Prices In South East London/woolwich Regeneration

[danski]

Hello everyone,

I'm new to the forum but have been reading many of the threads on here for some time to try and get a feel for the market. As a first time buyer I've had quite a horrendous time looking for property over the last 6 months putting in offers on 14 properties and being gazumped twice (once without there even being a counter-offer - the seller just decided he wanted an extra £15,000 on exchange day!).

I'd been looking at established areas such as Clapham and Highbury but the competition is just too fierce so I've turned my attention to South East London and in particular the Royal Arsenal development by Berkley homes. I'd like to gage the views of the users on this forum as to whether this development is overpriced. The one beds are upwards of £200,000 and two beds are upwards of £320,000 - this is pretty average on a London wide basis but a great deal higher than property outside of the development grounds. I'm quite interested as the development itself looks to be of a very high quality but I'm slightly concerned by Woolwich itself as it seems a bit rough to say the least.

So, any views on whether the Woolwich regeneration is an accident waiting to happen or a good future prospect would be much appreciated.

[maricopa]

1. do you want to be in a development?

2. from clapham and highbury (which are quite different from each other themselves!) to woolwich is quite a change, theres a whole host of other areas in between these two poles. look at these in woolwich, and then look at walthamstow, lewisham, forest gate, south tottenham, charlton, new cross, (these may be completely unsuitable and they might not be but i'd be looking at these before woolwich)

3. i havent been to woolwich in a while, but it seems the sort of place where developments are separate from the town, not part of it

[blackbrogue]

Purely in terms of investment the opening of the DLR station in 2009 is bound to make a difference. Likewise the Tesco plans for the town centre are very ambitious. To cap it all there is the possibility of a Crossrail Station if built. All in all therefore I believe Woolwich to be a better bet than elsewhere in the Thames Gateway. That being said the question is to what extent are these improvements priced into the Berkeley Homes development - you will need to decide - and currently Woolwich town centre has little going for it and at night I wouldn't go near it!

[danski]

There do appear to be a lot of plans on the table to regenerate Woolwich and the transport plans would make it very well connected to central London but as you say blackbrogue, I am concerned that perhaps the regeneration factor has already been priced in before the work has been done. There is also the worry that if there was a large correction in house prices, the developer may decide to delay completion of the project for a number of years until the upward cycle begins again. Woolwich would also seem to be the type of area that would suffer the effects of a price correction much quicker than more established areas. Decisions, decisions...

[maricopa]

how do prices compare to other parts of southeast london, lewisham, deptford, peckham, ladywell, charlton, even catford?

i agree that somewhere like woolwich is more vulnerable than most to price correction. if prices drop areas have to have something to offer themselves, rather than being connected or on the edge of other areas. area that have boosters and people repping for them are more likely to maintain popularity in the event of a downturn. i dont see woolwich having that. and i dont see it getting it if regeneration is divisive, plonking a load of 'haves' in a tower surrounded by 'have nots'. gentrification isnt always that simple, and can be quite an organic and gradual process

i also cant help thinking developments are also more vulnerable to price correction unless they are in super-soughtafter areas. and at those prices it seems to me that all this is already built into the price

a very important question might be...

do you LIKE woolwich?

[danski]

how do prices compare to other parts of southeast london, lewisham, deptford, peckham, ladywell, charlton, even catford?

i agree that somewhere like woolwich is more vulnerable than most to price correction. if prices drop areas have to have something to offer themselves, rather than being connected or on the edge of other areas. area that have boosters and people repping for them are more likely to maintain popularity in the event of a downturn. i dont see woolwich having that. and i dont see it getting it if regeneration is divisive, plonking a load of 'haves' in a tower surrounded by 'have nots'. gentrification isnt always that simple, and can be quite an organic and gradual process

i also cant help thinking developments are also more vulnerable to price correction unless they are in super-soughtafter areas. and at those prices it seems to me that all this is already built into the price

a very important question might be...

do you LIKE woolwich?

