redwine Posted January 22, 2010 Share Posted January 22, 2010 http://blog.charentelibre.com/journal/index.php?post/2010/01/21/4760-28-720-euros-le-pavillon-grace-aux-encheres "Blog Charente libre " " 28720 euros le pavillon grace aux enchères ! "A house sold at an auction for 28720 euros" Quote "The inital asking price was 90k" "However there was nobody at the auction to put up the price apart from one and he played his cards right and got the mini price " Yesterday three properties were sold due to "saises"or non payments Once or twice a month property is sold at a low price much lower than the property market The house that was sold yesterday at "etagnac" for 28720 euros or a total of 35000 euros belonged to a "British couple" A new "phenomère" appears the "saisies" or the baliff's are knocking on the door of more and more British Residents The house in "Etagnac" was bought by a British family in 2006 They started to have credit problems in 2007 Then they "fled la France" leaving there debts behind them The French bank "Crèdit Mutuel" regret's there decision Which means more and more bargains Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 Le journal du Pays Basque Euskal Herriko Kaazeta Section opinion 1/12/2009 Break the law of the housing market and assure the right for everyone to have a home By Anita Lopepe / member of Batasuna (considered as the political voice of ETA ) A statement against the Fnaim an EAs lobby Quote "We do not have the same values or the same points of view" "Baiona will be only 3 hours from Paris if the new high speed train line is built and the property boom that vested interests want will be in our terms very dangerous for them and holiday home owners in this "joli petit coin de France" http://www.lejpb.com/paperezkoa/20100123/178901/fr/La-fin-des-annees-folles-selon-Fnaim La fin des "annèss folles" selon la Fnaim The end of the "mad years according to the Fnaim 23/01 The AGM of the Fnaim was held at St-Jean-de-Luz Quote "You have to admit that we had gotten into a situation of conflict with an average wage of 1200 euros a month prices have reached the summits " "Today the mad years are over we are no longer going to talk about prices going down and vendors will have to accept price falls" "The Fnaim promises for rented property that rents will go down by an average of 10%" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 23, 2010 Share Posted January 23, 2010 http://immobilier-revelateur-de-la-nature-humaine.over-blog.com/ Ninon Ingrid is back France's best known female EA btw she is a real EA and i think that her agency is in Toulouse Her last blog yesterday "Vrai bilan d'une agence de provence and 2010 prespectives" The truth about 2009 and the future of 2010 (property wise) The sad life of an "estate agent" as she calls her blog TBH its worth looking at so you can get an idea of price falls in certain areas (even if you don't understand french) She also noticed a price fall of -5% in 2008 in Toulouse not the -3.1% figures "official" -10% again Toulouse instead of -4.9% 2009 again the Fnaim figures She is also trying to pass a message to her clients "don't put up your prices as the market is fragile" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
south_bound Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 Now thinking about the possibility of buying a plot and getting a house built, which I'm not sure is necessarily a cheaper option but at least we would have better chance of getting what we want. I have contacted the Marie of a small town that is selling building plots (non lotissement) and they talk as if it is fixed price. The one I am interested in seems to have been on sale for a while both directly with the Marie and through agents - is there a protocol regarding offers as with the general housing market? I suspect the price has been based on advice from a notaire or similar and doesn't take account of current economic conditions which why it has not sold. Any comments? As an aside, trawling through the internet looking for self-build resources I came across this article promoting new-build lease-back schemes in Langedoc-Roussilion http://www.escapeartist.com/OREQ29/Real_Estate_in_Languedoc_South_France.html. Not something I am planning to get involved in for very good reasons, but if this is an up-to-date article then its no wonder there are still people coming in with the promise of such get rich quick schemes that have only one way to go - dissapointment all around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 24, 2010 Share Posted January 24, 2010 Now thinking about the possibility of buying a plot and getting a house built, Any comments? As an aside, trawling through the internet looking for self-build resources I came across this article promoting new-build lease-back schemes in Langedoc-Roussilion http://www.escapeartist.com/OREQ29/Real_Estate_in_Languedoc_South_France.html. get rich quick schemes that have only one way to go - dissapointment all around! http://www.adil13.org/ Southbound the above link is for the" Agence Departementale d' information sur le logement des Bouches -du -Rhone" Its ran by the Conseil General de Bouches-du- Rhone