Realistbear Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) http://uk.biz.yahoo.com/080716/214/i39hv.html Paragon sees lower bad debts | | | LONDON (ShareCast) - Buy-to-let mortgage lender Paragon (Xetra: 555869 - news) has seen reduced arrears over the past three months, (Advertisement) adding its loan book performance is "exemplary" with landlords benefiting from increased rents and yields. The group said it continued to operate profitably and in line with management's expectations from 1 April to 30 June 2008. Third quarter profit before taxation was similar to the average quarterly underlying profit for the first half of the year. The number of accounts in arrears has reduced since March, with the percentage of accounts in arrears remaining at similar levels, Paragon said. The charge for impairment remains consistent with that for the first six months and is in line with expectations. Credit market conditions continue to constrain new lending activity, it added, with lending mostly limited to further advances to existing landlords. Total loans to customers, at £10.4 billion, are at a similar level to a year previously. Business doing well in the BTL sector despite the rrest of the economy going to hell in a hand basket. Good to see one bright spot eh? PARAGON GROUP 66.00 6.25 +10.46% Edited July 16, 2008 by Realistbear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas Cage Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) Seems the mortgage interest might catch som eout, Rents are not rising staying the same rate they always have of around 3% inflation per annum Edit: recently 3%, they follow long term about 5% Edited July 16, 2008 by maxwell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 But they've left out the fact house prices have plummeted £20,000 in ten months. A few pounds a month more in rent won't help them out. Lets hope the migrants don't head home anytime soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silver surfer Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 I was shorting Paragon during most of 2007. Very successful trade, fully compensating for my disastrous investment in uranium! Ho hum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lets get it right Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Is there anyone on this planet who would buy their shares? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby9983 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) If any of you commenting on this had any knowledge of the banking sector you would know that Paragon... Practically pulled out of buy to let 2 years ago Specialise in high yielding HMO and student properties Only deal with experienced landlords Only deal with experienced landlords with very high credit scores Have a very low loan to value across their portfolio. Hmmmph, very lucky that shorter. Hope more get burned big time. Paragon are no B&B. Edited July 16, 2008 by bobby9983 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) If any of you commenting on this had any knowledge of the banking sector you would know that Paragon...Hmmmph, very lucky that shorter. Hope more get burned big time. Paragon are no B&B. Then why have their shares fallen from £10.00 a share to next to nothing? Edited July 16, 2008 by time 2 raise interest rates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby9983 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Then why have their shares fallen from £10.00 a share to next to nothing? :angry: Why do you think any shares fall or rise for that matter. Speculation! Buy/Sell on the rumour, Sell/Buy on the news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrGUID Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 All these repossessions are reducing stock of property - my last place has been empty for a year while it was repossessed and auctioned off. Demand for rental property in the South East remains strong. Even if more migrants leave I don't expect it will lead to vast amount of empty property as they usually pack several people into one property. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
symo Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 COuld not believe this when I saw the forum topic then I had a little think. Engage the shorting of Paragon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 :angry: Why do you think any shares fall or rise for that matter. Speculation! Buy/Sell on the rumour, Sell/Buy on the news. So that's how it works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoggums Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Dead Cat Bounce Rental income is linked to house prices. People aren't going to pay massive rents if a mortgage for an equivalent property becomes significantly cheaper. (which in due course it will!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DissipatedYouthIsValuable Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 So, they've gone up 10p, having dropped from about £70? This must be why my rent has doubled in the last 3 hours then? ******ed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas Cage Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 If any of you commenting on this had any knowledge of the banking sector you would know that Paragon...Practically pulled out of buy to let 2 years ago Specialise in high yielding HMO and student properties Only deal with experienced landlords Only deal with experienced landlords with very high credit scores Have a very low loan to value across their portfolio. Hmmmph, very lucky that shorter. Hope more get burned big time. Paragon are no B&B. I thought they were very proud of BTL lending in September 2007, Year ending 2007 34.3% increase in buy-to-let loan advances to £4,079.3 million 39.1% increase in buy-to-let portfolio £10,031.3 million http://www.paragon-group.co.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby9983 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Dead Cat BounceRental income is linked to house prices. People aren't going to pay massive rents if a mortgage for an equivalent property becomes significantly cheaper. (which in due course it will!) Yawn, except all those numpties who were paying huge amounts on their massively MEW'd mortgages get repossessed then find a really nice property for half the price each month. Even though the rent is high in rental terms, they still bite the landlords hand off because of the stampede of other dispossessed numpties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) Dead Cat BounceRental income is linked to house prices. People aren't going to pay massive rents if a mortgage for an equivalent property becomes significantly cheaper. (which in due course it will!) It's a no brainer, should i rent for a few pounds a month more or buy when house prices are falling by £25,000 per year. they are all ready down £20,000 in ten months. Edited July 16, 2008 by time 2 raise interest rates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby9983 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 I thought they were very proud of BTL lending in September 2007, Year ending 2007 34.3% increase in buy-to-let loan advances to £4,079.3 million 39.1% increase in buy-to-let portfolio £10,031.3 million http://www.paragon-group.co.uk That was mainly to existing customers. Experienced landlords. You need to start making a distinction between amateur and professional landlords. Amateurs bought overinflated new build. Professionals buy HMO's with over 10% yield. Paragon's loan book largely consist of the latter. You have to have at least 3 properties / 3 years of experience to get a mortgage with Paragon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 :angry: Why do you think any shares fall or rise for that matter. Speculation! Buy/Sell on the rumour, Sell/Buy on the news. Fudamentals, dear boy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobby9983 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 Fudamentals, dear boy. In a sane world yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicholas Cage Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 That was mainly to existing customers. Experienced landlords.You need to start making a distinction between amateur and professional landlords. Amateurs bought overinflated new build. Professionals buy HMO's with over 10% yield. Paragon's loan book largely consist of the latter. How do you know this or quantify Experienced ?, what about the increase in BTl lending contradicting your first post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 (edited) If rents rise 10% and you're paying £1000 per month that puts your rent up to £1.100 per month or £1,200 a year. If house prices fall £25,000 per year and your rent rises £1,200 you will be up £23,800 renting, let me think about it for a minute. Edited July 16, 2008 by time 2 raise interest rates Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedebtisreal Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 That was mainly to existing customers. Experienced landlords.You need to start making a distinction between amateur and professional landlords. Amateurs bought overinflated new build. Professionals buy HMO's with over 10% yield. Paragon's loan book largely consist of the latter. You have to have at least 3 properties / 3 years of experience to get a mortgage with Paragon. Do you have any evidence for these claims you are making? I know plenty of muppet landlords who are in trouble and most have paragon mortgages. Worse, paragon, unlike B&b are 100% reliant on money markets for funding and selling on of securities. Oh and the ONS figures released this week state that rent inflation is less than both CPI and RPI. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sillybear2 Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 In a sane world yes. Paragon are sitting on lots of very dodgy collateral, their landlords have very little skin the game or emotional attachment to their properties. Speculation alone doesn't explain £10 > 50p. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redgenieuk Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 I was shorting Paragon during most of 2007. Very successful trade, fully compensating for my disastrous investment in uranium! Ho hum. You probably didn't reach the "critical mass" required for the uranium investment to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
time 2 raise interest rates Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 And if you're a Landlord your mortgage rate will have soared in the last year so if your rent rises you will be no better off, but your property will have lost £25,000 in value and if you own 3-4 buy-to-lets you could be down around £100,000. Bless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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