heresjohnny Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 The idea of Brown taking credit for the final solution to nationalise the world banking system because he and his fellow numpties failed to do their jobs will not wash for much longer IMO. The REAL pain has yet to hit the wider economy and when it does they will be after Gordon's blood. I agree. I share everyones frustration at Brown and Labour but I personally think that there is little the Tories and the Meeja can do until some kind of stability (whatever that means/whenever that will be) is achieved. Heavy criticism during the crises will achieve little in terms of sorting this out - and this has turned into a huge disaster beyond dropping house prices. We are genuinely worried. When some kind of stability is achieved and there is a way out of this mess then Brown and Labour will be torn to shreds and there reputation will be in tatters until the Tories mess up their turn. Everyone thinks Brown is a ***** and no ones changed their mind - I think that people who have influence realise that we are in damage limitation now - the executions can wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 "The essential English leadership secret does not depend on particular intelligence. Rather, it depends on a remarkably stupid thick-headedness. The English follow the principle that when one lies, one should lie big, and stick to it. They keep up their lies, even at the risk of looking ridiculous."Goebbels ",,people will believe a big lie sooner than a little one; and if you repeat it frequently enough people will sooner or later believe it" Hitler. Knock it off, Eric. 10,000 posts..... well, they are just numbers on a screen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Injin Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 10,000 posts..... well, they are just numbers on a screen! Aye. Not just here either. Plenty of people will know when it all goes tits out who was responsible and it won't be those who signed up to liar loans, which the bankers would dearly love people to blame. Oh wel, it's almost upon us now and then we'll just have to cope as best we can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted October 12, 2008 Author Share Posted October 12, 2008 (edited) I was going to type that. Thanks anyway, it saved wear and tear on my keyboard.Oh, I see what I`ve done here........... Anyway, yes, leave Eric alone. We`ve had to put up with "house prices only go up" for far too long, Eric`s large red fonts are the perfect antidote to this bullcr*p coming from the mouths of the VI`s over the past few years. Thanks Prof: The fact is -- the bankers saw the average punter as bait and a PAWN in their game: Yes -- it's all about the leveraging -- but rather like the oak tree - it starts with an acorn: No acorn - No Oak Tree. They leveraged AVERAGE PEOPLE - i.e. sucked them dry with LIAR LOANS/STUPID MULTIPLES -- and then went on to leverage these "loans" even more ....... I have never denied that. But -- LIAR LOANS form the basis of an overall scheme - to suck blood out of people.......... EDIT: Of course -- it turned out that it was certainly NOT an oak tree --- Rather - and elm with rampant & cancerous Dutch Elm Disease........ Edited October 12, 2008 by eric pebble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gormless Clown Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 I agree. I share everyones frustration at Brown and Labour but I personally think that there is little the Tories and the Meeja can do until some kind of stability (whatever that means/whenever that will be) is achieved. Heavy criticism during the crises will achieve little in terms of sorting this out - and this has turned into a huge disaster beyond dropping house prices. We are genuinely worried. When some kind of stability is achieved and there is a way out of this mess then Brown and Labour will be torn to shreds and there reputation will be in tatters until the Tories mess up their turn. Everyone thinks Brown is a ***** and no ones changed their mind - I think that people who have influence realise that we are in damage limitation now - the executions can wait. That’s a good post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLondon Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Hi all,this is my first post having read with great interest the forum over the last 6mths or so.I work in the sub prime mortgage industry & i do not think the majority of people realise just how rife it has been over the last 4yrs or so.In fact,having worked in the industry for the last 18yrs,since the FSA regulated the mortgage industry in Nov 2004,up until the middle of 2007 it has been the worst i have ever seen it,so much for regulation! It has been a case of lending at any cost.The competition to lend amongst sub prime lenders has been so intense,they have been fighting over themselves taking bigger & bigger risks,after all,it wasn't their money that they were lending.The majority of lenders obtained their money through the money markets & then the mortgages were securitised & sold off as bonds to investors across the world. I would estimate that sub prime lending & i'm not including Northern Rock or B & B,amounted to about £10 billion a month at it's peak,GMAC alone were completing over £1 billion a month & i'm not just talking about self cert liar loans,i'm talking about lending to people who had not made a mortgage payment for a year & these people were able to obtain a remortgage up to 85% ltv.The real problems are going to start next year when the people that took out 2 & 3yr fixed rate mortgages in 2006 & 2007 come out of their fixed rates. Like most of you on here,i've held off buying a property as seeing the type of lending that was going on,this was always going to have a disasterous ending & the bubble was always going to burst.Roll on 50% price drops as believe me,it will happen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prof Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 (edited) Thanks Prof:The fact is -- the bankers saw the average punter as bait and a PAWN in their game: Yes -- it's all about the leveraging -- but rather like the oak tree - it starts with an acorn: No acorn - No Oak Tree. They leveraged AVERAGE PEOPLE - i.e. sucked them dry with LIAR LOANS/STUPID MULTIPLES -- and then went on to leverage these "loans" even more ....... I have never denied that. But -- LIAR LOANS form the basis of an overall scheme - to suck blood out of people.......... And I am correct when I say that now the banks have "sucked the blood" out of people, they`re going to take the remaining flesh and bones via the tax system ? What a f`ing mess. (Excuse the language). Edited October 12, 2008 