S S Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Heard of this before and seen it in the main forum. http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...121372&st=0 Will this stop the mountain of repossessions hitting the market? http://www.jobcentreplus.gov.uk/JCP/Custom...016128.xml.html I wounder if home owners know what benefits they are entitled to. Makes you wounder why you work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Dick Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Ahh the welfare system....it will be interesting to see what happens whenever unemployment reaches critical limits and the tax payers cannot afford to support the unemployed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 The only thing that keeps me in this country is that benefits are more absurd in most other countries. I even think the US welfare system is more generous than ours. Most non-federal levels of govt are choc full of bleeding heart liberals there. Except for Arizona. Dubai seems the only place where it actually pays to work hard. Even that article with the fatty woman who gets £600 a month in benefits fails to mention the same again she recieves in housing and council tax benefit. Honestly, if YOU EARN UNDER £20000 IN THIS COUNTRY YOU ARE BETTER OFF NOT WORKING. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polythene pam Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Honestly, if YOU EARN UNDER £20000 IN THIS COUNTRY YOU ARE BETTER OFF NOT WORKING. You're financially better off in the short term but what life is it? The person earning under 20k has a reason to get out of bed in the morning, has a chance to improve their situation, is developing themselves in terms of their skills and knowledge. A life of the dole is a life put on ice as far as I can see, with nothing there except perhaps a change of lover once in a while to lift the gloom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S S Posted July 31, 2009 Author Share Posted July 31, 2009 You're financially better off in the short term but what life is it? Years ago when I got my first job at 17 I working hard doing long hours, bought my first house at 19, got married at 19. Decided at 23 we could afford to have kids, wife left work (hasn't worked since, lol), I worked harder Blah Blah. Now at nearly 40 I have good family and friends with no mortgage and 2 companies doing well. The point is I still meet up with guys I went to school with, they haven't worked much since they left school they have a nice 3 bed semi (bought from the council for 3-4k) with all the gadgets, a car, a holiday and there kids don't don't want for much. They have taken full advantage of the benefit system throughout their life and called me many times wanting me to go play pool/snooker/cards but I had to work. Oh how they laughed at me. Anyhoo they look 25 and I look like I'm nearly 40 (I hope). They have good family and friends with no mortgage and substantial benefits payments every 4 weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashologist Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 In terms of ever owning your own home there's little point in working if you earn less than 45k a year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subby Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 I agree with Doccy there 100% Instilling a work ethic is something lacking in most people these days, I see it all over west Belfast. 3rd generation benefits family where no one worked a day and kids think it's normal quite sad to see but they get given money for nothing so they think why should I work when I can get by with handouts from government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride_on Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 Some people are happy with the sponging, it can be irritating to the rest of us who would like a better break now and again. However I do have a theory that everyone is similarly intelligent and put their brains to the same level of effort (just a theory for most people, not lazy teenagers etc). These dolites are well educated and work hard, just not at the same things the rest of us are/do. It takes considerable effort to carve out a nice life on the dole, its a pity those efforts aren't put to good use elsewhere. Its a sysmtom of gov't policy, they aren't bad people and they do work hard. I did like the idea on the main forum were every citizen gets a basic living citizens wage from the Gov't. When you work your salary is basically naturally reduced slightly, but if you have no work, then no paperwork you just have to handle it yourself. Obviously loads of other details to consider, and if anyone is interested read the original thread, but I like the idea of simplifying benefits massively, they are so complicated that you can feel rewarded for your efforts in getting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Dick Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 I have a close friend who is very intelligent but unbelievably lazy. He's doing law at queens, never goes to class and is now in his 6th year after several repeats. He never gets a job and never has 2p to rub together and gets £400 a month on benefits but he's happy with this life and I guess that's the problem - too many people can easily live on that sort of money and be happy. I think the benefit system should be radically changed, cash for a set period, after that your on your own. Changes like that would mean my friend would have to get job! His excuses of late being as lame as; "I don't want a job that I can't walk to - I don't like the bus". If the government cut his benefits he'd soon change his tune. Some might think my views are harsh, considering he's my friend too, but he has the potential to become a lawyer and provide taxes for people that really deserve and need government