Tuesday, Dec 29, 2009

Subliminal messaging

The Times: Companies begin moving production back to UK

Higher freight, energy and commodity costs have increased the expense of production overseas, while the recession has put pressure on companies to re-evaluate decisions on location.

Posted by devo @ 11:02 PM (2539 views)
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25 Comments

1. fallingbuzzard said...

I think the article is complete bull, although its only reporting on another report

Tuesday, December 29, 2009 11:08PM Report Comment
 

2. devo said...

1. fallingbuzzard said.. I think the article is complete bull

Who cares what you (or I) think?

I think protectionism is the way forward.

Tuesday, December 29, 2009 11:17PM Report Comment
 

3. fallingbuzzard said...

Hmm. We don't do protectionism nor have the assets or capabilities worth protecting. We thrive on openness in and out, in fact we are that and can't be anything else. As for the article only the author cares and I might just tell her.

Tuesday, December 29, 2009 11:22PM Report Comment
 

4. devo said...

3. fallingbuzzard said... We don't do protectionism nor have the assets or capabilities worth protecting.

Hmm.. right back at you.

Do you not have an interest in the future success of this country, or are you prepared to sacrifice it, for the sake of personal gain, at the altar of globalism.

Cue: "I do my bit for charidee; for the little kiddies."

Tuesday, December 29, 2009 11:32PM Report Comment
 

5. fallingbuzzard said...

Why debate something that is never going to happen

Tuesday, December 29, 2009 11:41PM Report Comment
 

6. markj69 str05 said...

Might happen to some small degree. Personally I would have thought a devalued currency must attract investment of some sort.

However, in times such as these, I would expect all governments to be doing their utmost to keep the money within their realms. But, I guess that decision will only be made by the money men themselves.

“He who controls the money supply of a nation controls the nation”

“Whoever controls the volume of money in any country is absolute master of all industry and commerce.”

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 12:45AM Report Comment
 

7. it_is_going_with_a_bang said...

A waste of time article just saying nothing to any great degree.

Manufacturing and other business operations is generally a one way street off this island.
I welcome the turn around that industry bosses sometimes make when they realize they should not have moved like the rest of the herd and end up brining something back - other than just their wallets.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 08:54AM Report Comment
 

8. Adskirockski said...

I work for a global chemical company with several mixing plants throughout Europe, due to the weakness of the pound we are bringing more work into the UK to be completed rather than being done in the Eurozone. At the moment this is only stopping our plant from shrinking rather than causing expansion due to a drop-off in demand.

We’re in a flexible organisation where it’s quite easy to make these changes but I’m sure they must be happening throughout the country and if the pound gets significantly weaker I’m sure we’ll be expanding here.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 09:09AM Report Comment
 

9. c'mon correction said...

The focus of the Labour government is on the public sector to the expense of all else. There is simply too much red tape, legislation, tax and employee costs for any manufacturing company of any decent size to be truly competitive in the global market.

We must have one of the most un-sustainable economies in the world right now. Sadly, we have a delusional government and electorate.

The UK is and will continue to be in a terminal economic decline for centuries to come (in global terms). We still have a lot of fingers in a lot of pies, but very slowly they are being plucked out. We are punching way above our weight, it's only a question how long we can keep bullying the developing nations before they realise and give us a sucker punch!

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 09:39AM Report Comment
 

10. alan_540 said...

@1 Agreed. Complete whitewash. Propaganda a la New Labour.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 10:57AM Report Comment
 

11. stillthinking said...

A devalued currency would attract inward investment, but only when it has stopped devaluing. If you are suspicious that the pound might have further to fall, then you save money by delaying. This is part of why uncertainty is so bad for business, if you don't know what the situation is going to be like then sit on your hands.

I would be surprised if anybody made a big investment decision now when you could wait 6 months and find out things you don't know now such as employment taxes (employer ni), corporation tax changes, end of qe effect on the pound and borrowing costs, possible large rise in repossessions and a fire sale of UK assets (cheaper to invest).

Which is why recessions should be allowed to let rip so as to get to the bottom as soon as possible.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 11:17AM Report Comment
 

12. devo said...

11. stillthinking said... A devalued currency would attract inward investment, but only when it has stopped devaluing. If you are suspicious that the pound might have further to fall, then you save money by delaying.

Logically, the same thought process will apply to houses.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 11:21AM Report Comment
 

13. stillthinking said...

I think it does, who would buy a house now? When you can just wait another 6 months. So very nearly there now.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 11:33AM Report Comment
 

14. devo said...

13. stillthinking said.. who would buy a house now? When you can just wait another 6 months. So very nearly there now

Only if there is an almighty crash.

What if there is a long, drawn out decline in house prices over a period of years?

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 11:40AM Report Comment
 

15. rumble said...

c'mon correction,
"The UK is and will continue to be in a terminal economic decline for centuries to come (in global terms). We still have a lot of fingers in a lot of pies, but very slowly they are being plucked out. We are punching way above our weight, it's only a question how long we can keep bullying the developing nations before they realise and give us a sucker punch!"

UK still on the decline from the empire bubble.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 12:24PM Report Comment
 

16. stillthinking said...

