Thursday, March 13, 2008

Will gold be confiscated again?

US mortgage implosion set to blow Darling's Budget to pieces

Washington is exploring - and now invoking - measures that have not been on the agenda since the Great Depression, and for a good reason. House prices fell 9.1pc last year. Goldman Sachs fears a 25pc fall from peak to trough, others go as far as 40pc. Some 8.8m US homeowners already face negative equity on their houses, yet the crash is still gathering pace.

Posted by sold 2 rent 1 @ 08:56 AM (1755 views)
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59 thoughts on “Will gold be confiscated again?

  • Gold price is interesting today – nearly at the magical $1000, but nowhere near an all time high in terms of pounds or euros.

    Whilst we may very well see gold at $1,250 or $1,650 soon – it’s worth bearing in mind that it could still be worth less than today’s price if counted in pounds and euros…

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  • happyrenterz says:

    Good point cornishman. In fact seen in this way, it is not surprising that stocks soared after the Fed action, for the same reason. If you undermine the dollar so severely you are better off putting your money in other assets than treasuries. Shares at least reflect a company that could be making profit.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    cornishman,

    “Whilst we may very well see gold at $1,250 or $1,650 soon – it’s worth bearing in mind that it could still be worth less than today’s price if counted in pounds and euros…”

    The euro and pound will soon be heading much lower. Don’t extrapolate current trends to inifinity.
    Everyone should be making their final preparations on their finances to “crash proof” themselves.

    P.S. Full marks to your intuition about Police chief Michael Todd.
    I thought when people get caught having affairs they either go back to their wives or get divorced. Suicide is a likely cover-up

    Did you know Michael Todd conducted the inquiry into allegations of British collusion in rendition flights?

    Found this article
    Torture flights: what No 10 knew and tried to cover up
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2006/jan/19/uk.humanrights

    “Shami Chakrabarti, director of the human rights group Liberty, which has demanded an inquiry into allegations of British collusion in rendition flights, said she was “deeply disappointed” by the memo. “The government seems more concerned about spinning than investigating our concerns,” she said. She has written to Mr Straw saying the government must now give its full support to the inquiry conducted, at Liberty’s behest, by the chief constable of Greater Manchester, Michael Todd.”

    9/11 and 7/7 were and inside jobs. The truth is out there.

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  • “it’s worth bearing in mind that it could still be worth less than today’s price if counted in pounds and euros…”

    Euros – possibly, but unlikely. Pounds – no chance. The pound’s fate will more closely reflect that of the dollar than the euro. IMHO, if people insist on keeping their savings in cash, keep it in something other than £s or $s. Our economy is a sham; we produce nothing, and live way beyond our means.

    S2R1, I think this time round if governments try to confiscate gold, the public will simply give them the finger – particularly in the US. My guess is that at the moment they are sh*t scared they will loose everything they’ve worked so hard for, and for so many years.

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  • I agree with Harold’s point and would like to add that people’s allegence to their country is not as great as it was in 1929, so they won’t be willing to make personal sacrifices to save their politicians skins.

    For example in 1914 people were lying about their age to gain the privelige of being slaughtered in the trenches. I can’t see people being willing to put their lives on the line like that for anyone in this day and age.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    harold & wage slave,

    The euro’s pull back will coincide with a gold super spike.

    Exchange and capital controls are almost certain once the financial chaos happens.
    Gold confiscation will be attempted for sure.
    You are right that people won’t comply. The political corruption stories will be unfolding at the same time so the public won’t surrender as their faith in the establishment will be in tatters.

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  • s2r1 – “The government seems more concerned about spinning than investigating our concerns”

    Someone I know is having a hard time of it at work at the moment because they are good at their job and a decent honest person. They are someone who wants what is right. They are up against an incompetent bullying management who are abusing their positions of authority, lying and putting spin on things. I’ve done quite a lot of research into bullying recently and, sadly, it seems that this country is being run in the same way. Bullies need to suppress anything that could destroy the illusion of competence and get angry when people see through them and their lies. That is why anyone who ‘thinks’ has been removed from the cabinet and repalced with the sycophants we have now, who are prepared to spin whatever they are told.

    It is only a small step on from that to accept that someone could seek favour from ‘higher up’ by removing someone who was prepared to speak out about something.

