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Shadow Minister Arrested


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I'm very sad if that is your attitude to people. Yes of course, limiting communication - as labour is trying to do - another move of facism to control the views of the population. Im not surprised you support that idea. Im not going to reply to you further. I see no point.

I suspect if I do continue to communicate with you we wil be meeting one day soon in the room where there is no darkness. SO good luck with your project. Dont forget... its the blindly loyal who get it first....Poor old Boxer, he was so loyal and ignorant all his life, he couln'dnt read the writing on the side of the knackers van that came to take him away. He thought he was off for a peaceful retirement...

That supporters of the Conservative party, which did so much to limit civil liberties in this country, throughout the 1980's and 1990's (free assembly, right to strike, right to trade union membership, right to freely express sexual orientation, support for oppressive regimes from Chilean Dictators to South African dictators, their economic support for oppressive regimes, denial of a free press) should now drape themselves in the cloak of freedom was surely rank amongst the greatest of hypocrisies.

As to 1984 - I lived through it. Some of us remember the vicious political witch-hunt against Clive Ponting because he revealed that Margaret Thatcher was lying to Parliament about The Belgrano.

Don't lecture me about freedom with you're silly allusions to Blair, I read the novel long ago - the proposed title was 1948 - it was a warning about all government. I know what freedom's worth and I know it doesn't exist in voting Tory - it exists in challenging all government excess - regardless of their political persuasion..

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Don't lecture me about freedom with you're silly allusions to Blair, I read the novel long ago - the proposed title was 1948 - it was a warning about all government. I know what freedom's worth and I know it doesn't exist in voting Tory - it exists in challenging all government excess - regardless of their political persuasion..

+1

starting with Gordon's.

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I remember the bloody conservatives too, and yes, they were in their own way as bad. I despised Thatcher as a young un.. But again iIt must be said that Labour have taken a lot of what they started and finished the job. Particularly with regards to civil liberties and surveillance...

Anyway, Im heartened that what I mistook for unquestioning party loyalty was devil's advocacy ... it seems we are at least agreed they're all a shower, with a few good men thrown in who rapidly sink to the bottom for refusing to play the game....so what the **** are we all going to do.

That supporters of the Conservative party, which did so much to limit civil liberties in this country, throughout the 1980's and 1990's (free assembly, right to strike, right to trade union membership, right to freely express sexual orientation, support for oppressive regimes from Chilean Dictators to South African dictators, their economic support for oppressive regimes, denial of a free press) should now drape themselves in the cloak of freedom was surely rank amongst the greatest of hypocrisies.

As to 1984 - I lived through it. Some of us remember the vicious political witch-hunt against Clive Ponting because he revealed that Margaret Thatcher was lying to Parliament about The Belgrano.

Don't lecture me about freedom with you're silly allusions to Blair, I read the novel long ago - the proposed title was 1948 - it was a warning about all government. I know what freedom's worth and I know it doesn't exist in voting Tory - it exists in challenging all government excess - regardless of their political persuasion..

Edited by bootfair
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Don't lecture me about freedom with you're silly allusions to Blair, I read the novel long ago - the proposed title was 1948 - it was a warning about all government. I know what freedom's worth and I know it doesn't exist in voting Tory - it exists in challenging all government excess - regardless of their political persuasion..

So to protect freedom you're going to vote labour then?

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Give it a rest with the ...........'s. There is no form of writing that replaces proper sentences, punctuation and capital letters with loads of dots.

No, but there are plenty of forms of argument that replace logic and reason with an attack on the writing style, grammar or punctuation of the other party.

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You call me a fool and an idiot but I bet I have a higher IQ than you.

Do you seriously think that having a high IQ test score makes you any less likely to be a fool or an idiot? If you do, I suggest you join mensa (I assume, from the pompous and condescending tone of your posts that you must have a high enough score for that, or are you just happy to have scored above 100 maybe?). As someone who was personally foolish enough to have been a member of mensa for a short while, I can tell you categorically I have never met more fools and idiots in a single sitting than I did at the few of their meetings that I attended.

