. That's the real reason people get professional help: they don't want to risk losing all their money and ending up with no house, in order to save themselves £1500. Obvious, no? Erm, how does anything in this thread affect conveyancers? It's estate agents - whose role is sales and negotiation - who may be looking at interesting times here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 Quite, they are unregulated. I'd rather deal with a sealed bid via Tesco's audited, transactional database where they are charging a flat-fee and have nothing to gain than some scumbag EA. No irony in claiming EAs are unregulated, while commenting on a thread about the specific legislation that covers EAs? Estate Agents Act 1979 Property Misdescriptions Act 1991 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 18, 2012 Share Posted September 18, 2012 One example from Northern Ireland the law says that an EPC (energy assessment) has to be done when a house is put up for sale or rent. If you look at propertynews - one of the 2 main portals there are approx 5% of houses showing an EPC report on the website. In fact I have had to fight with EAs who said that it is unnecessary even after showing them the relevant legal clauses. No one wants to put out 100 quid for an EPC in case they don't get it back from the vendor. One of our posters did not get the EPC info until his conveyancing solicitor insisted after it was sale agreed. He discovered that the house needed many thousands of pounds of work done on it and the vendor was unwilling to drop their price to take account of it. The EA had that info but withheld it from a FTB to get the sale. The solicitor was unwilling to take a case to court against the EA since it is a small town and business is business. The sale eventually fell through but our poster was out of pocket because the EA would not give the info to him at the initial offer. I would not trust a single EA -- I have seen and heard too many horror stories over the boom years of unscrupulous EAs lining their own pockets. It is a sad fact that some absolute arseholes are attracted to this industry, there are some good ones and I hope you will be fortunate to come across one in the near future. I'm afraid that I'm fairly cynical when it comes to EPCs, although we do comply with all current legislation. I've seen enough of these 'surveys' carried out to form the opinion they are a big waste of time. Changing a few lightbulbs seems to make more of a difference to the rating of a particular property than upgrading a boiler for instance. I'm not against the concept in theory, just wish they were a little more practical in the real world. The EPC compiled recently for a property we are selling suggests the installation of solar panels to reduce energy consumption, with an expected cost of £9000-£14,000. This is expected to produce typical annual savings of £231. If we take the lowest of the installation cost estimates this means you will need to remain at the property for 39 years, saving £231pa, to recoup your 'investment.' I've never personally seen any piece of information on an EPC that highlighted work required that I wasn't able to spot by physically looking at the house, but without knowing more details surrounding the circumstances it's impossible to comment further. Returning to the original point, I would be very happy to see some pretty stringent regulation come into force, as I suspect would many other EAs who take their job seriously and do things properly. There is no shortage of legislation in existence, but as you correctly point out the enforcement leaves a lot to be desired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride_on Posted September 25, 2012 Share Posted September 25, 2012 Shouldn't any fee be relative to the sale price of the property? No... why? Do they do more valuable work the more expensive the house? Are they taking any more risk? Do they have higher costs if the house is more expensive? If the house turns out to be pants, do the EAs have to refund you? You can put your house in the paper, do they charge a advertising fee based on the price of the property? Are they subject to the property misdescriptions act? How come paper is ok, but internet isn't? Bout tme they got with the program! Its rediculous, noone buys a property without viewing it, and EA are not obliged to have the house surveyed and present the results of that in a advert! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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