help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shipbuilder Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 I couldn't care less about people on benefits. The facts are that in the list of groups that are a sponge on my taxes or have a negative influence on society, they are well down the list, below many who would be classed as 'productive' members of society. One person happy on benefits is one less person likely to rob or assault me to feed themselves. In case anyone hadn't noticed, people can't be forced into jobs when there are no jobs. When you argue to cut benefits yet accept a system where full employment is impossible, you are arguing for a number of people in society to be allowed to starve or exist in poverty. My life and my ambitions concern me more than other people's do. As ride_on says, lets have a citizen's income and let people do what they want. The amount of money saved in bureaucracy and quangos would probably pay for it in itself. While we're at it, let's reward the people who produce wealth and punish the real scroungers who live off asset wealth - scrap income tax and replace with LVT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ride_on Posted July 31, 2009 Share Posted July 31, 2009 I couldn't care less about people on benefits. The facts are that in the list of groups that are a sponge on my taxes or have a negative influence on society, they are well down the list, below many who would be classed as 'productive' members of society. One person happy on benefits is one less person likely to rob or assault me to feed themselves. In case anyone hadn't noticed, people can't be forced into jobs when there are no jobs. When you argue to cut benefits yet accept a system where full employment is impossible, you are arguing for a number of people in society to be allowed to starve or exist in poverty. My life and my ambitions concern me more than other people's do. As ride_on says, lets have a citizen's income and let people do what they want. The amount of money saved in bureaucracy and quangos would probably pay for it in itself. While we're at it, let's reward the people who produce wealth and punish the real scroungers who live off asset wealth - scrap income tax and replace with LVT. You are a wise man, I have liked quite a few of your 'out-look on life' comments. I too forget that it matters more what you do than how you see other individuals. When you pick on individuals you obviously do not know the statistics, and it is these that will indicate where the money is wasted. I would not be surprised if the civil service budget was more than the benefit budgets, I wonder which would benefit from closer attention. Anyway I don't want to see anyone lose their job or benefits, but a good long term strategy to get people into USEFUL jobs would help. I was going to bang on about marketing and drive for wealth and the balance of innovation/reward, it all boils down to bad gov't, I shall stop and say I think the future can be solved with crowd sourcing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OptimusSubPrime Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 You are a wise man, I have liked quite a few of your 'out-look on life' comments. I too forget that it matters more what you do than how you see other individuals. When you pick on individuals you obviously do not know the statistics, and it is these that will indicate where the money is wasted. I would not be surprised if the civil service budget was more than the benefit budgets, I wonder which would benefit from closer attention.Anyway I don't want to see anyone lose their job or benefits, but a good long term strategy to get people into USEFUL jobs would help. I was going to bang on about marketing and drive for wealth and the balance of innovation/reward, it all boils down to bad gov't, I shall stop and say I think the future can be solved with crowd sourcing. its even worse in ROI for dole mongerers cos the dole is €205 A WEEK!! And thats just the basic rate before housing or children benefits etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearsrus Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 its even worse in ROI for dole mongerers cos the dole is €205 A WEEK!! And thats just the basic rate before housing or children benefits etc this will cheer you up then. a bloke i know has been on top rate dla and in-capacity benifits for the last 20 years , he got a council house about 10 years ago all courtesy of the taxpayer then was able to buy while on benifits, then through sheer luck/skill decided to sell in july 2007 at the bubble peak and pocketed 180k . he,s now enjoying life in thailand living the good life ,while still getting his in-capacity and dla paid into his bank account,and his attitude is if he dos,nt kill himself through drink,drugs and sh@gging then he,ll be back if old or sick to get another house again which he,ll be entitled to as he,s classed as half mad. i reckon fair play to him ,if i,d no kids i,d be there also making sure my money was spent. and from a moral view he,s no worse than a banker/MP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subby Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 think you need to use the ' key as opposed to the , key Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeDavola Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 he,s now enjoying life in thailand living the good life ,while still getting his in-capacity and dla paid into his bank account I thought that benefits payments stopped when you leave the country for a certain length of time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S S Posted August 6, 2009 Author Share Posted August 6, 2009 I thought that benefits payments stopped when you leave the country for a certain length of time? Not as far as I know. I know of an ex police officer retired through ill health living in Thialand who gets cold weather payments in winter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bearsrus Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 I thought that benefits payments stopped when you leave the country for a certain length of time? only if you tell the benifits agency ,he has family collecting mail and taking cash out of the account weekly just to keep things rolling along . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeDavola Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 (edited) I would have thought there would have been a record on a computer somewhere that would flag up the the benefits agency that you have been out of the country for X months/years - or am I over-estimating the sophistication of their IT systems. Also, I would guess that he must require some sort of permit if he wants to stay in thailand indefinately? Edited August 6, 2009 by JoeDavola Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VedantaTrader Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 I would have thought there would have been a record on a computer somewhere that would flag up the the benefits agency that you have been out of the country for X months/years - or am I over-estimating the sophistication of their IT systems. Yeah, I certainly think you are over estimating the government The track record with IT systems is nothing to write home about (from Thailand as the case might be)...I m not surprised that people will be doing this. One thing I m not surprised about is how people will stop at no cost to sponge from other people. Also, I would guess that he must require some sort of permit if he wants to stay in thailand indefinately? Alot of farang (as westerners are known in Thailand) will be on tourist visas, doing border runs every month to places on the Cambodian and Laos border. There are suppose to be a limit on the number of consecutive visas you can get, before you have to the Kingdom as its known for 3 months before you can return. Of course you can come back to the Uk or go to OZ and get a visa at the Embassy and come back straight away...but the sort of people who do the perpetual border runs to Cambodia don't have very much money so cannot afford to do fly back to the Uk or OZ, will be shacked up with some skanky bar girl who tells her benefit seeking (fake) England football shirt wearer that "he hansum man, and she lub him too mutt" in a 30 quid a month room in Pattaya somewhere...He ll probably drink cheap Thai whisky or beer Chang and might have a tendency towards taking "yaba"... You can either get an non-Immigrant type B Business visa, which you can get in the UK if you want to stay longer,or have a business set up under Thailand Board of Investment to obtain a work permit, or be working to a multinational, or a Type B-education visa which I had, if you study there...Also, if you buy a condo, you can get a resisdent type O visa, but you have to have a certain amount of funds each year in your bank account to get it renewed...or you could marry a beautiful Thai girl...plenty of options. Most are there on tourist visas...trying to get from one month ot the next. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yadayada Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 this will cheer you up then.a bloke i know has been on top rate dla and in-capacity benifits for the last 20 years , he got a council house about 10 years ago all courtesy of the taxpayer then was able to buy while on benifits, then through sheer luck/skill decided to sell in july 2007 at the bubble peak and pocketed 180k . he,s now enjoying life in thailand living the good life ,while still getting his in-capacity and dla paid into his bank account,and his attitude is if he dos,nt kill himself through drink,drugs and sh@gging then he,ll be back if old or sick to get another house again which he,ll be entitled to as he,s classed as half mad. i reckon fair play to him ,if i,d no kids i,d be there also making sure my money was spent. and from a moral view he,s no worse than a banker/MP. So who signs on for him? What's happened to that fortnightly signature rule? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basildon Bond Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 its even worse in ROI for dole mongerers cos the dole is €205 A WEEK!! And thats just the basic rate before housing or children benefits etc I'm not sure where you got that figure from? For income-based jobseeker's allowance the rates are: Single people aged 16 - 24: £50.95 Single people aged 25 or over: £64.30 see: http://www.jobcentreplus.gov.uk/JCP/Custom...015272.xml.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belfast Boy Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 The figures quoted were for ROI - Republic of Ireland. With unemployment estimated to reach depression levels of 20%... how long can a small economy like Ireland(south) afford to pay 3 times as much unemployment benefit as the UK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S S Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 So who signs on for him? What's happened to that fortnightly signature rule? You don't sign on for DLA and Incapacity Benefit you may have a review after 5 years or so. DLA can be awarded for life (you don't have to be severely disabled to get it for life) which basically gives you Incapacity for life because they won't argue with DLA doctors. So I'm told. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
subby Posted August 8, 2009 Share Posted August 8, 2009 some skanky bar girl who tells her benefit seeking (fake) England football shirt wearer that "he hansum man, and she lub him too mutt" in a 30 quid a month room in Pattaya somewhere... comedy gold there mate lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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