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That supporters of the Conservative party, which did so much to limit civil liberties in this country, throughout the 1980's and 1990's (free assembly, right to strike, right to trade union membership, right to freely express sexual orientation, support for oppressive regimes from Chilean Dictators to South African dictators, their economic support for oppressive regimes, denial of a free press) should now drape themselves in the cloak of freedom was surely rank amongst the greatest of hypocrisies.

As to 1984 - I lived through it. Some of us remember the vicious political witch-hunt against Clive Ponting because he revealed that Margaret Thatcher was lying to Parliament about The Belgrano.

Don't lecture me about freedom with you're silly allusions to Blair, I read the novel long ago - the proposed title was 1948 - it was a warning about all government. I know what freedom's worth and I know it doesn't exist in voting Tory - it exists in challenging all government excess - regardless of their political persuasion..

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No, but there are plenty of forms of argument that replace logic and reason with an attack on the writing style, grammar or punctuation of the other party.

Marxist/Socialists ( along with all political and religeous zealots) seem to like playing the man and not the ball, it's because their logic never stands up to close scrutiny; so they always try and divert attention away from arguments cenral premise and hope nobody notices. It's a political technique, not an examination of the possible truth. Logical fallacies are the meat and drink of all political whore's and second rate minds.

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I suspect there's a reason why they named themselves after a usually rather sturdy piece of furniture?

:) I think the idea was something to do with sitting around a table having erudite conversations. My experience was a load of people whinging about how unfair life is for not rewarded them with untold riches for their high IQ test scores.

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Every Government seems to leave us less free than the last. But with New Labour we have taken a quantum leap into authoritarianism. 3500 new crimes in a decade (compared to 500 under the Tories), over 60 law and order bills, the massive expansion of summary and arbitary justice, a growing army of unblinking officialdom, the move towards a total surveillance grid.

Not even the basic legal right, civil liberty or check and balance is safe under this Government.

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:) I think the idea was something to do with sitting around a table having erudite conversations. My experience was a load of people whinging about how unfair life is for not rewarded them with untold riches for their high IQ test scores.

I think it's common for people to equate high IQ with high ability to survive and adapt whereas in reality one does not necessarily follow the other. Traditionally I believe the state education system's bias towards rewarding the type of mental ability that predisposes children to perform well in IQ tests is the culprit. The type of intelligence tests we have are bound to be influenced by culture and a series of beliefs in what makes somebody clever. A monkey can do arithmetic and tasks that require pattern recognition and mental agility, it's been demonstrated - and they are quite quick at it too.

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You lot still not got this?

Green had knowledge about the IDs of the Brits involved in the Bombay malarky. Knowing he was going to leak, SO15 popped round to explain he'd be compromising an operation. Paps on his step eyeballed the CTC who took him in for form's sake.

End of.

My. You sound an awful lot like Pat. End of.

Actually I don't think so. We have only got your word. And its not much of a word really. End of.

I really don't mind labour party supporters on this site at all - I just can't stand arrogant twats that support the return to pre-Union attitudes by the ruling class to the management and treatment of individuals masquarading as 'Labour'. 4 Legs Better. End of.

Every Government seems to leave us less free than the last. But with New Labour we have taken a quantum leap into authoritarianism. 3500 new crimes in a decade (compared to 500 under the Tories), over 60 law and order bills, the massive expansion of summary and arbitary justice, a growing army of unblinking officialdom, the move towards a total surveillance grid.

Not even the basic legal right, civil liberty or check and balance is safe under this Government.

And the whole system has been set up around their own bullying intent. From consumer law to self-protection. You can't protect yourself and the police won't protect you. Basically in this country, people are prosecuted for small offences against the totalitarian state (putting your junk mail in a public bin on the way to your car) but kids are allowed to beat maim and damage without any contrition whatsoever because of a 'lack of evidence'. Its about proscecuting the compliant to create a greater element of fear.

