mfp123 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 You could pay 2-3 times the price for a true supercar, with 2 seats and no boot, which would still be slower by many reports. I think you guys miss the point of this car. The guys spending 150k on a Ferrari thats slower are the ones that are gonna look a bit stupid when they get smoked on a track day. Which is after all what this car is built for. perhaps but many of the reviews say that the car is fast but docile. you cant hear the engine noise, the cabin is quiet and smooth. its like sitting in a bullet train vs sitting on a roller coaster. the bullet train maybe faster but you dont really feel it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deadman Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Had an Elise, currently have an Exige (MK1), Exige as close to perfect as you can get. Given serious money to tie up in a car the Ultima GTR and the GT40 Continuation would be high in my sights. I don't really fancy the R9 or the GT-R as they are both too much fly by wire. A guy at our place has a Rover 100 (Metro!) with an Exige engine in it. It's really funny to see it annhialating everything in it's sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Skellan Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Its 102% of the performance of a 911 Turbo at 48% of the price (after options to equal the spec) and had about 70% of the operating cost (spares and servicing). It will have equal reliability and residuals. That is quite an engineering triumph and as such I'm interested in one. Beauty is a variable in the eye of the beholder. Personally I think it looks ugly and brutal like a Glasgow copper. Which is okay. I think the 911 Turbo and the R8 are prettier. But then I'm a 6ft 2in, 50 year old, bald, married with 3 kids and missing half an ear. I don't necessarily want a pretty car. With the way the world is going the next decade may very well be the last chance you have to own and enjoy personal vehicles with this level of performance.. its now or never. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gasket37 Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I thought you were a pauper? walter mitty? this is one of those willy waving HPC car threads isn't it so i am out of here* * declaration - owner of a silver vauxhall thingy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone_Twin Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 walter mitty? this is one of those willy waving HPC car threads isn't it so i am out of here* * declaration - owner of a silver vauxhall thingy. Or i'm missing the irony plugin for firefox. . ST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i_godzuki Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 perhaps but many of the reviews say that the car is fast but docile. you cant hear the engine noise, the cabin is quiet and smooth. its like sitting in a bullet train vs sitting on a roller coaster. the bullet train maybe faster but you dont really feel it. This is until you drive it fast. When you drive it slowly (normally), it feels strong and safe and very comfortable. Your aunt could drive it. But put your foot down. especially with a few settings adjusted, and it's a beast. What's more, the fact is it's incredibly fast partly because it corners like it's on rails. As someone else says, you have to think about as a triumph of engineering that the company that used to make Datsuns can sell a car faster than Porsches and Ferraris for half the cost. I don't think Japanese versus European fast sports cars means one is bad and the other is good. They're just different in the same way high end steel bikes ride differently to ultra lightweight carbon ones. I also don't think the GT-R looks that boy racer-ish. compared to the Evo or Subarus. In many ways, people look more like cocks in Ferraris or cheesier Porsches like the Boxsters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
council dweller Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Id take a 15 year old Lancia Delta Integrale evo 1 with manual steering and no airconditioning over one of these any day. You must be the only hpc'er under 6ft 12" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Buttafueco Jr Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 This is until you drive it fast. When you drive it slowly (normally), it feels strong and safe and very comfortable. Your aunt could drive it. But put your foot down. especially with a few settings adjusted, and it's a beast. What's more, the fact is it's incredibly fast partly because it corners like it's on rails. As someone else says, you have to think about as a triumph of engineering that the company that used to make Datsuns can sell a car faster than Porsches and Ferraris for half the cost. I don't think Japanese versus European fast sports cars means one is bad and the other is good. They're just different in the same way high end steel bikes ride differently to ultra lightweight carbon ones. I also don't think the GT-R looks that boy racer-ish. compared to the Evo or Subarus. In many ways, people look more like cocks in Ferraris or cheesier Porsches like the Boxsters. For me it will shake up the establishment in the same way the NSX did in the early 90's. Ferrari upped their game and gave us the 355 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 The Nissan GT-R is a perfect example of everything that I hate about modern cars - too much bloody technology and ugly as sin. I know any number of people with brand new, highly sophisticated cars that cost more than I could ever hope to spend on a house, yet they are always in the garage with vehicle technicians scratching their heads trying to diagnose faults that seem to come and go as they please. A couple of examples... BMW X5 that grinds to a halt because of a problem with the cruise control - Surely if there's a problem with the cruise control it should simply lose the cruise control feature, not