pootle Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 My thoughts:1. Don't get married. 2. Don't get married. <snip> Post of the thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickywackywoo Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 Average is 2 months salary if the man can afford it. If I decide to get married I'd like a nice ring. It's the one piece of important jewelry you wear all the time. Gross or net? Seriously, are you guys mad or what? I thought it was the engagement ring that was the expensive one and the wedding ring considerably cheaper. I got married 15 years ago. I spent £160 on the engagement ring and £60 on the wedding ring. Call me a cheapskate but it's what they signify that matters. Two months wages, that's £12k, b0llocks to that BTW My own wedding ring cost £40 and it's still going strong, if a little battered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickywackywoo Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 My thoughts:1. Don't get married. 2. Don't get married. 3, 4, 5 to 999,000 are basically the same as 1 and 2. If you insist on getting married: 1. Engagement ring - pointless, waste of money, living in the Victorian era are you? If your other half insists on one then I would have alarm bells ringing. 2. If your other half expects a fortune to be spent on a wedding ring then... alarm bells again. Rings are merely for girlies to show off to other girlies and establish themselves in the pecking order. It is also a way in which a girlie shows her girlie friends that she has your balls in her purse - the bigger and more expensive the ring the less chance of you ever getting your balls back, and her girlie friends will know this, until the divorce. At which point they will be old and shrivelled up - your balls that is! If you have a good, sensible woman then she will not want any of this nonsense and will be happy with a simple gold band that screams 'love' and not 'expense'. Out of interest, how old are you? Do you have many male friends in their late 30s to early 50s? Have you ever had a serious talk with them about women? Sorry, that makes me sound like a cynic but, boy, be careful... I hope you have a long, happy and healthy marriage... sucker! Spot on! Men don't realise how destructive marriage is until the divorce. I've seen too many middle aged men raped of their life's work to support an idle selfish woman to recommend marriage to anyone. I personally would not get married again if I could wind back the clock. I'd tell her we live together or you lump it. If she loves you, she'll accept and understand your reasons for it. Marriage is a diasaster for men if it goes wrong, which 50% do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waitingandsaving Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 Congratulations! I'm not a girly girl, and don't wear my engagement ring all the time, and don't wear any jewellery to speak of anyway, BUT! I love the fact that I have an engagement ring - no matter what she says, sparkly things always win. Traditionally, the engagement ring is a months wages, but in reality - what does it matter? A small bit of something sparkly is nice to have - even if she only wears it occasionally. Mr W&S was a student when he proposed, and the thought of anything extravagant appalled me, as it would be a waste of money. A housemate of his also got engaged about the same time - she was a greedy cow, and he had to take a loan out to get the ring she wanted. The thought of dragging a couple of grand of rock on one finger around is also a bit disturbing, I would worry for my safety in the less classy ends of town! I've met ladies who have a great big chunk on their hand, but for all anyone knows (unless you're looking really closely) to most people it could be a lump of CZ - size and cost doesn't matter - but it would be best to either take her shopping, or as another OP mentioned buy something cheap as a representative offering when you propose. Wedding rings come from very cheap at Elizabeth Duke in Argos, to more expensive models elsewhere. Traditionally, wedding rings should be 18ct or more, and a plain gold band - but as against that, so long as you're both happy with the choices, then it's down to you! Eternity rings are something else all together - and not included in the wedding ring shenanigans at all - traditionally, they are for the lady on the arrival of your first child, and have 7 rocks on them I believe - although I don't know anyone my age who has one. My only tip is to get a wedding ring that looks nice on it's own, or with an engagement ring if there is one. I'm quite sure you can get some lovely rings in pawn shops and the like, but I'd personally avoid these - the connotations of them are often not happy ones (I'm not superstitious, just wouldn't want to look at a ring that signified the end of a marriage or financial woes to someone else...) If you were going to take the plunge with the lucky lady anyway, then sometimes the practicalities just speed things up - congratulations again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 I am 32 & Know very few (good friends) who are married, so don't have anyone who would give me candid views on the matter. I personally don't think life would change dramatically after the marriage....but who knows. In all seriousness, as much as I would love all marriages to be perfect and last a lifetime of love and happiness, seek out some older, wiser males and ask them to educate you on women. Sadly, the truth about women seems to belong in some kind of Men's club that you are often only allowed knowledge of after some woman has screwed your life up for the first time. At which point you will be amazed how many men you know - friends, work colleagues, your boss, family, etc - who will tell you exactly what they think of women. You will be surprised by the Men who will tell you such things and you will be shocked by what is said. You will feel that you have never known women and that you have