The Welcome Thread For New Members

[Patience is a virtue isn't it!]

Thanks TB,

To be fair I didn't STR intentionally. We just couldn't get a buyer for ours if we were then stuck in an upward chain. It made more sense to say we had no chain and to move into rented.

I would buy a house today, if for my hard earned money I could get a nice 4 bedroomed house with a garden, driveway and garage in T.Wells.

Fact is, I can't. I'd therefore rather chill in a flat that costs me less in rent than the Interest would on a mortgage and wait to see what happens.

I just hate the fact so much emphasis it put on owning your own home. Being one of the more senior guys at work, but 7 years younger than the rest I missed the big rises in property. In '99 I was at Uni and for the next few years I paid off my debts and saved a deposit, by which time the gravy train had well and truely left. People look at you like you're weird if you don't either own, or desperately want to get yourself indebted to your eyeballs in debt!

[mayday]

Shock horror !!! UK house prices fall 35% !!! Could this happen , well how about it HAS happened in the last 2 years since the june 2004 peak . As measured in ounces of gold it takes to buy the average UK house - the amount has fallen from 689 ozs to 450 ozs. This made sound ludicrous to some but I believe it is a valid measure of how nominal prices mask inflationary tendencies that even governments are trying to pretend don't exist. They print money endlessly - people , banks, corporations and Governments balloon their balance sheets and nominal prices of everything rise - it is no surprise that houses can always go up. But relative prices are important - houses crashed in 1974 by 40% in real terms but barely moved lower in nominal terms . Most people aren't equipped to cope with real prices because there is no analysis , information or transparency available. Also to take advantage you need to be able to transfer money between the main asset classes - Property,Equity,Bonds,Gold and Cash.

[The Posh Plumber]

Hi all

Been lurking here for some time and have found the site very refreshing, informative and sometimes quite amusing.. The downside is I think I am hooked! I visit most days and can't get enough.

I bought an overpriced town centre new build in sumner 03 (1&1/2 bed 190k + 10k for parking) it was a very poor build quality and I should have known better being in the building trade! I thought prices were high then but I somehow got caught up in all the madness.. Things really hit me when the bills started coming in even though I had a 25% deposit it was costing me a grand a month just to pay the mortgage, maintenance and ground rent. I started to think I'm on an above average wage this can't be normal! Then I realised I could rent a better place for £750 with no maintenance worries or ground rent etc and so something far better with my deposit. Lucky for me I STR in sumer 04 somehow making a very small profit (I would have taken a loss to get out).

So thats me, look forward to posting

PP

[a j]

Hi all

Been lurking here for some time and have found the site very refreshing, informative and sometimes quite amusing.. The downside is I think I am hooked! I visit most days and can't get enough.

I bought an overpriced town centre new build in sumner 03 (1&1/2 bed 190k + 10k for parking) it was a very poor build quality and I should have known better being in the building trade! I thought prices were high then but I somehow got caught up in all the madness.. Things really hit me when the bills started coming in even though I had a 25% deposit it was costing me a grand a month just to pay the mortgage, maintenance and ground rent. I started to think I'm on an above average wage this can't be normal! Then I realised I could rent a better place for £750 with no maintenance worries or ground rent etc and so something far better with my deposit. Lucky for me I STR in sumer 04 somehow making a very small profit (I would have taken a loss to get out).

So thats me, look forward to posting

PP

Hi PP - great first post. How to make friends and influence people.

Did you STR with a belief that prices would fall, or did you sell to cut monthly bills?

[The Posh Plumber]

Hi PP - great first post. How to make friends and influence people.

Did you STR with a belief that prices would fall, or did you sell to cut monthly bills?

Hi a j

I STR with the belief that prices would fall not to cut bills, I was actually over paying every month to try to make a dent in the 150k debt.

Although I didn't enter into the purchase blindly it was just the realisation that I was paying out all this money for a tiny, poorly built flat that made me think I must get out of here! To be honest I have never looked back. Renting is underated!

PP

[Warwickshire Lad]

Although I didn't enter into the purchase blindly it was just the realisation that I was paying out all this money for a tiny, poorly built flat that made me think I must get out of here! To be honest I have never looked back. Renting is underated!

Welcome, Posh Plumber.