    “Why should we, in the words of Blix, expect governments to be more ‘serious’ and ‘credible’ during a time of war? Have these journalists, politicians and unelected Swedish businessmen forgotten about the twentieth century? Have we forgotten the words spoken by American Senator Hiram Johnson in 1917, that ‘the first casualty when war comes is truth’?”

    http://www.spiked-online.com/Articles/00000006DF23.htm

    “For Blair – accused of misusing, exaggerating or even inventing intelligence in order to justify the overthrow of Saddam Hussein – the stakes could not have been higher.
    This was undoubtedly the greatest crisis of his premiership to date.
    To add fuel to the flames, his director of communications, Alastair Campbell, had launched an unprecedented and vitriolic attack on the BBC, questioning its integrity and professionalism in the way it reported the story.
    Suddenly finding himself under tremendous personal pressure, it seemed that Dr Kelly had buckled and decided to commit suicide.”

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=488667&in_page_id=1770

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  • regarding the gold, yes I agree that the pound will be toast before very long – it was just a revelation to me that we could possibly see such high gold prices in dollars without a similar spike in the other major currencies.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    James, (from yesterday)

    “Do remember, chaps, that when arguing with s2r1 (which I gave up long ago) YOU CANNOT WIN.”

    Do you know the reason why YOU CANNOT WIN?
    Because the evidence of corruption in 9/11 and 7/7 is stacked sky high on youtube.
    You can’t win because you have NO ARGUMENT.

    Richard Gage on Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtZBNPDQKRE

    Why would a group of professional architects and engineers with professional reputations at stake make such a video?
    Watch the video and then we can have a proper discussion.

    This is an information war.
    Everybody must do their own research to find the truth.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    cornishman,

    “American Senator Hiram Johnson in 1917, that ‘the first casualty when war comes is truth’?””

    Well said.

    If this information war is essentiallty about the truth.
    Could this be the war to end all wars?

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  • s2r1 – Go and watch youtube all day if you enjoy being indoctrinated by others.

    Iv’e had enough of this rubbish.

    Webmaster, I’m off, this blog is spouting very dangerous attitudes from fringe elements.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    wdbeast,

    “s2r1 – Go and watch youtube all day if you enjoy being indoctrinated by others.”

    Go and watch the TV all day if you want to be indoctrinated by others.

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  • happyrenterz says:

    There was a good book review on in the FT magazine on Sunday “Undamned lies. COUNTERKNOWLEDGE: How We Surrendered to Conspiracy Theories, Quack Medicine, Bogus Science and Fake History“. The internet has allowed an explosion of this sort of thing. The internet can enlighten but also darken the human race. In terms of this hpc community I hope we will continue to show respect to each other in trying to find the truth. No one has a monopoly on the truth so we should not slag off peoples views. Please present your views but don’t try win the argument.

    As this cartoon shows we are not alone with this problem!

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  • @S2R1, although I share your sentiments. Please don’t scare the masses, as it is for these individuals to find out eventually or in there own time.

    It’s like this S2R1, the financial system which is literally crumbling before our very eyes is enough for everyone to realise the lies & deception that has been played upon the people. Whatever happens in the future, be assured that although it may be painful & frightening, eventually things or society will correct. It’s human nature.

    So please, relax with the theories, as I do agree with you. But again, let the people find this out for themselves.

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  • theboltonfury says:

    what about we can make our own minds up without nutbars on Youtube and without nutbars on TV?

    s2r – I watched one of the youtube things you sent, because frankly I actually think I’ve become so subliminaly scared by reading this site – I wanted to find out for myself. The guy was wearing a shirt with moon and stars on it!!! I also found that if you put any year you like into google, there will have been predictions of apocalypse or there will be

    I am now sick of all this talk of Mayans, polar shifts, cosmic rays, sunspots (which you may or may not have specifically mentioned but are clearly all associated with the imminent doom mongering). Quite frankly since I have been on this site as an avid reader and I think it’s lost it’s focus on housing issues in whatever form they take and is becoming a platform for a select few to bleat on about their personal beliefs from a spiritual point of view.

    I don’t blame wilderbeast, you have no idea the frenzy you a creating due to your interpretations of endless models and cycles and your personal interpretations as to the spiritual implications of this. I would be quite sure that there is a silent majority that can’t be bothered to post that they’ve had enough of it too. Quite how some people pop up and say it adds to an intriguing debate is lost on me. When it starts to verge on cosmic related prophesising I just think it’s mental

    sorry, I’m sure you’re a lovely guy/girl

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    theboltonfury,

    The Calleman model says the new level of consciousness cannot establish itself until the old one of POWER has been destroyed.

