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Edit - just too depressed by this abuse to write about it.

I remember the incident in the Commons you wrote about and just deleted. I watched it. The accusation of a police state was levelled at Blair. At the time, I found his reaction quite striking. He went out of his way to try and prove the accusation wrong, and was clearly rattled by it. With ridiculous or exaggerated accusations, Blair was the master of dealing with them effectively by ridiculing the questioner and cracking jokes. None of that with this - he was hypersensitive and defensive.

I thought there must have been some truth in the point the questioner made, simply based on that reaction. The Cenotaph/ Peterson arrests, Menenzes shooting, RIPA, the road censuses going on in London and now the Green arrest - all rather more substantial supporting evidence. So is the proposal floated during the Progress meeting this weekend for a civilian security force.

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How many posters actually watched the video?

Fair enough the police deal with a lot of crap, especially fri/sat nights on the town but this is out of order.

The 'few bad apples' scenario doesn't apply, watch the video and read what the result was.

There is clearly very excessive and unwarranted force being used by the one 'special constable', the squaddie gets convicted of 2 cases of assaulting a police officer and is forced to pay compensation to the officers.

The whole legal system seems very broken for that verdict to have been passed. :angry: :ph34r:

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Jesus, this is clearly a strange case

The guy is in the middle of the Road, he says something to 3 officers.

Normally, one should have gone over and " had a word"... they didnt, they decided to "take him down".

Course, we dont know what happened before the film, but it looks bad to me.

I left the Police Force 28 years ago.

punching drunks to losen his muscles? drunks are unco-ordinated and easy to put down. We used to let them fall, they would get "lost" and were easy to restrain. maybe just have a guy sit on him.

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I remember the incident in the Commons you wrote about and just deleted. I watched it. The accusation of a police state was levelled at Blair. At the time, I found his reaction quite striking. He went out of his way to try and prove the accusation wrong, and was clearly rattled by it. With ridiculous or exaggerated accusations, Blair was the master of dealing with them effectively by ridiculing the questioner and cracking jokes. None of that with this - he was hypersensitive and defensive.

I thought there must have been some truth in the point the questioner made, simply based on that reaction. The Cenotaph/ Peterson arrests, Menenzes shooting, RIPA, the road censuses going on in London and now the Green arrest - all rather more substantial supporting evidence. So is the proposal floated during the Progress meeting this weekend for a civilian security force.

Two things struck me about that incident in the Commons - and I'll go through Hansard tomorrow to find the exact exchange - the first was the fact that a Tory MP said it so loud and clearly, and the second the reaction of Anthony Blair, who was quite rattled like you say. It was a foreshadow of things to come.

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punching drunks to losen his muscles? drunks are unco-ordinated and easy to put down.

I've never been a copper but I have done a few martial arts, if you are trying to get someone's arm behind their back, a twist of the thumb or wrist with using one hand will almost always suffice. If someone is resisting strongly then using your second hand against their elbow will do the trick.

Unless human anatomy has changed a lot in the last few years I don't get how smashing smashing someone's head of the tarmac is a useful technique in restraint. :blink:

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But Charging across a road to quiten a drunk??

he police have been given far too many powers by this government, and this has created a certain attitude among some of them, I think. There are a lot of decent coppers, but this sort of thing tars them all with the same brush with the public, I'm guessing.

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My experience is that the police treat you as you treat them, be polite and they are polite.

Mine too.

After I climbed up Nelson's Column in 1996 on a protest, the police were very polite and friendly even posing for photos with us for all the tourists that had been watching. They saw protest and non violent action as an acceptable and normal part of life in Britain, not even bothering to arrest us, just apologetically asked if we wouldn't mind giving them the banner when we were finished with it.

A few years later, after Labour got in but before 9/11, the very same police force was kicking down doors and assaulting Tibetan protesters so that the Chinese President Jiang Zemin wouldn't have to see the banners of the people he had been torturing for years.

Britain is changing, if you so much as unfurl a banner in Trafalgar square without prior written permission now, you will be arrested and prosecuted.

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Mine too.

After I climbed up Nelson's Column in 1996 on a protest, the police were very polite and friendly even posing for photos with us for all the tourists that had been watching. They saw protest and non violent action as an acceptable and normal part of life in Britain, not even bothering to arrest us, just apologetically asked if we wouldn't mind giving them the banner when we were finished with it.

A few years later, after Labour got in but before 9/11, the very same police force was kicking down doors and assaulting Tibetan protesters so that the Chinese President Jiang Zemin wouldn't have to see the banners of the people he had been torturing for years.

Britain is changing, if you so much as unfurl a banner in Trafalgar square without prior written permission now, you will be arrested and prosecuted.

Good post. Everyone should know that most uniformed human beings will do whatever they are told by their superiors - that is the very essential nature of the chain of command, and that this change in the police was driven by political forces, and pretty disgusting ones at that. It is not too late to get our old intelligent police force back, but it will take many years to flush out some of the current ideas that circulate among it now.

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I've toyed with the idea of joining the Police. That's made my mind up for me once and for all.

Don't worry, if you sign up now by the time you hit the streets you will be issued with a taser, you can inflict as much pain as you want without leaving any signs of your brutality on the faces of your victims.