[ninjacat]

Hi all, like others I have been lurking on the forum for a year - I can't tell you how much sustenance I have gained from reading HPC posters' contributions. My partner and I bought a property at the top of the market in 1990 which was the biggest mistake we ever made. The property was devalued by more than half by 1992 and we couldn't move because the banks and mortgage providers treated us as if we were pariahs and did not want to know. We clung on for another 4 years before the property was eventually repossessed (long story) and our lives shattered. We are now in our 40's with three children age 14, 12 and 10. Imagine! More than a decade of our lives was consumed by trying to survive the horrors of negative equity, repossession and bailiffs! I am concerned that there are quite a few people who are going to find themselves in exactly the same position that it has taken us over a decade to extricate ourselves from.

[Speruncular]

Hi I have just joined - what a great site! I guess we all have a vested interest in seeing house prices drop and for a whole variety of reasons. I haven't noticed much about new homes here. As a former estate agent (I've had the treatment and it's all OK now) it is my opinion that the overall market is balancing at the moment - but local fluctuations are obscured by the averages. The planned level of new home construction will see some steep house price drops in areas designated for substantial development as new home builders offer part exchanges in order to stimulate the market. On the other hand there is an increased demand for accomodation, and looking very long term, we may have to revise our expectation of first time purchasers having a 'right' to be able to afford property in some areas.

[teddyboy]

Hi all, like others I have been lurking on the forum for a year - I can't tell you how much sustenance I have gained from reading HPC posters' contributions. My partner and I bought a property at the top of the market in 1990 which was the biggest mistake we ever made. The property was devalued by more than half by 1992 and we couldn't move because the banks and mortgage providers treated us as if we were pariahs and did not want to know. We clung on for another 4 years before the property was eventually repossessed (long story) and our lives shattered. We are now in our 40's with three children age 14, 12 and 10. Imagine! More than a decade of our lives was consumed by trying to survive the horrors of negative equity, repossession and bailiffs! I am concerned that there are quite a few people who are going to find themselves in exactly the same position that it has taken us over a decade to extricate ourselves from.

Sorry to hear that your learnt the hard way 'ninja' but its good that people like yourself contribute to this site. You have LIVED through NE and have the SCARS to prove it. We are seen as Doom-mongers when in reality we are actually 'saviours'. God starting to sound like a cult now (phew good job I typed that correct!

You dont say what your status is at the moment? Are you renting? Also can you post on the main forum your experience of repossession. Not the whole story (use different names etc) but just what it is like. How it made you feel. What affect it is having on you now etc. This is all relevant stuff. Obviously, I understand if you dont want to bring up the past but I think it would be a great contribution to the site to warn other of the DANGERS or Negative Equity.

Welcome aboard!

TB

Ninja - if you could fill in your details stating location and status it helps when you make postings. IE If you put local estate egent says market has popped. If we see your from Kent then we dont have to post.

WHERE!!! WHERE????

Hi I have just joined - what a great site! I guess we all have a vested interest in seeing house prices drop and for a whole variety of reasons. I haven't noticed much about new homes here. As a former estate agent (I've had the treatment and it's all OK now) it is my opinion that the overall market is balancing at the moment - but local fluctuations are obscured by the averages. The planned level of new home construction will see some steep house price drops in areas designated for substantial development as new home builders offer part exchanges in order to stimulate the market. On the other hand there is an increased demand for accomodation, and looking very long term, we may have to revise our expectation of first time purchasers having a 'right' to be able to afford property in some areas.

Nice to see another EX-EA on the board. Your contributions are invaluable. Father Fred is ex-EA and he brings a hell of a lot of knowledge. Your balanced view is fine, you dont have to be BEAR to discuss on this forum (it does help though )

With reference to the averages and new builds etc I agree with you. I think the new builds, or LUXURY APARTMENTS have skewed prices by a MASSIVE amount. According to data from the land registry flats in my local are of L17 (Liverpool) have gone up 700% since 2000 This massivle skews the data and also forces the terraces and semis to go up in tandem.

My strong belief is that all these flats/apartments will crash big time and the other will just follow in tandem. NEW BUILDS that are FAMILY HOMES might take a bit of a beating also.

Welcome aboard!

TB

Could you fill in your details also for the reason above?

Cheers

Edited May 3, 2006 by teddyboy

[Susieq2]

I came across HPC quite by accident but I believe we have a data source for Spanish property prices that other forum members might not be aware of. I'll try and make this non-adverty but I am referring to a web site of which I am one of the owners (just so you know).

Kyero.com is the largest Spanish property portal (in English) and we've been collecting advertised property price data for just over a year now. We publish these stats in two places - when you view a property you can see comparative prices in the top RHS of the page. Also, if you click on the Price Guide tab at the top you can download complete pdf versions of the stats we collect and update each month.

