Jump to content
House Price Crash Forum

Kingston Upon Thames


Recommended Posts

my opinion is that there is a shortage of people with much less to spend, to whom my flat would be a top option and an improvement on the 2 bed flats or houses miles away from public transport that they'd been looking at. i think that these are the people who are having trouble accessing finance, but if eventually these folks are able to come into the market (not guaranteed, i know), i think i'll see much more interest in my flat. it'll be more of a 'value proposition' for these types of people.

incidentally, we did have one offer very early on which was miles below the asking price (at the time) which we rejected... we're kicking ourselves now because it was at a level which we would happily accept now :(

Why not reduce a chunk off the price and see if that generates any more interest? You wouldn't be under any obligation to sell for that price, but it might be a way to gauge the market. I sold my house (in a crappier part of London) for a similar amount to your asking price, so ime there are people looking in that price bracket. And while I don't really like flats and my old house is very big I'd prefer to live in your flat than in my old house and I'd imagine many potential buyers would feel the same.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 2.4k
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Posted Images

Oh - and bear in mind that an FTB nowadays is likely to need at least a 10% deposit in cash... + fees. So call it 13%.

Even of 'only' 300k that means they need to part with almost 40K before they get started on the affordability stakes - this in a time when the majority of people (apparently) are suffering under a heavy load of consumer debt.

Then they need to borrow 270k from somewhere. Even at a 5x salary multiple that means they will need to be earning around £54k. Even then the payments are going to be close to 2k a month.

Best of luck with it, but People are expecting 30% off over the next year or so, and even then it will not be a cheap place to live - which with the best will in the world a conversion flat is meant to be.

Edited by RichB
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Oh - and bear in mind that an FTB nowadays is likely to need at least a 10% deposit in cash... + fees. So call it 13%.

Even of 'only' 300k that means they need to part with almost 40K before they get started on the affordability stakes - this in a time when the majority of people (apparently) are suffering under a heavy load of consumer debt.

Then they need to borrow 270k from somewhere. Even at a 5x salary multiple that means they will need to be earning around £54k. Even then the payments are going to be close to 2k a month.

can't argue with your maths, however remember that there would be more than one salary involved if/when my place was sold. a professional couple earning 27-30k each isn't all that rare... i'm pretty sure a singleton isn't going to be buying a three bedroom property. (if anyone knows if its not as simple as just adding up the two salaries, do say)

good point about the deposit required being a large wedge of cash in anyones book, but not everyone is up to their eyeballs in store-card debt. as long as nothing unexpected happens in a month i'm able to add a little to my savings each month and my salary is very unremarkable. also, there's more than one way to come by sums of money than just your salary (a canny investment, an inheritance, even just parents gifting the cash if the family is relatively well off)

Edited by snuffle_uk
Link to comment
Share on other sites

can't argue with your maths, however remember that there would be more than one salary involved if/when my place was sold. a professional couple earning 27-30k each isn't all that rare... i'm pretty sure a singleton isn't going to be buying a three bedroom property. (if anyone knows if its not as simple as just adding up the two salaries, do say)

The problem with this is that it ignores possibility that a couple (even professional ones) would at some point like to have kids - generally 2 salaries are essential to service a mortgage on a decent place in Kingston right now - All my friends that have kids have to have both parents working - in some cases 1 half pretty much works full time just to pay for childcare - :blink: - one of my criteria for buying back in (I STR'd from Kingston last Sept) is when I can afford a decent place (where I can have kids) on ONE salary so the other half can actually be a mother and look after the kids rather than both of us slaving just to service the mortgage.

good point about the deposit required being a large wedge of cash in anyones book, but not everyone is up to their eyeballs in store-card debt. as long as nothing unexpected happens in a month i'm able to add a little to my savings each month and my salary is very unremarkable. also, there's more than one way to come by sums of money than just your salary (a canny investment, an inheritance, even just parents gifting the cash if the family is relatively well off)

I'm pretty much the only person I know who is really a saver at the mo - my friends either don't bother or simply can't because they are already stretched. Before you ask they are generally professional middle class types from fairly well off backgrounds.

IMO Kingston is highly overrated (I grew up there and in Richmond) and IS overpriced at every level. The proliferation of new build flats will I believe collapse the market for flats - I have explicit memories of the last crash in Kingston where my mother who unfortunately bought a 1 bed flat in 1990 had to endure the thick end of a 30% haircut - whilst in arrears - we only narrowly avoided repossession due to the massive negative equity that made repossession uneconomical for Abbey. We eventually managed to sell at a profit 10 years later.