somehow gone through a 4 year degree course and post-doctorate on Women in a matter of hours. You will talk to such men, and they will be men who you know as decent, honest, hard-working types, and you will be thoroughly shocked by what you hear. Until it happens you will not believe it and, most likely, even reading what I am writing now you will think that I am some kind of nut. You will wish that someone had told you this when you were 15 and end up feeling that every 15 year old male should be taught it. When you marry a woman she will expect you to be her best friend - just like her girlie best friend but only better because you roger her - but what probably drew her to you in the first place was that you were her hero, her knight in shining armour. This is a dilemma for women as they will expect you to be all emotional and sensitive as the 'girlie' best friend but also tough, macho, the hero as her knight in shining armour. This contradiction begins about 2 minutes after the honeymoon and gradually eats away at women until they decide to cheat on you, divorce you and take you for every penny. Then you have the girlie friends - every male on the planet should be taught to look at the girlie friends of any woman that you consider dating. If your beloved has nutty friends the odds are on that your beloved is a nut job. If her friends cheat then... If her friends are manic depressives who hate men then... If her friends think men are cashcows then... If her friends are serial divorcees who take men for every cent then... ALWAYS judge the woman in your life by her friends - if any of the above then run, run, run! Decent women, and there are some decent women around, don't have any of the above as friends. Drip, drip, drip - misery loves company. Women hate other women being happily married, especially if they are on the shelf themselves or bitter divorcees. If your beloved has just ONE of the aforementioned as a friend then your marriage is screwed. Drip, drip, drip... Eventually your beloved will complain to her bitter friend about you not doing some DIY job or something and this will be an opportunity for the bitter friend, usually there is more than one, to get another girlie in their club. If they see your beloved as happily married then the bitter female friends will do everything they can to destroy your happy marriage... and get your beloved into your club. You can often spot these women are the wedding - usually the bridesmaids!!! Oh boy, wait till the demands start. Girlie friends will tell your beloved that she needs to exert her control over you - a bit like the ring thing in earlier posts - and you will begin to be asked to do things, to change your way of life, etc - i.e. the sport which you have done every Sunday since you were 12 and which your beloved loved you doing when she met you will suddenly coincide with a shopping trip to the garden centre or some other daft last minute made up thing. If you don't go to buy the tulip bulbs and plastic planters there will be hell to pay... and if you give in then... remember those shrivelled balls... I could go on and on and on. No doubt other Men could add vast text here. I think a woman, Dr. Laura Schlessinger, summed it up best in the audio version of her book entitled 'The Proper Caring And Feeding Of Husbands' - modern women are unhappy, deeply miserable and don't know what they want in life anymore. However, they all blame all men for all their ills and poor men don't have a clue what is going on until the divorce comes, they are kicked out of their home, lose their pension and never see their kids again. I strongly advise ALL men everywhere to download the audio version of the above book! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 Spot on! Men don't realise how destructive marriage is until the divorce. I've seen too many middle aged men raped of their life's work to support an idle selfish woman to recommend marriage to anyone.I personally would not get married again if I could wind back the clock. I'd tell her we live together or you lump it. If she loves you, she'll accept and understand your reasons for it. Marriage is a diasaster for men if it goes wrong, which 50% do. Alas, you only have to live with a woman now - and that can mean that she has just left a pair of sneakers and a thong in your wardrobe unbeknown to you - and you technically have to give her everything you have, your home, your car, your balls, your pension and pay for her boob jobs. In other words, if you live with one then you are technically married and suffer all the same losses as every man in every divorce! You never hear women complaining about divorce settlements do you? It is amazing how many lovely, sweet, intelligent seemingly open-minded and well-balanced women, that you have known for years, that you can get to admit, in a moment of pique/anger, that she believes that it is a woman's right (Yes, her right!) to get it all in a divorce. It never ceases to amaze me when this eventually comes out in the open! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrashedOutAndBurned Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 I love being married to a fantastic woman - although I do find the following site a complete hoot with its frequent glimpses of bitterly spat forth brutal truth. http://www.nomarriage.com/ Love this page: http://www.nomarriage.com/discussion.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 I love being married to a fantastic woman - although I do find the following site a complete hoot with its frequent glimpses of bitterly spat forth brutal truth.http://www.nomarriage.com/ Love this page: http://www.nomarriage.com/discussion.html That second url is frightening. I wonder what they mean by a ''non alimony state''? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thermo Posted June 17, 2008 Author Share Posted June 17, 2008 Thanks for the advice from all of you, I now have something to think over. Masked Tulip, I'll bear your comments in mind, but the type of woman you describe, I can spot a mile off. Mine ain't like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pootle Posted June 17, 2008 Share Posted June 17, 2008 Thanks for the advice from all of you, I now have something to think over. Masked Tulip, I'll bear your comments in mind, but the type of woman you describe, I can spot a mile off. Mine ain't like that Yeah? That's what we thought too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest anorthosite Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 In all seriousness, as much as I would love all marriages to be perfect and last a lifetime of love and happiness, seek out some older, wiser males and ask them to educate you on women.Sadly, the truth about women .......snip.......I strongly advise ALL men everywhere to download the audio version of the above book! That's possibly the most misogynistic thing I've ever read in my life I can never tell if its repression or bitterness when I read something like that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 That's possibly the most misogynistic thing I've ever read in my life I can never tell if its repression or bitterness when I read something like that... Yes, of course it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Speak&Spell Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 The Masked Tulip... you've obviously been either very unlucky or your personality just seems to attract crappy woman. Don't tarnish us all with the same brush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Skint Academic Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 The Masked Tulip... you've obviously been either very unlucky or your personality just seems to attract crappy woman. Don't tarnish us all with the same brush. Quite agree S&S. You can hear women say the same things about men. It comes down to a lack of communication and the fact that men and women think differently. And of course there are just some nasty greedy people out there (BTL'ers anyone?) Mr Academic and I have the perfect relationship. We know this because we make sure that we have a perfect relationship. No matter how good it currently is, if we can improve it then we will do so. This requires communication on both parts, a willingness to change and a refusal to hold grudges. We both make mistakes, we accept that, but it's the willingness to remedy any problem that comes up that makes our relationship so good. Tarnishing half the population with the same brush shows that TMT is unwilling to accept any fault on his own part. After all, it takes two to tango. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bart of Darkness Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 My fiance proposed whilst presenting to me a brand new compost bin. I'm at a loss as to whether this was some attempt at symbolism. Don't I must add my vote to the naysayers. Sorry mate. Hope it all works out as you hope it will though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest anorthosite Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 I'm at a loss as to whether this was some attempt at symbolism. Personally I think its an original and unique symbol of commitment (compost bins become part of a cycle of living) which, given young Skinty's other posts about being self sufficient, suggest that maybe her partner knows the true way to her heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pootle Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 ... being self sufficient, suggest that maybe her partner knows the true way to her heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bart of Darkness Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 Personally I think its an original and unique symbol of commitment (compost bins become part of a cycle of living) which, given young Skinty's other posts about being self sufficient, suggest that maybe her partner knows the true way to her heart. Damn you're good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest anorthosite Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 Damn you're good. That's what Mrs Anorthosite says Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bart of Darkness Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 That's what Mrs Anorthosite says I'm happy to take her word on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wickywackywoo Posted June 18, 2008 Share Posted June 18, 2008 Alas, you only have to live with a woman now - and that can mean that she has just left a pair of sneakers and a thong in your wardrobe unbeknown to you - and you technically have to give her everything you have, your home, your car, your balls, your pension and pay for her boob jobs. In other words, if you live with one then you are technically married and suffer all the same losses as every man in every divorce!You never hear women complaining about divorce settlements do you? It is amazing how many lovely, sweet, intelligent seemingly open-minded and well-balanced women, that you have known for years, that you can get to admit, in a moment of pique/anger, that she believes that it is a woman's right (Yes, her right!) to get it all in a divorce. It never ceases to amaze me when this eventually comes out in the open! Agreed. I honestly think that most womens definition of fairness is 75/25 to them, whereas most men think 50/50 is fair. I don't believe all women are like this as I know some that aren't. There is no doubt however that many are, even if they think they are not. I speak not from any personal bitterness as I have never been f*cked over, yet I simply say what I observe as I go through life. The truth is women have become spoilt over the last couple of generations to the extent where they now think life revolves around them. With some it's hard to tell the difference between them and little children. The legal system is extraordinarily biased against men during the divorce process and rewards bad behaviour on the part of the woman. Men are penalised whether their behaviour