alexw Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Yet we can see how much money these companies are making. That is what public accounts and auditing are for. Companies do not hide the fact that they are making money, they shout it from the rooftops in order to increase their share price (executive share options). If a company was breaking even using this manipulation, then it would make a loss without it, thus would have to raise prices. Thus far from being a consumer rip off, this is beneficial to the consumer. They are taking money from commodity gamblers to subsidize gas. Off course that is why you are hearing about it and why it is spun in reverse. The city bods take, they don't give. No we don't. We see what they claim to be making on supplying households. But these companies buy and sell electricity/gas on the wholesale market also. So if they are able to manipulate wholesale costs then they can shrink the profit per household supplying retail part, but meta-size the profits they make from supplying wholesale to other energy co's. And it is of course the profits supplying retail that we always discussed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koala_bear Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 No we don't. We see what they claim to be making on supplying households. But these companies buy and sell electricity/gas on the wholesale market also. So if they are able to manipulate wholesale costs then they can shrink the profit per household supplying retail part, but meta-size the profits they make from supplying wholesale to other energy co's. And it is of course the profits supplying retail that we always discussed. Agree than there is the potential for doing that. But there are also plenty of wholesale only suppliers like Total etc. (before we even get to the trading houses). Don't forget that the NG is often upgraded using lighter distillation fractions from refineries (i.e. propane to bring it up to spec). The market is an far more complicated than most people think especially as there is very little storage in the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Lorne Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Agree than there is the potential for doing that. ...... The market is an far more complicated than most people think especially as there is very little storage in the UK. ..thought we had a direct pipeline from Norway for gas now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
koala_bear Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 ..thought we had a direct pipeline from Norway for gas now... ... and you think they treat us like a charity??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thod Posted November 15, 2012 Share Posted November 15, 2012 ... and you think they treat us like a charity??? You got a seller one side of the pipe and a buyer the other. It's in both parties interest to keep the gas going down that pipe. You got a Mexican stand off. Both parties know this. The profit lies in cooperating in a conspiracy against the public rather than a war. No we don't. We see what they claim to be making on supplying households. It seems to me you are suggesting that these companies have retained huge piles of cash in the company. These piles have been hidden from the forensic accountants of their auditing companies and the revenue. If this were true, then whom is controlling this money? If they were to distribute it, it would show up on every shareholders tax return. You would ask us to believe that the directors of these companies are engaged in a massive and widespread fraud. An exceptional claim, so we are justified in demanding exceptional evidence. These secret pots of money must be shown to exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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