Kingston will be hammered this time mainly because of ridiculous amounts of newbuild.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Manners? As (s)he said, its just business.

Business or no business, to me it's unacceptable to make scathing remarks about someone else's home, while in the same breath bragging about how much money you've got.

But evidently it's acceptable to you, so thank you for underlining my point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hardly scathing to suggest its not worth the 1/3million they want for it.

As for bragging about how much I have - well, the fact that I could afford it, and am therefore the person in questions target market, indicates I am not simply a tyre kicker/dreamer but would be in the market. At the right price. Yet as it stands my point is that I (and most people I know) prefer to have the available spending money, no debt and compared to purchasing relatively cheap rent.

For it to make sense for someone in my place to consider that as a purchase it would need to fall by over 600/month on the repayments - or 1/3.

There is a quite disturbing trend on this board for people to be quite anti wealth, whether asset based or income based. For the last several years we have had their inflating assets rammed down our throats - some of us have positioned ourselves to share the joy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Kingston will be hammered this time mainly because of ridiculous amounts of newbuild.

I am not sure I agree about Kingston being over-rated. On the contrary, I think that people tend to have a fairly low opinion of the place, and are generally very surprised and impressed when they visit (unless they venture out in the nightclub district at night!)

I agree about the new-builds affecting the flat market. The problem is that most of these developments are in such poor locations. For example, the developer St George built the 'Charter Quay' development in a nice riverside location within walking distance of the town centre. Flushed with success. they went on to build 'Royal Quarter' with it's views of the gasworks, trainline and main roads, and tried to sell them at the same price as Charter Quay.

Places like Royal Quarter and the developments on the main London Road near Norbiton/Kingston Hill will get hammered as they are just not desirable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am not sure I agree about Kingston being over-rated. On the contrary, I think that people tend to have a fairly low opinion of the place, and are generally very surprised and impressed when they visit (unless they venture out in the nightclub district at night!)

I agree about the new-builds affecting the flat market. The problem is that most of these developments are in such poor locations. For example, the developer St George built the 'Charter Quay' development in a nice riverside location within walking distance of the town centre. Flushed with success. they went on to build 'Royal Quarter' with it's views of the gasworks, trainline and main roads, and tried to sell them at the same price as Charter Quay.

Places like Royal Quarter and the developments on the main London Road near Norbiton/Kingston Hill will get hammered as they are just not desirable.

Some of them are getting hammered already. A one bed in the Buick House block is now on at £194K-ish, down from an original price of £265K-ish. Those flats were so ludicrously overpriced I did wonder who on earth would be daft enough to buy them. Rents were never even going to begin to cover mortgages.

The i-Pad block is another due for the hammer. Some of these minute studios are still up for rent for £900-ish. Some of the one-beds don't even have bedroom windows.

As for Kingston being over-rated, I must say I'm no great fan of the centre and avoid it where possible, so it's just as well I hate shopping. ;) However we have friends from rural Devon who can't wait to hit the shops while they're with us.

The main reason we're still here after over 20 years is that we're only a couple of minutes' walk from Richmond Park, and it's very handy for both Heathrow and Gatwick. Mr Bear does a lot of business travel and we have a lot of overseas friends who visit, not to mention a daughter working in Indonesia who can do without long post-flight journeys. Also like the riverside walks, particularly from Ham House to Richmond.

Must confess that I was initially anti the new Rose Theatre. It seemed crazy for a council that charges the highest CT in London and is always protesting that it's broke, to be pouring money into something that will probably always need subsidising. Especially since there are two theatres in Richmond and another in Wimbledon - 2 if you count the Polka children's theatre. However I've been to a few productions at The Rose and have to admit I was impressed.

A major factor bringing people to the area (and keeping them here) is the two Tiffin schools and the very good primaries in North Kingston and Coombe.

I guess this trend will only increase, given reports of parents no longer able to afford school fees.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A major factor bringing people to the area (and keeping them here) is the two Tiffin schools and the very good primaries in North Kingston and Coombe.

I guess this trend will only increase, given reports of parents no longer able to afford school fees.

Yes, good state schools become even more attractive during a downturn.

The other thing in Kingston's favour is it's generally low prices compared to the surrounding areas. From Surbiton, I can be at Waterloo in 15 minutes, but the houses prices (whilst expensive) are a lot cheaper than Richmond. Wimbledon and other places with a similar commute.

The green spaces are also a factor - I am a good 25 minute walk from Richmond Park, but can be in Home Park in a 30 second boat ride in the summer.