ie The french govt You can telephone them and go and see a "specialist" and its free They will explain how to go about building a house your taxes etc You will be getting some real up-dated info alot better than an internet forum Your link looks to me to be The law Demessine -ZRR (Zone de rivitalisation rurale) or "French time-shares" Theres alot been said about this its, for tax -reductions Again lots or investors have lost alot of money through this just like the notarys scandal thats being going on last week although these were LMPs but the same law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 http://www.lefigaro.fr/flash-actu/2010/01/25/01011-20100125FILWWW00543-le-credit-foncier-condamne.php Yet another property rip-off in France this time with "Credit Foncier " or the "Caisse d' Epargne" a french bank that bought them in 1999 They were fined 50,000 euros by a court in Paris today The "action collective " who took them to court confirms over 5,000 victims The bank says that there is only a few hundred Actually this is about sales lies about property lending rates between 2005 and 2007 Be careful of french banks they are often EAs in disguise A French saying " one train can hide another" More like "one EA can hide another EA" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 26, 2010 Share Posted January 26, 2010 Theres lots of property to watch next week on M6( btw this is national TV watched by millions ) It all starts next sunday with" Capital" "Live underground the new fashion a "souplex" caves and cellars that are attracting more and more future property buyers "How to find the best ones and get some real bargains" Next wednesday "maison a vendre" "Rose-lin lives 5 days a week in a caravan where she works this cuts out lots of travelling time and costs" "She leaves her five children by themselves during the week alone they just get on with it" "She wants to build a house nearer to where she works but with only 5 visits in the last 18 months " BTW this one is worth watching because it is in Normandy This is probably the first time that they have left the Paris region but the second one is in Paris After" house for sale" theres "looking for a flat or house" This all starts at 20.40 pm and goes on until 1.00 am Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 http://www.letelegramme.com/ig/generales/economie/immobilier-la-baisse-des-prix-s-accelere-en-bretagne-les-chiffres-28-01-2010-757449.php "Le telegramme " 28/01/ "La baisse des prix s'accelere en Bretagne" Property price falls are accelarating in Brittany These are notary figures showing average price sales in Brittany and the downward spiral that is happening They give prices for every region and dept in Brittany Finistere -14.70% Morbihan -15% Cotes d' Armor -16.5% Ille et Villaine "Rennes" -19.70% Worth looking you don't have to understand French a well done graph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 28, 2010 Share Posted January 28, 2010 http://www.batiactu.com/edito/les-maisons-du-littoral-breton-peinent-a-trouver-d-25100.php The Brittany fall seems to have spread into the Loire - Atlantique This article talks about "holiday -homes" the buyers have vanished or no more buyers Finistere - Nord Around Saint-pol-de-léon Prices down by -20.10% Ea's don't know when the fall will stop "anyone who is trying to sell at 200K we just don't bother putting them on our catologue" I am quoting another link today there is a lot of news about the "Brittany Crash" IMHO for future buyers "watch it fall, keep out" for the good of your bank account Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thod Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 (edited) Guess its time to counter some of the spin. The full document, the article is based on, comes from the chamber of notaires http://www.notaires-ouest.com/media/PDF/NOTAIRES-Baro%20IMMO-01%2010-N4.pdf This shows the price drops of 2009, as expected, but then goes on to say that volumes and prices are rising after the fall in prices. Oddly not mentioned. What you don't get from this is the mechanism. The expensive market died, the 100k houses continued to shift. You can clearly see this by the greater falls on the coasts, where the expensive houses are. If you sell 2x100k houses and 1x200k house, the average price is 133k. If you sell 4x100k houses and 1x200k house, the average price is 120k. No house has been reduced, yet the average price has fallen. Once again not mentioned, yet talk to any EA and they will tell you this is what happened. Edited January 29, 2010 by thod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 29, 2010 Share Posted January 29, 2010 "The connexion" frances english language pro- property newspaper Febuary 2010 This is a pure propoganda "buy property in france newspaper" Quote Housing sales to pick up in 2010 according to Renè Pallincourt the FNAIM "Whats more buyers have taken on board the fact that prices will not drop any more and have stopped speculating on lowering prices" Although 51% of potentiel buyers said that it was hard to get a mortgage 76% thought that prices were still to high" They also talk about poverty in France from a British point