    This destruction is imminent. By September/October we should see more clearly a new level of ETHICS consciousness. The economy, political system, and mass media will be either in tatters or have changed radically.

    Maybe Ron Paul will be the front runner by then.

    Global enlightenment will happen, whether you as an individual make it or not.
    Everyone has a choice.

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  • happyrenterz says:

    funny FT remove articles as soon as they get some readers! Here it is:

    Undamned lies

    By Michael Skapinker

    Published: March 8 2008 02:00 | Last updated: March 8 2008 02:00

    COUNTERKNOWLEDGE: How We Surrendered to Conspiracy Theories, Quack Medicine, Bogus Science and Fake History

    by Damian Thompson

    Atlantic Books £12.99, 162 pages

    FT bookshop price: £10.39

    At Ohio’s Creation Museum, the displays show children and dinosaurs frolicking in the Garden of Eden. Dinosaurs survived Noah’s flood and roamed the earth until quite recently, the museum says. How did they fit into Noah’s ark? ’’They only took young dinosaurs on board,’’ a guide explains.

    Here is something else you may not know: the Chinese discovered America before Christopher Columbus, at least according to 1421: The Year China Discovered the World, a bestseller by Gavin Menzies. Menzies does not tell us that Israel’s northern border was determined by Freemasons. That is in Talisman: Sacred Cities, Secret Faith, by Graham Hancock and Robert Bauval.

    All this shows we are living through a ’’golden age’’ of bogus science, history and archaeology, Damian Thompson, a leader writer on The Daily Telegraph, says in his bracing polemic Counterknowledge.

    He piles on the evidence. About 45 per cent of Americans think God created humans 10,000 years ago, according to a 2004 Gallup poll. British readers can stop smirking. Homeopathy, for which there is little scientific evidence, is available on the National Health Service, as well as being taught in some of the country’s universities.

    Counterknowledge’s essential characteristic, Thompson says, is that it purports to be knowledge, but can either be disproved or has no evidence to support it. There is no evidence, for example, that federal officials assisted in the September 11 attacks or did nothing to stop them, but 36 per cent of adult Americans believe one of these propositions. (Thompson, who is also editor-in-chief of The Catholic Herald, concedes that the story of ’’a Palestinian carpenter coming back to life’’ is equally implausible, but argues there is a difference ’’between declaring one’s belief in isolated supernatural events such as the Resurrection, which is what ordinary churchgoers do, and making falsifiable statements about the world around us, which is what faith healers do’’.)

    There are two particularly worrying aspects about counterknowledge today, Thompson writes. The first is that people who should know better are helping to promulgate it. 1421 and Talisman were published by reputable companies – the former by Transworld, the latter by Penguin, which, like the FT, is owned by Pearson.

    Second, Thompson says counterknowledge is spreading to countries where scientific traditions are thin and untruths find a ready anti-western audience. In northern Nigeria and Pakistan, Islamic leaders have told parents that polio vaccines are an American plot to sterilise them.

    The deluge of ’’counterknow-ledge’’ is bigger now than it has been for decades and threatens to sweep away one of the Enlightenment’s greatest legacies – ’’a scientific methodology that allows us to make increasingly accurate observations about the world around us’’.

    The internet has made the spread of counterknowledge easier. But the web, argues Thompson, is also the way to strike back – which makes it a pity that his own sourcing can be slapdash. An allegation that Muslim students at Guy’s Hospital distributed leaflets attacking Darwinism is unsourced, as is the (easily verifiable) assertion that measles increased in London after unwarranted doubts about the MMR vaccine. In the battle against lies, it is important to buttress the truth.

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  • theboltonfury says:

    that’s it, i’m off too – never to return. I’m sorry, in my mind I’ve given you every chance – you are a fruitcake who spends too much time on the internet and I can do without spending my day talking about hippy wizards and their ****ing models of karma sh*ite

    goodbye!

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    happyrenterz,

    You can find as many sources as you like to back up your arguments.
    Just as I can find the same number to back up mine.