Not wishing to upset residents of Woolwich, I don't think anybody could honestly say that they LIKE Woolwich town. The Royal-Arsenal site is very very nice indeed and for £350,000 you can get 1000sq feet in a grade II listed building in a historical site. That makes me think that perhaps this development is more insulated from a crash than the typical riverside tower blocks that you see popping up along the thames. But the town itself seems pretty rough so it really needs the development plans to be seen through to the end. Maybe I'm falling victim to the 'must buy at all costs' disease that is exercising the minds of most London FTB's who feel that they can get on the ladder now just but may not be able to in 3 months time if 3.7% per month is anything to go by!

[maricopa]

im just puzzled why you're rushed from clapham/highbury to woolwich, without examining any of the hugely varied intermediate places. and then the fact that you're still going to be paying quite a high price.

i think a place like woolwich needs a lot more than converted apartments, listed or not, to become a draw (none of this matters if you like the place)

another way to look at this is, if prices everywhere were just that bit lower, would you have even looked at woolwich?

[danski]

im just puzzled why you're rushed from clapham/highbury to woolwich, without examining any of the hugely varied intermediate places. and then the fact that you're still going to be paying quite a high price.

i think a place like woolwich needs a lot more than converted apartments, listed or not, to become a draw (none of this matters if you like the place)

another way to look at this is, if prices everywhere were just that bit lower, would you have even looked at woolwich?

I decided to totally move away from the established areas such as Clapham as the reports are true - I genuinely was fighting against 20 people for every flat.

I've always wanted a warehouse style flat near the river but that type of property was never in my price range until I stumbled across Woolwich. That's why I have done the big jump. It's also particularly well connected to the city which is important work wise but I can't help thinking that I'd be running out of the station every night for the next few years to get into the development grounds as quickly as possible!

[Little Miss]

I decided to totally move away from the established areas such as Clapham as the reports are true - I genuinely was fighting against 20 people for every flat.

I've always wanted a warehouse style flat near the river but that type of property was never in my price range until I stumbled across Woolwich. That's why I have done the big jump. It's also particularly well connected to the city which is important work wise but I can't help thinking that I'd be running out of the station every night for the next few years to get into the development grounds as quickly as possible!

Hi Danski

I moved just a 15 minute walk along the river from the Berkeley Home Royal Arsenal site two years ago. I would say that of all the river developments,including the one I live in, that the Woolwich Arsenal one is the best. My concern in the long term would be how well will such a large estate be managed when Berkeleley finish up there (that could be 10 years away though) and of course the prices. I know there are a few problems there, but nothing to be concerned about from my community contacts (we have community groups that work together and also know people who have moved in down there). I am very sceptical of relying on the so called regeneration plans to turn the area around - they have completely messed it up where we are and it is a nightmare. The DLR will be good, and the riverboat service is excellent (but not frequent enough) but at the end of the day you have to question if you think you can live there, and also do you think others like you will too, in the future. We have seen a huge exodus of good people in our area and the bad come in - I don't know what it is about this side of London - I have never seen so much bad behaviour and truly vile people who make it like a ghetto.

I dislike Woolwich and the whole surrounding area immensely - I cannot tell you how much, and lets face it, if we are honest the whole area is a dirty, run down place, with high deprivation rates and some really, really bad people around. No you would not go to Woolwich at night - it is unpleasant enough in the day let alone at night. Then I look at the river and the wildlife and it is lovely. Before everyone thinks I came from Highgate or something - I didnt! I lived at New Cross for 8 years - not glamourous but not as challenging as out here. I cannot wait to get right out of this Thames Gateway corridor.

The Royal Arsenal could be the crown jewel - but when the put the retail in there - if they put poor quality take aways etc in there and another dreaded suburban Wetherspoons on site then the whole nature of the development will change. We are hoping to see that development keep gentryfying as it is so handy for us to walk to.

