Your Cheeky Offers

[HOORAY]

Hmm cheeky offers...

A 3 bed Regency(?) terrace under repossession by a recently bailed out bank in Cheltenham was originally on the market for 215k early this year. Empty now for a year but had previous occupant dossing in it for a while - his sleeping bag is still there !

Two sales fall through after survey as the banks simply wont lend to the offers agreed 190 in May and 170ish in August. I offered 139 in August and they came back to me asking me to up my offer as it was back on the market after 3 months.

To which I offered 131 as just over a 40 percent drop. The EA was disgusted and told me the Bank had already refused a higher offer than my previous offer but since the property needs 45-50 grand to do it up internally and fix the subsidence of a supporting wall and complete the cellar renovation not to mention gut every room for a new finish, what do they expect ! ?

It would be a lovely house once finished and although I may be ahead of the curve they are definitely behind it. Soon the council will be statutory purchasing. I think Ill buy a flat in Leeds for cash the way things are going ! (Any suggestions? )

[researchmug]

my suggestion..

wait and buy in cash, for happy stress free life and no pesky bank dealings

[The Conveyancer]

Hmm cheeky offers...

A 3 bed Regency(?) terrace under repossession by a recently bailed out bank in Cheltenham was originally on the market for 215k early this year. Empty now for a year but had previous occupant dossing in it for a while - his sleeping bag is still there !

Two sales fall through after survey as the banks simply wont lend to the offers agreed 190 in May and 170ish in August. I offered 139 in August and they came back to me asking me to up my offer as it was back on the market after 3 months.

To which I offered 131 as just over a 40 percent drop. The EA was disgusted and told me the Bank had already refused a higher offer than my previous offer but since the property needs 45-50 grand to do it up internally and fix the subsidence of a supporting wall and complete the cellar renovation not to mention gut every room for a new finish, what do they expect ! ?

It would be a lovely house once finished and although I may be ahead of the curve they are definitely behind it. Soon the council will be statutory purchasing. I think Ill buy a flat in Leeds for cash the way things are going ! (Any suggestions? )

My suggestion would be dont buy a leasehold property unless you really cannot afford anything more. I would rather buy a two up two down terrace with a small mortgage than a "luxury apartment" for cash. If you buy a flat at some point you will look back and regret it!

[6538]

Hmm cheeky offers...

A 3 bed Regency(?) terrace under repossession by a recently bailed out bank in Cheltenham was originally on the market for 215k early this year. Empty now for a year but had previous occupant dossing in it for a while - his sleeping bag is still there !

Two sales fall through after survey as the banks simply wont lend to the offers agreed 190 in May and 170ish in August. I offered 139 in August and they came back to me asking me to up my offer as it was back on the market after 3 months.

To which I offered 131 as just over a 40 percent drop. The EA was disgusted and told me the Bank had already refused a higher offer than my previous offer but since the property needs 45-50 grand to do it up internally and fix the subsidence of a supporting wall and complete the cellar renovation not to mention gut every room for a new finish, what do they expect ! ?

It would be a lovely house once finished and although I may be ahead of the curve they are definitely behind it. Soon the council will be statutory purchasing. I think Ill buy a flat in Leeds for cash the way things are going ! (Any suggestions? )

I wouldn't touch anything with subsidence as they can be virtually impossible to insure.

It puzzles me that banks hold out so long for unrealistic sums on repossessed properties. I think anyone who's offer on a repo is rejected because it's not enough should ask the bank in possession how much they would be prepared to lend on it!

[Stop The Ride]

It puzzles me that banks hold out so long for unrealistic sums on repossessed properties. I think anyone who's offer on a repo is rejected because it's not enough should ask the bank in possession how much they would be prepared to lend on it!

Interesting idea. I wonder what happens if you are arranging a mortgage with the same bank that is the vendor (assuming that's allowed and not a conflict of interest). Presumably the bank might refuse to lend the money at the offer price at the same time as refusing to lower the price to the valuation. Any ideas, anyone?

[greenalien]

90% or 95% LTV is cloud cuckoo for the next 3 to 4 years

I reckon it'll be a lot longer than that - maybe 10 years or more...

[silver surfer]

I'm in the market as a cash buyer, looking in Hampshire and West Sussex. I'm aiming to pay late 2003/early 2004 prices, which equates to a good 30% off the top 2007 prices. I haven't had an offer accepted yet, but there's no doubt that I'm getting closer by the week.

What I've found is that it's best to be up front with the EA, and be clear about what my price expectations are. In almost every case they know who are the "motivated sellers" and who are the ones in denial. It just saves everyone's time.

