Northern Ireland

[tara747]

WouldBeSeller, welcome to the thread. You mention that you bought your house for c. £100K and spent money on doing it up. How much would you need to sell for to break even?

[Vespasian]

TOP TIP: For first time buyers, NOW is a good time to buy! *

"The man from Pooler-Watson, he says yes!"

[Sogy]

Ah, go on. Go on, go on, go on, go on, go on...

... We ain't not buying one for £180K either...

... nor for £160K...

Oh, yes, we may bother to go viewing one for £150K if it's really well pre-sen-ted, has a good sized garden, and is located off the de-si-rable Creagagh Road or something similar. Which is, I think, about 1 price-year away.

[Sogy]

"The man from Pooler-Watson, he says yes!"

He certainly can offer you a good choice!

[tara747]

... We ain't not buying one for £180K either...

... nor for £160K...

Oh, yes, we may bother to go viewing one for £150K if it's really well pre-sen-ted, has a good sized garden, and is located off the de-si-rable Creagagh Road or something similar. Which is, I think, about 1 price-year away.

Yes, by all means go and view one at £150K - but don't pay more than £110K. Which is still 5.5x average NI salary. Just pricing in the future drops, don'tcha know!

Anyone heard rumours about a public sector pay freeze in the next few years? It's being talked about openly in the Republic.

[FrustratedFTB]

Yes, by all means go and view one at £150K - but don't pay more than £110K. Which is still 5.5x average NI salary. Just pricing in the future drops, don'tcha know!

Anyone heard rumours about a public sector pay freeze in the next few years? It's being talked about openly in the Republic.

Well not if you are near the top of the government then you get somewhere near 16% I believe according to The Independant on a previous post I think :angry: . Aswell as a good few kickbacks from developers I would guess, is that not what all the tribunels are all about down south?

[Sogy]

Yes, by all means go and view one at £150K - but don't pay more than £110K. Which is still 5.5x average NI salary. Just pricing in the future drops, don'tcha know!

Of course, we don't want to outbid you, Tara!

And if the seller is a BTL, we wouldn't be willing to pay even that!

[LondonView]

Just had a flick through a few EA websites to Fermanagh and West Tyrone. I know some of the people whose houses are on there as sale agreed but they were sold 6 months ago or thereabouts. Must not have been too many deals in the interim.

Mate says he needs to sell a house, he has three he got by the usual equity release and btl mortgages from his financial adviser (!). When he went to sell his first property he was told he was mad and so began his landlorism.

Now the figures do not add up and he had a problem with an open drain that to be honest i don't understand but it cost money he doesn't have to put right. He can't get shot of any of the houses although in fairness he has never had a day without a lodger. The houses are now two-three year old and like all things rented in need of TLC.

I think he would cut his price but the EA is telling him to wait until the spring as this is a bad time to sell. Also, he was genuinely chuffed and "doing well for himself, he has a load of houses".

Honestly, and this may sound absolutely ridiculous but since buying the houses he's scored more too, small town Ireland eh, like having a farm in years gone by!

I can very easily see how he has got himself in this situation. My point is this, it has been a gradual easy ride to this point, not a journey in driven ambition to be a landlord, he just followed the crowd, now he doesn't want to be ahead of the crowd because this is not about informed decisions, it has been about being in step with his peers.

IF I'd been in NI since graduating i'd be in the middle of it too.

So based on the impact of low city bonuses infecting the London market and turning the media completely by the new year combined with what i'm guessing is a common hope among EA's that things pick up in the spring I'm thinking next April to be a period of quiet desperation for my mate.

He is an ordinary fella, under 30 and with houses in Belfast and the West and his growing financial pain is the tipping point in my opinion.

[WasSeller (ex-WouldBe)]

... We ain't not buying one for £180K either...

... nor for £160K...

Oh, yes, we may bother to go viewing one for £150K if it's really well pre-sen-ted, has a good sized garden, and is located off the de-si-rable Creagagh Road or something similar. Which is, I think, about 1 price-year away.

It IS off the desirable Cregagh Rd, with a good-sized patio/garden and fish pond (3 koi carp optional), is gorgeous inside, imho.