[Little Miss]

Hi Danski

I moved just a 15 minute walk along the river from the Berkeley Home Royal Arsenal site two years ago. I would say that of all the river developments,including the one I live in, that the Woolwich Arsenal one is the best. My concern in the long term would be how well will such a large estate be managed when Berkeleley finish up there (that could be 10 years away though) and of course the prices. I know there are a few problems there, but nothing to be concerned about from my community contacts (we have community groups that work together and also know people who have moved in down there). I am very sceptical of relying on the so called regeneration plans to turn the area around - they have completely messed it up where we are and it is a nightmare. The DLR will be good, and the riverboat service is excellent (but not frequent enough) but at the end of the day you have to question if you think you can live there, and also do you think others like you will too, in the future. We have seen a huge exodus of good people in our area and the bad come in - I don't know what it is about this side of London - I have never seen so much bad behaviour and truly vile people who make it like a ghetto.

I dislike Woolwich and the whole surrounding area immensely - I cannot tell you how much, and lets face it, if we are honest the whole area is a dirty, run down place, with high deprivation rates and some really, really bad people around. No you would not go to Woolwich at night - it is unpleasant enough in the day let alone at night. Then I look at the river and the wildlife and it is lovely. Before everyone thinks I came from Highgate or something - I didnt! I lived at New Cross for 8 years - not glamourous but not as challenging as out here. I cannot wait to get right out of this Thames Gateway corridor.

The Royal Arsenal could be the crown jewel - but when they put the retail in there - if they put poor quality take aways etc in there and another dreaded suburban Wetherspoons on site then the whole nature of the development will change. We are hoping to see that development keep gentryfying as it is so handy for us to walk to.

[kagiso]

There is an arc of property from New Cross through Deptford, Woolwich, Plumpstead to Thamesmead that is analogous in this boom to Rotherhithe, Surrey Quays and the Isle of Dogs in the last boom.

Woolwich etc are traditionally poor, working class, rough areas, with relatively poor transport links, but stunning Thames views. They are also being built over with huge numbers of flash, cheap, flats.

Exactly the same as Rotherhithe, etc in 1989.

These places will crash very, very, badly in the next couple of years. Just like the IoD did in the early 90s. It has already started; prices in Thamesmead, Woolwich and Greenwich are already going down.

For the next five to ten years, these flats will be bought on the cheap at auction, and filled with poor workers from Poland and Nigeria.

If you buy here now you will suffer doubly, you will lose 70% of your equity, and you will be obliged to live in a really rough area with poor transport.

But, in the long term these areas will be very good places to invest. Extensions to the DLR, ELL and Crossrail will vastly improve transport. And when prices are at the bottom young professionals will realise it is a cheap area, with good transport, and pretty views over the river. The poor people will be crowded out, and it will become a very nice, very expensive area.

Exactly what has happened to Rotherhithe and the IoD.

I am currently STRed, and my plan is to buy some of these flats, somewhere between New Cross & Thamesmead, at knock down prices at the bottom of the slump.

To buy there now is suicide.

[danski]

Hi Danski

I moved just a 15 minute walk along the river from the Berkeley Home Royal Arsenal site two years ago. I would say that of all the river developments,including the one I live in, that the Woolwich Arsenal one is the best. My concern in the long term would be how well will such a large estate be managed when Berkeleley finish up there (that could be 10 years away though) and of course the prices. I know there are a few problems there, but nothing to be concerned about from my community contacts (we have community groups that work together and also know people who have moved in down there). I am very sceptical of relying on the so called regeneration plans to turn the area around - they have completely messed it up where we are and it is a nightmare. The DLR will be good, and the riverboat service is excellent (but not frequent enough) but at the end of the day you have to question if you think you can live there, and also do you think others like you will too, in the future. We have seen a huge exodus of good people in our area and the bad come in - I don't know what it is about this side of London - I have never seen so much bad behaviour and truly vile people who make it like a ghetto.

