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juvenal

Darwin Couple Canoeist Case

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Spokesman said Mr Darwin got heavily into debt and was unwilling to relinquish his 'portfolio' to pay mounting debts. Deception seen as only alternative.

It starts with BTL, and ends with 6 years in the cooler. Lesson there?

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I just read that one of the ex-NASA astronaunts has seen aliens so no doubt EAs will soon be using aliens coming here as an excuse for putting up house asking prices.

Any idea what size portfolio he, Darwin, had?

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What an unfortunate coincidence that these people, who really shouldn't be allowed to further their DNA into the gene pool, share the same surname as the author of the theory of natural selection/survival of the fittest.

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Spokesman said Mr Darwin got heavily into debt and was unwilling to relinquish his 'portfolio' to pay mounting debts. Deception seen as only alternative.

It starts with BTL, and ends with 6 years in the cooler. Lesson there?

BTL

Below Tide Line?

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What an unfortunate coincidence that these people, who really shouldn't be allowed to further their DNA into the gene pool, share the same surname as the author of the theory of natural selection/survival of the fittest.

He was also an expert on worms...

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Yeah how can you fail to make enough money? It sounds like they started in the trough and rented out bedsits, the most profitable way of getting your money back. 12 properties bought in the trough, each containing 5/6 rooms rented out individually at 200quid a month? Gives you about 144k PA, mortgage costs are only going to be 40k per year at most, why were they struggling on 100k PA?

Unless it was just 12 bedsits in the house next door? (28kPA), if that was the case why didn't they buy more/get real jobs?

Edited by moosetea

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Yeah how can you fail to make enough money? It sounds like they started in the trough and rented out bedsits, the most profitable way of getting your money back. 12 properties bought in the trough, each containing 5/6 rooms rented out individually at 200quid a month? Gives you about 144k PA, mortgage costs are only going to be 40k per year at most, why were they struggling on 100k PA?

Unless it was just 12 bedsits in the house next door? (28kPA), if that was the case why didn't they buy more/get real jobs?

Er, maybe they were trying to keep up with the moosetea's

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Er, maybe they were trying to keep up with the moosetea's

hypothetically speaking of course, it would have been 'easy' if you started in 1997.... If only I had a canoe...

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I just read that one of the ex-NASA astronaunts has seen aliens so no doubt EAs will soon be using aliens coming here as an excuse for putting up house asking prices.

Any idea what size portfolio he, Darwin, had?

From the local paper:

In addition to 3 and 4 The Cliff in Seaton Carew, the Darwins owned 12 terrace properties across the north east of England, each worth between £20,000 and £30,000.

These properties were bought with a £245,000 mortgage from the Yorkshire Bank, which was on favourable terms and was interest-only for the first six months.

The Yorkshire Bank extended that period once, but refused a further extension and it turned the couple down when they requested a £20,000 loan.

An analysis of the Darwins’ finances showed that they had outgoings of £6,700 every month, which consisted of £5,000 mortgage repayments and £1,700 in credit card repayments.

John Darwin earned £1,300 a month from his job as a prison officer and his wife was paid £747 a month from her part-time job as a doctor’s receptionist.

In addition, the rental income from their property portfolio brought in another £3,000. It meant they were losing £1,700 a month and were close to going bust.

A police source said: "Any reasonable person who finds themselves in the Darwins’ position would sell their properties to realise the debt.

"Instead they hatched this plot. Mr and Mrs Darwin liked to portray themselves as well-to-do and it was an image that they found difficult to move away from.

"It would have been very easy for them to put their properties up for sale."

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I don't think it was BTL that got them into debt.

Apparently, the guy who bought their house said there were about 20 phone lines going into it when he took possession and he was bugged for months by debt collection agencies acting on behalf of stock brokers in London.

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From the local paper:

In addition to 3 and 4 The Cliff in Seaton Carew, the Darwins owned 12 terrace properties across the north east of England, each worth between £20,000 and £30,000.

These properties were bought with a £245,000 mortgage from the Yorkshire Bank, which was on favourable terms and was interest-only for the first six months.

