Wednesday, Dec 09, 2009

Is This What We Should Expect After The Election

BBC News: Tough 2010 Irish budget unveiled

"Public servants will face pay cuts, ranging from 5% on those earning 30,000 euros to 15% on those earning more than 200,000 euros"

Posted by wdbeast @ 09:00 PM (1824 views)
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22 Comments

1. montesquieu said...

This is a precursor to full-on deflation, Japanese style.

Wednesday, December 9, 2009 11:16PM Report Comment
 

2. Fallingbuzzard said...

Deflation, eh, really? Spell it out to me then. Why would this budget reduce the amount of money in the Irish economy or reduce the speed at which money moves? I would have expected this to increase the volume of money and the speed thereby counteracting the structural deflation. Faced with a very similar problem, the UK is taking a different path whereby it slows the velocity of money and has added a modest amount to the volume. I think the UK will experience a more significant deflation than Ireland and over a far longer period because we have bigger structural problems and no growth potential.

Wednesday, December 9, 2009 11:22PM Report Comment
 

3. Ann said...

not necessarily, if one assumes that public sector pay is out of step with the economy (the rest of which i.e. private sector has largely corrected itself already). i do assume this because every senior public sector fool i know is grossly overpaid and on the sponge.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 05:40AM Report Comment
 

4. Me said...

Total outstanding credit in the Irish economy is now down a whopping €25bn (from €400bn to €375bn) since the credit deflation kicked in early this year. This is roughly made up of half mortgage debt and half "all other" debt.

Credit is being sucked out of the economy at roughly €2bn a month, every month.

http://www.centralbank.ie/data/MonthStatFiles/10%20-%20October%202009.pdf

Thursday, December 10, 2009 06:26AM Report Comment
 

5. crunchy said...

This is a precursor to full-on Copenhaven. Good point montesquieu, but those unforseen dynamics are still on the horizon.

Speaking of Copenhagen, the weather in North America must have taken 'some' by suprise. Those unforseen dynamics I guess.

Al Gore, long live the polar bears that can't swim to well? LOL

Thursday, December 10, 2009 08:27AM Report Comment
 

6. crunchy said...

The problem with the Japenese deflation theory is that we have a Global dynamics now. A wild beast is difficult to tame. methinks.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 08:40AM Report Comment
 

7. will said...

Labour will not take these sorts of measures until after the General Election.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 09:18AM Report Comment
 

8. Brucie said...

Shame - Oz economy is booming .. ;)))

Thursday, December 10, 2009 09:30AM Report Comment
 

9. dbc reed said...

The Green New Deal group in their new report The Cuts Won't Work is recommending that quantitative easing money be spent into circulation by public works etc.They give a pretty authoritative account of how the commercial banking system controls the creation of money and not the BoE/ financial authorities as people imagine.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 10:02AM Report Comment
 

10. techieman said...

montesqui is right, either that or rioting in the streets.... my comment was going to be "how do you spell deflation in Gailec anyway" [assuming ive spelt Gailec right!]

Le crunch you are reminding me of the office bore that when asked a question about anything always reverts to whatever their pet subject is of the day. Whilst the Copenhagen stuff is interesting, can we leave it until someone actually posts a climate change / copenhagen blog? Perhaps you could "test the [flood] water" yourself?

Thursday, December 10, 2009 11:02AM Report Comment
 

11. crunchy said...

Never mind the 'evidence' we need a new green collar economy (we busted the last one) that we can regulate and control with noble armies like no other in history. Carbon taxation will fund our new global governmental system to put the 'solution' of global imbalances into the hands of the overcrowded, unknown and unelected.

The UN, IMF and World Bank are now our masters, playing nations off one another in the altruistic pursuite for 'global peace and harmony.'

Did someone mention that we have an election soon? How provincial and quaint. Only my opinions of course!

Thursday, December 10, 2009 11:10AM Report Comment
 

12. crunchy said...

