Get me out of here! Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 Interesting Website, check it out, I bet they are very busy soon! What does everyone think??? Cheap Properties www.a-quick-sale.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzg113 Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 You will find that one of the long-time posters on Singing Pig is a Southern Sales Manager at AQS. That's about all I need to know about it. He posts under the username "Property Master"(!). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Get me out of here! Posted October 23, 2004 Author Share Posted October 23, 2004 You will find that one of the long-time posters on Singing Pig is a Southern Sales Manager at AQS. That's about all I need to know about it.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep, thats where I found the link!!!. Cannot see any property they have for sale though! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBB Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 Interesting Website, check it out, I bet they are very busy soon!<{POST_SNAPBACK}> steady there Get me out , your words might be construed by some that you could actually make money out of property even in a flat /falling market. ie: if the company was to be ''very busy soon'' then they would have been buying properties for substantially below market value (customer gets a ''Quick Sale'' in return of course), and being a profitable (soz about that word) business they will have worked out at what price they could move them on at ........steady now you might not like this last bit........ and made a profit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Get me out of here! Posted October 23, 2004 Author Share Posted October 23, 2004 steady there Get me out , your words might be construed by some that you could actually make money out of property even in a flat /falling market.     ie: if the company was to be ''very busy soon'' then they would have been buying properties for substantially below market value (customer gets a ''Quick Sale'' in return of course), and being a profitable (soz about that word) business they will have worked out at what price they could move them on at ........steady now you might not like this last bit........ and made a profit <{POST_SNAPBACK}> BBB, All I want is to be able to buy a property at 3.5 times my income!. at the moment to buy a 1 bed bedsit, I would need to stretch this to about 7 times my income!. I dont care if EAs or whoever makes a profit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy88s Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 The fact that this company exists shows there is a market for all the exiting BTL's and other over extended OO. The company could do well as it capitalise on peoples panic to offload their tremendously overvalued properties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topher Bear Posted October 23, 2004 Share Posted October 23, 2004 The fact that this company exists shows there is a market for all the exiting BTL's and other over extended OO. The company could do well as it capitalise on peoples panic to offload their tremendously overvalued properties.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> but I'm not sure how having hundreds of difficult to shift properties which are steadily going down in value is a great business venture? Agreed at 10 - 25% off market value they are protected from a small downturn, but a crash of the magnittude most of us are expecting? And where do they get their money from to purchase the properties and pay the costs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 You guys!!! Do you honestly think that because property is going down that you can't make money from it!!! Do honestly think that NO-ONE is buying property??? If we at AQS are buying prop at a TRUE BMV We can offer it back to the market at a BMV price (leave something in it for the next man) thereby shifting the prop very quickly. You see property has ONLY ONE disadvantage over every other asset class..... speed of acquisition and disposal.... at AQS we exploit this and use this as our leverage to generate REAL discounts off property....99% of ppl wanting to sell their property WE ARE NOT RIGHT FOR.... but those ppl where speed and flexibility is more important, we are the ideal solution. Topher bear..."And where do they get their money from to purchase the properties and pay the costs?".....This has got to be the most dumb ass question ever!!! If you were gonna buy a property....where would you get the money from???!!! FOOL....plus whats to say you have to buy a property to sell it.... we routinely SELL properties that we DON'T OWN making a lovely profit and also not having to spend any money buying it!!! IT'S CALLED OPTIONS TRADING!!! Simple concept I know but maybe too difficult for a bunch of Neghead Bears.... And seeing as you mention the CRASH you are expecting...... Yes the Froth is coming of the market... but crash??? Puh please.... just look at the cold hard