Mayor Of Doncaster Says We Could Learn From The Taliban

[Three Pint Princess 2]

When were these remarks made ? the Telegraph doesn't say AFAIK

Because up in Edlington, Doncaster they recently had this happen, I hope I never end up on the wrong

side of a New Labour smear team.

Doncaster torture case: Social workers 'must intervene earlier'

Labour MP calls on government to break the inter-generational cycle of abuse that led to Edlington attack

* Peter Walker

* guardian.co.uk, Friday 4 September 2009 11.59 BST

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/sep/04/d...e-abuse-history

Social workers must intervene earlier in chaotic, violent families, child protection experts warned today,

as more details emerged of the backgrounds of the young brothers who carried out a prolonged torture

attack on two other children in parkland near Doncaster.

The brothers, now aged 12 and 10, pleaded guilty yesterday to a series of charges linked to the horrific

attack, in which close friends aged nine and 11 were beaten, stamped on and pierced with sticks. The

ordeal also involved sexual abuse and humiliations such as being forced to eat nettles.

The older of the two victims almost died when a section of a sink was smashed on to his head and he

was left, unconscious, half-naked and face-down, at the bottom of a steep ravine. He was only found

after the nine-year-old was discovered, bleeding and traumatised, wandering nearby.

...

Doncaster council's troubled children's services department, which had its management team replaced

by Whitehall earlier this year after a string of child deaths, is also carrying out an investigation. Critics

charge that the brothers should have been removed earlier from their anarchic home in another part

of Doncaster where they lived with five siblings and a mother who was reportedly heavily dependent

on cannabis and alcohol.

Britain 'could learn from Taliban family values', says Doncaster's mayor

By Stephen Adams

Published: 7:00AM BST 04 Sep 2009

Peter Davies, who has made it his personal mission to rid Doncaster of political correctness, said that under the Taliban, Afghanistan had an "ordered system of family life".

By contrast he said social policies which disregarded the importance of the traditional family had "created mayhem" in Britain.

...

He stressed that he "detested" the Taliban, but added: "The point I was making was that even a regime as hideous as the Taliban

at least appear to have sort of decent sort of family affairs. In fact probably...they have an ordered society.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/613...ters-mayor.html

[1929crash]

We've got Muslim dating ads coming up! Complete with headcoverings!

I suppose it makes a change from the usual Thai Bride ads, but how come we cant get Gay Bear Dating to come up, no matter how hard we try?

You'd have a shock, General if ads came up with bearded insurgents and the caption "Lonely Freedom Fighter living Desperate Mountain Existence Seeks Straight or Gay Friendships" appeared.

[Guest anorthosite]

No, but how would it go down if a major politician were to stand up and say Hitler did some wonderful things, and that although the holocaust was a terrible thing, it just proved what you could do with an effciently run railway and scientific management?

He'd be right though.

[1929crash]

He'd be right though.

Well, if you got stopped by a singularly ugly policeman with a hideous facial disfigurement and agun, it would be correct if you said it, but personally I'd try a different topic than his facial features.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

Playing devil's advocate, I suspect that if he does cut a load of nonsense from the council budget and slashes 3% from council tax bills Joe Voter's not really going to give a toss what daft verbiage this pompous old curmudgeon comes out with.

What have spin-neutered politicos scared to stray from party-sanctioned soundbites or politically correct orthodoxy ever done for anyone anyway?

[Guest anorthosite]

Well, if you got stopped by a singularly ugly policeman with a hideous facial disfigurement and agun, it would be correct if you said it, but personally I'd try a different topic than his facial features.

You're going to have to translate that one for me

[1929crash]

You're going to have to translate that one for me

1. You get stopped by an ugly policeman.

2. You say "Helllo Officer, you really are ugly."

3. You are correct, but you are not wise.

[Guest anorthosite]

1. You get stopped by an ugly policeman.

2. You say "Helllo Officer, you really are ugly."

3. You are correct, but you are not wise.

And how does that relate to my previous comment?

[1929crash]

And how does that relate to my previous comment?

I thought only cells engaged in this kind of war of attrition.