Screaming right wing Rudoph Gianno in New York. Proscecuted for small offences that affected others rather than offences against the state. The crime rate dropped from NY City being one of the most dangerous places on earth to one of the safest. Rather than sending someone to counselling for spitting on the pavement, lock em up, If a kid beats up a pensioner, send the to reform school because what their parents are doing obviously isn't working. Make them do national service.

I had a friend who was mugged close to Stockwell Park while walking home one night. Not the safest place in the world but not the most dangerous from reputation. Black and blue and a splintered shin bone. The cops told him there had been about 10 serious muggings in the same area in the past 3 months. I mean FFS these little shites were sitting ducks for a sting, but nothing had been done. Lots of old folks in that area as well.

BRING BACK NATIONAL SERVICE FOR YOUNG OFFENDERS.

THE POLICE SHOULD BE STALKING THE LITTLE BASTARDS, CATCH EM IN THE ACT THEN SCRAPE PRISON AND INTRODUCE MILITARY TRAINING CAMPS.

Make them march across the freezing Scotish slopes with 50 kilos on their back (and nowhere to buy the cocaine!!!). Give em 6 months of that and a further 3 months everytime they try to scarper. And then if they do, make it a priority to hunt them down. I reckon in about 3 months (when they had scarpered for the first time, told their mates about it and then been dragged back to Scotland) the crime rate would drop by 90%.

Actually all you would have to do is systematically target these areas and catch the little scum for the crime rate to drop by 90% but the last time a copper did that he was told his arrest rate was too high. In other words, they need criminality to ensure they have something to 'fix'.

And then there are the aging male judges who routinely make excuses for aging male peadophiles, grandfathers particularly, and suggest things like 'buy her a bike' before letting them off. What are THEY making internal excuses for?

Edited by Elizabeth
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Sorry, I meant Mensa.

Latin for 'table', but similar enough to the Latin for 'mind' that there's bound to be a god-awful pun in there somewhere.

I heard Mensa being interviewed once. If they advertise in a learned newspaper of publication, they get very few replies. Advertise in the tabloids and that get a lot of replies, out of proportion to the readerships, and presumably even more out of proportion of the intellectual make-up of their respective readerships.

In other words, strict intelligence and intellect are different things (with a bit of snobbery thrown in). It is not the done thing to boast about your IQ. After all, if you need to mention it to win an argument, you have already lost.

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The more I consider recent events and this government I see how well the name 'ZanuLabour' fits the their actions.

No one in the government ever answers a simple question on whatever issue they are questioned. Staying on this subject, just look at the way Jackie Smith (**tch) fails to answer whether it is reasonable for the police to arrest a shadow minister in the link below. She just gets full of righteous indignation because people rightly assume that she had some knowledge of or hand in the arrest.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7754473.stm

The party is defended by nasty and vicious henchmen who repeat the same old lies. Witness some of the contributors to this thread who are clearly employed to disrupt online forums.

Once Again what is wrong with a civil servant making information public if they believe it is justifiable and providing it is not a true national security issue. This is exactly how Gordon Brown obtained his leaks early in his career. There was footage of him shown yesterday from back in the early nineties justifying how a civil servant 'concerned for the country' had provided him with a leak.

The police are now hounding a 26 year old civil servant for leaking information that anyone with two brain cells could have deduced for themselves.

Why is the government so silent on speaking up for civil liberties on this issue.

It is inconceivable that Jackie Smith did not know beforehand of Damian Green's arrest, given that Boris Johnson and David Cameron did.

Damian Green was held for nine hours and his home and two offices searched!

If you go back to the John Major government the media were relentless in their hounding of the Conservative Party and perhaps rightly so. So where are they now? Why do the spin, lies, deceit and ruinous policies not get properly challenged!