    The “information war” is looming and will be the bloodiest in May.
    Expect family and friends to be arguing with each other.

    By September/October, truth will be the winner.

    Quote from prisonplanet.com
    “The more people are exposed to the truth, the more receptive they are to it�and the closer they are to believing it. Think of it this way: if your parents, siblings, or spouse devoted as much time listening to Alex Jones and visiting sites like http://www.infowars.com and http://www.propagandamatrix.com as they spend watching talking heads like Tom Brokaw and reading the daily newspapers, they would awaken to the truth. Much like love, the truth requires much attention and dedication to flourish. Does a man tell his wife that he loves her only once? Of course not. He reminds her everyday with words and thoughts and actions. Does a mother tell her child she loves him only one time in his life? Of course not. She tells him as much as possible, even when he doesn�t want to hear. The truth is like love. We must tell those around us as much as possible. We must show them the documents that serve as the blueprint for the vile forces that have overtaken our nation. Even if they don�t want to hear. Especially if they don�t want to hear. Victory in this information war requires understanding of the truth, but patience is just as important. So be patient with yourselves and others, keep fighting the good fight, and we will all keep marching on to victory!”

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    @theboltonfury and wdbeast.

    I thought I was the only one getting the hump with s2r. Here Here! Well said.

    I had a pop at him/her a few weeks back when the youtube dude with stars & moons on his shirt was posted but no one else seemed to care!

    Too much hocus pocus for my liking sorry s2r. No disrespect. Like I said before. Please keep it real and I still don’t have 3 hours to spend watching youtube.

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  • What doesn’t make sense to me is why would someone who doesn’t like something, and knows that they will disagree with something, go to such lengths to try to stop people posting their views? It’s the same as someone who knows they don’t like sexy films watching one all the way through and then moaning about how it shouldn’t have been broadcast.

    So why do wdbeast et al go to such lengths to keep saying how fed up they are with various postings. The answer is simple, just don’t look at them/skim over them.

    Unless of course they are the ‘authority’ trying to stop the plebs from discovering the truth with their tittletattle. Conspiracy or what!

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  • S2R1,

    What do you mean by the pull back of the Euro ?

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    @cornishman

    It is simply that s2r is do dam prolific when he’s on line. It’s almost impossible to ignore it!

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    The blog suicide rate is high today.

    Seriously, If you can’t handle my concepts I am putting forward, how are you going to cope with the financial/political chaos about to emerge.

    I am actually giving you hope for the future and explanations and reasons for the destruction that is ahead.

    The history of “fifth nights” shows it is shifting from a physical destruction to a mental destruction.
    We should all be relieved that this fifth night will not involve a physical war but an information war (unlike in WW2)

    Look what boltonfury said

    “I’m sorry, in my mind I’ve given you every chance”

    His mind cannot cope. Like the rest of us, our minds will be unable to process the forthcoming destruction. The only way through this mess will be to move to the next level of consciousness.

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  • theboltonfury says:

    cornish, because there is only so much a person can take of another’s inane rantings before they feel the need to say something. I come on here to read about houses and this guy constantly quotes almost insane preachings and read about it for months, as you say skipping over it and saying nowt. To use your analogy about porn. if i was setting out to watch it or knew it was coming then I wouldn’t complain if it was screened, but if I set out to watch a football match but instead was met with porn (cue jokes about how that wouldn’t be bad) then I’d be annoyed. This is similar

    the guy is off his rocker

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  • theboltonfury says:

    your posts are now similar to David Icke when he went on Wogan

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    …. Or more to the point perhaps we should all go to “911&77Conspiracy.com” or “thetruthisoutthere.org” to discuss HPC!!!!!

    (just in case you were wondering I made those URLs up.. no need to go there)

    Fifth Night = Friday Night Yay! Will I get to the next level of consciousness when I crack open the wine?

    All hail s2r. You are my savour. I repent! I repent! I am ready to be saved!

    Physical & mental destruction. Have you been to my local then? Do I know you?

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  • I have learnt to recognise and ignore the more outlandish posters and conspiracy theorists on this site, and simply don’t bother to read their offerings anymore. I do feel however that some are impacting on the credibility of this site – which is unfortunate. The internet can be a real magnet for people with strange and unorthodox views. Mind you, I feel the same way about religion and I guess a large proportion of the world population would disagree with me on that one.