[Guest anorthosite]

I thought only cells engaged in this kind of war of attrition.

I genuinely don't understand what you meant by your post.

[1929crash]

I genuinely don't understand what you meant by your post.

I suggested that it wouldn't go down too well if a politician said how well the Holocaust had been organised.

You said that he'd be right.

My point was that yes, but it's not a wise thing to say.

[Guest anorthosite]

I suggested that it wouldn't go down too well if a politician said how well the Holocaust had been organised.

You said that he'd be right.

My point was that yes, but it's not a wise thing to say.

That's not quite what you said - I took it that you meant the Nazis achieved a great deal in re-building their country, which they did.

I've also argued for a long time that its about time we dropped the anti-nazi stigma from history and re-evaluate their achievements dispassionately, and see what can be learnt from them.

I know John Gill said the same, but he took it too far.

[Boomer!]

Get yer ankles out for the lads

geeeet yer ankles out for the lads

[Three Pint Princess 2]

I suggested that it wouldn't go down too well if a politician said how well the Holocaust had been organised.

You said that he'd be right.

My point was that yes, but it's not a wise thing to say.

But (as we get further and further from the point) he said this on the same day as the media said this. So he , as Mayor of Doncaster said

things were out of control and even the Taliban could do a better job.

http://news.google.com/news/search?pz=1&am...amp;q=edlington

"In the estate where they had been living previously in nearby Doncaster, their departure was already a cause of some relief.

The inseparable brothers were members of a large and notorious family which had lived there for about eight years in a run-down semi-detached house. "

/

"People living near the brothers' home before they moved to a foster family in the weeks before the attacks said they appealed to the council and police for help to deal with the problems they were causing."

"The unemployed man, whose 10 and 12-year-old sons carried out a vile attack on two young boys, downed a lethal cocktail of booze and pills after discovering their mum had hooked up with a toyboy.

He eventually collapsed outside a parade of shops near his new home and was taken to hospital.

Friends claim he was "messed up" about his sons but went "really bonkers" two weeks ago."

/

"The Edlington attacks have also prompted calls for earlier intervention by social services in family situations where children are at risk of continuing a cycle of deprivation and abuse.

The former Conservative leader Iain Duncan Smith, who has written a book on early intervention, said: "We are seeing a growing level of this dysfunctional behaviour, as there are now a growing number of families who are dysfunctional. "

"What's happening is... dysfunctional kids [are] growing up and then breeding dysfunctional families themselves."

/

"After the brothers first went to court in April, their cannabis-smoking mum, who has seven sons by a variety of fathers, fled the family home with her brood.

Grim ... Sun front page

They only returned briefly to remove a prized possession - a "Beware of the Kids" sign outside.

The mum, 36, is now said to be seeing a new boyfriend aged 29, after meeting him while living in a caravan on the East Coast.

The father, described by neighbours as a violent drunk, has also left the area. The other brothers are aged 18 and under. The 18-year-old had moved out. "

[indirectapproach]

"If a taliban doctor found a cure for cancer, would that not be a good thing? Would you take it?"

If a taliban doctor finds a cure for cancer I will give up smoking and convert to Islam and only drink alcohol in a state of sin.

Until that time maybe the taliban should consider their own casualty count and reach an accommodation with some reasonableness and some sense so they do not sustain another few thousand avoidable civilian casualties over the next 6 months.

All the taliban have to do is prevent their territory from ever being used as a staging ground for attacks against the West (and probably the Russians too and maybe even anyone else like the Indians) and the war is over.

Who cares about Pashtoonwalli?

No one outside of Pashtoon.

It's so simple.

And it doesn't matter how much the taliban raise the stakes, the community of nations have the resources to raise them higher.

And if it gets high enough, what happened in Dresden will happen in taliban town and then maybe the war will be on the way to be being won.

And all the taliban have to do to avoid this is play the game and get reasonable and then no one will care about the barbarism they visit upon their own.

[1929crash]

"If a taliban doctor found a cure for cancer, would that not be a good thing? Would you take it?"

If a taliban doctor finds a cure for cancer I will give up smoking and convert to Islam and only drink alcohol in a state of sin.