I don't mean wait 6 months and then there -will- be an almighty crash, I mean wait 6 months because there are going to be some big changes which -most likely- will cause an almighty crash.
For all the talk of inflation, we still face a huge deflationary onslaught next year, and a big part of this is that people have stopped borrowing. The end of recessions are preceded by an expansion of consumer credit, that is the ultimate marker to look for. At the moment why are we deflating? Because * nobody is borrowing for houses and nobody is borrowing for consumption * (because many need to save up for a house). Housing totally dominates the UK financial landscape. The gov. can take on debt to compensate for a certain while, another 6 months or what have you, but sooner or later they will have to allow/enable an expansion of consumer credit, which means putting people in homes because people don't buy goods in rental, they are deposit saving, and if credit or just the mood of the country is against the current pricing level for housing, then eventually they can't feasibly hold prices up. The market is frozen because of interference with repossessions to the detriment of the economy. New Labour have a vain hope they can kick start at their dream pricing level, but they can't, the wages aren't there, the bank capital isn't there, the disposable income isn't there, soon they will, not give up, but reality will reveal their empty hand. Attempting to hold one asset group of pricing up is naturally going to force other prices down.
The UK is still property obsessed, utterly mad with it, and the will of the people is such that -I will not buy consumer goods, I will not partake in society, until I can own my own home, even if the economy sinks into hell I will l not change my stand-.

So all to play for really. Another 6 months, so what. Maybe people will just give up on property in the UK altogether, I haven't dismissed the possibility of large emigration away from the UK. Look at the figures, more and more people are leaving.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 12:49PM Report Comment
 

17. devo said...

"I don't mean wait 6 months and then there -will- be an almighty crash, I mean wait 6 months because there are going to be some big changes which -most likely- will cause an almighty crash."

semantics

otherwise, a good post

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 01:05PM Report Comment
 

18. stillthinking said...

Just thinking about this again has got me into a froth. I am 100% convinced that there will be a crash in prices of catastrophic unbelievable proportion. In the North of England there are some areas with economies 60% of which are government spending. There is no way that they will survive 15% fiscal tightening. Prices are determined at the margin after all. There is no replacement employer to step forward, they face large scale no hope unemployment, and the value of properties in those areas is going to be determined basically by housing benefit.
They are going into a barren wilderness.
For London, maybe not so bad, but a sh*t one bedroom flat in paddington, surrounded by boarded up shops and people hanging around on the streets outside, is not going to hold up a valuation of 150K. Who on earth would pay that? Its only worth about 80K if that and that is where the price is going to head to.
For family homes, we have over the last decade put generations into mid-to-low properties which they cannot sell because of neg. equity. Where are the future family house buyers coming from? These large expensive properties are going collapse the most, for all the misleading nonsense about holding their price up well now. The people living in them are heading into a dinosaur style dying off as the boomers pop their corks.

House prices will collapse IMO, and that Labour have purported to support them while sacrificing the general economy is their worst crime. Ultimately the reason why is that they are not worth that much money ! Simple. They are not worth the price now, nor in 2007,06,05,04,03 they are not worth it and anybody who put that much cash just outside the reach of the uk economy, into a foreign currency or whatever, has profited handsomely and demonstrated the point.

Labour are running out of ability to freeze events in time. And from a personal point of view, I wil be f*cked before I am put into debt slavery just to buy some sh*t house in a run into the ground sh*t hole surrounded by labour voters.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 01:21PM Report Comment
 

19. letthemfall said...

stillthinking
You sound a bit cross. I share your crossness: I too do not wish to plunge myself in debt to buy a crummy house, regardless of which voters it's surrounded by, which are as likely to be Tory as any other. When they will collapse must depend on credit, which I think we are all very surprised to see hold up so well, and must be largely down to the liquidity measures. At present there is a growing polarisation between the wealthy and the rest, which in itself may go to supporting the prices of decent housing. What worries me is that this will continue, so that expensive housing will get more expensive (via 2nd and 3rd homes), while the rest go down the pan. Progressive taxation is the way to counteract this if current conditions persist.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 02:08PM Report Comment
 

20. a saver said...

Stillthinking said 'I am 100% convinced that there will be a crash in prices of catastrophic unbelievable proportion. In the North of England there are some areas with economies 60% of which are government spending. There is no way that they will survive 15% fiscal tightening. Prices are determined at the margin after all. There is no replacement employer to step forward, they face large scale no hope unemployment, and the value of properties in those areas is going to be determined basically by housing benefit.'
Can't help thinking much of Scotland could go the same way, especially Edinburgh, where most people are employed by HBOS/RBS or the public sector, but the property only goes up mentality is still persisting. Only last week someone pointed out that St Andrews property was going to skyrocket because of the open golf championship this year. We had an article mentioning a 12% crash in Edin in the last quarter -in the Scotsman, unbelievably -yet someone was arguing a day or two ago that prices were on the up.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 02:14PM Report Comment
 

21. stillthinking said...

well, we will see the direction things go in six months. the end of qe and fiscal tightening is a biggie.
I am fairly cross and thats putting it mildy, but typing out my bile here does me a power of good.
what i dislike most about labour voters is that they invariably dress up their blatant desire to personally profit from uk collapse in a mock sincere "good of society" way, implicitly treating me as an idiot and lying to my face, and i also dislike the fact that they are totally wrong and will end up busted dragging me down with them.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 03:26PM Report Comment
 

22. Endgame said...

Don't despair, I sold up at the end of 2006, now renting and have no intention of getting back into the market until I've seen the shake up of the General Election for starters. Then watch out for the end of Q.E. Micky Mouse money, added to the solftly softly repossesions policy, Then watch what happens as Interest Rates start to raise as they must. Average wages at shite levels. Baton down the hatches, the pain hasn't even begun yet. Them's my sentiments.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 05:00PM Report Comment
 

23. alan said...

@Stillthinking,

I suppose you have tried making much reduced offers on the houses you like. A number of people I know have negotiated big reductions from those REALLY wanting to sell.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 05:01PM Report Comment
 

24. letthemfall said...

Bit sweeping stillthinking. You'll be saying their eyes are too close together next. I think you'll find an awful lot of arrogant selfish upstarts amongst all political persuasions. Me, I'm just hoping for interest rate rises.

Wednesday, December 30, 2009 05:34PM Report Comment
 

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