The Yorkshire Bank extended that period once, but refused a further extension and it turned the couple down when they requested a £20,000 loan.

An analysis of the Darwins’ finances showed that they had outgoings of £6,700 every month, which consisted of £5,000 mortgage repayments and £1,700 in credit card repayments.

John Darwin earned £1,300 a month from his job as a prison officer and his wife was paid £747 a month from her part-time job as a doctor’s receptionist.

In addition, the rental income from their property portfolio brought in another £3,000. It meant they were losing £1,700 a month and were close to going bust.

A police source said: "Any reasonable person who finds themselves in the Darwins’ position would sell their properties to realise the debt.

"Instead they hatched this plot. Mr and Mrs Darwin liked to portray themselves as well-to-do and it was an image that they found difficult to move away from.

"It would have been very easy for them to put their properties up for sale."

Thanks juvenal, useful info, it confirms that he has no grasp of finance...

They owned 12 Terrace properties (we can assume they were rented individually as next door which was rented out as individual bedsits) andtotal income was only 3000 per month! rent from each property was 250 quid a month! That is a hell of alot of voids, you could have rented each property out as a complete house for 350-400 quid a month.

The total mortgage for the 12 houses was 245k and it cost £5000 to service, this guy cant have a credit rating a 245k mortgage costs about £1000 quid a month I/O! £5000 quid a month to service 245k would mean there mortgage was about 30% APR !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!! However the post says it was on favorable terms?!? WTF

£1,700 on credit card repayments! how much debt, what interest rate? 40%? and this is at a time when the rest of the world was shifting debt between interest free cards and not paying anything for it!

This guy needed to sign up to Money Saving Expert, not buy a canoe...

total income:

£3000 + £1300 + £700 = £5000, should have been £7000 to £8000

total costs

£5000 + 1700 = £6700, should have been £1000 to £2000

Its another case of spend spend spend and not pay the bills, the family could have quite easily been earning 6k a month after mortgage costs rather than spending it all on paying interest

Edited by moosetea

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Expect to see 1000's of yellow canoes being washed up on UK shores in the next 12 months as BTL'ers like the Darwins realise the sums don't add up :lol::lol::lol:

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Anyone with a real urge to see the man punished, just remember that he used to be a prison officer. He's gonna get a lot of luvin in there.
The total amount of money stolen was £250,000 does any one else think that with what is going on inthe finacial world this is a drop in the ocean,That the Meja is making a big thing out of this and the jail term 13 years in total is very very hard,When other crimes against the person get a slap on the wrist

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The total amount of money stolen was £250,000 does any one else think that with what is going on inthe finacial world this is a drop in the ocean,That the Meja is making a big thing out of this and the jail term 13 years in total is very very hard,When other crimes against the person get a slap on the wrist

I agree. This is a heavy sentence. Either becuase money is more important than murder or violence against the person, or is this just a showcase? Is more money going to be wasted on an appeal?

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I agree. This is a heavy sentence. Either becuase money is more important than murder or violence against the person, or is this just a showcase? Is more money going to be wasted on an appeal?

I think it's a bit of both, bear in mind that the common law was originally designed to mainly protect the property of the wealthy land owners..

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What an unfortunate coincidence that these people, who really shouldn't be allowed to further their DNA into the gene pool, share the same surname as the author of the theory of natural selection/survival of the fittest.
In the article I read, they got into property investment in Panama, after the fraud, but if their original problems (aside from simple greed and stupidity) arose from BTL, then that raises some interesting questions. First off, I note that they are both in the mid/late 50s. I wonder if they were partly driven by this 'shame of debt/failure' driver that is absent in so many younger people to do more and more desperate things to hold onto the plot. Bit like Neeson. I suspect we will see thousands of younger people not infected with this quaint idea (and who have gown up with debt, IVAs and softer bankruptcy rules) to simply hand back the keys to their properties and liquidate their investments. So they were irrational as well s greedy. Second, the real interest for evolutionists, here, since there are good reasons for thinking that evolutionary processes are largely irrelevant when genetically disadvantaged individuals in most countries are very likely to have a long-lifespan and healthy kids given medical advances, is the idea of cultural evolution. Dawkins has the idea of a meme which is transmitted like a virus and which facilitates reproductive success. Maybe the virus of debt is now dying out like other ineffective memes as generations of indebted families now struggle to transmit their genes across generations?