I dislike Woolwich and the whole surrounding area immensely - I cannot tell you how much, and lets face it, if we are honest the whole area is a dirty, run down place, with high deprivation rates and some really, really bad people around. No you would not go to Woolwich at night - it is unpleasant enough in the day let alone at night. Then I look at the river and the wildlife and it is lovely. Before everyone thinks I came from Highgate or something - I didnt! I lived at New Cross for 8 years - not glamourous but not as challenging as out here. I cannot wait to get right out of this Thames Gateway corridor.

The Royal Arsenal could be the crown jewel - but when the put the retail in there - if they put poor quality take aways etc in there and another dreaded suburban Wetherspoons on site then the whole nature of the development will change. We are hoping to see that development keep gentryfying as it is so handy for us to walk to.

It's a shame to hear that the redevelopment plans aren't really being carried out properly. How are prices looking in your development as a result? Have they risen over the last couple of years? Also, are you sticking around in Woolwich to see if things improve or are you trapped due to a lack of growth in your property value?

[kagiso]

This is what happened last time, house prices dropped by 20%-30% nominal in Docklands, that is 60%-70% in real terms.

Please read the whole thread. Carry on renting and buy yourself a property for 1/3 to 1/4 of current prices in 2 to 3 years time.

http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...st&p=609710

[Little Miss]

It's a shame to hear that the redevelopment plans aren't really being carried out properly. How are prices looking in your development as a result? Have they risen over the last couple of years? Also, are you sticking around in Woolwich to see if things improve or are you trapped due to a lack of growth in your property value?

Hi Danski

My husband and I were first time buyers when we purchased here two years ago. We moved our mortgage just a short while ago (I started a thread West Thamesmead - leading in negative equity' on this forum) and the property was valued at £200,000, this is a drop of £20,000 (initially the surveyor had said 169-189,000 to our horror!). We have the most beautiful, 2 bed, 2 bath flat which is very large and has an amazing view with a large balcony. We knew that prices had gone down because of the mass mortgage fraud and reposessions that followed - the area was targeted by West African crime rings and it has affected property values massively. Nobody would believe the extent of this fraud unless they lived here. I do not believe that this is an issue on the Berkeley development at all though. The Royal Arsenal is exceptional in my opinion, the people there are mostly decent people from what I can see, - it is mostly them that jump on the boat to work - a mixture of young professionals getting on with their lives and earning a living. But as soon as you exit those walls or leave the riverside it is a different world.

So the short answer is our prices have dropped due to the problems in the area. We have to stay for a while, at least until we get back the price we paid and then I suspect we will be out of the area very quickly - I've only ever lived in South London - but I have now had enough of it after here. So for now we are depressingly trapped but heartbroken too. It is really sad as there is a very good side, and a very bad side to the area - the river and wildlife is fantastic - the rest just makes you feel like you are living in hell! I get the boat to work sometimes - it is such a treat and I think how lucky I am to be able to do that - then I sit on my balcony and look out over the city, docklands, post office tower and the huge breadth of the river. If we had more decent people in our area life would be better. I think the comments on here about Docklands are very relevant though - I remember reading of all the huge problems over there in the 1980s. In the longterm things will be good - perhaps in 6 years things will improve - who knows, but it is all down to whether you think there are enough positives to make up for the negatives.

[danski]

There is an arc of property from New Cross through Deptford, Woolwich, Plumpstead to Thamesmead that is analogous in this boom to Rotherhithe, Surrey Quays and the Isle of Dogs in the last boom.

Woolwich etc are traditionally poor, working class, rough areas, with relatively poor transport links, but stunning Thames views. They are also being built over with huge numbers of flash, cheap, flats.

Exactly the same as Rotherhithe, etc in 1989.

These places will crash very, very, badly in the next couple of years. Just like the IoD did in the early 90s. It has already started; prices in Thamesmead, Woolwich and Greenwich are already going down.

For the next five to ten years, these flats will be bought on the cheap at auction, and filled with poor workers from Poland and Nigeria.