How are they calculated? We take a snapshot of all advertised property prices on the first day of each month and store them separately from the property advert itself - that way we can track how an individual property changes in price over time. With 70,000 properties advertised by 400 estate agents, this collection of data is one of the largest available.

We strip out property types that are not representative of the market in general. For example, commercial and garages are excluded from any calculation of average property price. For a similar reason, only properties that have between 1 and 5 bedrooms are included in the calculation.

Finally, we calculate average (median) property prices broken down by town, province and number of bedrooms and graph each of these over time compared to the province and national averages.

Averages are only useful when you know their limitations and these are the main ones for this data source. Prices are 'as advertised': actual sales prices will almost certainly differ. The two, most popular provinces of Malaga and Alicante (Costa del Sol and Costa Blanca), have a significant effect on the national averages because, between them, they represent almost 70% of the properties evaluated. A

small number of properties in some locations means that the prices are less likely to represent the 'actual' average in these locations.

The main criticism we've had over these stats is that classifying by number of bedrooms is arbitrary and an average price per square metre would be more useful (something we're addressing at the moment).

Having said all that - I believe that these average price calculations are the most comprehensive and accurate available and a useful gauge of property price movement throughout Spain. Official sales figures are often skewed in Spain because, until recently, the officially declared price would almost always differ from the 'actual' purchase price as sellers preferred a cash transaction to minimise their tax bill.

Personally, the most interesting product of these guides is the trend graphs. The show that, on a national level, property prices have not increased significantly over the past 12 months. The same is true in most provinces although there are 'pockets' of price increases - mostly in inland and 'less-developed' locations.

[Guest Winners and Losers]

Hi all, like others I have been lurking on the forum for a year - I can't tell you how much sustenance I have gained from reading HPC posters' contributions. My partner and I bought a property at the top of the market in 1990 which was the biggest mistake we ever made. The property was devalued by more than half by 1992 and we couldn't move because the banks and mortgage providers treated us as if we were pariahs and did not want to know. We clung on for another 4 years before the property was eventually repossessed (long story) and our lives shattered. We are now in our 40's with three children age 14, 12 and 10. Imagine! More than a decade of our lives was consumed by trying to survive the horrors of negative equity, repossession and bailiffs! I am concerned that there are quite a few people who are going to find themselves in exactly the same position that it has taken us over a decade to extricate ourselves from.

Hi ninjacat

I don't think people realise what a big impact it has on your life until it happens to you. I bought a property in London in 1996 (completely oblivious to market conditions at the time I might add). The vendor who bought in 1988/89 was STILL in negative equity at the end of 1996. Nearly 10 YEARS on. I'm finding it very interesting the way people are talking on this site that it won't happen here again, they are getting as bad as the sheeple! Anyway, welcome. I'm sure you will be able to make a valuable contribution through your experience.

[perplex]

I'm a 19 year old student and live in the South East of England. I have been reading this forum for a few hours straight and find it very interesting to read the various threads.

Well anyway, I was just wondering if there's other people that are really loving the housing market right now? My family currently have 7 properties and the values have sky rocketed since the boom around 1997 (when we started buying). My parents don't even work and just manage the buy-to-letted properties which is easy "work" We live in a very nice four bedroom detached house with a large drive (10+ car place) and a fairly big garden and are planning an extension this summer or autumn.

We had 5 properties in this city in the South East but this year we bought 2 properties in Surrey, Greater London where we found a very good place for investing/buy-to-let. As there's a university close by there's incredible demand for rented accomodation for students and sometimes young professionals. Each property leaves a nice amount left over so we'll hopefully buy more here or invest elsewhere.

Finally, I just want to say how incredibly well we've done and anyone can do it. All you have to do is buy-buy-buy in well thought out locations.

Good Luck

[Jason]

I'm a 19 year old student and live in the South East of England. I have been reading this forum for a few hours straight and find it very interesting to read the various threads.

Well anyway, I was just wondering if there's other people that are really loving the housing market right now? My family currently have 7 properties and the values have sky rocketed since the boom around 1997 (when we started buying). My parents don't even work and just manage the buy-to-letted properties which is easy "work" We live in a very nice four bedroom detached house with a large drive (10+ car place) and a fairly big garden and are planning an extension this summer or autumn.