facts.... - High Employment - Inflation 45% lower than should be!!! - Highest Interest rates in the only important economies (Check HPC home page. Our rates are tooooo high...watch them come down after christmas fueling another boom in the housing market!) - Mortgages are still 25% more affordable than the Crash (OOOoooo a whole 27% from peak to trough....no wait thats only 1 year of growth!!! I can loose that no problem!) of 1991 - HPI slowing - Economy slowing to less than Gordon Brown needs to get the tax take he needs. - Mortgage lending slowing - Need to lower rates to be in harmony with Europe ready to take the Euro - Extremely strong £££ hate to break it to you guys... but ALL.... YES....ALLL the above economic indicators are pointing to Interest rates being lowered....and you know what that will do don't you....yes thats right... mortgages will become even MORE affordable.....meaning ppl will start to re-enter the market place and bringing some more upward pressure on HPI... My prediction... HPI to groe by 12% 2005.... forget 5%... or even a crash... it AINT GONNA happen!!! for it to happen we need.... - Recession - Weak £££ - High Inflation - High Interest rates - High Unemployment - Over-supply of housing stock - High level of repossessions - Lenders unwilling to lend - Over supply of rental props As a True Blue Tory Boy... Hate to admit it... but can't see 'Tory Blair' letting this lot happen all at once... Anyway... I also need to get something else of my chest... We at AQS need to THANK YOU all here at HPC... Your site is fabulous for us.... we guide all our clients to you... once they've read this load of tripe they're gagging to sell their property to us BMV... is as anything... I would say this website gets us at least 15% off deals alone... SINCERELY.... KEEP DOING WHAT YOU'RE DOING... YOU'RE MAKING ABOUT 80 PEOPLE WEALTHY BEYOND THEY'RE WILDEST DREAMS. THANK YOU ok.... now for the pitch..... Anyone here who might be interested... I have unexpectly had the Canterbury Area become available for a potential person to join us as a A Quick Sale affiliate.... this person will get exculsive controll over all leads generated in this area.... If you are interested in buying BMV property Week in Week out... let me know.... (you'll find the email over on SP) "You will find that one of the long-time posters on Singing Pig is a Southern Sales Manager at AQS. That's about all I need to know about it. He posts under the username "Property Master"(!)."..... " when I left you.... I was but the learner....now I am the Property Master" "Only a Property Master of evil Darth"..... Do you guys have NO Homour??? IT'S CALLED SARCASM!!! Oh no of course you have no homour... you all sad negheads, who are jealous that some of us are able to buy and YES make a profit outta property... I'm 32 been retired on property for 2 years and making more money this years than I ever have.... there is just sooooo much out there to learn about property... even for .... "DUM DUM DUMMMM!!" "THE PROPERTY MASTER!" Cheers Guys PM (BTW My name is Jeremy if PM is too painfull for you to use!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saving For a Space Ship Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 You guys!!! Do you honestly think that because property is going down that you can't make money from it!!! Do honestly think that NO-ONE is buying property??? If we at AQS are buying prop at a TRUE BMV We can offer it back to the market at a BMV price (leave something in it for the next man) thereby shifting the prop very quickly. You see property has ONLY ONE disadvantage over every other asset class..... speed of acquisition and disposal.... at AQS we exploit this and use this as our leverage to generate REAL discounts off property....99% of ppl wanting to sell their property WE ARE NOT RIGHT FOR.... but those ppl where speed and flexibility is more important, we are the ideal solution. Topher bear..."And where do they get their money from to purchase the properties and pay the costs?".....This has got to be the most dumb ass question ever!!! If you were gonna buy a property....where would you get the money from???!!! FOOL....plus whats to say you have to buy a property to sell it.... we routinely SELL properties that we DON'T OWN making a lovely profit and also not having to spend any money buying it!!! IT'S CALLED OPTIONS TRADING!!! Simple concept I know but maybe too difficult for a bunch of Neghead Bears.... And seeing as you mention the CRASH you are expecting...... Yes the Froth is coming of the market... but crash??? Puh please.... just look at the cold hard facts.... - High Employment - Inflation 45% lower than should be!!! - Highest Interest rates in the only important economies (Check HPC home page. Our rates are tooooo high...watch them come down after christmas fueling another boom in the housing market!) - Mortgages are still 25% more affordable than the Crash (OOOoooo a whole 27% from peak to trough....no wait thats only 1 year of growth!!! I can loose that no problem!) of 