    I’ve often wondered what these folk do when their short term prediction dates pass by without any noticeable change or upheaval. I suppose if they look hard enough, they can find some event somewhere in the world that they can claim justifies the prediction.

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  • wage slave – s2r1 means that after the Dollar has fallen in his view to between 1.55- 1.60 Euros *its 155.80ish at the moment, that will exhaust the Dollars down-move and there will be a correction with the Dollar appreciating against the Euro. Actually trading wise the pound / dollar looks easier to call. 20466 gives a 61.8% retracement from the downmove and we have already past the 50% retracement level of 20250. A bit more dollar weakness and then a major correction against the Euro and less so v. The pound. i.e. the $ gets stronger, after a bit more downside.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    theboltonfury,

    “your posts are now similar to David Icke when he went on Wogan”

    Yeh. We all remember what that lunatic said all those years ago.

    Yet. Many of the predictions he made have come true.
    So much in fact that Channel 5 made a fair documentary about him in December 2006.

    David Icke – Was He Right?
    http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6860946590182985661

    David Icke-World Banking System (pt 1 of 2) (from 1996 NO LESS)
    This guy was a decade ahead of us
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LnCjYagqtMo

    Stop hiding from the truth boltonfury – no wonder you are so furious.
    Get a new user id – boltontruth – you will feel much better

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  • happyrenterz says:

    s2r I enjoy your posts and enthusiasm to this site. You research widely, your financial views are usually spot on and you also entertain lots of unconventional opinions. Even when “unconventional” tips over into “bogus” I enjoy the grain of truth they contain. However, your insistence on winning the argument is upsetting a lot of people here and is cruel. This is not because they are not open to the truth, it is because you sometimes pick arguments and conflict. Using language like “information war” etc comes from a psychological angle that is not open to the truth, forcing people into a position of supporting or resisting you. By all means present your views but let others refute them with theirs. I support your expression of views but please don’t make this site a crusade to convert opinion. If you express unconventional views you need to show patience and give people time to absorb and reject what you are saying.

    To all. I for one hate this “blog mortality” happening today. I don’t want the web manager to take action restricting what people write and I don’t want s2r, boltonfury or wdbeast or any of you to leave.

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  • 1commentandgoneforeverbecausethisisuttershizzle says:

    I’m absolutely gobsmacked at some of the rubbish being posted on here today. I can only assume that some members of this forum are wind-up merchants or have been smoking too much doob. Next level of consciousness? Destruction? Global enlightenment? Do me a favour. You’ll be walking around your town centre with the “the end of the world is nigh” sandwich board on next (if you can drag yourself away from the crystal ball and purple wizard robe).

    All that’s gonna happen is house prices are gonna come down a bit/lot (good!) and we’ll have a recession for a while (not so good really as friends and family will lose jobs). That’s it. Same as what’s happened in the past. We’ll get through it – it’ll be OK – honest! No need to cry over spilt mung bean soup.

    You very much remind me of a lady who I used to work with. She took a week off and went one of those “personal development” courses (i.e. a cult-ish course where you pay £1000 in return for a brain full of mumbo-jumbo and quasi-religious nonsense). She came back to work with an inane grin and a worrying calmness about her. She was sectioned 2 weeks later under the mental health act. Took her 2 years to recover. Obviously some people on here have been on the same course and are mid-recovery.

    I thought this site was about House Prices? No? OK, then I’m off to talk to the dog – get more sense out of him (although I did catch him browsing the Mayan sunspots theory the other day, so maybe i’d best have a word with him too)……..

    Unbelievable……..

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  • We all believe what we want to believe, IF someone posts something that others dont agree with i’m all for a discussion on the issues, it focuses the mind. Basically s2r1 is a “cyclist” of the non-2 wheeled variety His basic views are first and foremost where we are in the financial / Long wave cycle. Now having THOUGHT that he looks for convergence with other indicators. Thats fine and perfectly sensible.

    Now in his quest to do this he has come across some works that others may think “go off the deep end”. I personally am very interested in what happens (i.e. what markets turn) around the 22nd March (his calleman / Mayan / Kondra / Armstrong / Elliott view). i.e. when these indicators “converge”. Looking at the markets, I think the most likely element is a rebounding in the USD, but it could be all manner of other stuff – a shakeout in the stockmarket whatever. OR he could be completely wrong, but at least he has the guts to stick his neck out.

