Monday, March 24, 2008

“Undisclosed Losses !”

Gordon Brown's £300bn banking debt fear

Banks worldwide could be as much as £295billion in debt, Gordon Brown will warn this week. In a joint meeting with French President Nicolas Sarkozy, the Prime Minister will admit they are getting "increasingly concerned" about the world economy. And the pair will say the black hole of debt, causing the potentially explosive credit crunch, could be far worse than expected. It means more banks will be plunged into difficulty because they cannot get money to keep afloat. Savings could be threatened. Businesses and families will also find it more difficult to get loans and mortgages. And it will mean firms closing, unemployment rising and property prices falling.

Posted by plato @ 08:11 PM (1740 views)
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28 thoughts on ““Undisclosed Losses !”

  • uncle chris says:

    Well perhaps if GB has not encouraged banks to behave in such a reckless way to keep his “feel good” factor going until he made it to No.10, then maybe we wouldn’t be in this mess. Sorry GB, you cannot pass on the responsibility for this fiasco that easily. Over the past 11 years, you had the power to prevent this situation developing, and you did nothing.

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  • Gordo’s reign of “continuous growth” was based on the easy availability of debt, underpinned by rising house prices.

    How come he didn’t notice it before?

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  • Perhaps the Mirror has finally realised that New Liebour do not represent the best interests of the people who actually purchase it. This story affects it’s readers more than a Tory riding a bicycle, and ultimately means that it’s readers may not actually have any money left over to buy their excuse of newspaper.

    The Mirror should take a long look in the mirror itself which side of the bread the butter is on, New Liebors or it’s working class readerships!

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  • planning4acrash says:

    Um. Given that all fiat currency is debt, this would be a statement of the glaringly obvious! Banks hold as much debt as the paper value of all currency. But the sheeple will be sucked in once more.

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  • planning4acrash says:

    What do you and your banking friends propose doing? Generate more debt based currency to solve the problem of old debt, or pull up into the euro?

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  • “increasingly concerned”

    Preposterous. The only thing these two guys are concerned about is that people in the West might be gradually waking up to the banking fraud that is being committed against them. They are both completely aware of the immoral nature of the credit system in which we have the misfortune to live – their “concern” is merely crocodile tears.

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  • off topic but where has the Zietgiest posting that sold2rent posted earlier? It was on here a minute ago and now its been removed?censorship on hpc website,seems a bit suspicious to me.

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  • mark wadsworth says:

    £300 bn is perfectly plausible, as it happens – if the value of mortgage debts in the UK were written down by 10%, that’d wipe off £140 bn in the UK alone, about enough to wipe out our banks’ capital base and possibly plunge them into insolvency.

    So there must be a great opportunity for a new bank, or a small bank that holds no such overvalued mortgage assets to go round snapping up existing customers, bank branches, bank staff and cash machines en masse for tuppence ha’penny in fire sales from banks as and when they go *pop*.

    Does anybody know how to start up a bank?

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  • Don’t panic! We will all be perfectly, ok because we have massive gold reserves, err don’t we???

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  • planning4acrash, fundamentally, fiat currency is held by the creditor, not the debtor. I work for somebody and they give me some fiat currency so they will have to do some work that ultimately benefits me to pay off that debt. Rather, I gamble that somebody will pay off his debt and promise not to hold him responsible for his debt – but it’s still close. If nobody then wants the fiat currency I am left with the currency but with nobody to do work for me. Yet I do not owe anything to anybody.

    The problem is that banks buy things now and pay later. “I will give you some money in the future if you do this for me, just say when you want it” and then pray that they’ve got the money when you want to withdraw something.

    Realistically, it is when people trade like this without keeping the printed notes on hand that you have a problem, and when they keep real cash on hand without spending it (because the market gets used to the reduced liquidity and then gets a splash of cash later).

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  • planning4acrash says:

    Wow, sold out, well spotted. Maybe the vi’s like Greenbay are plants by the management? But they didn’t predict how well we fight back. Shall we start a new site? Does this show that we were onto something? Info war has commenced!

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  • planning4acrash says:

    We shouldn’t take this sitting down. Any calls for action? I suggest we
    All spam the webmaster with questions and how we feel about it first off. Second, start a new website if its not reinstated and an apology posted.

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  • @planning4acrash

    “Maybe the vi’s like Greenbay are plants by the management? But they didn’t predict how well we fight back. Shall we start a new site? Does this show that we were onto something? Info war has commenced!”

    Get a grip on yourself. S2R1 admitted that his post was a bit off topic when he put it on here. I’ve lost count of the number of times that ‘Zeitgeist’ has been promoted on this site. There’s nothing unreasonable about removing it if the site admins think it’s too far off topic. If you don’t like what the site admins are doing then you can always ask for a refund!

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  • yes perhaps it was removed by site admin.But why?Can the site admin expain?Has it happened before for other postings?I never noticed this happening before.Anyway i watched the zeitgiest video and it really was an eyeopener and i recommend it.Thanks sold2rent for posting it originally.

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  • planning4acrash says:

    The film is about corruption in banking. Absolutely central to house price crash. To understand corruption requires a critique of conspiracy theories. Totally on topic. Admin are loosers or corrupt or both.

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  • new user 2007 says:

    Everyone can relax. Last week Bush was on the case. Now we have Brown. Can’t go wrong from here.