We had 5 properties in this city in the South East but this year we bought 2 properties in Surrey, Greater London where we found a very good place for investing/buy-to-let. As there's a university close by there's incredible demand for rented accomodation for students and sometimes young professionals. Each property leaves a nice amount left over so we'll hopefully buy more here or invest elsewhere.

Finally, I just want to say how incredibly well we've done and anyone can do it. All you have to do is buy-buy-buy in well thought out locations.

Good Luck

Does this warrant a reponse? I dunno, but you are a twit.

How are you going to afford a place without help from mummy and daddy?

[Guest Winners and Losers]

[quote name='perplex' date='May 9 2006, 07:09 PM' post='371544'

Well anyway, I was just wondering if there's other people that are really loving the housing market right now?

NO, awooga, go away.

[Ferret]

Does this warrant a reponse? I dunno, but you are a twit.

How are you going to afford a place without help from mummy and daddy?

Well I bet mummy and daddy are paying for their little soldier to go to University with a monthly allowance.

I hope he appreciates what they are doing for him until the day he gets his inheritance and becomes self sufficient.

[wsn03]

Hi

New to site. Economics is a main interest of mine, and house prices around the world defy reality. I was in a share club during the dot com era, and told them to sell all; they decided to treat me as stupid - 2 weeks later the market crashed.

I argued a recession would come back in 88, I remember the way I was treated then by friends and family.

I am a big believer in both the hurd mentality and the stupidity of people. I follow 1 golden rule - when everybody's talking about it its already too late.

I entered the property market in 95, and only wanted a place to live. I traded up in 2005, just as prices in my area began to tumble; moved to an area that is scarce and wealthy - the gap between my new house and the old one has grown a lot since.

Intend to buy some rental appartments one day for pension income (not capital growth), but only following a substantial correction. Appartments for younger transient populations only, do not believe houses should be the preserve of a greedy BTL generation of landlords, living in the fantasy that money comes from doing nothing.

Edited May 10, 2006 by wsn03

[wsn03]

I'm a 19 year old student and live in the South East of England. I have been reading this forum for a few hours straight and find it very interesting to read the various threads.

Well anyway, I was just wondering if there's other people that are really loving the housing market right now? My family currently have 7 properties and the values have sky rocketed since the boom around 1997 (when we started buying). My parents don't even work and just manage the buy-to-letted properties which is easy "work" We live in a very nice four bedroom detached house with a large drive (10+ car place) and a fairly big garden and are planning an extension this summer or autumn.

We had 5 properties in this city in the South East but this year we bought 2 properties in Surrey, Greater London where we found a very good place for investing/buy-to-let. As there's a university close by there's incredible demand for rented accomodation for students and sometimes young professionals. Each property leaves a nice amount left over so we'll hopefully buy more here or invest elsewhere.

Finally, I just want to say how incredibly well we've done and anyone can do it. All you have to do is buy-buy-buy in well thought out locations.

Good Luck

I went to a very expensive school filled with kids like you.

In your 20s you'll see mum and dads nest egg fall, dad will have to get a job.

In your 30s you'll continue to believe things will recover.

By your 40s you'll realise they wont.

The problem you'll have through most of your life will be an inability to do things for yourself. Bragging only highlights this. I had a wealthy mum and dad too, I refused to take a single penny from either of them, went through much struggle, and came out successfully the other side. The fact that my inheritence isnt the same it was no longer matters, I learned to fend for myself - something you wont learn until its too late.

Twit is correct, but thats probably not entirely your fault.

NB: Most of the 'rich' kids I was at school with now have to work for a living, mum and dad didnt managed to hold onto their wealth. A rude awakening beckons. If a spouse dosent take it from you, economics probably will.

[popeye doyle]

Hello - have been lurking for the best part of six months, after having chanced on the site by accident and I'm so glad I did. This time last year I didn't know inflation from deflation - carry trade from carrier bag and hadn't the first idea about mining stocks and gold. It's been an education if nothing else.

I'm just into my early 30's living in Bristol renting with a friend who bought in 01 and watched his house nearly double in value in the last five years . I bought myself in that time but had to sell for personal reasons in 03 and to claw back all the debt I'd accrued in my 20's so essentially I started from zero again.

My friends are between their late 20's and late 30's - some who've made it, and done really well for themselves, some with large debts, no place to own, but good jobs and some like me, who have done boom and bust and are trying to find our way to a bit of stability.