If you buy here now you will suffer doubly, you will lose 70% of your equity, and you will be obliged to live in a really rough area with poor transport.

But, in the long term these areas will be very good places to invest. Extensions to the DLR, ELL and Crossrail will vastly improve transport. And when prices are at the bottom young professionals will realise it is a cheap area, with good transport, and pretty views over the river. The poor people will be crowded out, and it will become a very nice, very expensive area.

Exactly what has happened to Rotherhithe and the IoD.

I am currently STRed, and my plan is to buy some of these flats, somewhere between New Cross & Thamesmead, at knock down prices at the bottom of the slump.

To buy there now is suicide.

I appreciate that now may not be the best time to buy but I am in a position where my parents want to reinvest money that they have released by selling the flat that they had in London and if they don't invest in a London property to help me then they will tie up their money elsewhere. They are still relatively confident that in 5 years time (being the point at which they would need to retrieve their funds), they wouldn't have lost on their investment.

So, even if the market slumps by 20% in a years time, the funding available to me will have disappeared and anything above £200,000 will be well out of reach - even in a slump I think it will be hard to find a decent 2 bed in London for under £200,000. Therefore, I'm looking at Woolwich on a 5 year basis - however, I'm also considering Greenwich. For the same price as one of the s*****y 2 bed flats in Woolwich I could get a small 2 bed cottage with garden in Greenwich. The Berkley homes complex at Woolwich is as nice as the best streets in Greenwich but as soon as you step out of its grounds, it gets rough whereas Greenwich seems a better area overall. Still don't know what to do and have until 5pm to decide (classic estate agent pressure which makes me livid!).

[danski]

I appreciate that now may not be the best time to buy but I am in a position where my parents want to reinvest money that they have released by selling the flat that they had in London and if they don't invest in a London property to help me then they will tie up their money elsewhere. They are still relatively confident that in 5 years time (being the point at which they would need to retrieve their funds), they wouldn't have lost on their investment.

So, even if the market slumps by 20% in a years time, the funding available to me will have disappeared and anything above £200,000 will be well out of reach - even in a slump I think it will be hard to find a decent 2 bed in London for under £200,000. Therefore, I'm looking at Woolwich on a 5 year basis - however, I'm also considering Greenwich. For the same price as one of the s*****y 2 bed flats in Woolwich I could get a small 2 bed cottage with garden in Greenwich. The Berkley homes complex at Woolwich is as nice as the best streets in Greenwich but as soon as you step out of its grounds, it gets rough whereas Greenwich seems a better area overall. Still don't know what to do and have until 5pm to decide (classic estate agent pressure which makes me livid!).

Not sure why the word s-w-a-n-k-y is censored above? Anyway, just in case it's censored again - I mean smart/flash 2 bed flats and not a rude word which starts in S and ends in Y....

[Little Miss]

Therefore, I'm looking at Woolwich on a 5 year basis - however, I'm also considering Greenwich. For the same price as one of the s*****y 2 bed flats in Woolwich I could get a small 2 bed cottage with garden in Greenwich. The Berkley homes complex at Woolwich is as nice as the best streets in Greenwich but as soon as you step out of its grounds, it gets rough whereas Greenwich seems a better area overall. Still don't know what to do and have until 5pm to decide (classic estate agent pressure which makes me livid!).

Danski - I personally think you would be better off looking at Greenwich - you are then looking at a more established, mixed community where you are far less likely to get any sudden unpleasant 'social problems' that can come into the new developments where a community has not had time to establish itself. Greenwich is not perfect but I think it is pretty good as far as south east london goes but there are plenty of nice, character properties and it has a lively centre and good transport links. (just don't be tempted by Deptford's lower prices or the PR spin about it being up and coming - it is good for the DLR connection but it is not a pleasant place by any means!).

