Pickle's In A Pickle: We Dont Know How Many Romanians Are Coming

[bulboy]

Can we (i.e. HPCers in the UK) take out ads in Bulgarian and Romanian newspapers, kindly informing any would be migrants from those countries about this?

You certainly can, i can gladly help you with the translation to Bulgarian. Here's a link to all of the daily newspapers.

[bulboy]

Now, to be serious, I will repost something I posted a while ago. Same topic.

Right, where do I start. My nick name of course BULgarianBOY. Came here on invitation from British company who could not find Civil engineers in UK and came to Bulgaria in their search after exhausting their South Africa and India connections. I kindly accepted the offer as it was made on my turf in Sofia. almost 10 years later I am still helping build this country and I am proud to be part of the process, in the mean time I earned the British Citizenship, my children are both born here and raised as proud citizens of both countries with respect to others, history and law. Is it much better here you will ask, what keeps me in. Most importantly the ability to work in my subject from Uni on variety of projects without widely spread questionable practices that come in brown postal accessories, pressure to cut corners. The convenience of life and opportunities to spend your spare time in fun rather than sit in queue at desk 1 to get form 3c to move to desk 56 to attach to form 8g to go to desk 234 to find the lady on the phone for 3 hours and when she is done to shut the desk until tomorrow,...Great attention and preservation of history. I will not be listing in details the bad things you all know them: HPI, benefit system, WEATHER, banks.

The truth is not much will change, especially from Bulgarians. This country used to be 8 mil population, nowadays is barely 7 mil. Of those a lot are pensioners, new capitalists who exploit the country, politicians who have power and wealth, minorities who are looked after by the politicians especially before votes. If you like stats, they are easy to find. Of those 8 mil 10 years ago at least 1 million left when they could. A lot of people "won" green cards for USA, a lot emigrated elsewhere. Most went to hot countries with similar climate to Bulgaria: Greece (convenient, close, close traditions), Italy - within a day's driving, good food, fond memories of "La Piovra" on telly, Spain and Portugal - far, but same climate, temperament and good food. Plenty of construction work until recently, France - Half of Bulgarians were frankofons, they studied french in school, French culture, love, fashion, finest things in life - all associated with France. Then some moved to Germany/Austria as students adn then stayed to work. Close ties during the wars (not that people wanted to be in the Axis, it was the artificial King of the SaxCobburghGottha family and the politicians who got the alliance). German and Russian standards are very close and very good (who copied who? and we are not talking about quality but requirements). A lot of children studied german at school when I was young. Most of the investments in Bulgaria in the past 15 years are predominantly from germaneese companies (Germany, Austria, Switzerland) and things look and sound comfortably similar. Close to home, again within probably 12 hours driving and bit harsher weather in winter. Summer is irrelevant because everyone heads back to Bulgaria to the sea.

Great Britain is seen as interesting for the ones who studied English at school and were influenced by WESTERN Quality music of DOORS, BEATLES talking about freedom. And freedom is the quality aspect of British culture. A lot of people come here, get disapointed and wet and go to the southern countries to pick fruits and veg.

The opportunity to come to UK was existent since long time ago. there were couple of hurdles but not too hard to jump for anyone who wished to come. There is a lot of media engineered hype on the A2 countries.

Couple of facts:

- You could come to UK for the at least last 10 years either on Work permit ( as I did) or as a self employed

- You have no recourse to public funds for at least the duration of your license - in my case 5 years. for the Self employed usually 3+ 2 +1 years.

- you do pay all the taxes though since day one. First couple of weeks you may actually be on the emergency rate until you get your NIN.

- Work is plenty if you want it. Umbrella companies as well for the self employed.

- Romanians are very close to Italy hence their preference to go there. They speak the same language its close to home.

- UK is one of the last to open its borders to Bulgarians, those who had the chance emigrated at first opportunity not many left.

- The UK benefit system is not that generous to be worth living away from home on small change. In Bulgaria a lot of people have villages where they (or should I say their retired parents and grandparents are growing veg and fruit, stock which helps A LOT during summer and during winter as it gets prepared and stored. Famous rakija gets brewed and helps with the SAD

- Even in my case, I only claim child benefit. I did calculations for tax credits and I do not qualify as earnings are above threshold. Still my nursery is 900£/month for the last 7 years (4 with first and 3 with second).

- Even though now in Bulgaria the average salary is around 250£/month, a lot of people a getting cash in hand or in the grey economy. Check the point about the food above. There are decent for Bulgarian standard jobs which pay not bad money too. (unfortunately for me my discipline is not very well represented there in terms of variety of scale and complexity of projects, so I will stay here for now on that account).

- Somebody suggested above to buy houses to house 20 bulgarians to a room, sorry, two in a double bedroom may be, it will feel like in the uni or in the army, more than that - forget it. They will rather pay more to be alone in a room.

There is many more to say on the subject but I do not think much will change from Bulgaria.

one possible issue could be from Roma gypsies. I can not voice opinion on that so do your own research.

As for the criminals - I suspect they don't like to stay in a place for too long. the three months tourist visa is just enough for a "tour" of UK and to disappear with no trace.

[Dr Matt]

In the A&E I work in (A DGH in the NW) I'd estimate about 10% of our daily attendance to be Polish, something not seen pre 2005 ish.

They appear to be much more likely to present with trivial GP style problems, the Bain of any A&E department. The reason seems to be that many of them aren't registered to GP's for whatever reason. They also appear to be quite demanding of free medications especially painkillers which can be bought over the counter for a few pence.

Just an observation that's all.

[bulboy]

In the A&E I work in (A DGH in the NW) I'd estimate about 10% of our daily attendance to be Polish, something not seen pre 2005 ish.

They appear to be much more likely to present with trivial GP style problems, the Bain of any A&E department. The reason seems to be that many of them aren't registered to GP's for whatever reason. They also appear to be quite demanding of free medications especially painkillers which can be bought over the counter for a few pence.

Just an observation that's all.

It may be the way it used to work in Poland or any eastern European country.

We just recently inherited the GP practice from the west. Before that you used to go to the hospital. And be seen by specialist or directed to one. So if you are generally unwell a doctor at reception will point you to the right specialists. If it is sore throat you go to the "ears, throat and nose " specialist. The slight difference with GP practice was that most of the time they will diagnose or carry in hospital tests (blood, antibiogramme etc), rather than refer you to the standard painkillers for a week and fob you off.

With regard to free medication I would think that initial treatment/dose is acceptable but then one should be referred to the nearest pharmacy with prescription. In "hospital era" in eastern europe there was no free medication for general aches and colds. They may treat you for minor things and give you the prescription. The pharmacies were usually opposite the hospital.

[Sour Mash]

You can be pretty sure it will eventually turn out to be 'completely unexpected', and 'considerably more than first thought'.

IIRC this is pretty much what happened when the first batch of Eastern Countries gained immigration rights. It was played down with the mainstream media at first suggesting hardly anyone was coming and then when figures were released - surprise - it turned out that a mahooosive amount of people had immigrated.

Funny thing is, a wave of uncontrolled immigration from Romania and Bulgaria will probably take jobs from 'Lazy Poles'

The less motivated amongst the Poles have probably observed how there's a resident population of lazy locals enjoying a reasonable lifestyle on the dole and are wising up and realising that they can do it too. The more motivated will be looking for better grades of job.