I've asked a few EA's why they even bother keeping these overpriced properties on their books. The answer they normally give is that they want to keep their "For Sale" boards widely distributed in the area, although increasingly they seem to realise that these unrealistic asking prices are acting as a barrier to getting prices down to a level where they might get the market moving again.

[mr slump]

I offered the 2005 price of 130k and he laughed at me and called me "idiotic and insane" to offer so little. This house is out in the sticks with no jobs or shops nearby. Agent has over 200 houses on his books and there are approx another 400 houses for sale in a 15 mile radius.

Guess his business is not going to last much longer then. Sales of houses in NI have fallen to about 2 per month per agent lately because of the mortgage famine and low wages. Everyone with a plot of land built a big house on it and can't afford to heat or pay the mortgage for it. Unfortunately they all think their houses are worth their weight in gold and Prince Charming will come and buy at an outrageous price.

Latest move over here is to put up for sale at over 300k or rent for 500 quid per month -- hoping for the upturn next year

hi Doccyboy

did he actually say you were 'idiotic + insane' or the offer was?

if it was a personal remark I'd make a point of actually going in there for a chat

the arrogance of (some) EAs here is quite sickening

what other business would get away with this/

on property news you can ' view this agents properties'

some have a couple of hundred on thier books with maybe 5% under offer

some of these under offer ones have been in that state for 6-8 months or more before they take them off

[mr slump]

He said it would be idiotic to put in an insane offer of RV. I have met with arrogance like this before in EAs---most wouldn't even look at you when you came in unless you looked wealthy --and I don't. I look forward to seeing these agents in administration.

I will never forget the distress on a young man's face when the uppity EA would not let him put his offer of asking price to a vendor (this was in late winter 2006 / early Spring 2007) -- because the vendor wanted much more than the asking price. He pleaded with the girl but she was adamant. I hope he now realises what a lucky escape he made. That particular agent was one of the first to pay off staff last year.

Like many on here I've met some of these

thier aim is to humiliate people , to make them embarrassed to go far under the asking

'how dare you doubt MY valuation' like theyre qualified for anything

intimidation is a horrible thing

of course the reflex reaction is 'go f... yourself'

but we must remain restrained knowing that our details are on file and there may be a property to view

in future

the tongue biting will end soon enough

[northeast Canuck]

I just finish speaking to an EA telling him the truth, which I learnt from HPC... :-)

Last week, an EA started showing me Ex-Local which I wasn't impressed... I din't put any offer in.

Today, he started sending me proper flat in W9 london. Due to constant call, I decide to tell him the facts.

On the phone, I told him that we are willing pay 30-40% of peak price. The new properties he just send me is value at 400 - 2 bed apartment - 4 year old.

Then he start asking me the range I would offer. I told him I do not want to offend himor the Seller, that's why we decide no to put any number/offer.

He insisted. I told him, that from Auction(i.e. Barnard Marcus/Allsop), prices are looking at the 2002/03 region (i.e. 30-35% in this area), and this is where we are looking,

And, we are willing to wait, since we are not desperate, and our mortgage are ready - no chain.

There was a long 5-10 secs pause. He didn't disagree nor agree but ended saying "I will continue to send you new suitable properties when arises'.

I say, Fine, but I told him, I just don't want to waste his time, or my time, showing around and yet no action from my side.

Do you think I am too harsh on this EA? Do you think this will kill of my relationship with this particular EA (i..e. as though if I care very much).... hahaha?

I've just done the same thing. I believe that if you were to put in an offer of 30-40% off a selling price, not only will the seller not accept it, it will p*ss them off so much that in future they will not sell to you - at any price, even when prices drop below the level you previously offered. This is why I have said something similar (my offer would be substantially lower so I am reluctant to put one in at all). Interestingly, the agent called me back yesterday and left a message on my ansafone - would I like to come back for a second viewing? But there won't be an offer - not yet, anyway.

[crashlanded]

Reminds me of an amusing thread on the ever-angry Sheffieldforums - a quick scan on Rightmove shows this is still on, too

He paid 130,000 for it after someone else refurbed it. Paid way over the odds for it and now wants way over for it in return....I went to look at it as I was passing...Yikes, someone paid 150,000 for same type in 2006...Oh and he stareted off wanting 160k!!