of view "We love the life -even if we are skint " The French reply "On ne peut pas vivre d'amour et d' eau fraiche" "We cannot live only with love and fresh water" (a French expression) Another example of a Brit who left London to go and live in Brittany He worked for six years in an a slaughterhouse As he says "there was less stress and we had fun" IM O I would not consider cutting piglets throats open (letting them bled to death) Or electrocuted six month old baby cows not forgeting chickens or chicks As being good fun ! Although this all depends on your point of view They even talk about "Roger Moore" as he says "Where else better to live than France" Easy Roger where you live Geneva in Switzerland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 http://www.sudouest.com/lot-et-garonne/actualite/villeneuvois/article/851688/mil/5654569.html Sud Ouest Lot et Garonne Today Immobilier Les Anglais et le prix reculent Property The English go back and the prices go down Quote "Our English clients of the last 5 to 10 years have indeed disappeared in 2009 and with them the "holiday home market" "Property valued at 200k are now re-calculated with a 30% price drop "Three out of sixteen Fnaim EA members have put the key under the door" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/banking_and_finance/article6999298.ece From the Dordogne dream to shattered lives The times 23/1/10 A british con man and a 2 million property fraud the victims are british and americans I would just like to point out that if someone pays you with a check all you have to do is to sign the back of it and put it into your bank having first completed a coupon in your cheque book called a "remise de chèques à l' escompte" Therefore if you pay with a check you should always check your monthly bank statement also you can take out an insurance with your bank against fraud it costs 40 euros although that depends upon the different banks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 . The full document, the article is based on, comes from the chamber of notaires http://www.notaires-ouest.com/media/PDF/NOTAIRES-Baro%20IMMO-01%2010-N4.pdf This shows the price drops of 2009, as expected, but then goes on to say that volumes and prices are rising after the fall in prices. Oddly not mentioned. What you don't get from this is the mechanism. The expensive market died, the 100k houses continued to shift. You can clearly see this by the greater falls on the coasts, where the expensive houses are. If you sell 2x100k houses and 1x200k house, the average price is 133k. If you sell 4x100k houses and 1x200k house, the average price is 120k. No house has been reduced, yet the average price has fallen. Once again not mentioned, yet talk to any EA and they will tell you this is what happened. http://www.ouest-france.fr/region/bretagne_detail_-La-precarite-traverse-tous-les-paysages-bretons-_8619-1239825_actu.Htm These are notary figures and as it says the vendors are putting there prices down to 2005 prices don't forget that in some areas volumes are down by -70% As for notary figures its only what they say none of there websites show the real price that property was sold for Talk to a French EA i would rather talk to my dog he doesn't tell lies The above link is about the poverty that exists in Brittany the real world or the future buyers ouest -france yesterday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 30, 2010 Share Posted January 30, 2010 BTW thod i didn't post a link to the French Notarys as you say "oddly not mentioned" I posted two links the first one LeTelegramme de Brest and the second one Batiactu if you read the second link it says that even the Bretons can now afford to buy a house there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heading South Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 I very much welcome your regular postings, Redwine and others on the current state of the French property market. So please keep going. I've been thinking of buying a house in France for some time, but with the steep devaluation of Sterling since Gordon Brown became PM in June 2007 (when Sterling was at around Euro1.48), most properties are too expensive for me right now - falling prices have gone nowhere near to cancelling out Sterling's fall. Not that that Sterling's weakness should dictate prices for French buyers, but the type and location of property appealing to the British market needs to fall a lot further in my opinion. Of course asking prices are one thing - actual sale prices are another. It really depends on how flexible sellers are. I can see British sellers who are moving back to the UK being prepared to take a hit, given the currency gain they will make by converting their Euros back to Sterling. However the French sellers are another matter. From what I've heard, they've traditionally seen the Brits as a soft touch prepared to pay over the odds. Have they finally cottoned on to the new reality of Britain as the poor man of Europe again? Or are they going to stay in stubborn denial? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Of course asking prices are one thing - actual sale prices are another. It really depends on how flexible sellers are. . From what I've heard, they've traditionally seen the Brits as a soft touch prepared to pay over the odds. Have they finally cottoned on to the new reality of Britain as the poor man of Europe again? Or are they going to stay in stubborn denial? http://www.blogdegerardpicovschi.com/html/articles/45400454.html Le blog de Gerard Picovschi a French Lawyer 2009 une annee noir pour l'immobilier 2009 a "black year" for French property "The French minister of housing has admitted that you have to go back to 2003 to observe over a 12 month cumulation of only 400,000 new buildings in France and the majority of them are social or council houses" TBH as for "stubborn denial" i disagree with you an empty property can cost alot of money don't be fooled by the "garlic don't care less attitude" its not true although you have this impression (will post later i have alot to say about this) Thank god you understand the "reality of asking prices and real sold for price" Having said that not everybody is born with a business or negociating mind and thats a trap I posted a link to a 2 million property fraud in the Dordogne and this happened due to a simple French check system which due to the lack of knowledge by the victims even though the same banking system existed in the UK until 2006 it turns out to be the fault of the French Bank Learn to speak French before coming to live in France and i do not see why France has to change its banking laws because a "British conman who was as he says "was greedy also his so called victims were like him greedy lost everything " They should consider them lucky due to there greed and stupidity that a French bank has remboursed a third of the money that they lost He should be in a French Prison, lets get rid of him! so why don't you put him into a British prison? Here in France never forget that the "taxman is powerful" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiterabbit Posted January 31, 2010 Share Posted January 31, 2010 Out of interest I normally rent in Provence in the summer but for a change this year we considered the Dordogne. I am staggered at the rental prices people want for so so houses. If you look at the actual value of the houses then people in the Dordogue are expecting twice the rental return as Provence. Is this just "trying it on" or are they really getting such high rents? I mean who in their right mind would pay 2500 euros a week or more for an average 4 bed with small pool in the Dordogne? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agentimmo Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 Out of interest I normally rent in Provence in the summer but for a change this year we considered the Dordogne. I am staggered at the rental prices people want for so so houses. If you look at the actual value of the houses then people in the Dordogue are expecting twice the rental return as Provence. Is this just "trying it on" or are they really getting such high rents? I mean who in their right mind would pay 2500 euros a week or more for an average 4 bed with small pool in the Dordogne? They are trying it on. Big time. The only people mad enough to pay those prices you quote are other Brits. All playing "keeping up with the Jones' with their 2 weeks in "little England". I had a friend from the UK who spend 2 weeks near St. Emilion a few years back. His next door neighbour in the UK was in another villa about 100M from his place at the same time........ The rents paid were "bubble Britain" prices. I suspect quite a few will drop their rents considerably this summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heading South Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 They are trying it on. Big time. The only people mad enough to pay those prices you quote are other Brits. All playing "keeping up with the Jones' with their 2 weeks in "little England". I had a friend from the UK who spend 2 weeks near St. Emilion a few years back. His next door neighbour in the UK was in another villa about 100M from his place at the same time........ The rents paid were "bubble Britain" prices. I suspect quite a few will drop their rents considerably this summer. It would be interesting to know what level of occupancy properties are actually achieving. When I looked for a last minute booking in French villa in the Dordogne last summer, there seemed to be plenty of availability even in the school holiday period. I can only see the situation getting worse this coming summer. 