    People like s2r1 and other bloggers give you the opportunity to think about issues. Now im not saying i agree with everything that s2r1 says – but his stuff is thought provoking. The financial stuff does clearly relate too HPC. For example Spainish postings – the purchase of Spanish properties by UK residents (at the very least) added to their bubble. The US anlysis is important because banks are global and have taken hits which has made them less likely to lend etc. Now if there is a framework under which this all happens that is surely of interest.

    Personally im interested in how large the falls will be and the pressure we are put under once there is the inevitable initial bounce and where that will be. I’m sure when that bounce happens the bulls will re-enter the fray, the resolution of that is what i find of interest. If there are ANY methods that help me determine that then my ears and my mind are open…

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  • theboltonfury says:

    he also said big green lizards were our forefathers and were watching us in human skins. please can i have a youtube video to prove that as well?

    He also said he was the son of God – video please?

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  • See, I really don’t have time to keep up. S2R1, if you are going to quote me at least have the decency to do so properly. Then again, selecting bits out of a piece that suit your views whilst ignoring the rest is rather your style, isn’t it? Here’s the link that you really ought to take a look at:

    http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html

    Not that it’s for me to say, but you should be banned. You make it far too easy for Kirstie and pals to paint anyone predicting a housepricecrash as a loon.

    “Do remember, chaps, that when arguing with s2r1 (which I gave up long ago) YOU CANNOT WIN. Look at how quickly they’re prepared to invent conspiracies – that poor policeman has been bumped off by shadowy forces obstructing the TROOF! We have no evidence, not even an article on the internet for this one, but it’s the TROOF!

    s2r1, cornishman, your assorted sockpuppets,

    http://www.urban75.org/info/conspiraloons.html

    Tell me you don’t recognise yourselves.”

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  • Actually, here’s the list…

    10 characteristics of conspiracy theorists
    A useful guide by Donna Ferentes

    1. Arrogance. They are always fact-seekers, questioners, people who are trying to discover the truth: sceptics are always “sheep”, patsies for Messrs Bush and Blair etc.

    2. Relentlessness. They will always go on and on about a conspiracy no matter how little evidence they have to go on or how much of what they have is simply discredited. (Moreover, as per 1. above, even if you listen to them ninety-eight times, the ninety-ninth time, when you say “no thanks”, you’ll be called a “sheep” again.) Additionally, they have no capacity for precis whatsoever. They go on and on at enormous length.

    3. Inability to answer questions. For people who loudly advertise their determination to the principle of questioning everything, they’re pretty poor at answering direct questions from sceptics about the claims that they make.

    4. Fondness for certain stock phrases. These include Cicero’s “cui bono?” (of which it can be said that Cicero understood the importance of having evidence to back it up) and Conan Doyle’s “once we have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however unlikely, must be the truth”. What these phrases have in common is that they are attempts to absolve themselves from any responsibility to produce positive, hard evidence themselves: you simply “eliminate the impossible” (i.e. say the official account can’t stand scrutiny) which means that the wild allegation of your choice, based on “cui bono?” (which is always the government) is therefore the truth.

    5. Inability to employ or understand Occam’s Razor. Aided by the principle in 4. above, conspiracy theorists never notice that the small inconsistencies in the accounts which they reject are dwarfed by the enormous, gaping holes in logic, likelihood and evidence in any alternative account.

    6. Inability to tell good evidence from bad. Conspiracy theorists have no place for peer-review, for scientific knowledge, for the respectability of sources. The fact that a claim has been made by anybody, anywhere, is enough for them to reproduce it and demand that the questions it raises be answered, as if intellectual enquiry were a matter of responding to every rumour. While they do this, of course, they will claim to have “open minds” and abuse the sceptics for apparently lacking same.

    7. Inability to withdraw. It’s a rare day indeed when a conspiracy theorist admits that a claim they have made has turned out to be without foundation, whether it be the overall claim itself or any of the evidence produced to support it. Moreover they have a liking (see 3. above) for the technique of avoiding discussion of their claims by “swamping” – piling on a whole lot more material rather than respond to the objections sceptics make to the previous lot.