    They know exactly how to fix it as they helped cause it.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    RE: Zeitgeist

    I had a polite email from the webmaster saying there had been complaints about off topic postings.
    To be fair it was not a news topic but a website.

    Still, 34 comments, says it was relevent.

    I push the boundaries. I must get my knuckles wrapped every now and then.

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  • @planning4acrash

    “Can the site admin expain?”

    Why bother? Basically, we’re here on sufferance. We have no recourse against the site if we disagree with its actions.

    If the site admin’s decide to delete my postings, they can just do it.
    If the site admin’s decide to your postings, they can just do it.
    If the site admin’s decide to S2R1’s postings, they can just do it.
    If the owner of the site decides they are bored with it and shut it down now, they can just do it.
    If the owner of the site decides to charge for access, they can just do it.

    I don’t want to hurt anybody’s feelings but I respectfully suggest that you consider your relationship with HPC and the way the web works in general. Utimately, if you feel strongly enough about this, you can start your own website and set your own agenda – in my opinion that is the only way that you will be able to assert your own control.

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  • @s2r1, I must admit that bothers me a lot too! Normally I’m the first to complain about off-topic posts, but Zeitgeist is within the boundaries, particularly the segment on banking. There are far worse posts on the blog – see today’s nonsense about speed limits. I agree that the volume of comments adds weight to the post.

    @quiet guy, HPC has a relation with its bloggers in the same way that Coca-Cola has with its customers. In the 1980s, coke was reformulated and sold as “new coke”. The customers didn’t like it and complained to the Coca-Cola Company in large numbers (over 400,000 calls and letters according to Wikipedia), demanding the return of the original coke. Now at this point the company could have persisted, saying that it knows best what people want. After all they are a private company, answerable only to shareholders and not to any kind of democracy. However they would be foolish to fight against their own customers; so they brought back the original coke. Maybe a lesson for HPC to learn too?

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  • planning4acrash says:

    Sold 2 rent. Please post the email.

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  • planning4acrash says:

    All things said. Deletion of the zeigist video embodies what i said about associating valid conspiracy with socially unacceptable anti religion content. It got dismissed. One battle in the info war one by the vi’s. Win with ure own truth, not other’s lies

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  • @drewster

    Let me start by observing that this is one of the very few times that I find myself disagreeing with you.

    “There are far worse posts on the blog – see today’s nonsense about speed limits.”

    I admit that some of my posts in the past have also been questionable as well but a key difference is that I don’t keep posting the same thing again and again. How often does S2R1 intend to promote Zeitgeist?

    “the volume of comments adds weight to the post.”

    Aside from the practical difficulties of finding out how many supporters/indifferent/opponents there are to Zeitgeist, who controls this site? The admins or the users?

    “HPC has a relation with its bloggers in the same way that Coca-Cola has with its customers.”

    There is the significant difference that we do not pay HPC cash. It could also be argued that we don’t have an alternative – Pepsi to follow your analogy.

    “they would be foolish to fight against their own customers”

    I’ve never thought of myself as a customer of this site, instead an occasional contributor and reader. Some of the information I have found from the site is useful.

    Generally, I don’t go for conspiracy theories. When I first came across S2R1’s posts I was a bit annoyed and had a go at time on one or two occasions. Later, I just decided to ignore him or at least keep it polite when addressing his questions. I would have been content to see his deleted posting kept on the site but the admins evidently thought otherwise.

    So just who gets to set the agenda here? We don’t have a contract with HPC. If they want to censor, they are free to do so as far as I can see.

    In what way does S2R1 have the right to influence this site’s content and politics compared to (say) Greenbay or Glorious Sunshine? You might say that you think S2R1’s arguments are more truthful or relevant but Greenbay and GS could argue the same.

    Hopefully, this comment will not be censored.

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  • Sorry too much irrelevant comments here. Please use phone for your personal discussion

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  • it_is_going_with_a_bang says:

    Generally posts are left as they are, I doubt the site admin checks every posting unless someone emails a complaint.

    Whatever the reason, keep in mind this is a Blog, which you have no ‘given’ right to keep your postings on. There will be times when for one reason or another a blog is removed for various reasons.
    But, generally, it is a fairly open area I think you would all agree with that.

    Don’t over react to the odd posting being removed.

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    I won’t post the email from the webmaster but it was short and polite. He/she said they had been getting a lot of complaints about irrelevant postings.

    I don’t have any issues with the removal. It is a fair decision. If you feel that the article was relevant then send the webmaster an email. He/she will then be able to see how many people complained and how many want it reinstated.

    I did reply to the email saying that the conflict between bloggers was likely to increase as the crisis worsened. Now HPC has started, the search for the root causes and truths behind HPC will likely fuel conflict between bloggers who were previously alligned with their ideas.

    The thread still exists if you search on “zeitgeist housepricecrash” in google
    http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/newsblog/2008/03/blog-not-a-news-item-but-still-important-11466.php

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  • sold 2 rent 1 says:

    This information war is way more complex that I had previously thought.

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  • happyrenterz says:

    Conspiracy theories don’t cause as much offence as insulting someone’s religion. I suspect this is why it was removed.

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  • sold 2 rent 1, personally I have no problem at all with the ‘big picture’ and welcome it. However, I think the best thing to do fro the time being is what you have done in post 24 above; namely, embed interesting links within a comment. That tends to be my approach. Don’t be discouraged.

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