2009 was the first season that renters were faced with the pound as low as Euro1.10 and discovering just how expensive things were (eating out, fuel, etc). The few people who have cash to spare in the present economic climate may well decide to holiday somewhere cheaper this summer. Also I suspect the "keeping up with the Jones" mentality is being replaced by the "we got our 2 week holiday in the sun for only £xxx". I'm convinced most renters and sellers in France are still in denial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted February 1, 2010 Share Posted February 1, 2010 http://www.sudouest.com/charente-maritime/actualite/article/853392/mil/5657307.html Sud -Ouest Charente -Maritime Today "Regional Identities" 13000 British live in the charente -maritime according to INSEE the french govt There's not alot of foreigners who live in the region There are 41300 foreigners living there which is only 2.4% of the population A third of them are British mostly over 50 years old and 85% of them live in "rural ares " near Confolans and Montmorillon The article goes on to talk about Algerians ,Turks etc This is actually a property article but "hidden" cheap property and the rich British buyer is there even though they are a "micro-population" compared to the French and other foreigners but they come from "poor countries" Btw if anybody watched an insane M6 Capital on the "Souplex" you can watch it on M6 replay but you will have to fast forward at least 1h40 totally mad Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 I can see British sellers who are moving back to the UK being prepared to take a hit, given the currency gain they will make by converting their Euros back to Sterling. However the French sellers are another matter. From what I've heard, they've traditionally seen the Brits as a soft touch prepared to pay over the odds. Have they finally cottoned on to the new reality of Britain as the poor man of Europe again? The French seem to be very much aware of British sellers who are prepared to take a "hit" to the point where i was reading today about a Parisien and his friends who are very interested in British property . He wants to buy in the Gers he prefers British sellers as all the major renovation work has been done. He keeps in touch with a local EA friend of his to see if they will accept a 30% price drop also his EA friend telephones him to let him know when to make a "cheap" offer seeing as the owners can't find any buyers Theres even a woman who works in the local "tourist information" who telephoned him to say that the English who are trying to sell at a 120K will now accept 80K Theres another one in the Tarn who keeps in touch with a local notary looking out for bankcrupt british property thats going for auction You are not alone looking for "distressed sellers" i noticed that they are prepared to wait out of sight Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sesim Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Nice posts redwine, as always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 Nice posts redwine, as always. http://www.ladepeche.fr/article/2010/02/01/767319-Agen-De-Robien-un-parc-locatif-sur-les-bras.html Here's another one for you nothing to do with the British BTW i can post "Happy France" property news if thats what you want to read ? Quote "Investors in all of France (the french) thought that Agen (Lot et Garonne) was the chicken that layed the golden eggs they even "fought over it" Out of 2600 empty properties the 1/1/09 or 13% of the "property park" more than 600 in 1999 and out of a total of 3400 empty properties in the Agen area most of them are DeRobiens which grew like mushrooms in Agen" They got "badly burnt" with there property" package deal " because to have the tax reductions you needed to find a renter for at least 8 years and guess what ? There was nobody out there to, "rent to" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redwine Posted February 2, 2010 Share Posted February 2, 2010 http://blog.charentelibre.com/journal/index.php?post/2010/01/21/4760-28-720-euros-le-pavillon-grace-aux-encheres "Blog Charente libre " " 28720 euros le pavillon grace aux enchères ! "A house sold at an auction for 28720 euros" Quote "The inital asking price was 90k" "However there was nobody at the auction to put up the price apart from one and he played his cards right and got the mini price " Yesterday three properties were sold due to "saises"or non payments The house that was sold yesterday at "etagnac" for 28720 euros or a total of 35000 euros belonged to a "British couple" A new "phenomère" appears the "saisies" or the baliff's are knocking on the door of more and more British Residents The house in "Etagnac" was bought by a British family in 2006 They started to have credit problems in 2007 Then they "fled la France" leaving there debts behind them The French bank "Crèdit Mutuel" regret's there decision Sesim I am not being nasty or taking the p*ss but i have noticed that the buyer "who knew how to play his cards and got the mini price" He was well informed by somebody Do not forget that in Paris over 70% of civil servant jobs eg postmen,firemen,policemen etc They are recruted in "Provence" which means all of France They often live in "barracks" When they want to retire (in the above case) as Paris is to expensive and after all its not there real home They look for cheap bargains back home where they come from(thats why they have friends eg EAs ,civil servants etc) What better than a bankcrupt British couple to get a bargain ! This is the real world the Britsh are considered as another "immigrant group" just like Algerians ,Turks,,Morrocans etc Sorry but that is the way it is when it comes to property and money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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