To answer the break-even q. above, I'd have to sell for about £190 - I didn't keep costs down doing it up 'cos I had no intention of leaving the house and wasn't doing it to flip. Had also drawn down equity to clear the initial doing up debts etc., and since gave up my job to start a business so am back in debt. None of which I know is relevant to potential buyers of my house, just answering the question above!

And for whoever said they didn't agree if people had known about this site in '05 it wouldn't have made a difference - I don't know... If I'd known about it last year I would have sold when I quit my job (Jan this year) and used the proceeds to start my business in London, renting there for a year or two. But all I was hearing from news and peers was about prices going up and up and investment in Titanic Quarter, etc. etc. - ignorantly, I didn't question it, because my mind was on changing my career and I wasn't thinking about property. If by chance I'd come across this, I would have seen things differently. So I'm now telling everyone about the site, even though it might mean I don't sell my gaff.. nightmare.

I do think the prices need a big correction, and I'm hoping it will take a year or two - if only because a massive crash means trouble for everyone, on the ladder or not. I have no idea what the government would do, if anything, to intervene in things and think that's the most unpredictable factor. E.g. they're under pressure from business to scrap that flat rate CGI, which MIGHT stem a flood of BTL properties in April, but who the feck knows. With rising grain and milk prices etc. I can't see them dropping IRs any time soon, so have no idea how this is all going to pan out.

I just hope that the price I need to sell at (to breakeven and start from scratch) is affordable to a couple, or someone with a big deposit, who plan(s) to stay in it for years anyway and would therefore be back in positive equity in a few years and enjoy the house while they're here. I think I'm understanding that some on here believe that because it's a 3-bed terrace it's not worth over 120, but there still are massive variations from area to area; I bought here because it is private, quiet, has a back garden which I can have bbqs in, is roomy enough for me and the mate who rented with me/these days, for friends to stay over, is a 30 min walk to city centre or a £1.20 bus ride and basically has everything I want except warm weather! It was a massive stretch at the time, I needed to borrow and have my family borrow to help, but it was the cheapest I could find in an area I felt safe living in, which was one of the main factors.

Tell you what, half of me is glad I'm getting the learning experience; talk about big lessons. But I would really, really like to make it out by the skin of my teeth.

[Sogy]

It IS off the desirable Cregagh Rd, with a good-sized patio/garden and fish pond (3 koi carp optional), is gorgeous inside, imho.

This means you are A LOT luckier than most terrace owners, because your house WILL sell, while those thousands of dreary dog kennels will not (until they reach the income multiple, of course, somewhere on the other side of the £100K barrier).

However, if I were you I'd try to sell it now, and sell it quickly - reducing it below what similar houses are being "sold" for now. that way you can catch someone who (a) has money, ( does not care about losing it, or wants a house RIGHT NOW. Of course, you need to mind that there's no chain involved, and the buyer looks and feels honest, and can get a mortgage. Unfortunately, an average FTB just cannot buy from you, someone moving will have trouble selling their old house, and every day there are fewer and fewer people beleiving in a "spring revival" - so you'll be having fewer reckless buyers and more anxious fellow sellers.

Wish you good luck!

[pootle]

From the main board

It's been announced - County Derry has been mothballed.

More than 900 computer jobs to go

Seagate has been in the area for 10 years

More than 900 jobs are to be lost in County Londonderry with the closure of the Seagate plant which makes components for hard disc drives.

Staff were given the news at a meeting in the company's Limavady plant on Monday.

Seagate, which has received £12m from Invest Northern Ireland and its predecessor IDB since 2001, will close in the second half of next year.

On the radio now too ...

... "inevitable cost pressure from the Far East" says MD

Edited October 29, 2007 by crash_bang_wallop

[pod]

On Radio Five Live now there's a piece saying that the number of UK reposessions to increase 50% next year and this is taking into account a cut in interest rates.

What happens if interest rates remain the same or increase!

[Sogy]

... "inevitable cost pressure from the Far East" says MD

Yep. And now not only the Far East, but the much nearer East as well.

They don't go on strike every now and then, you know...

[FrustratedFTB]

On Radio Five Live now there's a piece saying that the number of UK reposessions to increase 50% next year and this is taking into account a cut in interest rates.

What happens if interest rates remain the same or increase!

