Cornwall

[NeilP]

Amongst the large number of holiday lets that are coming onto the market, house prices are starting to fall too.

Here's a good one - screen shot attached.

£20K reduction.

There are also alot more properties up for sale - This seems to increase weekly.

It looks like the waiting game is starting to pay off

[cannycat]

Amongst the large number of holiday lets that are coming onto the market, house prices are starting to fall too.

Here's a good one - screen shot attached.

£20K reduction.

There are also alot more properties up for sale - This seems to increase weekly.

It looks like the waiting game is starting to pay off

When the brown stuff really does hit the fan, and all those City boys and girls with 3 holiday homes start selling up and/or not invading us every summer, it'll become quite apparent just how done for the south west 'economy' really is.....

Lots of farms gone as they've been sold for holiday homes/bought by people who have no clue how to raise a pot of mint never mind any useful edible crops; no heavy industry since the time of Thatcher; and wage differentials between salaries and the cost of living that make my north-east birthplace look positively equitable....

But I forgot. Of course. Devon and Cornwall are immune to the reality the rest of the country is shortly going to be facing.... all those chi-chi art shops, exclusive boutiques, and coffee shops in the South Hams won't go bust here, it couldn't happen as 'everyone wants to live in the south west because of the lifestyle' (based on 1-4 weeks every summer, not the reality of living here!)

Still, if it means the south west can go back to being a genuinely good place to live, where people can afford to buy homes, raise families and have a life, that can only be a good thing... I just think we're in for a good few years of pain and grief first!

[NeilP]

But I forgot. Of course. Devon and Cornwall are immune to the reality the rest of the country is shortly going to be facing.... all those chi-chi art shops, exclusive boutiques, and coffee shops in the South Hams won't go bust here, it couldn't happen as 'everyone wants to live in the south west because of the lifestyle' (based on 1-4 weeks every summer, not the reality of living here!)

I know what you mean. Still, even the hardened 'House Prices will only rise' brigade are now starting to accept it I think.

[reign1]

Hi,

I am moving to Falmouth this summer to start a job there. I've been following both the rental and the sales market for the past couple of months. One thing that struck me is the small number of nice, 3/4 bedroom family homes (garage, garden) available for rent compared to the huge (and growing) number of such properties available for sale.

Does anyone have an explanation for this? Is this a seasonal thing? I am not sure whether I should rent the first house that comes my way, or wait in the hope that more rental properties, including perhaps more suitable ones, will come onto the market over the next few months.

Thanks for any insights!

[Edit: sorry if my question is a bit off topic - though there is an obvious link between the question and house prices in Falmouth]

Edited April 17, 2008 by reign1

[The Conveyancer]

Hi,

I am moving to Falmouth this summer to start a job there. I've been following both the rental and the sales market for the past couple of months. One thing that struck me is the small number of nice, 3/4 bedroom family homes (garage, garden) available for rent compared to the huge (and growing) number of such properties available for sale.

Does anyone have an explanation for this? Is this a seasonal thing? I am not sure whether I should rent the first house that comes my way, or wait in the hope that more rental properties, including perhaps more suitable ones, will come onto the market over the next few months.

Thanks for any insights!

[Edit: sorry if my question is a bit off topic - though there is an obvious link between the question and house prices in Falmouth]

It may be because people choose to rent their properties to holiday makers rather than on long lets. That way it makes them more money and they can still use the property for holidays during void periods

[reign1]

It may be because people choose to rent their properties to holiday makers rather than on long lets. That way it makes them more money and they can still use the property for holidays during void periods

Yes, that may be a factor. I also suspect that many of the 3+ bedroom properties are let to students. I originally toyed with the idea of buying given the lack of suitable rental properties. I have now decided against buying, in principle, partly after stumbling across HPC.co.uk.

[stevebrowne]

I don't think it will crash too badly down there. Mix in the fact that people will not go on holiday abroad if money is tight/excahnge rate is bad, and Devon/Cornwall have the UK holiday market wrapped up. At least some of it, anyway.

[NeilP]

I don't think it will crash too badly down there. Mix in the fact that people will not go on holiday abroad if money is tight/excahnge rate is bad, and Devon/Cornwall have the UK holiday market wrapped up. At least some of it, anyway.

Another one of the 'Denial Brigade'.........

It will crash down here as much as anywhere else.

The leisure industry will be hit hard. I know of a few businesses in the industry that went bump last year.