by Prof Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Injin Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Hi all,this is my first post having read with great interest the forum over the last 6mths or so.I work in the sub prime mortgage industry & i do not think the majority of people realise just how rife it has been over the last 4yrs or so.In fact,having worked in the industry for the last 18yrs,since the FSA regulated the mortgage industry in Nov 2004,up until the middle of 2007 it has been the worst i have ever seen it,so much for regulation! It has been a case of lending at any cost.The competition to lend amongst sub prime lenders has been so intense,they have been fighting over themselves taking bigger & bigger risks,after all,it wasn't their money that they were lending.The majority of lenders obtained their money through the money markets & then the mortgages were securitised & sold off as bonds to investors across the world.I would estimate that sub prime lending & i'm not including Northern Rock or B & B,amounted to about £10 billion a month at it's peak,GMAC alone were completing over £1 billion a month & i'm not just talking about self cert liar loans,i'm talking about lending to people who had not made a mortgage payment for a year & these people were able to obtain a remortgage up to 85% ltv.The real problems are going to start next year when the people that took out 2 & 3yr fixed rate mortgages in 2006 & 2007 come out of their fixed rates. Like most of you on here,i've held off buying a property as seeing the type of lending that was going on,this was always going to have a disasterous ending & the bubble was always going to burst.Roll on 50% price drops as believe me,it will happen Cheer up mate, no money ever changed hands anyway the whole thing was a con and it's no crime to lie to a liar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gormless Clown Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Hi all,this is my first post having read with great interest the forum over the last 6mths or so.I work in the sub prime mortgage industry & i do not think the majority of people realise just how rife it has been over the last 4yrs or so.In fact,having worked in the industry for the last 18yrs,since the FSA regulated the mortgage industry in Nov 2004,up until the middle of 2007 it has been the worst i have ever seen it,so much for regulation! It has been a case of lending at any cost.The competition to lend amongst sub prime lenders has been so intense,they have been fighting over themselves taking bigger & bigger risks,after all,it wasn't their money that they were lending.The majority of lenders obtained their money through the money markets & then the mortgages were securitised & sold off as bonds to investors across the world.I would estimate that sub prime lending & i'm not including Northern Rock or B & B,amounted to about £10 billion a month at it's peak,GMAC alone were completing over £1 billion a month & i'm not just talking about self cert liar loans,i'm talking about lending to people who had not made a mortgage payment for a year & these people were able to obtain a remortgage up to 85% ltv.The real problems are going to start next year when the people that took out 2 & 3yr fixed rate mortgages in 2006 & 2007 come out of their fixed rates. Like most of you on here,i've held off buying a property as seeing the type of lending that was going on,this was always going to have a disasterous ending & the bubble was always going to burst.Roll on 50% price drops as believe me,it will happen Good first post, it is going to be interesting having you here considering you are an insider so to speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TruraBuoy Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 The code of silence… It was a routine press conference given by Canada’s Finance Minister Jim Flaherty and Bank of Canada Governor Mark Carney on the results of Friday’s G7 meeting.After reassuring Canadian’s that they “probably have the most efficient, effective financial system in the world”, Carney was asked how Wednesday’s coordinated interest rate cut came together and who drove the process. His answer revealed not only a “code of silence” among Central Bank leaders, but also hinted that those same leaders might have some special powers — at least if we are to believe they all independently decided an interest rate cut was a good idea at the exact same time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 And I am correct when I say that now the banks have "sucked the blood" out of people, they`re going to take the remaining flesh and bones via the tax system ?What a f`ing mess. (Excuse the language). Take it where? Its only credit thats being destroyed... wealth remains intact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted October 12, 2008 Author Share Posted October 12, 2008 Take it where? Its only credit thats being destroyed... wealth remains intact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted October 12, 2008 Author Share Posted October 12, 2008 Lets be clear then, it is the LEVERAGE of the securities on these loans, MBS and CDOS that has caused the problemLiar loans from 2003 were rolled up into a package. That package was sliced and diced into a CDO. So, banks that issued the original LLs were able to lend the same again, and as the end point CDOs wer providing a good and bomb proof investment, there was huge demand for more. As good borrowers became hard to find so criteria was reduced. eventuall so much that they werent liar loans at all ( as far as the brokers were concerned). NINJA loans with tiny teaser rates were the apex. rinse and repeat. We now have 10's of thousands of CDOs with huge defaults on them. The CDS raised to support the CDOS in the event of defauls are at risk. The CDOS themselves support the balance sheets of banks, so what was maybe a potential 5% of all mortgages going to rats becomes, with the magic of leverage, the total disaster that is unfolding. Its an inverted house of cards. Well put....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrabus Posted October 12, 2008 Share Posted October 12, 2008 Aye. Not just here either. Plenty of people will know when it all goes tits out who was responsible and it won't be those who signed up to liar loans, which the bankers would dearly love people to blame. Oh wel, it's almost upon us now and then we'll just have to cope as best we can. How will Knobend like you cope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted October 12, 2008 Author Share Posted October 12, 2008 How will Knobend like you cope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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