grind to a halt completely - A computer wouldn't crash because the printer had run out of ink, so why should a car stop working when a feature that's peripheral to it's main purpose ceases to function correctly? Ferrari F430 that goes into 'limp-home' mode as and when it feels like it. Garage can't find a fault each time they look at it, but there's obviously a fault there. There was a time when cars were just machines and these faults couldn't even exist. If something went wrong with your car you just took it to any competent mechanic who could fix it because all cars were basically the same. These days it's all computers and software. Only the main dealers have access to the software that they seem to need when a car needs fixing, so they can charge what they want for it, even though it requires zero effort to download the 'fix' into the car's ECU. And what happens when the car gets old? "Sorry sir, we can't fix your car, the software it's running on is obsolete and the new software won't run on your car because the hardware is too old... Oh, and that advice will be £400 please". No, give me an old car any day. And what of the Nissan GT-R's curious feature, where the sat-nav knows when you reach a race track and turns-off all of the limiters? Given how flaky and unstable these hi-tech gadgets are, would you really trust it? Suppose you're half way round a particularly demanding turn at the Nordschleife and the sat-nav suddenly decides you're not at a race track? Limiters lick-in and it's lift-off oversteer all the way to the armco... or you're out on the road, throttle to the floor round a second gear hairpin and the sat-nav suddenly decides you are at a race track and turns the limiters off? Power oversteer all the way to the nearest cliff. And... who, among us, who saw the Nissan GT-R, found it truly marvellous that each car is slightly unique because each engine is built by hand, and who thought "sh*t! that thing's going to be impossible to fix because bespoke parts will have to be made - there'll be no 'off-the-shelf' replacement components for it? No, these cars are stupid and pointless. Clearly a Top Gear arm chair car expert. It is a Nissan, therefore it will be as reliable as a Micra. Do your homework. Clarkson as usual is WRONG. Each car will fall into a predetermined production tolerance whether a component is hand assembeled or made via automation. ALL cars are slightly variable, Engineers then use software is "tune" the control systems to allow for this tolerance so that every car drives and feels the same. STOP listening to this lanky tw@t as if he is some sort of car god, he is a journalist who likes cars period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I find it difficult to get excited about a car that does the driving for you. What is the attraction?Anyone interest in Karting? I'm organising another event at RedLodge (nr Newmarket) on 8th August at 7pm. I have 13 drivers so far and space for 2 more. One qualifying session, and five races on a 1200m outdoor track in 270cc karts. VMR. and you have driven this car that does the driving for you then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 i like top gear also, but its the mugs that go out and buy these cars then drive them like morons on public roads. why demo a powerslide when you cant do it legally,. this show should then also show the best guns, drugs and glorify murder too. these are all illegal too.though its not the cars, its a show off thing. i think some idiot got wiped out with 4 of his friends last week in a mondeo into a huge truck. i have little sympathy. from the reports he was doing wreckless speeds and left his side of road on a bend right under a 40 ton truck,. killed them all. clarkson doesnt demo that does he ? I think you will find that car crashes existed way before the first episode of Top Gear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Id take a 15 year old Lancia Delta Integrale evo 1 with manual steering and no airconditioning over one of these any day. The GT-R is way out of the Lancia's league. the Integrale is a great classic car these days as long as you dont mind breaking down a lot (two of my mates have them). Even if you compare the Integrale with Nissan Skyline R32 GT-R of a similar vintage, the Nissan spanks the Italian big time. Again, nice car the Lancia though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 it really does look crap though. if you saw it parked next to a toyota celica and a hyundai coupe, it wouldnt look out of place. Have you seen one from the 3/4 rear view angle on the road? Nah, didn't think so, nothing looks like it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Bear Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 A guy at our place has a Rover 100 (Metro!) with an Exige engine in it. It's really funny to see it annhialating everything in it's sight. That could be quite a Q car. The Exige engine is in fact a development on the Rover K series which, as far as I know, started life as a 1.4 litre in the Metro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeryMeanReversion Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 and you have driven this car that does the driving for you then? Nope, but it even has electronics to help you with your hill starts! Other electronics assistance is for: Variable steering assist Electronically controlled rack and pinion steeering Traction control Differential control (traction/yaw) AVDC (brake and engine output) Shift-speed control Downshift rev matching Predictive pre-shift control Electronic damper control ABS EBD (brake distribution) May as well have a chauffeur and tell him where you want to go. VMR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Its 102% of the performance of a 911 Turbo at 48% of the price (after options to equal the spec) and had about 70% of the operating cost (spares and servicing). It will have equal reliability and residuals.That is quite an engineering