8 Crag View Close,

Oughtibridge,

Sheffield,

South Yorkshire,

S35 0GA £130,000

Semi-Detached

Freehold

Not New Build 11-Feb-2005

Map (S35 0GA)

8 Crag View Close,

Oughtibridge,

Sheffield,

South Yorkshire,

S35 0GA £85,000

Semi-Detached

Freehold

Not New Build 28-Apr-2004

Map (S35 0GA)

14 Crag View Close,

Oughtibridge,

Sheffield,

South Yorkshire,

S35 0GA £150,000

Semi-Detached

Freehold

Not New Build 20-Oct-2006

M

Edited November 30, 2008 by crashlanded

[researchmug]

I had a bit of a debate with an agent the other week who said that he had sold a property but the buyers (of the said property) own sale fell through. My response was 'well you didn't sell it then did you?' He insisted he had sold the property but it had fallen though. I said ' It doesn't count then does it? you haven't sold anything until you've got the money, all you had was a potential buyer' He didn't like it at all. As a result I have a very frosty situation with that agent which earns me no leverage if I do try a buy a house through him.

I always seem to end up in a heated debate with the EA in which I try to get them to accept reality and they try to make me believe in fairytales.

Consequently I've decided to keep my communication with EA's, minimal, very formal and shockingly brief.

Edited November 30, 2008 by researchmug

[The Knimbies who say No]

I had a bit of a debate with an agent the other week who said that he had sold a property but the buyers (of the said property) own sale fell through. My response was 'well you didn't sell it then did you?' He insisted he had sold the property but it had fallen though. I said ' It doesn't count then does it? you haven't sold anything until you've got the money, all you had was a potential buyer' He didn't like it at all. As a result I have a very frosty situation with that agent which earns me no leverage if I do try a buy a house through him.

I always seem to end up in a heated debate with the EA in which I try to get them to accept reality and they try to make me believe in fairytales.

Consequently I've decided to keep my communication with EA's, minimal, very formal and shockingly brief.

ah, ****** 'em, who cares. Maybe the EA has a column in their accounts for 'Sales we made but for which we received no money but which really was a sale. Honest.'

Their probably getting arsey 'cause they're staring down the barrel of a P45.

They are paid by sellers, so any info they give should be viewed as such. Good on you for trying though! I had a chat with an EA who said they were still selling properties, despite the market. Bo11ox. My letting agent said that 'We are seeing an increase in properties available for rent, but not a drop in rents' when I enquired about a cut. More bo11ox. Bottom line is, most people who walk through their doors believe what they tell them, and if they don't, there's bu$$er all they can do about it 'cause their sellers live in fantasy land.

Look at auctions instead, and short-circuit all the ********.

[lindsayg]

So, I believe we are about to see the end of DENIAL.

Could be. I had some agents in this week to get an idea of how my place is doing (not to sell, you understand, to try to get out a bit of equity..)

I live in a good part of Glasgow (no, really!), and one of the agents told me that lots of places just aren't selling because the vendors refuse to get realistic about the price crash. They've had one place on their books for well over a year and are planning to 'demarket' it. Unless the vendors get a grip the agents haven't got a chance, either.

Not that I want anyone to feel sorry for them!

[mr slump]

Unless the vendors get a grip the agents haven't got a chance, either.

Not that I want anyone to feel sorry for them!

exactly, it would take a very short memory to have sympathy

a lot of the vendors denial has a lot to do with thier earlier spiel

[TheLastSamurai]

I live in Northern Ireland where we have a bubble on a bubble. House I was interested in was on for over a year at 260k (twice its 2005 price). It dropped to 200k on the website and I phoned up. Ea said that vendor had changed his mind and was putting it back to 260k but would be flexible.

I offered the 2005 price of 130k and he laughed at me and called me "idiotic and insane" to offer so little. This house is out in the sticks with no jobs or shops nearby. Agent has over 200 houses on his books and there are approx another 400 houses for sale in a 15 mile radius.

That takes the biscuit. "Idiotic" to offer a price of just a year or two ago!

The fact the vendor is looking to put his price back up shows he is a complete idiot.

No-one in NI should be buying a house for at least 3 years.

[janet41]

i made an offer of 360k on a 465k property back in March; the EA was utterly rude - laughed at me in front of others, and ridiculed me saying that i was seriously off the mark. Didnt hear anything at all until Oct when the EA said they would now accept 360k; i declined politely and its now been dropped to 350k. This is in a small city in the southwest.....it is apparently under offer again but i dont believe it for a moment as it is now seriously overpriced larged already renovated properties in the same (good) area

[s2r2005]

your cheeky offer is now a very very reasonable one, i wonder if you could make sure the EA who was rude is not the one who gets the commission from the sale?

good luck with house hunting, in west yorks am still faced with EAs who keep telling me about serious offers from others for the properties i am interested in 'any day now' on houses that do not even get under offer. because, you know, this is such a good town to communte from that it can't happen here. really.

