dunedin Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 The 2 properties I mentioned at the start of this thread in January are still for sale.The offers over 189k is now 189k fixed and the 160k is now 137k. However my feelings when I did this thread are stronger than ever. Although some properties may have dropped in price I feel as though overall things have just gone silly up here. I'm at the stage where properties I viewed in 2007 but didn't buy are coming back on the market - at higher prices than the so called "peak"!! There is another today that we viewed in 2007 that sold for £190k and today with little discernible change they want offers over £245k. This is a good thread thats a decent drop the one at 137k that was 160k some of the new stuff that is coming up for sale in Edinburgh is close to the 2007 figures another poster kindly put this on one of the other threads this seems to explain why this is happening http://www.home.co.uk/guides/asking_prices...burgh&all=1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTD Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 From the home.co.uk page quoted above; "Note: The house prices for Edinburgh were calculated by sampling over all properties for sale in the Home.co.uk property search within 7 miles of the centre of Edinburgh" Where does a 7-mile radius get us to ..... by my reckoning, includes all of Musselburgh, Wallyford and Whitecraig to the East, almost as far as Penicuik to the South, and just beyond the city boundary to the West. So maybe not just Edinburgh..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunedin Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 (edited) From the BBC today. The fall in property prices in Scotland has been less dramatic than in the UK as a whole, according to the latest figures. The Nationwide Building Society reported that the UK's annual house values fell by 15.9% in 2008. However, in Scotland prices went down by 8.1% over the year. You are wrong in terms of Edinburgh the crash is now at 8% from the highest price although some properties are way up on 07 prices the top winners are 2 and 3 bed flats the rest are affecting the crash and are dragging prices back up. Check out the latest Edinburgh figures and educate yourself http://www.home.co.uk/guides/asking_prices...burgh&all=1 Edited September 11, 2009 by dunedin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted September 12, 2009 Share Posted September 12, 2009 You think next time he creates a new user account he may think about posting in a different fashion ? Just to at least pretend he is someone else. And I am not talking about our Hamish here.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noodle doodle Posted September 14, 2009 Share Posted September 14, 2009 You are wrong in terms of Edinburgh the crash is now at 8% from the highest price although some properties are way up on 07 prices the top winners are 2 and 3 bed flats the rest are affecting the crash and are dragging prices back up.Check out the latest Edinburgh figures and educate yourself http://www.home.co.uk/guides/asking_prices...burgh&all=1 whoop, get into terraced housing in eh11 http://www.home.co.uk/guides/asking_prices...mp;endyear=2009 entirely depends what start and end points you pick though which brings me to the whole point of house price crash, it's all about falls from 'peak', but how many people bought at 'peak', say the 3 month period in 2007/08 it seemed to be? About 1% of the population? It's not as devastating as it looks to be honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 I am amazed by some of the prices of property coming on the market now. One came on last week in Elgin for £180k that is a 3 bed semi in a not very nice area and the highest price ever paid in that street is £105k. Of the previous 62 sales the average prices is £62k. Admittedly a lot of the properties in that street are "affordable" flats - but that just tells you more about the street. Another that I viewed in 2007 when it sold for £190k has come back on for £245k with minor cosmetic changes so up 29% since "peak"! A house within 50 yards that also has 3 bedrooms has been on the market for a year at £170k after selling in 2008 at £182k. It seems that the £170k is a screaming buy even though nobody wants it or the £245k could be classed as a mortgage fraud and a large dose of subsequent negative equity if someone pays that price. It's almost as if the surveyors up here have been told to get their valuations up. Could this have happened? The Scottish banks such as RBS and Lloyds (BoS) are in the worst financial position so they have most to lose if prices were to drop. I thought home reports might reduce prices but now feel as though the surveyors are adding the offers over part into the valuation! I even phoned RBS yesterday to try speak to their mortgage fraud department to ask what they thought about valuations at the moment. The customer service bloke said "this is rare all the calls we get are that valuations are below what people wanted". He refused to put me through to fraud as I wasn't involved in a transaction. I asked him if he would have said that a couple of years ago if I was trying to help them about phoney BTL flat valuations to which he said "no". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Redhat Sly - interesting stuff - have a look at the Edinburgh latest thread. A few of us have noticed this as well. Lots of valuations that are simply what the sellers want - with absolutely no link to reality. What is the point... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 After typing the earlier post I noticed another property new on the market for offers over £270k. Checked the price and it sold in 2007 for £195k. I don't remember the house from 2007 but there are no extensions so presumably any changes were merely cosmetic. Up 38% since this "peak"! One interesting point about crash Gordon's lies yesterday was that on one of his new credit cards he has decided to remove the means testing for old people needing care down south. This will cost a mere £870m over the next 2 years and obviously more in the future as people are living longer. As Scotland already offered free care was it a bit of a no brainer for people further south who needed care to move up here? Was it as simple as stay south, have to sell up just to pay for your care or sell up move to Scotland, keep your money and get free care? If/when it comes in could this see some people moving back south? More houses for sale less demand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lulu Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Redhat Sly - interesting stuff - have a look at the Edinburgh latest thread. A few of us have noticed this as well. Lots of valuations that are simply what the sellers want - with absolutely no link to reality. What is the point... A perfect example of this is a flat I had a close association with. It was bought in 2003 for £197K, the flat opposite on the stairs (essentially a mirror image of this flat) sold for £245K last December. The flat in question has just gone on the market at OO £280K which I am really struggling to understand as the flat opposite was on the market for months last year only to sell for £245k. So in effect they are expecting an offer of £300K+ on a flat of which the equivalent of sold for £245K less than 12 months ago! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Even Keel Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Redhat Sly - interesting stuff - have a look at the Edinburgh latest thread. A few of us have noticed this as well. Lots of valuations that are simply what the sellers want - with absolutely no link to reality. What is the point... I think you're right about that, and it is an unintended but unavoidable consequence of single survey valuations since high valuations benefit both buyers and sellers. If the mortgage valuation of the single survey is accepted by the buyer's bank, then it essentially sets an upper limit to the offer they can make. It is then in the seller's interest to make sure that the valuation is as high as possible, even if they are not expecting to get that amount for the house. It is also in the buyer's interest, as then the amount of mortgage they can get will be limited by the actual purchase price, rather then a valuation which is lower than what they are willing to pay for the house, and which might prompt then to get a valuation of their own which came in yet higher. Therefore survey valuations are likely to go up, even if selling prices are coming down. It's taking a while to work it's way through the system, and is probably one of the factors supporting house prices at the moment. Eventually buyers should realise what is going on, and start offering well below the single survey valuations, even in a rising market. Of course, cash rich buyers are less affected by this, but with 60% LTV deals significantly bettert than 75% ones it should be affecting most of the market just now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 The thing is people seem to believe the valuations and I am seeing closing dates again. One came on for £155k on a Friday two weeks ago. A friend of mine viewed it Sunday and offered £160k. That was refused and it went to closing date the Friday after. At closing date he offered £165k but didn't get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 I presume the £155k property would sell below the £175k stamp duty threshold. Perhaps there is more demand for that sort of price before the no stamp duty £125k to £175k finishes at the end of the year? Though it seems false economy if you bid lots over the price! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 I think you're right about that, and it is an unintended but unavoidable consequence of single survey valuations since high valuations benefit both buyers and sellers.If the mortgage valuation of the single survey is accepted by the buyer's bank, then it essentially sets an upper limit to the offer they can make. It is then in the seller's interest to make sure that the valuation is as high as possible, even if they are not expecting to get that amount for the house. It is also in the buyer's interest, as then the amount of mortgage they can get will be limited by the actual purchase price, rather then a valuation which is lower than what they are willing to pay for the house, and which might prompt then to get a valuation of their own which came in yet higher. Therefore survey valuations are likely to go up, even if selling prices are coming down. It's taking a while to work it's way through the system, and is probably one of the factors supporting house prices at the moment. Eventually buyers should realise what is going on, and start offering well below the single survey valuations, even in a rising market. Of course, cash rich buyers are less affected by this, but with 60% LTV deals significantly bettert than 75% ones it should be affecting most of the market just now. Of course the other thing high valuations do for properties new on the market, is make long term unsold properties look cheaper. I've noticed a couple of really old ones that have sold this week. So is the plan to do high valuations, catch a few cash rich suckers, high valuations help sell unsold properties, then the unsold overvalued properties reduce their price and look cheaper against the valuation and next batch of overvalued new on the market properties? If that were true though couldn't surveyors up here be sued later if properties bought were proved to be overvalued? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Just watched the horrid Homes under the hammer. One bed flat in Walthamstow for 110k at auction. Room in the front for parking. Big back garden, big rooms, separate kitchen, 5 minutes walk to underground. On the down side this was right next to the railway, needed a bit of tidying up although was structurally fine, and is not the best area of London, but as far as I know not exactly the worst either. Compare this to what people pay for one bed flats in Gorgie with no parking, small rooms, no separate kitchen and no garden. About 100-105k even today. Also speaking to someone from my work who is from London and lives in Brighton. She is shocked by the prices up here. Thinks it is total ripoff - even compared to London and Brighton !! Not sure about Scotland as a whole, but as for Edinburgh ? Definitely the most overpriced place in the entire UK I have heard of. Even worse than London FFS. That is really taking the piss. I know it is a nice place and all, but when flats in London are better value something is seriously wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lulu Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Not sure about Scotland as a whole, but as for Edinburgh ? Definitely the most overpriced place in the entire UK I have heard of. Even worse than London FFS. That is really taking the piss. I know it is a nice place and all, but when flats in London are better value something is seriously wrong. But I have it on good authority from a friend of mine that I should 'get in quick' before the market picks up again next year. One bedroom flats in Gorgie are apparently now a 'bargain' at only £110,000. (any suggestions that the banks are now requiring deposits and sticking to vaguely sensible salary multiples as interest rates will be rising within 10 months fall on well and truly deaf ears - prices for property simply cannot fall apparently) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman001 Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Seriously, Edinburgh can't be more expensive than London......?? If you want to see expensive in Edinburgh, check out Platinum Point lol... was driving round there last night - good looking flats at ridiculous prices! Rents seem EXTORTIONATE though. I have to beat it and rent soon... single place... but I'm looking at about £600 a month! I really, really, REALLY don't want to pay that sort of money.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman001 Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 I'd almost be better off getting a mortgage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccc Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 There are plenty of 2 bedders for around £600 if you are renting soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fflump Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Edinburgh rents are cheap when you compare to their purchase costs, in relation to other parts of scotland and indeed the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman001 Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 I guess then... I'll need to find somebody to share with! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lulu Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Seriously, Edinburgh can't be more expensive than London......?? If you want to see expensive in Edinburgh, check out Platinum Point lol... was driving round there last night - good looking flats at ridiculous prices! Rents seem EXTORTIONATE though. I have to beat it and rent soon... single place... but I'm looking at about £600 a month! I really, really, REALLY don't want to pay that sort of money.. Where are you looking? I started renting a one bedroom place in Morningside for £470 a month back in July - I may be leaving in January as the agents are rubbish but that is a side issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guitarman001 Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 What's the place like, out of interest? Got a web link or...? It's just shattering that I've been working and living at home for 2 years now.. and have bought a car outright and saved a wad. The though of shelling out anywhere near half a grand on rent fills me with horror lol... I could maybe push it and see if I can stay at home for longer (I'm saving ~£1k a month!) but it's really getting overcrowded and work is a bit further away now. Bah humbug! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul77 Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Where are you looking? I started renting a one bedroom place in Morningside for £470 a month back in July - I may be leaving in January as the agents are rubbish but that is a side issue Sounds cheap in that area. Is it a flat? Do you know it's "value" ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fflump Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 What's the place like, out of interest? Got a web link or...? It's just shattering that I've been working and living at home for 2 years now.. and have bought a car outright and saved a wad. The though of shelling out anywhere near half a grand on rent fills me with horror lol... I could maybe push it and see if I can stay at home for longer (I'm saving ~£1k a month!) but it's really getting overcrowded and work is a bit further away now. Bah humbug! It seems to me you're just used to stopping with your parents and paying very little (if any?) rent and saving lots of money in the process. Compared to this renting a place in the 'real world' is bound to feel expensive. Get used to it-the rest of us have (almost!) You'll need £5-600 to rent a half decent one-bed in edinburgh, or if you share then £400 each will get you an even nice place. You can add in another £200 per month on bills. insurance and council tax while you're at it Of course you could stop at home with your parents and accumulate money, but as you indicate there are quality of life issues-you've got to fly the nest sometime! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lulu Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Sounds cheap in that area. Is it a flat? Do you know it's "value" ? Its 'value' is a good question. When I moved in there were two flats on the stairs for sale for £150,000 (fixed price and offers around) I dont know if either sold as they are not on ESPC but one of the sale boards is still up. I was looking the other day and identical flats on the street around the corner were OO £132,000 I am going to keep and eye on these to see if they sell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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