As always, it is supply and demand that will be final telling factor and the proliferation of poorly located, small flats (iPad is a great example) will have a big effect. These will start to become very affordable as soon as people realise that they can afford good flats or houses instead.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sounds like we are neighbours Mrs Bear. Best not tell people about the walk though (the cars zooming by, the potholes, the neds hanging about, the litter, the clambering over hedges, etc people would get a disappointment...get my drift)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There has also been a lot of talk in recent times about bringing kingston and surbiton into zone five.

Does this affect prices in today's market...is it a case of 1 and two having more clout and the rest fighting it out?

Personally, I like z.6 makes it sound far away even if it's walkable!

Anyway, good to see the discussion is moving on, keep it clean eh?! ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There has also been a lot of talk in recent times about bringing kingston and surbiton into zone five.

Does this affect prices in today's market...is it a case of 1 and two having more clout and the rest fighting it out?

Personally, I like z.6 makes it sound far away even if it's walkable!

Anyway, good to see the discussion is moving on, keep it clean eh?! ;)

Kingston and Surbiton should be in zone 5, and the zonal pricing that is currently being phased in has having a massive upward effect on ticket prices - 35% increase in single tickets last year, similar for season tickets next year.

I don't think that moving from zone 6 to zone 5 would have much of an upward effect on house prices even in a strong market. Commuters who live in Surbiton value the speed of the journey and the frequency of the trains. If they were that worried about the monthly ticket costs they would move further in anyway. I can't imagine it will be more than a £30-£40 per month saving anyway. There is also no snob value as there is in central London - if you live in the suburbs, no one really cares if it is in zone 3, 4, 5, or 6.

Lots of places around Kingston are actually in zone 4 already (New Malden, Worcester Park), yet house prices are significantly cheaper there than in Kingston or Surbiton. Berrylands station is in zone 5, but the area surrounding it remains cheaper than neighbouring Surbiton in zone 6.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The problem with this is that it ignores possibility that a couple (even professional ones) would at some point like to have kids - generally 2 salaries are essential to service a mortgage on a decent place in Kingston right now - All my friends that have kids have to have both parents working - in some cases 1 half pretty much works full time just to pay for childcare - :blink: - one of my criteria for buying back in (I STR'd from Kingston last Sept) is when I can afford a decent place (where I can have kids) on ONE salary so the other half can actually be a mother and look after the kids rather than both of us slaving just to service the mortgage.

One of the reasons that we chose to STR was that it allows us to live comfortably on one salary. Now we can start a family as soon as we decide to, rather than the far off point of "when we can afford it." We can still afford holidays, occasional meals out/take-aways. And we still have enough left over to keep saving more into our STR pot.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

One of the reasons that we chose to STR was that it allows us to live comfortably on one salary. Now we can start a family as soon as we decide to, rather than the far off point of "when we can afford it." We can still afford holidays, occasional meals out/take-aways. And we still have enough left over to keep saving more into our STR pot.

I totally see where you're coming from, and when (or if, lol) my place sells i'll most likely join you in renting for the forseeable future, to remove the need for a second salary. The only reason i originally mentioned a couple (or two mates) pooling salaries to buy together was to point out that 'the buyer has to be earning 55k to buy your flat' wasn't the only scenario out there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone else noticed the amount of empty shops are growing in Kingston. Just in the last week I've seen Jacks hair place and the kitchen shop next to pret shut the boards. There is also a walkway opposite boots (sorry the name doesn't come to me) that is pretty much a ghostway. The EA's seem to be hanging on for now!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone else noticed the amount of empty shops are growing in Kingston. Just in the last week I've seen Jacks hair place and the kitchen shop next to pret shut the boards. There is also a walkway opposite boots (sorry the name doesn't come to me) that is pretty much a ghostway. The EA's seem to be hanging on for now!

Kingston has got so much retail space considering the town centre's relatively small geographic size. Even the rally sought after areas (Market Place and Bentall Centre) have a couple of empty shops at the moment, and the less popular parts (like the 'Eden Walk' centre you mention) have even more.

Unbeliveably, there is currently a scheme in place to actually increase the amount of square footage available. This will have the advantage of removing the scruffy parts like Eden Walk, but who is going to rent this space?

The problem is that independent shops and small chains cannot afford the rents somewhere like Kingston, so it is left to the larger chains. Clearly, there is far too much capacity for them, so we end up with 3 branches of Game, 5 Starbucks etc. Can there ever really be a need for 3 branches of Game within a 5 minute walk of each other?

I still think that Kingston is one of the better shopping centres, but it would probably be just as good without 30% of it's current capacity.