Well Radio 1 has mentioned in the news that there is a possiblity of drops next year. Its amazing how quickly sentiment changes. At the start of the summer all we got was house prices are only going up, you will need to mortgage yourself to 20 times your salary to get on the ladder in a few years time etc

[WasSeller (ex-WouldBe)]

This means you are A LOT luckier than most terrace owners, because your house WILL sell, while those thousands of dreary dog kennels will not (until they reach the income multiple, of course, somewhere on the other side of the £100K barrier).

However, if I were you I'd try to sell it now, and sell it quickly - reducing it below what similar houses are being "sold" for now. that way you can catch someone who (a) has money, ( does not care about losing it, or wants a house RIGHT NOW. Of course, you need to mind that there's no chain involved, and the buyer looks and feels honest, and can get a mortgage. Unfortunately, an average FTB just cannot buy from you, someone moving will have trouble selling their old house, and every day there are fewer and fewer people beleiving in a "spring revival" - so you'll be having fewer reckless buyers and more anxious fellow sellers.

Wish you good luck!

Cheers for the good luck Sogy (you look like one of my carp ).

But yeah, I agree with all of what you say - except that I'm also hoping for a couple buying together, so it is affordable, and about the 'it WILL sell' - don't really believe that any more and am now terrified. I've had it on since July - it was 15k less than another was on for down the road, and 20k less than what one had just gone for. Now it's down a further 20k, am offering to pay stamp duty and have had no further interest - it may be too late already. But I'm just going to have to come up with a way to make enough money elsewhere to mitigate the damage.

...I have a bottle of Bolly I got given for my 30th there that I was keeping to celebrate when the house sold. I think I may tear into that tonight to numb the shock! Anyone else want a glass?

Btw, thanks to everyone who posts links and info. on here, if you didn't take the time to do it we'd all be in the dark. Much appreciated.

Also, sorry for/to anyone working in Seagate - that's truly awful news.

Edited October 29, 2007 by WouldbeSeller

[Vespasian]

Yeah, looks like that big recession we have all been talking about - pretty awful if its your job going out the window

http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:CcbNs...;cd=1&gl=uk

http://www.propertynews.com/brochure.php?r...mp;p=PWCPWC0674

This one is for sale with Pooler/Watson a**holes

[tara747]

Of course, we don't want to outbid you, Tara!

And if the seller is a BTL, we wouldn't be willing to pay even that!

Don't worry, I will not be bidding even at those prices!

WouldBeSeller, I do hope that you sell at or above your break-even price - keep us posted. Unfortunately, FTBs have disappeared and so have investors so it may be hard. Even a couple may not be able to afford it - think about it, you'd need a couple earning 32K each at 3x joint salary. How many couples do you know like that? And not many want to stretch that much any more as having children becomes almost impossible! i.e. it's manageable with two salaries but not one if the mother takes time off to care of them. And children are expensive. Could you afford your house at your asking price?

The location is important, of course - and it will likely sell faster than an apartment, but even prime Dublin and Belfast houses are not selling, so you will have to be realistic about prices. But good luck.

Edited October 29, 2007 by tara747

[Sogy]

This may sound stupid but would it be worthwhile to have a friend who is good at amateur interior design "dress it up for you" - I've seen some diabolical pictures of homes for sale which look as if they had been lived in by squatters. A nice ambience - a cheese and wine open viewing - just a few ideas to maybe help you.

Yes, yes - all the old-fashioned art of selling! I rememeber replacing the smoke alarms in my (sold) house last February - myself, of course. And painting the porches with my son, while my wife pruned the shrubs. And it is sold, sold, sold!

A couple more suggestions: DIY advertise at Gumtree & Craigs List, and print some nice brochures with picrtures, descriptions, price and a hint that the latter is negotiable. Put tose brochures in a wee boh, nailed to the for sale sight post, and write on it: 'Please take one'. That's what all EAs in the States do, so passers-by could read about a house they like. It works!

It is now a real war between the sellers, just like those bidding wars between the buyers a few months ago - and he should wage a total war, no less.

Edited October 29, 2007 by Sogy

[Sogy]

Don't worry, I will not be bidding even at those prices!

Why not?

[WasSeller (ex-WouldBe)]

Don't worry, I will not be bidding even at those prices!

