Excellent News - Uk Imports Another Heroin Smuggler

[hev]

You are ignoring the 89% of consumers who manage their habit and live a normal life. You might just as well ask what is normal about sado-masochistic sex.

You may be the expert on that!

What would I know, I'm only a drugs/mental health worker who picks up the pieces and notes the cost in real terms!

[hev]

Nothing. That's half the fun of it

or should it be ?

[Kurt Barlow]

You may be the expert on that!

What would I know, I'm only a drugs/mental health worker who picks up the pieces and notes the cost in real terms!

I think the point is that it is evident that prohibition is not working and simply hands the trade over to criminals and criminalises the users.

I remember E being £5 a tab - whats it know £1-£2

[Guest theboltonfury]

Well, if legality is the issue, legalise all hard drugs now. Why should anyone have the right to interfere with what an individual chooses to consume?

Because someone has to pay for the 'free' healthcare, social support, incapacity benefit and child care to sort these people out.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

Because someone has to pay for the 'free' healthcare, social support, incapacity benefit and child care to sort these people out.

I actually agree with crash here. Legalise the lot and remove all benefits and healthcare for drug related. Time for Darwin to have his say.

[Kurt Barlow]

Because someone has to pay for the 'free' healthcare, social support, incapacity benefit and child care to sort these people out.

Most of the healthcare issues arise from problems associated with the criminality of drugs. Legalise & license much of this cost will be removed. Secondly taxation from the sale of licensed drugs will more than offset the cost of education, healthcare etc.

Lets face it the cost of drugs related policing / healthcare is huge know. We are already paying it.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

Most of the healthcare issues arise from problems associated with the criminality of drugs. Legalise & license much of this cost will be removed. Secondly taxation from the sale of licensed drugs will more than offset the cost of education, healthcare etc.

Lets face it the cost of drugs related policing / healthcare is huge know. We are already paying it.

Yes.

Sadly.

But yes.

[Guest AuntJess]

You may be the expert on that!

What would I know, I'm only a drugs/mental health worker who picks up the pieces and notes the cost in real terms!

That pretty well draws up the 'camps' on here.There's them wot have to pick up pieces - like thee and me - and them wot get all defensive and want to justify any sort of drug habit.

Just for the record - in case those with poor comprehension skills by constantly stating a case, convince skip readers of their veracity - I don't believe in prohibition of alcohol. I think that alcohol in moderate amounts can be beneficial - as it relaxes the arteries. Having done research in this area, I can say that it DOES tax the liver, as said organ has to detoxify any alcohol we ingest turning it from acetyl-formaldehyde - a deadly poison - into a harmless substance. The more we ingest the more liver damage we sustain.

Why else has liver transplants become necessary for young people - when 40 years ago this was unheard of? Managing to get to my age enables me to know one inescapable truth: the 'piper' must always be 'paid'.

Or as the old proverb states " Take what you want from life" says God " but pay for it".

[Guest AuntJess]

Most of the healthcare issues arise from problems associated with the criminality of drugs. Legalise & license much of this cost will be removed. Secondly taxation from the sale of licensed drugs will more than offset the cost of education, healthcare etc.

Lets face it the cost of drugs related policing / healthcare is huge know. We are already paying it.

So you think that people must be allowed to have a drug habit - which most of them steal, mug and rob to finance. Why not also give thieves loads of cash, so they won't break into houses and hurt people?

Some world you want to create there.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

[/b]

That pretty well draws up the 'camps' on here.There's them wot have to pick up pieces - like thee and me - and them wot get all defensive and want to justify any sort of drug habit.

Just for the record - in case those with poor comprehension skills by constantly stating a case, convince skip readers of their veracity - I don't believe in prohibition of alcohol. I think that alcohol in moderate amounts can be beneficial - as it relaxes the arteries. Having done research in this area, I can say that it DOES tax the liver, as said organ has to detoxify any alcohol we ingest turning it from acetyl-formaldehyde - a deadly poison - into a harmless substance. The more we ingest the more liver damage we sustain.

Why else has liver transplants become necessary for young people - when 40 years ago this was unheard of? Managing to get to my age enables me to know one inescapable truth: the 'piper' must always be 'paid'.

Or as the old proverb states " Take what you want from life" says God " but pay for it".

Cigerettes are my sin.

Even the local shop keeper has started questioning my habit.

[Guest skullingtonjoe]

[/b]

That pretty well draws up the 'camps' on here.There's them wot have to pick up pieces - like thee and me - and them wot get all defensive and want to justify any sort of drug habit.