1991 - HPI slowing - Economy slowing to less than Gordon Brown needs to get the tax take he needs. - Mortgage lending slowing - Need to lower rates to be in harmony with Europe ready to take the Euro - Extremely strong £££ hate to break it to you guys... but ALL.... YES....ALLL the above economic indicators are pointing to Interest rates being lowered....and you know what that will do don't you....yes thats right... mortgages will become even MORE affordable.....meaning ppl will start to re-enter the market place and bringing some more upward pressure on HPI... My prediction... HPI to groe by 12% 2005.... forget 5%... or even a crash... it AINT GONNA happen!!! for it to happen we need.... - Recession - Weak £££ - High Inflation - High Interest rates - High Unemployment - Over-supply of housing stock - High level of repossessions - Lenders unwilling to lend - Over supply of rental props As a True Blue Tory Boy... Hate to admit it... but can't see 'Tory Blair' letting this lot happen all at once... Anyway... I also need to get something else of my chest... We at AQS need to THANK YOU all here at HPC... Your site is fabulous for us.... we guide all our clients to you... once they've read this load of tripe they're gagging to sell their property to us BMV... is as anything... I would say this website gets us at least 15% off deals alone... SINCERELY.... KEEP DOING WHAT YOU'RE DOING... YOU'RE MAKING ABOUT 80 PEOPLE WEALTHY BEYOND THEY'RE WILDEST DREAMS. THANK YOU ok.... now for the pitch..... Anyone here who might be interested... I have unexpectly had the Canterbury Area become available for a potential person to join us as a A Quick Sale affiliate.... this person will get exculsive controll over all leads generated in this area.... If you are interested in buying BMV property Week in Week out... let me know.... (you'll find the email over on SP) "You will find that one of the long-time posters on Singing Pig is a Southern Sales Manager at AQS. That's about all I need to know about it. He posts under the username "Property Master"(!)."..... " when I left you.... I was but the learner....now I am the Property Master" "Only a Property Master of evil Darth"..... Do you guys have NO Homour??? IT'S CALLED SARCASM!!! Oh no of course you have no homour... you all sad negheads, who are jealous that some of us are able to buy and YES make a profit outta property... I'm 32 been retired on property for 2 years and making more money this years than I ever have.... there is just sooooo much out there to learn about property... even for .... "DUM DUM DUMMMM!!" "THE PROPERTY MASTER!" Cheers Guys PM (BTW My name is Jeremy if PM is too painfull for you to use!) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Hello Property Master, member 666 (hope that is not a bad 'omen') someone seems to have hit a nerve with you. Please don't make sweeping generalisations of people on this site. There is a wide variety of types/views of posters and some excellent humour that I have seen. Thanks for taking some time out from your charity work in your early retirement to give us your view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EmpiricalBear Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 I have to admit I am very impressed by Property Master and AQS. He and we can make a lot of money together. At last, there is a way of providing downward liquidity in this market and a way to trade in a bear property market. I take my hat off to the Property Master But I don't think it will work. I think that it will run dry once the herd has started to turn. Why do bulls have to use CAPITALS and exCLAmaTION!!! marks all the time. Is it because the force of their argument is too weak that they have to resort to window dressing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emptybarrel Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 <i>Extremely strong £££</i> If it's so strong how come it's currently at its lowest value against a bag of other currencies since 2000? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 1) I'm not a bull, I'm actually Bearish about the market, just not a NEGHEAD. We make money no matter which way the market is travelling, acutally prefer it heading down though, make much more then. 2) CAPITALS???? This is standard use on the net for giving emphasis and tonality. You know, the things that you would be hearing in my voice were it spoken. 