Edited by worried1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I still think that Kingston is one of the better shopping centres, but it would probably be just as good without 30% of it's current capacity.

Too right - IMO far too many shops selling a load of old tat. Spent half a day with daughter a couple of weeks ago looking for a glam dress for her to wear to a wedding in Italy. Ended up with 3 OK-ish dresses to bring home, think about and probably take back.

Following day she kindly came with me to the Hampton Court Flower Show, and lo, we not only found her a stunning and perfectly fitting dress in the vast Country Living marquee, but also a mere 3 stalls away the perfect little bag to match.

All followed by a jug of Pimms on the grass.

Which certainly beat traipsing around litter and gum-strewn Kingston. And telling that we couldn't find anything half as stunning or perfectly fitting in a huge shopping centre on the doorstep.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I just looked on FAP - if it's the Lower Ham Road one, overlooking the river, I'm surprised it hasn't sold. Lovely location, unless of course you're Paddles. ;) and those houses don't come up very often.

At the other end of KT2, this one was originally on at £265K, just now down to £219,950.

As I think I've said before, these look pretty hideous from the outside, but nice location/views and much bigger than the average 2-bed.

http://www.findaproperty.com/displayprop.a...p;agentid=00720

I'm still expecting the KoT flat market to implode by Christmas.

This is the Sound,

This is the Sound of the Suburbs

This is the Sound,

This is the Sound of the Suburbs

Every Lousy Monday Morning Heathrow jets goes crashing over my home,

Ten O’clock Broadmoor siren driving me mad won’t leave me alone,

The woman next door just sits and stares outside,

She hasn’t come out once ever since her husband died,

This is the Sound,

This is the Sound of the Suburbs

This is the Sound,

This is the Sound of the Suburbs

Link to comment
Share on other sites

a little of the members eh?!

maybe more this...

This town, is coming like a ghost town

Why must the youth fight against themselves?

Government leaving the youth on the shelf

This place, is coming like a ghost town

No job to be found in this country

Can't go on no more

The people getting angry

Hard to think that 1979 is being echoed and I cannot really remember it!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

a little of the members eh?!

maybe more this...

This town, is coming like a ghost town

Why must the youth fight against themselves?

Government leaving the youth on the shelf

This place, is coming like a ghost town

No job to be found in this country

Can't go on no more

The people getting angry

Hard to think that 1979 is being echoed and I cannot really remember it!

Can you believe that Ghost Town by the specials was from 1981 ...... 27 years ago :o

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Unbeliveably, there is currently a scheme in place to actually increase the amount of square footage available.

Clearly, there is far too much capacity for them, so we end up with 3 branches of Game, 5 Starbucks etc. Can there ever really be a need for 3 branches of Game within a 5 minute walk of each other?

I still think that Kingston is one of the better shopping centres, but it would probably be just as good without 30% of it's current capacity.

I think the comments you made resound to many that live in this area. I personally hate to see the sight of another starbucks...how much terrible coffee can people drink?! Overpriced ciabatta's with clothes that are made to last a wash or two. I would much rather see a propert community of shops. Somehow though, local business' need to be able or supported in fighting for the space. The trouble is that the independent shops that do come through have so little margin for profit that their prices can never be competitive. I agree, compared to a lot of shopping areas, kingston is still a good place to go for, but it needs the local business to make it a little more unique.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Taken from the main forum - Rightmove's August report. Kingston down 7.2% IN ONE MONTH!!!! :o

London's Bottom 5

Avg. Price Aug 08 Avg. PriceJul 08 MonthlyChange

Wandsworth £480,555 £521,653 -7.9%

Brent £503,690 £544,592 -7.5%

Kingston-upon-Thames £477,563 £514,371 -7.2%

Richmond-upon-Thames £513,035 £550,248 -6.8%

Greenwich £242,736 £259,809 -6.6%

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/pdf/p/hpi/House...hAugust2008.pdf

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Taken from the main forum - Rightmove's August report. Kingston down 7.2% IN ONE MONTH!!!! :o

London's Bottom 5

Avg. Price Aug 08 Avg. PriceJul 08 MonthlyChange

Wandsworth £480,555 £521,653 -7.9%

Brent £503,690 £544,592 -7.5%

Kingston-upon-Thames £477,563 £514,371 -7.2%

Richmond-upon-Thames £513,035 £550,248 -6.8%

Greenwich £242,736 £259,809 -6.6%

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/pdf/p/hpi/House...hAugust2008.pdf

Quine, you beat me to it. This is pretty spectacular!!!!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.





×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.