Just for the record - in case those with poor comprehension skills by constantly stating a case, convince skip readers of their veracity - I don't believe in prohibition of alcohol. I think that alcohol in moderate amounts can be beneficial - as it relaxes the arteries. Having done research in this area, I can say that it DOES tax the liver, as said organ has to detoxify any alcohol we ingest turning it from acetyl-formaldehyde - a deadly poison - into a harmless substance. The more we ingest the more liver damage we sustain.

Why else has liver transplants become necessary for young people - when 40 years ago this was unheard of? Managing to get to my age enables me to know one inescapable truth: the 'piper' must always be 'paid'.

Or as the old proverb states " Take what you want from life" says God " but pay for it".

Friday and Saturday nights, most of the UK`s casualty wards look like a major disaster`s just taken place!

[Guest AuntJess]

Cigerettes are my sin.

Even the local shop keeper has started questioning my habit.

I too once smoked and my health was affected and it was only 10 or less per day at that - of low tar. I wish I'd never done it at all, and tell others of this, but one thing I have learned: You can't put an old head on young shoulders. We all learn our lessons as we get older and must also learn abide by the consequences of our behaviour.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

I too once smoked and my health was affected and it was only 10 or less per day at that - of low tar. I wish I'd never done it at all, and tell others of this, but one thing I have learned: You can't put an old head on young shoulders. We all learn our lessons as we get older and must also learn abide by the consequences of our behaviour.

. . . got other issues too. But there's a time and a place.

[Guest AuntJess]

Friday and Saturday nights, most of the UK`s casualty wards look like a major disaster`s just taken place!

Yep. Where I differ from a few on here is that I'd like to remove /change the circumstances that drives folks to drink and drugs - through education, and creating a fair way of life. which pretty much damns this NuLab lot to the eternal fires.

[Guest AuntJess]

. . . got other issues too. But there's a time and a place.

Feel free to PM me. As to smoking: what helped me was working in a hospice and seeing how smokers can end up. It isn't pretty and it is a helluva way to go. Chew gum instead. You might get tum ulcers but those can heal...lung cancer can't.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

Feel free to PM me. As to smoking: what helped me was working in a hospice and seeing how smokers can end up. It isn't pretty and it is a helluva way to go. Chew gum instead. You might get tum ulcers but those can heal...lung cancer can't.

I'm jokin' Aunty. I am fvckin' crazy yes, but it's all good.

Lung cancer, yeah, the old boy died last Sept of it. Real nasty exit that. Well he had oesphogeal and other secondaries every where in the end. The tumor behind his one of his eyes prevented the Doc from closing it such was the pressure forcing the eyeball out.

I also work with asbestos.

[Guest AuntJess]

I'm jokin' Aunty. I am fvckin' crazy yes, but it's all good.

Lung cancer, yeah, the old boy died last Sept of it. Real nasty exit that. Well he had oesphogeal and other secondaries every where in the end. The tumor behind his one of his eyes prevented the Doc from closing it such was the pressure forcing the eyeball out.

I also work with asbestos.

A girlfriend of mine lost her OH to lung cancer and he had only worked with asbestos for 6 months - in his teens. Take care, hon.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

A girlfriend of mine lost her OH to lung cancer and he had only worked with asbestos for 6 months - in his teens. Take care, hon.

Ah sh1t, I've sorted about 300,000 tonnes of dirt contaminated with the stuff. Got a real nasty wee job coming up soon, the design is scary. I'll change it. I'm still the boss.

It's no joke that stuff. I've friends who lost family and have flecks in their lungs too. These are the old boys that used to mix it by hand to make pipe lagging. They were told to wear a hanky over their face and drink milk. This was in the 50's/60's.

They knew it was a carcinogen back in 1890 something. Exposure to the silicate dust results in the consumption of the lung.

[HPC001]

The sad thing is a homeless charity and the like are more likely to help someone hooked on drugs\alcohol etc than a normal young person down on his luck...*sigh*

[Guest AuntJess]

The sad thing is a homeless charity and the like are more likely to help someone hooked on drugs\alcohol etc than a normal young person down on his luck...*sigh*

My son reckons that if he'd been a bad lad and gone to jail, they'd have kept him and educated him for nowt, so that when he emerged he would not have any student debts - like he ended up with, by doing it the 'righteous' route.

...and they say crime doesn't pay.

[Guest Parry aka GOD]

The sad thing is a homeless charity and the like are more likely to help someone hooked on drugs\alcohol etc than a normal young person down on his luck...*sigh*

Yes such is the social injustice of the UK my friend.

Where I lived in the UK, the road, most were 'drug rehab centres'. Hilarious. What a scam. I was good friends with one of the owners who was shocked at the hand outs these were getting. £200 a week was typical, cash, add to that the council paid rent and food and other bits and pieces.