3) Weak arguement? Don't see anyone countering it. 4) You don't think it'll work???? It already is and always will because of the leverage of the slow time to dispose of property. There are a million reasons why ppl contact us and it's rarely because of economic (personal or macro) reasons. Ppl will always : - Divorce - Die - Move for job - Move for kids - Move for good - exit investment - Move to set up new business - have financial difficulties - have chains break - not want to use agents - not want neighbours to know to list just a few To the person who called me for tarring you all with the same brush.... I truly appologise if I did. By way of explanation and not excuse. I have to admit that I can't understand why anyone would want to come on here and be soooooo negative. What good does it do? How does it help you/the economy? Do yo feel reasured or something?... lets face the facts.... OF COURSE THERE IS GOING TO BE A DROP (see I'm a bear!).... the real arguement is how much??? lets say those negheads of you out there are right and it's in the region of 40%.... do you think this is gonna happen over night??? The last crash.... howlong did that terribble, desperate situation last??? 4 Years!! Not a real problem eh? And the biggest single drop in a year??? 13%!!! Yes 13%!!!.... If ppl in property can't handle drops like this and for this long they shouldn't be investing in property. I mean 4 years.... hardly can even call that medium term.... now 40% coming off is hardly a problem if you've had a 100% growth in the last 4 years....It still leaves you with a property that has grown at 20% from start to finish with a ROI of 133%!... And that is if prices crash by 40%!!! Of course there will be bandwagoners jumping off like lemmings....as soon as the market reacts to this the pro-investors (who don't focus on BMV) will see massive bargins and rentals that work again and then come steaming back into the market to lett itself find a nice natural level again. And the other things that make property perfect is the fact that you have 2 profit engines that react to polarised economic environment. ie HPI increasing because of demand we make money on capital appreciation and gearing. Rentals become soft and maybe cashflow negative. How cashflow negative is a private pension though? 100% HPI "crashing" (just love that word!) because of lack of demand/over supply/not affordable, means no capital appreciation, but hey no worries I'll wait for it to recover. Demand then shift to the rental market causing serious upward pressure there and bringing higher than average yields. Yes guys it's Heads I win (capital appreciation) vs Tails I win (monthly income). And the best part... this is all done with using OPM. How many banks will lend me £85,000 to buy £100,000 of shares??? DOH!!! If I can go from poor student in 1995 to retired now, anyone can, I've made soooo many mistakes. I should be at least 5 times where I am if I was more clever. And a last thought.... I'm not saying that EVERY wealthy person became such through property....but I ask you...when you see the next "rich List"....try and find out how many of them DON'T own property now. funny that eh? made their money elsewhere but chose to put at least some of it into property...can't be too bad. Cheers PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emptybarrel Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 And seeing as you mention the CRASH you are expecting...... Yes the Froth is coming of the market... but crash??? Puh please.... just look at the cold hard facts.... - High Employment - Inflation 45% lower than should be!!! - Highest Interest rates in the only important economies (Check HPC home page. Our rates are tooooo high...watch them come down after christmas fueling another boom in the housing market!) - Mortgages are still 25% more affordable than the Crash (OOOoooo a whole 27% from peak to trough....no wait thats only 1 year of growth!!! I can loose that no problem!) of 1991 - HPI slowing - Economy slowing to less than Gordon Brown needs to get the tax take he needs. - Mortgage lending slowing - Need to lower rates to be in harmony with Europe ready to take the Euro - Extremely strong £££ Ok, let's look at them. 1. High Employment - You need to sudy the ratio between income and property prices, not just the number of low paying jobs. 2. Inflation 45% lower than should be!!! - Commodity prices, oil prices and sterling exchange rates all point to higher inflation feeding it's way into retail prices in the future. 3. Highest Interest rates in the only important economies (Check HPC home page. Our rates are tooooo high...watch them come down after christmas fueling another boom in the housing market!) - The MPC have given every hint this week that interest rates have not peaked. 4. Mortgages are still 25% more affordable than the Crash (OOOoooo a whole 27% from peak to trough....no wait thats only 1 year of growth!!! I can loose that no problem!) of 1991 - Yes here you are showing parallels with the 1989 crash. 5. HPI slowing - And will probably continue 6. Economy slowing to less than Gordon Brown needs to get the tax take he needs. - Yes taxes are set to rise meaning less money is available for mortgage payments. Only manufacturing showed a 1 month hit due to higher import costs. The other sectors showed robust gains. 7. Mortgage lending slowing - And this is meant to stabilize house prices??? 