Until that time maybe the taliban should consider their own casualty count and reach an accommodation with some reasonableness and some sense so they do not sustain another few thousand avoidable civilian casualties over the next 6 months.

All the taliban have to do is prevent their territory from ever being used as a staging ground for attacks against the West (and probably the Russians too and maybe even anyone else like the Indians) and the war is over.

Who cares about Pashtoonwalli?

No one outside of Pashtoon.

It's so simple.

And it doesn't matter how much the taliban raise the stakes, the community of nations have the resources to raise them higher.

And if it gets high enough, what happened in Dresden will happen in taliban town and then maybe the war will be on the way to be being won.

And all the taliban have to do to avoid this is play the game and get reasonable and then no one will care about the barbarism they visit upon their own.

So you are in favour of mass murder?

[indirectapproach]

Well that's always a delicate one.

I think it's a good idea to be in favour of doing what has to be done to win wars rather than lose them because it's too distasteful to get dirty.

[1929crash]

Well that's always a delicate one.

I think it's a good idea to be in favour of doing what has to be done to win wars rather than lose them because it's too distasteful to get dirty.

I think it's distasteful to kill people. As Harry Patch said before he died, war is organised murder.

[indirectapproach]

Yes, but better to kill than be whacked while upon one's knees.

[1929crash]

Yes, but better to kill than be whacked while upon one's knees.

Nobody in this country is on their knees because of Afghanistan. So why not leave them alone?

[indirectapproach]

That is a very strong point and you are probably right.

The counter argument is that if we back out we are likely to see more 7/7s than less.

[King Stromba]

Isnt this like me saying 'hilter was a guy who could get things done'.

The the rest of the article talking about the bad things hitler did.

[indirectapproach]

And even though I am probably wrong I go with the counter argument.

I think it is necessary to both show and indeed do resolve, perseverance and persistence.

That is eventually what told in Northern Ireland and I think it will tell against this Islamic terrorism.

Staying power.

I do not for a second think we can export democracy or our way of doing things but I think we can prevail upon them to stop killing us and trying to kill us by facing them down.

And that, sadly, probably means killing enough of them for them to get the message that killing us is not a good idea.

If only they placed the same value on their people that we place on ours, there would be so much less killing.

[indirectapproach]

"Isnt this like me saying 'hilter was a guy who could get things done'."

With the greatest of respect, I am not quite sure where you are coming from and I am not quite getting your connection but totally, completely and utterly f8cking not is where I am.

Einsatzgruppen.

Concentration camps.

Genocide.

Deliberate carpet bombing of civilian centres from Warsaw to Rotterdam to Belgrade.

Norway, Denmark, Poland, Holland, Belgium, Greece, Yugoslavia, Albania, France and Russia did not attack Germany.

Ok even if Afghanistan and Iraq didn't attack America that's only two countries as opposed to many.

And 9/11 was a greater atrocity than Pearl Harbor.

Comparing it to Hitler.

F U C K

Hang your head in shame.

For knowing nothing and being glib about that frightful Bohemian corporal.

[King Stromba]

"Isnt this like me saying 'hilter was a guy who could get things done'."

With the greatest of respect, I am not quite sure where you are coming from and I am not quite getting your connection but totally, completely and utterly f8cking not is where I am.

Einsatzgruppen.

Concentration camps.

Genocide.

Deliberate carpet bombing of civilian centres from Warsaw to Rotterdam to Belgrade.

Norway, Denmark, Poland, Holland, Belgium, Greece, Yugoslavia, Albania, France and Russia did not attack Germany.

Ok even if Afghanistan and Iraq didn't attack America that's only two countries as opposed to many.

And 9/11 was a greater atrocity than Pearl Harbor.

Comparing it to Hitler.

F U C K

Hang your head in shame.

For knowing nothing and being glib about that frightful Bohemian corporal.

What are you waffling on about?

I was commentling on the article, not on hitler. The quote is actually from bernie ecclestone. I was stating that the original article, is a quote about the taliban from the doncaster mayor. Which is just a statment of fact, followed by a load of non quoted material about the taliban.

Is crappy sensationalist journalism.