Whenever you buy a property it is a risk - either due to a change in your circumstances or the economy. If we choose to buy we have to take that on the chin, and hope we are lucky - after all negative equity is only a problem if you want to move in the short term - if you are happy to stay in a property for a long time - then it isn't an issue. That is why it is important to buy in an area that you really like and one which you want to put roots down in - because then it doesn't become such an issue. Good luck with your search - I hope you find a snug pad which you will be happy in!

[kagiso]

Danski - I personally think you would be better off looking at Greenwich - you are then looking at a more established, mixed community where you are far less likely to get any sudden unpleasant 'social problems' that can come into the new developments where a community has not had time to establish itself. Greenwich is not perfect but I think it is pretty good as far as south east london goes but there are plenty of nice, character properties and it has a lively centre and good transport links. (just don't be tempted by Deptford's lower prices or the PR spin about it being up and coming - it is good for the DLR connection but it is not a pleasant place by any means!).

Whenever you buy a property it is a risk - either due to a change in your circumstances or the economy. If we choose to buy we have to take that on the chin, and hope we are lucky - after all negative equity is only a problem if you want to move in the short term - if you are happy to stay in a property for a long time - then it isn't an issue. That is why it is important to buy in an area that you really like and one which you want to put roots down in - because then it doesn't become such an issue. Good luck with your search - I hope you find a snug pad which you will be happy in!

I am personally convinced prices are going to crash 50% average, even more in poorer areas. If you possibly can try and persuade your parents to put their money into bonds and allow you to rent off the interest for two years.

If they absolutely insist on you buying property, then looking at what happened last time, you will lose much less money by buying a nice mature property in a nice area. If you have to buy then I would also recommend Greenwich. Another area to consider is Bermondsey, Rotherhithe, Surrey Quays, which is already gentrifying, and is central with good transport links.

[danski]

Danski - I personally think you would be better off looking at Greenwich - you are then looking at a more established, mixed community where you are far less likely to get any sudden unpleasant 'social problems' that can come into the new developments where a community has not had time to establish itself. Greenwich is not perfect but I think it is pretty good as far as south east london goes but there are plenty of nice, character properties and it has a lively centre and good transport links. (just don't be tempted by Deptford's lower prices or the PR spin about it being up and coming - it is good for the DLR connection but it is not a pleasant place by any means!).

Whenever you buy a property it is a risk - either due to a change in your circumstances or the economy. If we choose to buy we have to take that on the chin, and hope we are lucky - after all negative equity is only a problem if you want to move in the short term - if you are happy to stay in a property for a long time - then it isn't an issue. That is why it is important to buy in an area that you really like and one which you want to put roots down in - because then it doesn't become such an issue. Good luck with your search - I hope you find a snug pad which you will be happy in!

Thanks for all the advice Little Miss. I will have another look at Greenwich tonight - it's actually East Greenwich so it's a bit ropey but it doesn't have the huge Woolwich council towers which dominate the skyline there. I think it's wrong to place people in that sort of housing - if I was a kid trapped on the 15th floor of a council estate I'd probably also go around causing trouble.

[maricopa]

parents want to reinvest money that they have released by selling the flat that they had in London and if they don't invest in a London property to help me then they will tie up their money elsewhere

^^ massive factor in keeping housing market going btw. esp in london

woolwich is not the kind of place id want to end up if things go wrong, i really think in your price bracket you have more options than this in london. id really look at lewisham and greenwich again if i were you. though as you have said you like the type of building this is, and if it feels right, then it feels right.

this CENSORED OH NO from estate agents that you have to decide by 5oclock or whatever, is just that, CENSORED OH NO you can say to any number of things and stall, put off, cancel, at any time

Edited April 23, 2007 by maricopa

[danski]

parents want to reinvest money that they have released by selling the flat that they had in London and if they don't invest in a London property to help me then they will tie up their money elsewhere

^^ massive factor in keeping housing market going btw. esp in london

woolwich is not the kind of place id want to end up if things go wrong, i really think in your price bracket you have more options than this in london. id really look at lewisham and greenwich again if i were you. though as you have said you like the type of building this is, and if it feels right, then it feels right.

this CENSORED OH NO from estate agents that you have to decide by 5oclock or whatever, is just that, CENSORED OH NO you can say to any number of things and stall, put off, cancel, at any time

On the basis of much that was said in this thread, we pulled the plug on the Woolwich riverside purchase so I forfeited my £1000 reservation fee! I'm neither a bear nor a bull but I do think that prices, at least in London, will stagnate for a couple years rather than suffer a meltdown although my old man thinks to the contrary and therefore wants the property search to continue in more established areas which will be more insulated during a crash.