[Jim B.]

i made an offer of 360k on a 465k property back in March; the EA was utterly rude - laughed at me in front of others, and ridiculed me saying that i was seriously off the mark. Didnt hear anything at all until Oct when the EA said they would now accept 360k; i declined politely and its now been dropped to 350k. This is in a small city in the southwest.....it is apparently under offer again but i dont believe it for a moment as it is now seriously overpriced larged already renovated properties in the same (good) area

lovely stuff, I imagine that would be you feel pretty good (it would me).

[jimi]

I put in three 'offers' recently (well, not quite offers but I always say to the EA before I go for a second viewing that I want to make sure my and the vendor's price expectations are aligned and therefore before we proceed to another viewing can I check that £X is in the right ball park).

Anyway, first property on for £280k, reduced from £300k. In a very desirable location so I offerred £220k. Was told they had turned down an offer of £267k and my offer would be refused.

Offer two - On market for £300k. I'd previously suggested a price of £220k and this was turned down so I upped it to £240k. Was told £270k was their minimum.

Offer three - lovely new build (from local builder). On for £330k, I offerred £250k and was told mimimum they'd accept is £290k.

Seems to me that in the area I'm looking at 10% falls are the norm but sellers are not willing to go below that at this stage.

On the other hand, buyers are not willing to pay these prices and therefore until vendors reduce their expectations they won't sell their properties. Sadly for me though I'd really like to buy, but until the prices budge I'll be in rented for a while....

[xux42]

Offer three - lovely new build (from local builder). On for £330k, I offerred £250k and was told mimimum they'd accept is £290k.

Your offers are ahead of the curve at 25% off.

Why not agree to leave the offer on the table?

In 6 months the fair market value for the newbuild may have dropped below £250k.

Rather than try to re-negotiate further down, you could just go ahead knowing you are no worse off than if they had accepted the money now.

It might come down another 20-30K but do you want to wait another 18months - 2 years?

Worst case scenario might be an eventual bottom of £175K but it shouldn't cause problems with re-mortgages etc. assuming you have at least £100k to put down.

TBH if prices fall that far who knows what state the country will be in.

[Nomadd]

OK, general question aimed at everyone in this "cheeky" thread.

Has anyone tried just telling an agent: "Hey, I have £XXX to spend. Period. I'm in no rush to buy - I'll wait 5 years if I have to. But, my £XXX is there, on the table, so to speak. Let me know what you have. No rush." Then just leave.

Now, I'm not looking to buy for at least another 2 years, but when I do, I was thinking that that would be my approach. Simply to tell them how much I've got to spend, and leave it at that. Isn't that a better approach than dealing with all this "trying to knock the price down" stuff? I'd have thought the knowledge to a Salesman (EA) that you are ready to buy would be enough incentive to cut through the BS and just make them get on with it.

Or maybe I'm wrong? Maybe it's still too early in the death cycle of UK house prices to try this approach? Whatever, at least it will stop you having to go through a load of carp from EAs...

Comments?

Cheers,

Nomadd

[Jim B.]

OK, general question aimed at everyone in this "cheeky" thread.

Has anyone tried just telling an agent: "Hey, I have £XXX to spend. Period. I'm in no rush to buy - I'll wait 5 years if I have to. But, my £XXX is there, on the table, so to speak. Let me know what you have. No rush." Then just leave.

Now, I'm not looking to buy for at least another 2 years, but when I do, I was thinking that that would be my approach. Simply to tell them how much I've got to spend, and leave it at that. Isn't that a better approach than dealing with all this "trying to knock the price down" stuff? I'd have thought the knowledge to a Salesman (EA) that you are ready to buy would be enough incentive to cut through the BS and just make them get on with it.

Or maybe I'm wrong? Maybe it's still too early in the death cycle of UK house prices to try this approach? Whatever, at least it will stop you having to go through a load of carp from EAs...

Comments?

Cheers,

Nomadd

I would think the worse thing to do from a bargaining point of view is let the other party know how much you've got.

[pablopatito]

Has anyone tried just telling an agent: "Hey, I have £XXX to spend. Period. I'm in no rush to buy - I'll wait 5 years if I have to. But, my £XXX is there, on the table, so to speak. Let me know what you have. No rush." Then just leave.

Yes, I have. It works ok. I get selected properties sent to me that are advertised at way above my budget, so I'm able to read between the lines and work out what the agent is hinting at.

[s2r2005]

wish the agents round here were helpful or realistic enough to make that work, they have also gotten a little more bullish since christmas which won't help matters.

i have a feeling we are in for a long hard slog before serious reductions set in.