triumph and as such I'm interested in one. Beauty is a variable in the eye of the beholder. Personally I think it looks ugly and brutal like a Glasgow copper. Which is okay. I think the 911 Turbo and the R8 are prettier. But then I'm a 6ft 2in, 50 year old, bald, married with 3 kids and missing half an ear. I don't necessarily want a pretty car. With the way the world is going the next decade may very well be the last chance you have to own and enjoy personal vehicles with this level of performance.. its now or never. "With the way the world is going the next decade may very well be the last chance you have to own and enjoy personal vehicles with this level of performance.. its now or never." I fear you may well be right. Better get my order in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Bear Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 "With the way the world is going the next decade may very well be the last chance you have to own and enjoy personal vehicles with this level of performance.. its now or never."I fear you may well be right. Better get my order in. That is a sad fact. I suspect that no kid in primary school now in the EU is going to be able to go into a showroom as an adult and buy a new interesting car even if he becomes as rich as Bill Gates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geed Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Nope, but it even has electronics to help you with your hill starts! Other electronics assistance is for:Variable steering assist Electronically controlled rack and pinion steeering Traction control Differential control (traction/yaw) AVDC (brake and engine output) Shift-speed control Downshift rev matching Predictive pre-shift control Electronic damper control ABS EBD (brake distribution) May as well have a chauffeur and tell him where you want to go. VMR. It has hill start assist because it does not have a driver controlled manual clutch, therefore you can't hold it on the hill by slipping the clutch, it has two pedals like an automatic and an electronically controlled dual plate clutch. Most of these other gizmos you can option on a well specc'd Mondeo. It is the way the Nissan Engineers have mastered the four wheel drive traction system that is the genius bit. They have been doing it since 1989 when the had the R32 Skyline GTR - which was faster than most Ferrari's and Porsches of the time also - British people didm't hear about it because it was not sold in Europe, but the Asia Pacific region knew it was the Daddy). GTR's are famed for having clever electronics that give the driver an analogue feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impatient_mug Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 "With the way the world is going the next decade may very well be the last chance you have to own and enjoy personal vehicles with this level of performance.. its now or never."I fear you may well be right. Better get my order in. Unfortunately I think it may be far less than a decade. The highly visible yellow boxes that only catch those that aren't concentrating are slowly being replaced by these 'Specs' averaging cameras. Only way to avoid them is to basically tailgate a larger vehicle - the whole 'change lanes' thing is a myth. They're no longer just put in sensible places like residential areas and schools - they're moving to open A-roads and motorways. There's also talk of road charging by satellite. Given this governments track record with major IT projects I don't think a national system will be in place any time soon, but I believe insurance companies are trialling the scheme. It's currently only available as an option if you want cheaper insurance, but I can see it becoming the only insurance available eventually. The authorities would then be able to see exactly how you're driving at any time. There's also petrol price hikes and road tax. A lot of people also seem to have Fred's attitude to driving and life in general - any form of fun should be banned by the state. By the time the GT-R makes it to UK roads I suspect it could already be useless :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomBoom Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 I've driven it on a test track here in Japan. It's amazingly quick yet can be driven slowly without fuss. You see quite a few on the roads. I prefer the dark grey color. I can't wait to get mine, being based in Germany I will be spending a lot of time on the Nurburg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joey Buttafueco Jr Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 I can't wait to get mine, being based in Germany I will be spending a lot of time on the Nurburg. You will have a long wait Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abaxas Posted July 28, 2008 Share Posted July 28, 2008 Why bother..... Just buy an old 2.8 capri and LOTS of toilet roll. More dangerous = more fun. The rest is marketing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomBoom Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 So you are expecting delivery in 2010 or 2011? I can have it early 2009. I work in the industry so I always have favours to call in with somoene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomBoom Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 I thought you were a pauper?. ST No, far from it. I make a very good living now as a consulting engineer. That's why I appreciate this car, because I know what a brilliant piece of engineering it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomBoom Posted July 28, 2008 Author Share Posted July 28, 2008 walter mitty? this is one of those willy waving HPC car threads isn't it so i am out of here* * declaration - owner of a silver vauxhall thingy. It was actually a discussion about engineering excellence and how Japan can do it for a lot less than we can Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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