This year I know of reduced bookings (not taking into account Easter that came early) for both accomodation and leisure services.

If money is tight for people and the exchange rate is pants, why would a couple come down here for a holiday spending £300 for just accom and transport when they can go for a week in, say, Malta for £130 B&B each?

I wouldn't.

There are holiday properties at Pendra Loweth, a village of holiday cottages just down the road, that are being put up for sale at an alarming rate. Nobody is buying.

Interesting times lie ahead.

[NeilP]

Hi,

I am moving to Falmouth this summer to start a job there. I've been following both the rental and the sales market for the past couple of months. One thing that struck me is the small number of nice, 3/4 bedroom family homes (garage, garden) available for rent compared to the huge (and growing) number of such properties available for sale.

Does anyone have an explanation for this? Is this a seasonal thing? I am not sure whether I should rent the first house that comes my way, or wait in the hope that more rental properties, including perhaps more suitable ones, will come onto the market over the next few months.

Thanks for any insights!

[Edit: sorry if my question is a bit off topic - though there is an obvious link between the question and house prices in Falmouth]

Hi,

Falmouth is a student town, so many of the 3/4 bedroomed properties are occupied by students.

Where are you looking? The best place would be the local rag that comes out of a Thursday - West Briton. It has a property section and there are alot of rental properties in there. PM me if you want me to send you a copy.

[reign1]

I don't think it will crash too badly down there. Mix in the fact that people will not go on holiday abroad if money is tight/excahnge rate is bad, and Devon/Cornwall have the UK holiday market wrapped up. At least some of it, anyway.

Yep, that's another valid point I have been thinking about. It seems that the prices of some properties in the Falmouth area are going to fall quite a bit. In fact, some new build flats are falling already: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-881...=1&tr_t=buy (down from Ł270.000).

On the other hand, it is possible to find reasonably nice houses for not completely unreasonable prices. Assuming there is a nationwide fall, I expect these properties to preserve more of their current value (more than a London flat, anyway). Which is why I have not ruled out buying completely. I am selling a property abroad so luckily I wouldn't need a mortgage - otherwise I would definitely not buy. Basically, I am trying to work out which will cost me less: STR or cash buying in the near future.

[reign1]

Hi,

Falmouth is a student town, so many of the 3/4 bedroomed properties are occupied by students.

Where are you looking? The best place would be the local rag that comes out of a Thursday - West Briton. It has a property section and there are alot of rental properties in there. PM me if you want me to send you a copy.

Hi Neil,

I am currently located abroad, so I have been looking mainly on rightmove. I am travelling to Falmouth next week, but right now there are only about 3 houses advertised that look remotely interesting... I am glad we turned this into a short family trip, otherwise I would just be wasting my time. Thanks for the tip about the local paper - I'll PM you.

[reign1]

OK, PM didn't work out - may be might fault though. I googled "west briton" and found the local classified page. There are actually two ads there which sound promising - might give them a call. Thanks again for the advice!

[The Conveyancer]

I don't think it will crash too badly down there. Mix in the fact that people will not go on holiday abroad if money is tight/excahnge rate is bad, and Devon/Cornwall have the UK holiday market wrapped up. At least some of it, anyway.

I wouldn't bank on it. The amount of second homes in Cornwall/Devon which are not let is quite high, all the London Bankers. They will start to go on the market once the city jobs losses kick in.

Also the average wage is absolute peanuts. Minimum wage is advertised as a good thing in some places. Skilled workers can expect less than 15k a year, it really is a disgrace just how low wages are.

Many of the visitors to Cornwall are people who have two holidays a year, one abroad and one in Cornwall (very middle class retro at the moment). Many of these would rather still have the holiday abroad and get a tan than spend a week shivering in Cornwall.

Also there have been loads of new holiday homes being built throughout Cornwall in the last few years so there isnt exactly going to be a shortage.

Just my opinion.

[NeilP]

Also the average wage is absolute peanuts. Minimum wage is advertised as a good thing in some places. Skilled workers can expect less than 15k a year, it really is a disgrace just how low wages are.

Spot on.

I think we are classed as one of the, if not the, poorest county in England (Don't start me on the great 'Cornwall is a country' debate).

I think the avg. salary is £14k a year or something.

Unless you work for local government or NHS in well paid professions it is dreadful.