I found a place I quite like this week in the Greenwich/Blackheath area which seems reasonably priced compared to other parts of London but I checked the land registry records and the asking price is 30% greater than what it was bought for at the start of 2006! Does anybody with knowledge of South East London know whether prices have really rocketed to such an extent?

[wotnocrash]

On the basis of much that was said in this thread, we pulled the plug on the Woolwich riverside purchase so I forfeited my £1000 reservation fee! I'm neither a bear nor a bull but I do think that prices, at least in London, will stagnate for a couple years rather than suffer a meltdown although my old man thinks to the contrary and therefore wants the property search to continue in more established areas which will be more insulated during a crash.

I found a place I quite like this week in the Greenwich/Blackheath area which seems reasonably priced compared to other parts of London but I checked the land registry records and the asking price is 30% greater than what it was bought for at the start of 2006! Does anybody with knowledge of South East London know whether prices have really rocketed to such an extent?

From what I understand, prices in Greenwich have been one of the slowest risers over the past year. Thats not to say that it is only the upmarket parts that are going stratospheric though.

My part of north london (seven sisters area) prices are up 25% or so in the last year. It is undergoing gentrification however and is very much experiencing an overspill from people priced out from Islington etc, as it is only 2 stops further out on the tube. On that note it is definately an area I would recommend to others. It is a little rough around the edges, but your money goes a long way (you can still get a nice 3 bed terrace for circa £325k or one needing work for £250k) and it has excellent tube and train links to the city and west end. No warehouse conversions with river view though!

[maricopa]

doesnt surprise me about seven sisters, though it seems more like stamford hill overspill than islington overspill

as for greenwich/blackheath, if the place is good i would be much more inclined to go for this than woolwich. theyre established and the kind of place people like living in. can i ask what type of place you are looking at, and how much you are paying? have you looked at ladywell?

[adibrown]

On the basis of much that was said in this thread, we pulled the plug on the Woolwich riverside purchase so I forfeited my £1000 reservation fee! I'm neither a bear nor a bull but I do think that prices, at least in London, will stagnate for a couple years rather than suffer a meltdown although my old man thinks to the contrary and therefore wants the property search to continue in more established areas which will be more insulated during a crash.

I found a place I quite like this week in the Greenwich/Blackheath area which seems reasonably priced compared to other parts of London but I checked the land registry records and the asking price is 30% greater than what it was bought for at the start of 2006! Does anybody with knowledge of South East London know whether prices have really rocketed to such an extent?

This thread is really interesting. I lived in Blackheath for 8 years and in 2003 went to look at the Berkley Homes development in Woolwich Arsenal. I decided against buying at that point because Woolwich is a sh*thole and one of the builders kindly told us that a man had been in the showroom the day before with a knife thinking that they kept money onsite. I think Little Miss has made some excellent points and I really feel for her situation. This development is quite nice but the area is dire. I was in a serious buying position but my gut feeling was the place seemed completely soul less. It only takes a slump and the development could become a bit of a nightmare. I know somebody who lived in a similar development near Deptford. They paid £250k for their one bedroom flat (This was 5 years ago!!) only to find 3 months later the flat next door rented out to a number of Yardies. Cars pulled up at 3am with stereos blurting out and dodgy people all over the development. They felt trapped in theri flat and luckily because of the market at the time they sold up and got out with a profit (only because the buyers never came to look at the development at night!!) .