8. Need to lower rates to be in harmony with Europe ready to take the Euro - It's economic cycles that affect entry into the Euro not interest rates alone. Besides there is a majority of opposition to joining the Euro. 9. Extremely strong £££ - Not as strong as you think, if anything it is weaker against a basket of currencies than it has been for 4 years. The Fed may be tempted to increase their rates to prevent devaluation of the USD in which case we would fall into line and increase ours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 1) The ratio is irrelevent....it does not matter if it's 3.5 times or 20 times...it's affordability that counts.... how affordable IS the mortgage? 2) Commodities, Oil & Forex are only being fueled by the fact that equities are not worth jack at the mo. Therefore people retreat to the "safe stocks". Once equities pick up there flavour they'll (coms,oil &forex) be back to the normal solid performers they have always been. Not called safe stocks for no reason. This will then ease the short term pressure that they have caused. And whats that... yes you're right ... the FTSE hit a 2 year high this Month!!! Well I'll be darned. 3) Of course... they've got to talk the market down. They can't raise rates to far because we'll then be too far form US & Euro rates and Cash will come flooding into the economy causing serious inflation. Therefore they use the only weapon they have at the mo...."DON'T BUY PROP", "RATES MAY NOT HAVE PEAKED". Do you honestly think all the banks are wrong to be seriously lowering the swap rates if there was a chance that rates had not peaked? They know far more than you or I. 4) and your point is??? 5) I agree. See I'm a bear. (Not a neghead, who's still making money from prop) 6) Taxes RISE before the election????!!! Oh look there goes one of my pet pigs by my bedroom window. GB will be letting the MPC know in no uncertain terms that 1.1% inflation is not acceptable with HPI cooling, time to cut rates MPC. 7) No this point is made to show that rates have peaked and that they can safely cut them 8) I agree... I'm totally against it.... But the man in charge isn't... Tory Blair wants it, and he'll be making dam sure we get an opportunity to join it. 9) Yes your right. but this is dependent on the Fed doing something. Every day it does not it maintains our strength. Right you dealt with the current climate and why we disagree on what is gonna happen.... what about what has to happen for a crash...: - Recession - Weak £££ - High Inflation - High Interest rates - High Unemployment - Over-supply of housing stock - High level of repossessions - Lenders unwilling to lend - Over supply of rental props Do you see any of these???? Cheers PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggest Bear Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 1) The ratio is irrelevent....it does not matter if it's 3.5 times or 20 times...it's affordability that counts.... how affordable IS the mortgage?2) Commodities, Oil & Forex are only being fueled by the fact that equities are not worth jack at the mo. Therefore people retreat to the "safe stocks". Once equities pick up there flavour they'll (coms,oil &forex) be back to the normal solid performers they have always been. Not called safe stocks for no reason. This will then ease the short term pressure that they have caused. And whats that... yes you're right ... the FTSE hit a 2 year high this Month!!! Well I'll be darned. 3) Of course... they've got to talk the market down. They can't raise rates to far because we'll then be too far form US & Euro rates and Cash will come flooding into the economy causing serious inflation. Therefore they use the only weapon they have at the mo...."DON'T BUY PROP", "RATES MAY NOT HAVE PEAKED". Do you honestly think all the banks are wrong to be seriously lowering the swap rates if there was a chance that rates had not peaked? They know far more than you or I. 4) and your point is??? 5) I agree. See I'm a bear. (Not a neghead, who's still making money from prop) 6) Taxes RISE before the election????!!! Oh look there goes one of my pet pigs by my bedroom window. GB will be letting the MPC know in no uncertain terms that 1.1% inflation is not acceptable with HPI cooling, time to cut rates MPC. 7) No this point is made to show that rates have peaked and that they can safely cut them 8) I agree... I'm totally against it.... But the man in charge isn't... Tory Blair wants it, and he'll be making dam sure we get an opportunity to join it. 9) Yes your right. but this is dependent on the Fed doing something. Every day it does not it maintains our strength. Right you dealt with the current climate and why we disagree on what is gonna happen.... what about what has to happen for a crash...: - Recession - Weak £££ - High Inflation - High Interest rates - High Unemployment - Over-supply of housing stock - High level of repossessions - Lenders unwilling to lend - Over supply of rental props Do you see any of these???? Cheers PM <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Lets take the above list and see shall we - Recession, ON ITS WAY.... - Weak £££, WEAKER NOW THAN IN THE LAST 4 YEARS - High Inflation, THERE IS HIGH INFLATION, ITS JUST THAT THIS GOVERNMENT HIDS THE FACT - High