Myself an partner are very lucky as we both have very good jobs in the public sector.

Edited April 17, 2008 by NeilP

[Mrs Bear]

Still, if it means the south west can go back to being a genuinely good place to live, where people can afford to buy homes, raise families and have a life, that can only be a good thing... I just think we're in for a good few years of pain and grief first!

I'm not having a go (far from it) but pls remember it's not just the SW/other holiday areas where locals have been priced out of home ownership. Just the same here in SW London where 30 yrs ago buying a 3-bed semi was nothing so out of the ordinary for young couples. So many of our kids now at similar ages are hard pushed to afford a one-bed flat. I don't know why people in Devon and Cornwall always seem to think it's just them. You have your non-locals buying 2nd homes - for decades we've had foreigners buying 2nd, 3rd and 4th homes that are empty most of the time.

[cannycat]

I'm not having a go (far from it) but pls remember it's not just the SW/other holiday areas where locals have been priced out of home ownership. Just the same here in SW London where 30 yrs ago buying a 3-bed semi was nothing so out of the ordinary for young couples. So many of our kids now at similar ages are hard pushed to afford a one-bed flat. I don't know why people in Devon and Cornwall always seem to think it's just them. You have your non-locals buying 2nd homes - for decades we've had foreigners buying 2nd, 3rd and 4th homes that are empty most of the time.

I know it's not just the south west where there are problems, it's endemic across the whole country! I was born up in the north east and these days house prices are so far out of kilter with local wages up there I don't think I'm ever going to be able to live near my family again!

Unfortunately since the south west is within easy driving distance from London we do seem to have more than our fair share of 2nd, 3rd and 4th homes down here, mainly owned by City boy/girls and their loud braying spoilt kids who invade the surfing beaches every weekend - you see them on the train from Paddington all through the spring and summer... I also appreciate what a problem foreign non-doms are in London, particularly round Kensington/Chelsea and I think that's equally wrong.

Unfortunately the points at which something could have been done are long since gone, and we're all in for a lot of pain in the years ahead, mainly caused by greed and selfishness on the part of a few people who have taken so much more than they need that the rest of us will be left with not enough. Bit like the environment really, but I'll get off that soapbox before I even get on it....

Just for the record, I do have relatives in London and know there are millions of decent, ordinary hardworking people in London struggling to get by too.

[The Conveyancer]

I think the thing about Cornwall is the way the villages have been totally destroyed. The village schools have shut, the children are sent by bus miles away, the community spirit has gone because the village is full of holiday lets. The mines are closing down so the men are either out of work or taking on crappy jobs they hate. Village shops are shut because they are only busy in holiday times. The place is like a morgue out of season. All those wonderful days out are too expensive for the locals. The beaches are full of holiday makers in the season and too cold to benefit from out of season. Buses are very rare so elderly people get stuck in villages with no shops and the only buses run once every two hours.

On the whole the soul has been ripped out of the County. It was a proud County with a strong heritage, you see the flag of Cornwall flying everywhere. Now the young adults are moving away because there is nothing for them anymore, they say they want to come back to bring their kids up in Cornwall but invariably never do because they marry someone who isnt Cornish who doesnt want to move down there or they just cant afford to because of the cost of housing and lack of decent jobs.

It is very, very sad. No doubt Cumbria is much the same but I dont think you can say that London has lost as much as the rural areas

[reign1]

I think the thing about Cornwall is the way the villages have been totally destroyed. The village schools have shut, the children are sent by bus miles away, the community spirit has gone because the village is full of holiday lets. The mines are closing down so the men are either out of work or taking on crappy jobs they hate. Village shops are shut because they are only busy in holiday times. The place is like a morgue out of season. All those wonderful days out are too expensive for the locals. The beaches are full of holiday makers in the season and too cold to benefit from out of season. Buses are very rare so elderly people get stuck in villages with no shops and the only buses run once every two hours.

On the whole the soul has been ripped out of the County. It was a proud County with a strong heritage, you see the flag of Cornwall flying everywhere. Now the young adults are moving away because there is nothing for them anymore, they say they want to come back to bring their kids up in Cornwall but invariably never do because they marry someone who isnt Cornish who doesnt want to move down there or they just cant afford to because of the cost of housing and lack of decent jobs.