    8. Leaping to conclusions. Conspiracy theorists are very keen indeed to declare the “official” account totally discredited without having remotely enough cause so to do. Of course this enables them to wheel on the Conan Doyle quote as in 4. above. Small inconsistencies in the account of an event, small unanswered questions, small problems in timing of differences in procedure from previous events of the same kind are all more than adequate to declare the “official” account clearly and definitively discredited. It goes without saying that it is not necessary to prove that these inconsistencies are either relevant, or that they even definitely exist.

    9. Using previous conspiracies as evidence to support their claims. This argument invokes scandals like the Birmingham Six, the Bologna station bombings, the Zinoviev letter and so on in order to try and demonstrate that their conspiracy theory should be accorded some weight (because it’s “happened before”.) They do not pause to reflect that the conspiracies they are touting are almost always far more unlikely and complicated than the real-life conspiracies with which they make comparison, or that the fact that something might potentially happen does not, in and of itself, make it anything other than extremely unlikely.

    10. It’s always a conspiracy. And it is, isn’t it? No sooner has the body been discovered, the bomb gone off, than the same people are producing the same old stuff, demanding that there are questions which need to be answered, at the same unbearable length. Because the most important thing about these people is that they are people entirely lacking in discrimination. They cannot tell a good theory from a bad one, they cannot tell good evidence from bad evidence and they cannot tell a good source from a bad one. And for that reason, they always come up with the same answer when they ask the same question.

    A person who always says the same thing, and says it over and over again is, of course, commonly considered to be, if not a monomaniac, then at very least, a bore.

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    @s2r

    Yes I saw “David Icke – Was he right?” when it was on TV and I was fascinated by him. He didn’t come across at all well. I came away feeling sorry for the shell suited nutter. Son God? Please!

    I’m with Happyrenterz. Mostly I enjoy your posts and find them relevant as to why I’m @HPC. The problem I have with you s2r is the same problem I have with anyone like David Icke or evangelists of any kind or any religion… You can’t help trying to convert people or persuade them to “your way”. People need saving.

    No we don’t.

    I’m happy just being thank you. I don’t have a religious or cult like bone in my body and for the record I think anyone who is overly religious is a misguided nutter (Just look at Scientology).

    How many people have died in the name of religion or a cult? Religion and Cults must be a good thing, right?

    But you won’t hear me sprouting on about it here.

    I use this site to cheer myself up, stay focussed and learn some financial stuff. Just this year I started trading gold. Soon after the HPC I will be able to buy a house. I don’t come here to be lectured to about conspiracy theories or spiritual matters.

    I go to the other side of the internet if I’m feeling that way…. And I don’t talk about HPC stuff when I’m there!

    Simple enough hey? Live & Let live. Horses for Courses and all those good old clichés. Not much to ask is it?

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  • Sold 2 rent – you might find this movie very interesting if you haven’t seen it already. Its free to watch

    zeitgeistmovie.com – it’s a little wacky in places with it’s ideas but interesting.

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  • holding out says:

    S2R used to come out with interesting and relevant articles – I could even cope with the myriad of graphs.

    Now he justs instantly believes any old tosh on YouTube – provided it goes against established thinking.

    I think he needs to get out more. I guess the invitations for such opportunities aren’t what they used to be.

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  • yawn.. let’s just agree we live in interesting times…….. as for confiscating gold… not a chance.

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  • rocket robbie says:

    Techieman

    Sorry If i sound stupid but if the pound will rebound shortly against the dollar, is it a good time to buy the dollar then change back after the rebound??

    Like i say, i dont know much about currency exchange so sorry if i sound dumb

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  • RR – no probs. Obviously caveat emptor and im not suggesting anyone should act on my views, but my view is yes SOON that would be a good idea. At EXACTLY what level and EXACTLY what time is for you to decide. Personally i have some Euro – denominated investments, and am looking to hedge them against the pound soon (i need to see some market action and do some work on this over the w/end if i can, to see where my upside Euro target will be, before selling it). I actually think the dollar appreciates against the pound and the Euro, but more so against the Euro. But the Euro is more difficult to trade v the dollar than the pound. Yes by all means if the USD then appreciates you can buy back sterling – although i would be inclined to get into the Swissy, but thats another story…!!! IF im wrong then i will take it on the chin, its just i wouldnt want to feel as if i have been responsible for anyone putting their life savings on an exchange rate!! Now for my life savings… thats a different matter ;-).