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Good post. Everyone should know that most uniformed human beings will do whatever they are told by their superiors - that is the very essential nature of the chain of command, and that this change in the police was driven by political forces, and pretty disgusting ones at that. It is not too late to get our old intelligent police force back, but it will take many years to flush out some of the current ideas that circulate among it now.

Yup, the police today seem to think they are the Paras in Northern Ireland, everyone a potential terrorist out to kill them.

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Guest vicmac64
what about rule of law our police should be given respect..even if you have been in the army it doesn't give you any right too mouth of to police officers doing ther job.

too many people are disrespecting our good and brave police officers,,so if you have had a few drinks you can do what you want,,i don't think so piss where you want kick cars mouth off too the police..

get real we live in a society with rules all should obey them members of the army as well as the rest of us.the police do a very hard job and get no thanks for it.if some drunk was causing problems outside your house or in your street you would want the police to sort it out. as too your brave british war veteran he should know better then to abuse the police. to be brave for Queen & country is what we expect from our army..they sign up to fight and serve country in peace and war. for this we pay them as in any other job.as they risk ther lives, just like our police we owe both set's of these brave people our heart felt thanks.

But no one has any extra right's to break the law of the land. war veteran or not. if you are a brave war veteran you should know better then to cause problems for the police FF's.

Did you not see them rubbing his face on the road surface? I'm all for the rule of law and order, but we haven't had that for many years now, and we need a proper police force that law abiding people can look up to - not these Politically correct nobodys.

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Jesus, this is clearly a strange case

The guy is in the middle of the Road, he says something to 3 officers.

Normally, one should have gone over and " had a word"... they didnt, they decided to "take him down".

Course, we dont know what happened before the film, but it looks bad to me.

I left the Police Force 28 years ago.

punching drunks to losen his muscles? drunks are unco-ordinated and easy to put down. We used to let them fall, they would get "lost" and were easy to restrain. maybe just have a guy sit on him.

It certainly casts CCTV cameras in a positive light. Think of the spin that can be had from that.

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Hi, I would like to clarify a few things in the video. Being ex military and now in the police I think I can give a balanced opinion on the video compaired to the commentator.

What first you have to take into account is the police don't now his service before the event.

He is drunk and approaches the officers pointing at them saying something to trigger police action.

He is taken down as cleanly as could be, it may not look nice but it is a reality of what happens when you try and restrain someone.

Banging his head on the floor is completly out of order. :angry: The head is a vulnerable part and you should never strike it apart from the most extreme circumstances. All police training teaches that.

The bite is wrong and can justify more force but the scrapping of the head is totally out of order. :angry:

All the punches are justified however. It is a technique to get someone resisting with their arms to loosen them enough to get them round the back to hand cuff them. I have had to do it twice on violently mentaly ill people and seen it done in similar circumstances.

The injuries aren't shocking, police oftern get the same injuries when taking people down, they go after a couple of days.

PC Light foot should be investigated but the other two did nothing wrong.

My own dealings with drunk military is that I tend to be over tollerant of them and only arrest if I really have no choice. Usally have words with their friends to get him out of here while asking my colleagues to restrain their actions. I fully aware of the affects of battle stress after studying it at university. I'm also aware from my own experiences of comming out of the field, wanting to let you hair down, getting a little bit over carried away and drinking to excess. Its been the squadie way for centuries ;)

For a policeman your spelling is terrible. Suppose it helps though when writing your reports so instead of spelling 'came along quietly' you misspell it as 'needed as slap as being mouthy'

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Tonight we learn that a british war veteran became somewhat drunk and mouthed off to three civilian police officers, For this he was bundled to the ground, two officers "restrained him" while the other "gravel rashed "his face then read him his rights eight times to the head, leaving the squaddie severely injured.

Your majesties forces are dying everyday in an illegal war for this government, and now are treated when they return in this shamefull manner by the government "forces". This government has gone too far, and now is the time to to do something about this over zealous government before they give themselves ultimate power, and bankrupt our once great nation. :ph34r:

If he was a hero of Iraq and Afghanistan, he should have gone around with a big sign on his head saying so. The police would then have let him do whatever he liked - after all, we can forgive our great squaddies everything, can't we? They can bite policemen, injure people, murder their grannies - basically, we're perfectly happy to let them do whatever they like. They're ex-servicemen, after all, and that means the law doesn't apply to them like it applies to the rest of us, does it.

(Now if the problem here is that the police acted outside their powers, the fact that the victim was an ex-serviceman is neither here nor there.)

p

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Guest barebear
One day these coppers will bring their tasers to a gun fight and will end up in coffins. My heart will bleed.

As someone that has witnessed police brutality on several occaisions and even had video evidence of a police officer repeatedly puching a restrained man in the face, I can say nothing will be done about this, they will get together and come up with a story that justifies the violence.

Something like he called my mate a fat pig so I kicked him.

I used my video evidence as a bargaining tool to get a case dropped against someone, I was fully expecting the authorities to take a dim view of police abusing their powers however the opposite was the case. A barrister told me that it happened all the time and courts were very reluctant to come down against the police.

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