is good or bad. As you've pointed out, it's like a conspiracy of silence up until this point. Part of the reason for this is because if men tell it how it is they are immediately painted by women as 'bitter' or 'losers'. This makes it difficult to impart this knowledge. We live in a feminised society where many men have turned into cowards and are afraid to speak their mind; or worse they've been brainwashed into thinking nothing is wrong. The best advice I will give to my son, is to not marry until he is at least thirty (and only then if he has to), make sure he really knows the woman and ensure she is capable of pulling her own weight (financially). Even then, who can foretell how things can change in 10, 15, 20 years time. As regards the female friends, sooooo true. I am fairly successful. My wife had a particular friend once, her husband wasn't so successful and she was unhappy. She spent years trying to undermine my marriage by constantly running me down to my wife. Eventually after a big argument I told my wife the malicious cow wasn't allowed in the house anymore. My wife understood then what was happening and agreed. Many of my friends have experienced similar. Curiously, this coffee morning husband bashing is common and yet I've NEVER seen men engage in this type of behaviour. As regards the other comments on your bitterness/resentment; I have never yet come across a single woman who will admit to women not being perfect Has any male? It's like a type of gender blindness. They all think well I'm not like that so no other woman can be either. And yet, even the best of women seem to expect preferential treatment, if only in subtle ways that most people no longer notice in society. Just to make myself clear again, I do not tar all women with the same brush. In fact, I would suspect that the more intelligent a woman (which may encompass many of the women on these boards), the less likely she is to fit this mould. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bart of Darkness Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Agreed. I honestly think that most womens definition of fairness is 75/25 to them, whereas most men think 50/50 is fair. I prefer the single bloke option, 100% for me. The legal system is extraordinarily biased against men during the divorce process and rewards bad behaviour on the part of the woman. Men are penalised whether their behaviour is good or bad. Yes, look at the MPC's David Blachflower. His wife cheated on him but because of outdated laws regarding same-sex adultery, he got taken to the cleaners. Not necessarily relevant but I do like to mention it at any possible opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 All men must be bitter, cynical types with personality disorders then I assume? Oh well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted June 19, 2008 Share Posted June 19, 2008 Agreed. I honestly think that most womens definition of fairness is 75/25 to them, whereas most men think 50/50 is fair. I don't believe all women are like this as I know some that aren't. There is no doubt however that many are, even if they think they are not. I speak not from any personal bitterness as I have never been f*cked over, yet I simply say what I observe as I go through life.The truth is women have become spoilt over the last couple of generations to the extent where they now think life revolves around them. With some it's hard to tell the difference between them and little children. The legal system is extraordinarily biased against men during the divorce process and rewards bad behaviour on the part of the woman. Men are penalised whether their behaviour is good or bad. As you've pointed out, it's like a conspiracy of silence up until this point. Part of the reason for this is because if men tell it how it is they are immediately painted by women as 'bitter' or 'losers'. This makes it difficult to impart this knowledge. We live in a feminised society where many men have turned into cowards and are afraid to speak their mind; or worse they've been brainwashed into thinking nothing is wrong. The best advice I will give to my son, is to not marry until he is at least thirty (and only then if he has to), make sure he really knows the woman and ensure she is capable of pulling her own weight (financially). Even then, who can foretell how things can change in 10, 15, 20 years time. As regards the female friends, sooooo true. I am fairly successful. My wife had a particular friend once, her husband wasn't so successful and she was unhappy. She spent years trying to undermine my marriage by constantly running me down to my wife. Eventually after a big argument I told my wife the malicious cow wasn't allowed in the house anymore. My wife understood then what was happening and agreed. Many of my friends have experienced similar. Curiously, this coffee morning husband bashing is common and yet I've NEVER seen men engage in this type of behaviour. As regards the other comments on your bitterness/resentment; I have never yet come across a single woman who will admit to women not being perfect Has any male? It's like a type of gender blindness. They all think well I'm not like that so no other woman can be either. And yet, even the best of women seem to expect preferential treatment, if only in subtle ways that most people no longer notice in society. Just to make myself clear again, I do not tar all women with the same brush. In fact, I would suspect that the more intelligent a woman (which may encompass many of the women on these boards), the less likely she is to fit this mould. Well said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thermo Posted June 19, 2008 Author Share Posted June 19, 2008 All men must be bitter, cynical types with personality disorders then I assume? Oh well... You should have probably tempered your (funny) argument by not implying that all women were like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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