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  • also sold to rent says:

    Wow, this is some kind of record for comments. Can we make it to 40? How much insane sheet does one have to spout around here to get booted, or do we keep them on as entertaining pets?

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  • rocket robbie says:

    techieman,

    Cheers for the reply, much appreciated

    Rest assured i wont put my life savings on it i will use my girlfriends instead, nah only kidding

    thanks again

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  • RR – yes ive done that to various ex g/friends over time – suppose that explains WHY they are EX!! – Good luck!

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  • also s2r – erm yes!

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    Gold just tipped over $1000 on bullionvault!

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  • nopension – yes you mean on spot… 1000.1 – loks like a high tick to me – for the moment…..

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    :o) Still learning all the terms.

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  • Cornishman

    “Someone I know is having a hard time of it at work at the moment because they are good at their job and a decent honest person. They are someone who wants what is right. They are up against an incompetent bullying management who are abusing their positions of authority, lying and putting spin on things.”

    Do you know me by chance?

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    happyrenterz,
    “If you express unconventional views you need to show patience and give people time to absorb and reject what you are saying”
    Point taken.

    techieman,
    Thanks for your support

    submedia,
    “zeitgeistmovie.com – it’s a little wacky in places with it’s ideas but interesting.”
    I have sen it. It really opens your mind (or should I say consciousness)

    nopensionnohouse,
    “David Icke – Son God?”
    My take on this is that David Icke’s consciousness suddenly jumped 2 levels above everyone else’s. This would be the same leap as a Homo erectus finding himself in the industrial revolution period. No wonder he thought he was God.

    also sold to rent,
    “Wow, this is some kind of record for comments. Can we make it to 40?”
    By May we will be hitting triple figures on these topics. Just like you used to argue with family and friends over house prices, you will be doing the same over “so called” conspiracies.

    May/June in “fifth night” terms corresponds to 1942-43 The Battle for Stalingrad – the bloodiest battle of WW2.

    One final point. Anyone noticed BBC2’s coverage of 10…9…8….days to war. It actually sounds like we will be going to war.
    The NWO know about the Armstrong model (as he is in a US prison without trial) and surely know about the Calleman/Lungold model.

    What war could they be planning? A new false flag terrorist attack?
    If you twisted my arm into speculation then I would say Heathrow T1-4 are targets. T5 comes online in April so an old cr*ppy terminal will not be missed.

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    @s2r

    Who are you calling a homo?

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    More thoughts on the BBC2’s coverage of 10…9…8….days to war series.

    Having thought about it, a terrorist attack is unlikely as this war is about information and truth.

    Just look at the brain conditioning going on here. Derren Brown would be proud.
    The content of the series shows the BBC as the seeker of the truth, which WE know is rubbish

    We are being conditioned to fight a “war on conspiracy theories” with the BBC being the holder of truth.
    We all know the BBC have spun rubbish for years on house prices. Why would they be different about anything else.

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    @s2r

    “… We are being conditioned to fight a “war on conspiracy theories”..”

    From now on I will believe everything you tell me and everything I see on the internet (and daily express & mail) and I will no longer think for myself.

    I was blind and now I see. Thank you for enlightening me.

    Now, where do I sign?

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  • nopensionnohouse says:

    Inside Track are looking for a new direction! They could use enthusiasm like yours!

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  • “We all know the BBC have spun rubbish for years on house prices. Why would they be different about anything else.”

    You know that 20,000+ people work for the BBC. As someone who’s worked there I can assure you that there are no conspiracies, no attempts of lying to the public, no disturbing agenda whatsoever.

    Mistakes may be made, bias may get through, but that is what’s going to happen in any organisation run by people. Really, you should stop attributing to conspiracy what can be put down to incomptence.

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  • happyrenterz says:

    Gold didnt quite make $1000. This is high drama. It does feel like a titanic battle going on. The US dollar is sick with venerable gold waiting its chance to take over. Conspiracy theories abound. Sit back and enjoy, this is more exciting than Coronation Street for sure.

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  • @ Earth – sorry to hear about your problem. Don’t let the [email protected] grind you down. There are still some decent people around!

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  • happyrenterz says:

    @techieman You mentioned that one possible out come you are imagining is a dollar rally. Would that be a rally against other currencies (in other words people deciding that if USA is in trouble so is everyone) or a rally against commodities (people deciding the dollar is the true safe haven after all)?

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