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Every Government seems to leave us less free than the last. But with New Labour we have taken a quantum leap into authoritarianism. 3500 new crimes in a decade (compared to 500 under the Tories), over 60 law and order bills, the massive expansion of summary and arbitary justice, a growing army of unblinking officialdom, the move towards a total surveillance grid.

Not even the basic legal right, civil liberty or check and balance is safe under this Government.

And yet people still vote for them, and their reasons are because it is better than having the other lot in. I lived through the eighties and so did my family, it wasn't so bad, I can remember my dad celebrating when Labour were voted out in 79. I can also remember the look on my dad's face the night we stayed up to watch the 1997 election, he was depressed for months, this is where it all turns to shit were his words.

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My. You sound an awful lot like Pat. End of.

Actually I don't think so. We have only got your word. And its not much of a word really. End of.

I really don't mind labour party supporters on this site at all - I just can't stand arrogant twats that support the return to pre-Union attitudes by the ruling class to the management and treatment of individuals masquarading as 'Labour'. 4 Legs Better. End of.

Did I say I thought that?

BRING BACK NATIONAL SERVICE FOR YOUNG OFFENDERS.

THE POLICE SHOULD BE STALKING THE LITTLE BASTARDS, CATCH EM IN THE ACT THEN SCRAPE PRISON AND INTRODUCE MILITARY TRAINING CAMPS.

You seem to though.

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My. You sound an awful lot like Pat. End of.

Actually I don't think so. We have only got your word. And its not much of a word really. End of.

I really don't mind labour party supporters on this site at all - I just can't stand arrogant twats that support the return to pre-Union attitudes by the ruling class to the management and treatment of individuals masquarading as 'Labour'. 4 Legs Better. End of.

And the whole system has been set up around their own bullying intent. From consumer law to self-protection. You can't protect yourself and the police won't protect you. Basically in this country, people are prosecuted for small offences against the totalitarian state (putting your junk mail in a public bin on the way to your car) but kids are allowed to beat maim and damage without any contrition whatsoever because of a 'lack of evidence'. Its about proscecuting the compliant to create a greater element of fear.

Screaming right wing Rudoph Gianno in New York. Proscecuted for small offences that affected others rather than offences against the state. The crime rate dropped from NY City being one of the most dangerous places on earth to one of the safest. Rather than sending someone to counselling for spitting on the pavement, lock em up, If a kid beats up a pensioner, send the to reform school because what their parents are doing obviously isn't working. Make them do national service.

I had a friend who was mugged close to Stockwell Park while walking home one night. Not the safest place in the world but not the most dangerous from reputation. Black and blue and a splintered shin bone. The cops told him there had been about 10 serious muggings in the same area in the past 3 months. I mean FFS these little shites were sitting ducks for a sting, but nothing had been done. Lots of old folks in that area as well.

BRING BACK NATIONAL SERVICE FOR YOUNG OFFENDERS.

THE POLICE SHOULD BE STALKING THE LITTLE BASTARDS, CATCH EM IN THE ACT THEN SCRAPE PRISON AND INTRODUCE MILITARY TRAINING CAMPS.

Make them march across the freezing Scotish slopes with 50 kilos on their back (and nowhere to buy the cocaine!!!). Give em 6 months of that and a further 3 months everytime they try to scarper. And then if they do, make it a priority to hunt them down. I reckon in about 3 months (when they had scarpered for the first time, told their mates about it and then been dragged back to Scotland) the crime rate would drop by 90%.

Actually all you would have to do is systematically target these areas and catch the little scum for the crime rate to drop by 90% but the last time a copper did that he was told his arrest rate was too high. In other words, they need criminality to ensure they have something to 'fix'.

And then there are the aging male judges who routinely make excuses for aging male peadophiles, grandfathers particularly, and suggest things like 'buy her a bike' before letting them off. What are THEY making internal excuses for?

:lol::lol::lol:

Great. The solution to littering is kidnap and forced labour. This will make the sum total of human misery go down and bring peace on earth, I can see that.

How do you cure headaches? Guillotine?

:lol::lol::lol:

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