Interest rates, 33% HIGHER THAN LAST YEAR - High Unemployment, BUT THERE IS ALACK OF WELL PAYING JOBS - Over-supply of housing stock, YES, AS I LOOK OUT OF MY WINDOW IN C BIRMINGHAM AND SEE 2000 EMPTY PROPERTIES AND MORE THAN 3000 STILL IN CONSTRUCTION, THERES LOTS OF OVER SUPPLY. - High level of repossessions, NOT YET, BUT MORE THAN LAST YEAR - Lenders unwilling to lend - Oh yes ther is, lost of them and the credit squeeze is getting tighter EVERY DAY - Over supply of rental props - Oh yes there is ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Do you REALLY Believe that???!!! My my... some ppl are beyond help!!! Well you sit there 'interpreting' stats to suit your argue irrelevent of the reality... I'll carry on making MORE and MORE money from property week in week out thank you. Do you still believe the earth is flat??? PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Bad_Bear Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Do you REALLY Believe that???!!!   My my... some ppl are beyond help!!! Well you sit there 'interpreting' stats to suit your argue irrelevent of the reality... I'll carry on making MORE and MORE money from property week in week out thank you. Do you still believe the earth is flat??? PM <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You're economic outlook is extremely flawed, but never mind. Not going to bother going into that one. Also, you say youhave been retired for 2 years yet still make loads of money from your business. So, what's the definition of retired? Do you still own or have a part in the business or do you still work, as you seem to imply? You can't be retired and work at the same time. I also find your shouty attitude amusing. Yes, you may be making money but there are some bears on here who are very nicely off as well but don't feel the need to boast about it. Most STR's will have a large chunk of cash lying around. In my experience, your attitude and lack of perspective could be your downfall. THere are very few one way bets in this world. You are involved in highly geared trading and you should relise that there are risks in that. I am involved in similar with equities but I always allow for the market taking some back, because markets always do. Have you provision for a few large losses and maybe a quiet 3 months? Or do you think that shouting 'Neghead' at people will get you through such times? On the other hand, I think your idea is a good one, if you can play it right and I take my hat off to you for that. I might refrain from making out that all your clients are cretins on a public forum though. Not very proffessional is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 "Also, you say youhave been retired for 2 years yet still make loads of money from your business. So, what's the definition of retired? Do you still own or have a part in the business or do you still work, as you seem to imply? You can't be retired and work at the same time."..... you misunderstand me and AQS.... I do not own AQS... And AQS HAS NEVER bought a property. It is the individual affiliates that buy the properties. All AQS does is charge a finders fee for everyone that the affiliate buys. No Buy No Fee. As for me and my retirement...if you mean by retirement that I never ever do anything towards generating money, then that is wrong. However that is not my definition of retirement. I mean that I enough passive income coming in from investments that it does not matter if I do anything to increase it for the rest of my life. Would you consider Paul McCartney "retired"...?? I would... if he never 'works' again his standard of living will never go down. Am I finished building wealth? NO WAY. "I am involved in similar with equities but I always allow for the market taking some back, because markets always do. ".... I understand Options trading fine... the difference with the gearing on property is that I am not Obliged to sell...if prices drop by 99% I just don't sell and wait for them to recover. Plus Property WILL ALWAYS have value because of the land it sits on, can't say the say for equities...there have been plenty of companies gone bust leaving nothing for the geared options trader. "On the other hand, I think your idea is a good one, if you can play it right and I take my hat off to you for that. I might refrain from making out that all your clients are cretins on a public forum though. Not very proffessional is it?".....Our clients are far from Cretins...and I have never implied as such.... We offer them solutions to their problems that they can't get elsewhere... They offer us opportunities for building wealth we can't find elsewhere.... It is a SIMPLE WIN/WIN business model. We tell our clients at the start that the majority of ppl looking to sell their house we are not right for, and we give them lots of free good advice on how they can find solutions to their problem without using US! But if Speed, Flexibility, and Peace of Mind is what they want.... we are the ppl for them. PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big_Bad_Bear Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yonmon Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Hi PM Happy for your success from property. I hope to make some money from it myself, hence why I'm happy with the prospect of the "crash" I believe is coming soon. That's not being a neg head it's being a value investor. Your posts seem to imply property is the best investment vehicle. Not so sure about that- equities are just as good if not better historically. And it is possible to use OPM for share trading. But property is still a good investment, if you know what youre doing and get the price/timing right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emptybarrel Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 1) The ratio is irrelevent....it does not matter if it's 3.5 times or 20 times...it's affordability that counts.... how affordable IS the mortgage?People's income is there to pay for more than just the mortgage. 2) Commodities, Oil & Forex are only being fueled by the fact that equities are not worth jack at the mo. Therefore people retreat to the "safe stocks". Once equities pick up there flavour they'll (coms,oil &forex) be back to the normal solid performers they have always been. Not called safe stocks for no reason. This will then ease the short term pressure that they have caused. And whats that... yes you're right ... the FTSE hit a 2 year high this Month!!! Well I'll be darned. I don't believe the increasing price of oil and commodities has much to do with the current valuation of shares, although it will affect them eventually. Oil is being purchased as a necessity through demand/supply. I have to say you have pretty well beaten you're own argument by stating that the FTSE has gone up and yet oil prices have also gone up when you are stating the reverse should happen. 3) Of course... they've got to talk the market down. They can't raise rates to far because we'll then be too far form US & Euro rates and Cash will come flooding into the economy causing serious inflation. Therefore they use the only weapon they have at the mo...."DON'T BUY PROP", "RATES MAY NOT HAVE PEAKED". Do you honestly think all the banks are wrong to be seriously lowering the swap rates if there was a chance that rates had not peaked? They know far more than you or I. Believe it or not banks do get it wrong, sometimes seriously wrong. Many were very badly hit with overseas loans. 4) and your point is??? 5) I agree. See I'm a bear. (Not a neghead, who's still making money from prop) 6) Taxes RISE before the election????!!! Oh look there goes one of my pet pigs by my bedroom window. GB will be letting the MPC know in no uncertain terms that 1.1% inflation is not acceptable with HPI cooling, time to cut rates MPC. And neither will he be telling them to make a judgement from one month's CPI figures. As I said there is plenty of inflation in imports and factory gate prices yet to hit the consumer. Even if they are ordered to drop them this will just make it more necessary to raise them later. 7) No this point is made to show that rates have peaked and that they can safely cut themAnd yet total outstanding personal debt is at an all time high and our trade deficit growing due to our reliance on imports. 8) I agree... I'm totally against it.... But the man in charge isn't... Tory Blair wants it, and he'll be making dam sure we get an opportunity to join it.I don't think joining the Euro is going to be involved in the outcome 9) Yes your right. but this is dependent on the Fed doing something. Every day it does not it maintains our strength.Only against the USD. Against other currencies we have weakened. Right you dealt with the current climate and why we disagree on what is gonna happen.... what about what has to happen for a crash...: - Recession - Not necessary - Weak £££ - I believe this will be the deciding factor. - High Inflation - Higher inflation will feed through from foreign goods than we have had recently unless rates pick up. - High Interest rates - At these levels of debt it doesn't have to be particularly high. - High Unemployment - Not necessary just a change in the market sympathy will do - Over-supply of housing stock - Yes compared to demand at current valuations. - High level of repossessions - A BS is recruiting more officers for this task. - Lenders unwilling to lend - They will be willing to lend at higher rates. - Over supply of rental props - Does help Do you see any of these????Yes Cheers PM <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Property Master Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Thanks guys Property is THE ONLY asset worth having because you can buy it BMV and Force it's appreciation.... neither of which you can do with shares!!! I can buy prop on 100% OPM and then choose the price I buy at, and force it to go up....can you do this with shares...?? I agree it's worth being a value customer and waiting to purchase... but how much of a crash are you expecting??? more than 20%??? No chance.... now I can buy property at 25%+ BMV... why would I wait??? I can then have that prop moved on in 3 months max... HPI would have to be falling at more than 8% a month to affect me. Cheers PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJG18 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 1) The ratio is irrelevent....it does not matter if it's 3.5 times or 20 times...it's affordability that counts.... how affordable IS the mortgage?