WouldBeSeller, I do hope that you sell at or above your break-even price - keep us posted. Unfortunately, FTBs have disappeared and so have investors so it may be hard. Even a couple may not be able to afford it - think about it, you'd need a couple earning 32K each at 3x joint salary. How many couples do you know like that? And not many want to stretch that much any more as having children becomes almost impossible! i.e. it's manageable with two salaries but not one if the mother takes time off to care of them. And children are expensive. Could you afford your house at your asking price?

The location is important, of course - and it will likely sell faster than an apartment, but even prime Dublin and Belfast houses are not selling, so you will have to be realistic about prices. But good luck.

Thanks very much Tara.

As for the mortgage multiples -do you all believe then that banks will only lend 3x salary? I just don't know if it'll quickly go back to that from the dizzy heights they were (wrongly) lending from - I was thinking 4x salary for a couple earning around 24/25 each, or slightly lower but with a deposit. That's what a big tier of people were earning in the IT job I used to work in - many closer to 30. But as I say, I'm not basing my price on that, just what I can 'afford' - the nightmare is if I have to choose to take a loss on the property now and be homeless and still in debt, or face 3-5 years of struggling to meet the mortgage and having no sort of a life in the hope that I can escape it after that.

DoccyBoy, thanks for your post too - I do think the house looks lovely - decorating it was half the pleasure (although ripping out the kitchen was great craic too). Decluttered, neutral, but warm and inviting - it does look great. I think if I'd a naked Clooney and Jolie draped artistically over my brown leather sofas it still wouldn't be enough! (Mind you, if Clooney was a permanent fixture, I might decide I could live with the mortgage..)

Thanks all again...

Edited October 29, 2007 by WouldbeSeller

[pod]

It is now a real war between the sellers, just like those bidding wars between the buyers a few months ago - and he should wage a total war, no less.

It's war!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYCOyaIUCSo

[WasSeller (ex-WouldBe)]

It's war!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYCOyaIUCSo

Hehe..

Burgundy's my escapism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EfzFh4dVG8I

[Belfast Boy]

Well Radio 1 has mentioned in the news that there is a possiblity of drops next year. Its amazing how quickly sentiment changes. At the start of the summer all we got was house prices are only going up, you will need to mortgage yourself to 20 times your salary to get on the ladder in a few years time etc

You would not believe the rubbish that was spouted by a VI on Radio 2. The usual supply/demand, high employment, market slowing down I really wonder how stupid these people think we are? :angry: There is some major damage limitation going on after the 2 negitive reports on reposessions and mortgages.

No mention of the real factors - mortgage resets + subprime + credit crunch - never mind the crashing housing market in America.

Oh well, they can only get away with spinning this rubbish for a few more months. Things are happening awfully fast.

[Guest vicmac64]

Yes, by all means go and view one at £150K - but don't pay more than £110K. Which is still 5.5x average NI salary. Just pricing in the future drops, don'tcha know!

Anyone heard rumours about a public sector pay freeze in the next few years? It's being talked about openly in the Republic.

I agree _ I can see the writing on the wall so to speak. Our economy is about to go South so Quick people won't know what has hit them.

[WasSeller (ex-WouldBe)]

Yes, yes - all the old-fashioned art of selling! I rememeber replacing the smoke alarms in my (sold) house last February - myself, of course. And painting the porches with my son, while my wife pruned the shrubs. And it is sold, sold, sold!

A couple more suggestions: DIY advertise at Gumtree & Craigs List, and print some nice brochures with picrtures, descriptions, price and a hint that the latter is negotiable. Put tose brochures in a wee boh, nailed to the for sale sight post, and write on it: 'Please take one'. That's what all EAs in the States do, so passers-by could read about a house they like. It works!

It is now a real war between the sellers, just like those bidding wars between the buyers a few months ago - and he should wage a total war, no less.

Just seen this post!

I had considered an open evening but got told by EAs they'd organised a few and no-one had turned up... I still might have to try tho. Have the house on a DIY site already but not Gumtree or Craig's list, should do that too... Might still point them to my estate agent tho, as I don't know the first thing about selling myself? Er, hold on, I don't mean selling myself. I moved away from Alfred St in '05...

Does 'he' refer to me, btw? I'm a bird.

Edited October 29, 2007 by WouldbeSeller