Blackheath and Greenwich in my opinion are the best places to live in London. I tried living in Crapham and Highgate and hated it, those places are unbelievably up their own bumholes.

If I was you I would go for the 2 bedroom in Greenwich or try and buy a nice one bed flat in Blackheath Village.

As for never seeing flats for less than £200k in London there are loads now in Blackheath. As for prices..I sold my flat in 2003 for £160k and next door sold theirs last month for £189k. This is in prime Blackheath (not Lewisham). I originally bought in 2001 for £75k. Before that I bought a 1 bedroom flat in a place overlooking the Heath for £65k (1999). So as for £200k flats I think you youngsters will be shocked when the crash hits full speed. I have to agree with Kagiso I can see prices dropping by 50% in areas like Woolwich, Kidbrooke, Deptford, Lewisham, New Cross etc. Areas like Greenwich and Blackheath may escape with 30% but I remember in the 1990's these areas also dropped to a point were people just couldnt sell. When things crash you will find it much easier to rent or sell a 2 bed cottage in Greenwich than a 2 bed flat in Woolwich.

You'll look back in a few years on your decision to not buy in Woolwich and see it as a massive life changing decision. When Berkley are offloading for £130k you can than your lucky stars you never got involved.

[danski]

This thread is really interesting. I lived in Blackheath for 8 years and in 2003 went to look at the Berkley Homes development in Woolwich Arsenal. I decided against buying at that point because Woolwich is a sh*thole and one of the builders kindly told us that a man had been in the showroom the day before with a knife thinking that they kept money onsite. I think Little Miss has made some excellent points and I really feel for her situation. This development is quite nice but the area is dire. I was in a serious buying position but my gut feeling was the place seemed completely soul less. It only takes a slump and the development could become a bit of a nightmare. I know somebody who lived in a similar development near Deptford. They paid £250k for their one bedroom flat (This was 5 years ago!!) only to find 3 months later the flat next door rented out to a number of Yardies. Cars pulled up at 3am with stereos blurting out and dodgy people all over the development. They felt trapped in theri flat and luckily because of the market at the time they sold up and got out with a profit (only because the buyers never came to look at the development at night!!) .

Blackheath and Greenwich in my opinion are the best places to live in London. I tried living in Crapham and Highgate and hated it, those places are unbelievably up their own bumholes.

If I was you I would go for the 2 bedroom in Greenwich or try and buy a nice one bed flat in Blackheath Village.

As for never seeing flats for less than £200k in London there are loads now in Blackheath. As for prices..I sold my flat in 2003 for £160k and next door sold theirs last month for £189k. This is in prime Blackheath (not Lewisham). I originally bought in 2001 for £75k. Before that I bought a 1 bedroom flat in a place overlooking the Heath for £65k (1999). So as for £200k flats I think you youngsters will be shocked when the crash hits full speed. I have to agree with Kagiso I can see prices dropping by 50% in areas like Woolwich, Kidbrooke, Deptford, Lewisham, New Cross etc. Areas like Greenwich and Blackheath may escape with 30% but I remember in the 1990's these areas also dropped to a point were people just couldnt sell. When things crash you will find it much easier to rent or sell a 2 bed cottage in Greenwich than a 2 bed flat in Woolwich.

You'll look back in a few years on your decision to not buy in Woolwich and see it as a massive life changing decision. When Berkley are offloading for £130k you can than your lucky stars you never got involved.

That's very helpful infor but unfortunately I can't find the sub 200k flats in blackheath which you mention. The place I had a look at in Blackheath is £319,000 - a 2-bed on Shooters Hill Road a stones throw from the heath and about 12 min to the heart of the village. I think it's nice and I could certainly see myself living there through a crash if necessary. It also appears a reasonable price compared to what £325,000 can get you in a place like Clapham but the price is £70,000 more than the property was sold for at the start of last year which equates to a 25%-30% increase in little over a year. With so few comparable 2 beds on the market there, it's hard to see whether this is indeed fair value or not...