<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Average net family income (monthly) = £1640 Typical Mortgage repayment on average priced property = £1160 This would require nearly 71% of typical takehome income to be used to pay a typical mortgage. .... leaving £480 a month..... - £100 council tax..... ...... leaves £380...... - £100 utilities & telephone bills..... ..... leaves £280........ - £400 typical food/grocery spending..... ....... leaves -£120 over spend..... - £300 typical costs of owning, running, fueling, insuring and taxing typical car... ..... leaves -£420 over spend....... - £40 insurances (bulding, contents, life insurance, etc) ... leaves -£460 over spend..... And so on. And this doesn't even take into account any kind of social costs, disposable income, other debt repayments (typically around £200-300 per month for average person)..... and leaves out a whole myriad of other costs of course too. There simply is no argument for mortgages being affordable at current pricings / current interest rates. It is not economically sustainable for the average buyer to spend over 70% of their take-home income on the average property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hra Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 There are a million reasons why ppl contact us and it's rarely because of economic (personal or macro) reasons. Ppl will always :- Divorce - Die - Move for job - Move for kids - Move for good - exit investment - Move to set up new business - have financial difficulties - have chains break - not want to use agents - not want neighbours to know <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Not in that order, I sincerely hope ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJG18 Posted October 24, 2004 Share Posted October 24, 2004 Thanks guysProperty is THE ONLY asset worth having because you can buy it BMV and Force it's appreciation.... neither of which you can do with shares!!! <{POST_SNAPBACK}> While it is true that an individual share will have a single price at any given moment in time, the price does of course move constanty, and is fully market driven. This means that of course you can buy shares below their value. When tracking the price on an intra-day basis you can by well below the average price for the day, or likewise the week, month, year or whatever. This will allow to you purchase below current average market value. I can buy prop on 100% OPM and then choose the price I buy at, and force it to go up....can you do this with shares...??<{POST_SNAPBACK}> I feel you are asset trading/investing way out of your depth if you actually feel your actions are allowing you to control the prices you are trading properties at. This is a common delusion when trading at the peak of a bubble market. I agree it's worth being a value customer and waiting to purchase... but how much of a crash are you expecting??? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Personally? Around 40-60% on average nationally. As little as 30% in some areas, but well over 80% in HA/Lego-land and other BTL last-resorts. now I can buy property at 25%+ BMV... why would I wait??? I can then have that prop moved on in 3 months max... HPI would have to be falling at more than 8% a month to affect me.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> No. This is the biggest delusion of all. By conducting these transactions in the market you are participating in the market. You are part of it. Buying "BMV" does not somehow exist outside the market in an independent vacuum. Many people are thinking lke you now: Few people are buying now and transaction volumes are way down, but those that are buying are those who are prepared to drive a hard bargain and only buy well below market value. But don't you see... all you're actually doing by attempting to buy BMV is actually setting market value, at a lower price point than it was previously, and reducing house prices at an ever accelerating rate. If the majority of buyers who are still buying (i.e. those who believe they can turn a quick buck by exploiting the current market sentinment to pick up BMV bargains), are say all achieving around 20% discounts on average.... then you're simply driving market value 20% lower.... as market value is simply the price that similar properties have recently been transacted at. You're simply riding the market downwards, and actually assisting in a more rapid devaluation of your asset class. Do you not see that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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