de1976 Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Hi there, Have recently received instruction to pay second 20% installment on LJDF VVT-8 villa. Am considering selling. Can anyone provide advice how I would go about this and does anyone have experience of reselling on the project? If so what has the growth been? Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nix Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 (edited) you might struggle to sell at any sort of premium to be honest - altho i am not a owner at Saidia so someone else may be able to offer you a better insight i think LJDF will deliver a good product for end users but the initial prices were too high so not really suitable for flipping before completion Edited January 24, 2008 by nix Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbox Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Let us know how you get on. I agree with Nix, I dont think flipping is worthwhile if you want a profit. Value wont be established until people start experiencing the development. There is a lot of bull spoken of about flipping, for example someone told me they made £60,000 by flipping a Cypriot property, but when I dug deeply they made just £7000 after costs! I think flipping unless you are lucky, is not really a feature of any market now. In case you want a comparison to discuss with potential buyers, you might do well to refer them to the Alhama Sports development by Polaris World in Murcia, Spain where the entry level on golf villa with own pool is £445,000 (not euros) and is a 20 minute drive from nearest beach and no marina etc. Spain is 'known and touched' but I see no reason why LJDF in Saidia will not reach price parity once 30,000 end users pass through per week and want to buy into the facility laden lifestyle experience. Its not Spain, but Saidia will have so much more to offer than this Spannish example I give so surely a beach & marina factor will offset the 'its not in Spain' factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonkers Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 I am surprised that you have been asked to pay your second instalment as I just heard from the Owners Group that although the licences were due to be issued shortly, PL had not called for the 2nd instalment yet? I tried to sell on a few months back and contacted a few agents, but as PL still had some villas for sale they said that it was very unlikely unless I was happy to take a drop. They were showing as avalable for several months but have now amended their website so that no available properites are showing - you have to contact agents to see what's available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fws Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 Love your enthusiasm Dogbox, but just a gentle reminder. Morocco isn't Spain and prices are much, much cheaper. We were all carried away with the hype a couple of years ago, but let's face the truth. Prices are the same as they were then and the properties,as Jonkers has already found, are virtually impossible to sell anyway. I still think it's a great buy in the long term, but knowing what we know now, it's certainly not been a good buy in the short term. I pity anyone who really needs to sell, although I have no sympathy for investors who were planning on flipping from the outset. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catara Posted January 24, 2008 Share Posted January 24, 2008 In case you want a comparison to discuss with potential buyers, you might do well to refer them to the Alhama Sports development by Polaris World in Murcia, Spain where the entry level on golf villa with own pool is £445,000 (not euros) and is a 20 minute drive from nearest beach and no marina etc. Dogbox, why do you keep comparing with the Polaris World properties? Everybody and their dog knows that those properties are a BIG fiasco, hugely overpriced, unhabited and where everybody wants now to sell for a loss. I am not a huge fan of Spanish properties at current prices (I might change my view if they drop by 30%-40%), but there are still infinitely better deals than Polaris World. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amoflaherty Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 I am surprised that you have been asked to pay your second instalment as I just heard from the Owners Group that although the licences were due to be issued shortly, PL had not called for the 2nd instalment yet?I tried to sell on a few months back and contacted a few agents, but as PL still had some villas for sale they said that it was very unlikely unless I was happy to take a drop. They were showing as avalable for several months but have now amended their website so that no available properites are showing - you have to contact agents to see what's available. I think re-sale to Brits will be harder now with the GBP rate against the Euro in decline. The rate was probably around 1.52 when you reserved your villa and determined the UK price, anybody doing the same now 1 year on will view your villa as more expensive with rate now at 1.33. Also deals can be done in Spain etc. to get discounts off sale price as market is in bad shape - LJDF aren't offering discounts YET. I think Fadesa will be first to start discounting what they have built and not sold, rather than just let units empty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catara Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Also deals can be done in Spain etc. to get discounts off sale price as market is in bad shape - LJDF aren't offering discounts YET. I think Fadesa will be first to start discounting what they have built and not sold, rather than just let units empty. MOrocco was just late to the real estate party. They counted on high prices in Spain to sell overpriced properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nix Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 MOrocco was just late to the real estate party. They counted on high prices in Spain to sell overpriced properties. This is not true at all - plenty of people have/are making good money out of Moroccan real estate - the fact is that the Brits are late to the party but the party is not over by any means - plenty of french and the moroccan themselves have made a killing out there over the past few years and i still believe there is good couple of years growth at least out there however i am talking mostly about city centre properties which have a strong local demand - Saidia et al are a whole other matter and i have said since day 1 that Saidia was massively overpriced for offplan property in an unknown area - basically LJDF and Saidia in general was one of the first developments to be strongly marketed in the UK and it seems UK investors are too lazy to get off their arses and actually go and do some research into what exactly is available elsewhere in Morocco... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogbox Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 Love your enthusiasm Dogbox, but just a gentle reminder. Morocco isn't Spain and prices are much, much cheaper. We were all carried away with the hype a couple of years ago, but let's face the truth. Prices are the same as they were then and the properties,as Jonkers has already found, are virtually impossible to sell anyway. I still think it's a great buy in the long term, but knowing what we know now, it's certainly not been a good buy in the short term. I pity anyone who really needs to sell, although I have no sympathy for investors who were planning on flipping from the outset. Keep the faith dude! This was never going to be a flipper. It's all about the end user experience. Again last night we spent a few hours looking at what is available villa wise for £1000 per week (not inc flight costs) in high season in Portugal and Spain and believe me you absolutely cannot get anything with own pool, on or very close to a beach or with leisure facilities. If you want the combination of close beach, own pool, leisure facilities, grass garden (not stoney un child freindly) and golf you need about £2000 per week. Note many are advertised from £400 but this is a fantasy. The cheapest we found was £500 per week for a villa with no pool (a shared pool is available 500m away), no leisure or sports facilities, and a good 10 minute drive from a small ok beach and no green garden - just a stone and tarmac affair so no good for child play. As soon as you add own pool, beach and grass garden (essential for us) and so on in, the prices rocket. We tried Turkey and thought we had identified an ok target in Calcan at £1400 per week, but then discover no green garden, no leisure facilities, no golf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catara Posted January 25, 2008 Share Posted January 25, 2008 This is not true at all - plenty of people have/are making good money out of Moroccan real estate - the fact is that the Brits are late to the party but the party is not over by any means - plenty of french and the moroccan themselves have made a killing out there over the past few years and i still believe there is good couple of years growth at least out therehowever i am talking mostly about city centre properties which have a strong local demand - Saidia et al are a whole other matter and i have said since day 1 that Saidia was massively overpriced for offplan property in an unknown area - basically LJDF and Saidia in general was one of the first developments to be strongly marketed in the UK and it seems UK investors are too lazy to get off their arses and actually go and do some research into what exactly is available elsewhere in Morocco... I was also refering to the development strongly marketed in the UK. The same is true in Spain, only the overpriced developments like Polaris are strongly marketed in UK, the ones with better prices are sold to people who actually do some research before buying. I am sure that there are and will be good opportunities in Morocco but only the ones who do not sell will be very strongly marketed, the others will sell because they are good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferrari430 Posted January 26, 2008 Share Posted January 26, 2008 My rule of thumb is to buy in city centers only. A city like Marrakech or even Fez will never loose its charm. They have history, they have celebrity status and now with cheap flights accessability. When i thought of morrocco 1 year ago I was not interested in these northern beach locations at all - its like buying on the black sea coast - bulagria - no one can sell - its like buying on the turkish coast - very difficult to sell again (my friend has been trying to sell without success for the last year). Its very important to do background research and not buy just from an ad campaign from the UK. I know we have made a lot of equity in our british property but frankly I think we are throwing it away. A lot of investors have bought but v few have had success selling and making a profit mainly in these emerging locations such as morrocco, bulgaria, turkey, germany (another big con - I have a german estate agent as a aquintance and she thinks it is stupid to buy in berlin!). Anyway, it is still probably worth buying in marrakech or Fez if you do feel the urge to buy in morrocco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amoflaherty Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Keep the faith dude! This was never going to be a flipper.It's all about the end user experience. Again last night we spent a few hours looking at what is available villa wise for £1000 per week (not inc flight costs) in high season in Portugal and Spain and believe me you absolutely cannot get anything with own pool, on or very close to a beach or with leisure facilities. If you want the combination of close beach, own pool, leisure facilities, grass garden (not stoney un child freindly) and golf you need about £2000 per week. Note many are advertised from £400 but this is a fantasy. The cheapest we found was £500 per week for a villa with no pool (a shared pool is available 500m away), no leisure or sports facilities, and a good 10 minute drive from a small ok beach and no green garden - just a stone and tarmac affair so no good for child play. As soon as you add own pool, beach and grass garden (essential for us) and so on in, the prices rocket. We tried Turkey and thought we had identified an ok target in Calcan at £1400 per week, but then discover no green garden, no leisure facilities, no golf. Don't understand the point you are making comparing renting a villa in Spain/Portugal, of course you aren't going to get a villa by the beach with golf for less than £1000 pw! If you want a cheap villa by the sea with golf then try Africa which is where Sadia. Villa rental prices here pw will be comparable to Sadia. Here is an example in Egypt where you can get fab villas at less than £1,000 a week with beach, golf and marina on your doorstep. http://www.holiday-rentals.co.uk/index.cfm...n%20Type:beach/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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