It is very, very sad. No doubt Cumbria is much the same but I dont think you can say that London has lost as much as the rural areas

I am sure Cornwall has its share of problems, but it also has its fair share of attractions. I have lived in central London for a number of years. Stayed in London recently for a couple of days and hated the noise and pollution. I am moving to Falmouth with my family and I am absolutely looking forward to what the sea and countryside has to offer. Cornwall seems like a brilliant place to bring up small kids.

[NeilP]

I think the thing about Cornwall is the way the villages have been totally destroyed. The village schools have shut, the children are sent by bus miles away, the community spirit has gone because the village is full of holiday lets. The mines are closing down so the men are either out of work or taking on crappy jobs they hate. Village shops are shut because they are only busy in holiday times. The place is like a morgue out of season. All those wonderful days out are too expensive for the locals. The beaches are full of holiday makers in the season and too cold to benefit from out of season. Buses are very rare so elderly people get stuck in villages with no shops and the only buses run once every two hours.

On the whole the soul has been ripped out of the County. It was a proud County with a strong heritage, you see the flag of Cornwall flying everywhere. Now the young adults are moving away because there is nothing for them anymore, they say they want to come back to bring their kids up in Cornwall but invariably never do because they marry someone who isnt Cornish who doesnt want to move down there or they just cant afford to because of the cost of housing and lack of decent jobs.

It is very, very sad. No doubt Cumbria is much the same but I dont think you can say that London has lost as much as the rural areas

Ahem, you make it sound alot worse than it actually is!

[The Conveyancer]

Ahem, you make it sound alot worse than it actually is!

I suppose it depends on what part of Cornwall you live in. If you are in the traditional mining villages, it really is that bad

[cannycat]

I suppose it depends on what part of Cornwall you live in. If you are in the traditional mining villages, it really is that bad

As is Cumbria, as is Northumberland, as are many, many rural areas round the UK....

They're great for retired people on a decent pension who don't need to worry about employment; great to bring up small kids (assuming you're in relatively safe, relatively well-paid employment), but once those kids get to the age of needing jobs, then they will struggle and end up having to move to the larger cities as large firms/organisations just don't invest down here. Exeter Council still regularly bangs on about all the inward investment and opportunities created by, er, the Met Office although it's now several years ago and they brought most of their staff with them.

There is also a lot of hidden poverty here, and though the south west is beautiful it can be very isolating if you don't have your own transport or a very good social network.

[yawnIHateSundays]

I don't think it will crash too badly down there. Mix in the fact that people will not go on holiday abroad if money is tight/excahnge rate is bad, and Devon/Cornwall have the UK holiday market wrapped up. At least some of it, anyway.

Don't count on it. We used to live in Plymouth, put house on the market in Dec '89 at £125K, eventually sold in Aug '91 for £95K. It was bad in the last crash and it will be no different this time.

[Antsy]

I am sure Cornwall has its share of problems, but it also has its fair share of attractions. I have lived in central London for a number of years. Stayed in London recently for a couple of days and hated the noise and pollution. I am moving to Falmouth with my family and I am absolutely looking forward to what the sea and countryside has to offer. Cornwall seems like a brilliant place to bring up small kids.

See you there - we're off to Truro for much the same reason and from much the same place in a few months. I grew up near there and have persuaded the Mrs to relocate for the kids' sake. Spent a very interesting few days recently viewing rentals. Apparently lots more are coming on presently as people can't sell and don't know what else to do with their personal millstone. Hence, the EA said rents were going down. Hooray! And just when I thought the good news was over, she added that 6000 more houses were being constructed presently on one side of the City alone. That'll put some nice downward pressure on...

[juvenal]

See you there - we're off to Truro for much the same reason and from much the same place in a few months. I grew up near there and have persuaded the Mrs to relocate for the kids' sake. Spent a very interesting few days recently viewing rentals. Apparently lots more are coming on presently as people can't sell and don't know what else to do with their personal millstone. Hence, the EA said rents were going down. Hooray! And just when I thought the good news was over, she added that 6000 more houses were being constructed presently on one side of the City alone. That'll put some nice downward pressure on...

Did I read somewhere that a university is scheduled for down that way shortly?. If so, that will create serious housing demand.

[NeilP]

Did I read somewhere that a university is scheduled for down that way shortly?. If so, that will create serious housing demand.

We have already have the University College Falmouth.

What you might have heard was that a new Dental school is being constructed (as I speak, 50m from where I am sitting right now) on site at Royal Cornwall Hospital, in Truro.