Years ago when I was running the UK's biggest land regen project at the time (I was 25, worked 14 hours a day, had no social life), I used to return home sometimes (job was 200 miles away, took 6-8 hours to get home usually) and take abuse off these tossers. They were on more money than I was. Living in places I could not afford, paid for by the likes of me. All because they had opted to screw up their lives.

You might see why I can be a little right wing sometimes.

[HPC001]

My son reckons that if he'd been a bad lad and gone to jail, they'd have kept him and educated him for nowt, so that when he emerged he would not have any student debts - like he ended up with, by doing it the 'righteous' route.

...and they say crime doesn't pay.

Maybe. As for student debt, well I've resigned myself to approximately £30,000 (a typical figure these days) of that by the time the 3 years of a degree are complete. I'll still struggle for money because the government assumes that my (non-existent) parents will shower me with it, and that I magically don't have to pay rent in the summer...

Yes such is the social injustice of the UK my friend.

Where I lived in the UK, the road, most were 'drug rehab centres'. Hilarious. What a scam. I was good friends with one of the owners who was shocked at the hand outs these were getting. £200 a week was typical, cash, add to that the council paid rent and food and other bits and pieces.

East London is largely one big benefit leech, I've even considered moving there because of the DSS-friendly environment. However I'd be condemning myself to a lack of opportunities and potentially ruining the next generation's future if I did so.

Years ago when I was running the UK's biggest land regen project at the time (I was 25, worked 14 hours a day, had no social life), I used to return home sometimes (job was 200 miles away, took 6-8 hours to get home usually) and take abuse off these tossers. They were on more money than I was. Living in places I could not afford, paid for by the likes of me. All because they had opted to screw up their lives.

You might see why I can be a little right wing sometimes.

Where was this project if you don't mind me asking? Up north somewhere I take it?

[Kurt Barlow]

So you think that people must be allowed to have a drug habit - which most of them steal, mug and rob to finance. Why not also give thieves loads of cash, so they won't break into houses and hurt people?

Some world you want to create there.

Straw(wo)man arguement there Aunt J

Steal, mug, rob is a symptom of a system that prohibits and thus passes the supply into the hands of criminals as it did in prohibition era USA.

Oh - and prohibition is working so well now - I mean how on earth could I get my hands on any drugs.

Heres a little test - would you consume heroin if you could buy it from a licensed chemist? - probably not and neither would I. The point is if people are going to use they are going to use and no amount of laws / draconian punishments are going to stop people. Laos has the death penalty - that hasn't stopped the trade.

If you legalise and apply standards you take much of criminality out of the trade and you have a far better chance of educating people not to use / treat users if they are not criminalised.

Smoking being a good case where prevalence has fallen year on year on the back of good targetted education / promotion and assistance to those wishing to give up.

All criminalisation has done is create a massive income stream for organised crime and terrorists - where do you think Al Quedas /Talibans funds come from (Heroin taxes in the growing regions). Decriminalise and you strip them of their funding.

[Guest AuntJess]

Straw(wo)man arguement there Aunt J

Steal, mug, rob is a symptom of a system that prohibits and thus passes the supply into the hands of criminals as it did in prohibition era USA.

Oh - and prohibition is working so well now - I mean how on earth could I get my hands on any drugs.

Heres a little test - would you consume heroin if you could buy it from a licensed chemist? - probably not and neither would I. The point is if people are going to use they are going to use and no amount of laws / draconian punishments are going to stop people. Laos has the death penalty - that hasn't stopped the trade.

If you legalise and apply standards you take much of criminality out of the trade and you have a far better chance of educating people not to use / treat users if they are not criminalised.

Smoking being a good case where prevalence has fallen year on year on the back of good targetted education / promotion and assistance to those wishing to give up.

All criminalisation has done is create a massive income stream for organised crime and terrorists - where do you think Al Quedas /Talibans funds come from (Heroin taxes in the growing regions). Decriminalise and you strip them of their funding.

I think you are trying to justify the consumption of a dangerous substance which destroys individuals and society. Dunno what the buzz phrase is for that, guess there aint' one. It is just plain common sense.

But you have just self- selected for one of the two camps.

[Kurt Barlow]

I think you are trying to justify the consumption of a dangerous substance which destroys individuals and society. Dunno what the buzz phrase is for that, guess there aint' one. It is just plain common sense.

But you have just self- selected for one of the two camps.

Im not trying to justify consumption - drugs are a mugs game.

But the evidence is conclusive - prohibition don't work either.

or Perhaps it does - could you cite any examples from round the world?