the gardener

I have no particular difficulty with this. We should honour the pension committments but of course: 1) There's no need to pay the entire lump sum in one go, instead pay as the pensions begin to be drawn 2) No further UK funded pension benefits are accrued from the date of leaving the EU. Accrued benefits up to the date of leaving are frozen. The EU27 will have to learn to live within their means without the largesse of the UK. 3) Any future changes to the EU pension scheme cannot result in an increase in UK liabilities. When the EU realise the unsustainability of their pensions and reduce the payouts the UK liabilities will fall in proportion. Another good reason to pay nothing up front.

I see, so the UK benefits from EU trade to the tune of £100Bn+ per year but the EU only benefits by £50Bn? Right. That must be because of the huge trade surplus the UK has with the EU. Oh wait....? Like I said, nonsense, made up Remoaner fabrications. Try harder.

The first of many cracks in the unity of the EU27. Sit tight Mrs May and they'll soon break ranks.

Made up nonsense figures. Also you see only one side. How much is trading with us worth to the EU? You can subtract that off the price for starters.

Well that's about 5 bloody good reasons for voting Leave so far. I've not heard any good ones for Remain yet.

Sounds like weakness from the EU to me. The time to make that offer was when Camoron went to Brussels to negotiate a better deal. Giving him (and the UK) the finger wasn't the wisest of moves. Spending the next year threatening punishments to the UK has further reduced (actually destroyed) any chance of the UK falling for their snares, apart from arch EU-philes such as the likes of Clegg and Farron who would round up their own families and shoot them if the EU demanded it. We. Are. Leaving. The. EU.

I think that's called the bargaining stage of grief. Progress! Well done. Now. Are you ready? ...The UK is leaving the EU. We are not seeking membership of the single market or customs union. The days of the UK paying huge amounts into the EU are gone. It may have made more sense in the past (it didn't) but the importance of EU trade for the UK is in decline (down from ~55% to 44% and falling). Remind me again, how much does Canada pay under their agreement? That's right, a bit fat zero dollars. Granted the EU saves about twice the amount due to the removal of tariffs as Canada but then since import tariffs are in effect a tax on a country's own consumers one could argue that the greatest benefit is to the Canadian side. Edit: No Canadians or EU citizens were harmed or punished in the making of this agreement.

They're powering past us in a fatal tailspin. There's no pulling up possible now, the stick has snapped off in their hands. ?

That worked out well for them didn't it?

ccc I think they're saying Lichtenstein isn't important because the GDP of Lichtenstein is a rounding error of the rounding of the rounding error of the rounding of the entire EU28's GDP. Of course this totally conflicts with the self-same expert's views on UK-EU negotiations where we will be dictated to by the EU and bent over a barrel and have nasty things done to us. This will absolutely occur because they have the whip hand since the EU27 economy is 5 times bigger than the UK. Following this logic of course means that Lichtenstein should have been utterly powerless in their negotiations with the EU but it seems they weren't. Perhaps it's a quantum effect? Basically Remoaners use contradictory arguments, often simultaneously. A bit like having your cake and eating it I suppose.

Do we set the rules for the other 200 countries in the world. A tip for you. You don't play a rigged game. You change the game that you're playing. To win a war you don't fight the battles your enemy wants you to fight but the one's that you want them to fight.

Go on, one more big push and you'll be through the denial phase.

I doubt it's even 21%. Probably only about 3% are die-hard Brexit deniers.

You are a butt-hurt millenial AICMFP.

That term has been used to describe virtually even country in Europe, from the Ottoman Empire, the UK (1970s), Germany (late 80s-early 2000s), Italy (2005), Russia, Portugal (2007), Greece (2009), France (2010s), Finland (2015-16) and not forgetting the EU itself (2011 Due to the Eurozone crisis, "The EU: The real sick man of Europe"). Looks like your beloved EU is the current holder of that title, having received it from France and Germany ?