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From the local paper:

In addition to 3 and 4 The Cliff in Seaton Carew, the Darwins owned 12 terrace properties across the north east of England, each worth between £20,000 and £30,000.

These properties were bought with a £245,000 mortgage from the Yorkshire Bank, which was on favourable terms and was interest-only for the first six months.

The Yorkshire Bank extended that period once, but refused a further extension and it turned the couple down when they requested a £20,000 loan.

An analysis of the Darwins’ finances showed that they had outgoings of £6,700 every month, which consisted of £5,000 mortgage repayments and £1,700 in credit card repayments.

John Darwin earned £1,300 a month from his job as a prison officer and his wife was paid £747 a month from her part-time job as a doctor’s receptionist.

In addition, the rental income from their property portfolio brought in another £3,000. It meant they were losing £1,700 a month and were close to going bust.

A police source said: "Any reasonable person who finds themselves in the Darwins’ position would sell their properties to realise the debt.

"Instead they hatched this plot. Mr and Mrs Darwin liked to portray themselves as well-to-do and it was an image that they found difficult to move away from.

"It would have been very easy for them to put their properties up for sale."

Oops. I take it all back. They are clearly greedy muppets.

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The total amount of money stolen was £250,000 does any one else think that with what is going on inthe finacial world this is a drop in the ocean,That the Meja is making a big thing out of this and the jail term 13 years in total is very very hard,When other crimes against the person get a slap on the wrist

I think the length of the sentance is probably supposed to be a deterrant also. Remember they were only caught because he, stupidly, went into a police station claiming amnesia. If he hadn't have done that, would they ever have been caught? They showed how easy it is to fake death and move to another country, while cashing in on insurance. As I say, the length of the sentance could be more to try and put off future canoeists.

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I think the length of the sentance is probably supposed to be a deterrant also. Remember they were only caught because he, stupidly, went into a police station claiming amnesia. If he hadn't have done that, would they ever have been caught? They showed how easy it is to fake death and move to another country, while cashing in on insurance. As I say, the length of the sentance could be more to try and put off future canoeists.

I think the scam is still on going. They will be out in three years. During these three years they will both write books on their lives which will end up as best sellers. On their release the media will want interviews and exclusives which the Darwins can gloss up ready for the big one. A blockbuster film "Seaton beach to Pananma city". And also the house market will have picked up so they can sell the portfolio at the peak. :lol:

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I think the length of the sentance is probably supposed to be a deterrant also. Remember they were only caught because he, stupidly, went into a police station claiming amnesia.

Agreed

If he hadn't have done that, would they ever have been caught? They showed how easy it is to fake death and move to another country, while cashing in on insurance. As I say, the length of the sentance could be more to try and put off future canoeists.

I think the most interesting part (completely brushed over in the media) is how did he leave the country as a dead man with no passport?!?

It's a long way to paddle!

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In addition to 3 and 4 The Cliff in Seaton Carew, the Darwins owned 12 terrace properties across the north east of England, each worth between £20,000 and £30,000

What the heck were they? Dolls houses? I thought we had rampant HPI??? I could buy one with me credit card!!

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I think the most interesting part (completely brushed over in the media) is how did he leave the country as a dead man with no passport?!?

I've gone on baccy trips to belgium about 4 times in the past 3 years, I had my passport checked once when leaving from Dover. It's always checked coming in, but not very often going out. From Europe I reckon it would be a lot easier to use a false passport to fly to mexico than from heathrow.

One other thing that made me laugh was they were going to set up an outdoor pursuit centre in mexico, horse riding, canoeing and that sort of thing. Guess who was going to be the canoe teacher!

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  • 396 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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