6. techieman... Your'e wrong it's 'Garlic.' : )

Call me an office bore if you want to, I don't care.

Don't worry the posts will come, but not from me. There's no fun in that.

Le crunch it out of the office on Le lunch.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 11:22AM Report Comment
 

13. mark said...

why do i get the feeling labour want the UK to get a credit rating downgrade?

Thursday, December 10, 2009 11:41AM Report Comment
 

14. mark wadsworth said...

Well, hooray for Ireland, who have, per capita, a third fewer taxpayer funded jobs than the UK.

For once I'll disagree with DBC Reed. There is no need for the state to go round spending taxpayers' finest on "public works". If you want a quick and cheap boost to the economy, just liberalise planning laws. Think of all the private money that will flow into construction of new airports, ports, power stations, houses etc etc. And maybe toll bridges, private motorways. Semi-public stuff like roads and rail can be funded from land value tax (or surcharges on Council Tax and Business Rates).

The boost from construction activity will be good, and those things will not only be of lasting benefit but they'll also generate future tax revenues.

What's not to like?

Thursday, December 10, 2009 11:47AM Report Comment
 

15. growler said...

@ Will
Labour won't be in after the next election. And the City knows it.

What maybe the City don't know is what the Irish budget has to do with Copenhagen - but then again, maybe not just the City ;-)

I think if Darling's growth hope turns to be misplaced (especially 2011 growth), we will have to have an Irish style budget.

I'm no great Tory, but it's as plain as hell. The Irish are tackling the problems, and the English under Labour are passing the ball backwards into open space for someone else to pick up.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 12:01PM Report Comment
 

16. rumble said...

Crunchy, "the weather in North America must have taken 'some' by suprise" - climate change = erratic weather, not sunnier every day.

"Carbon taxation will fund our new global governmental system" - would that be the carbon from solar panels or wind turbines?

Thursday, December 10, 2009 12:48PM Report Comment
 

17. crunchy said...

12. rumble. I gave up on your unsophisticated excuse for interlect some time ago. It's people like you that allow people like them.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 12:57PM Report Comment
 

18. Crunchy said...

14 rumble "Intellect"............ See how easy it is to dupe you rumble? No match!

Can't be bothered to keep refreshing.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 01:09PM Report Comment
 

19. dbc reed said...

@Mark Wadsworth
The whole point of the Green New Deal proposals is that the taxpayers don't foot the bill for the infrastructure works: they're financed by entirely publicly created money ( like quantitative easing) so no need for up-front tax money and no need for the intrusion of the banks into the process.
Anyone interested can get an entirely objective and readable account of how money is created in The Green New Deal Group's "The Cuts Won't Work which should satisfy the sceptical MW because it includes the netting off of two created accounts situation which he sets such store by.
The problem with this otherwise interesting document is that it does n't mention LVT.As usual economists plump for the wildest heretical proposals (like cutting the banks out of money creation process) and overlook the simple step of changing property taxation to land only.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 01:57PM Report Comment
 

20. crunchy said...

I6 rumble...You were even too slow for that one, and admin too fast. lol

May I suggest you go back to the 70s and see what terms over time that they, the so called experts have used for climate change.

You might want to also check out what our government was doing with our recycling materials in the past.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 02:25PM Report Comment
 

21. rumble said...

Crunchy, "You were even too slow for that one".

Nope, busy with other things. Not that I mean to suggest you've imagined an unreality based on unfounded assumptions and a lack of objectivity.

Thanks for the discussion...?!

Thursday, December 10, 2009 03:01PM Report Comment
 

22. crunchy said...

21. rumble said Nope, busy with other things.

So that's what you call objectivity. I call it plain lazy. Whilst I 'do know' that there are issues with polution I am not dumb enough to fall

for the oldest trick in the book of history. It comes with age rumble.

Thursday, December 10, 2009 05:22PM Report Comment
 

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