I'm amazed at the real and tangible belief people have that things are OK, and how this is portrayed in the media, newspapes especially, and the sheer greed, ramping done to ensure that people feel it's safe and OK to borrow more and more against assets that are subject to the same market forces as everything else :angry: . All you've got to do is look at the facts and surely there's going to be a recession and a half around the corner. But everyones' happy, yes, people have noticed prices have gone up a bit, but really no-one bats an eyelid. It's like people are sleepwalking into disaster. I don't believe we'll have a full on crash and burn scenario - it's going to be a gradual tightening over a number years that will just blindside the majority of people, which will be even more damaging for the country and prosperity - what have we done? I could let this rant carry on, but so many of you have more eloquently expressed what's really going on. So I'll shut up now.

[sheltie1]

Hi

New to site. I'm renting in Stoke-on-Trent. Bought with husband in 2000 & were told by friends & family that we were mad to buy a terraced house at £15000 as it was too cheap and therefore risky!!!!!!!!!! Then when we STR in 2004 were told we were mad again because property only goes up! Sold to a BTL and are renting the same house back.

My own personal view of the housing market is that it's no different to any other market, that it's become overheated due to the belief that prices can only go up, that prices will come down first because of rising interest rates and then crash because people's confidence will be lost.

[Jason]

Hi

New to site. I'm renting in Stoke-on-Trent. Bought with husband in 2000 & were told by friends & family that we were mad to buy a terraced house at £15000 as it was too cheap and therefore risky!!!!!!!!!! Then when we STR in 2004 were told we were mad again because property only goes up! Sold to a BTL and are renting the same house back.

My own personal view of the housing market is that it's no different to any other market, that it's become overheated due to the belief that prices can only go up, that prices will come down first because of rising interest rates and then crash because people's confidence will be lost.

Welcome Sheltie1,

So what sort of yield is your landlord getting? Selling to a landlord and living in the same house is a great idea. You probably didn't have to tell anyone you were even selling...

[sheltie1]

Welcome Sheltie1,

So what sort of yield is your landlord getting? Selling to a landlord and living in the same house is a great idea. You probably didn't have to tell anyone you were even selling...

He gets 7% of the purchase price back per year.

[Guest Bart of Darkness]

Finally, I just want to say how incredibly well we've done and anyone can do it. All you have to do is buy-buy-buy in well thought out locations.

Good Luck

Awoo

Awoo

Awoo

(come on, join in, you know the words)

Awooooooooooo

Awooooooooooo

Awoooga!

That is such a transparent piece of trolling that I normally wouldn't repond to it. It's only that the overall lack of sophistication made me chuckle.

(HINT: Trolls, if you're reading this, please try for a little subtlety, it will be appreciated, I promise)

[Fireball]

Hello to all!

I'm 31, have a wife and an 18 month old daughter.

Currently on a £27K salary and renting a room in a shared house for £350/month. This is only because my wife is currently in Thailand trying to get her mushroom farm going in order build a nice income out there and eventually buy a house in either the UK or Thailand. A 2 bedroom large "western-style" bungalow out there will cost you below £5000 to build.

We were in a tiny 2 bed house in Crawley 7 months ago paying £650/month just for rent and going nowhere as my salary isnt enough plus I have £12000 debts. My take home pay is £1550/month. After paying rates, loans and utilities there isnt much left over for housekeeping let alone saving.

Our goal currently is to get her business performing well and bringing in £1000/month profit then saving up for either a house here or over there or both as we have family in both countries.

My opinion of the house prices in the UK is that it definately is stupidly out of control, there are many selfish materialists out there making the problem worse and hope that the market corrects itself soon.

Regards

James

[Mags]

I'm a 19 year old student and live in the South East of England. I have been reading this forum for a few hours straight and find it very interesting to read the various threads.

Well anyway, I was just wondering if there's other people that are really loving the housing market right now? My family currently have 7 properties and the values have sky rocketed since the boom around 1997 (when we started buying). My parents don't even work and just manage the buy-to-letted properties which is easy "work" We live in a very nice four bedroom detached house with a large drive (10+ car place) and a fairly big garden and are planning an extension this summer or autumn.

We had 5 properties in this city in the South East but this year we bought 2 properties in Surrey, Greater London where we found a very good place for investing/buy-to-let. As there's a university close by there's incredible demand for rented accomodation for students and sometimes young professionals. Each property leaves a nice amount left over so we'll hopefully buy more here or invest elsewhere.

Finally, I just want to say how incredibly well we've done and anyone can do it. All you have to do is buy-buy-buy in well thought out locations.

Good Luck

What's this 'we'??

How about standing on your own two feet? You'll be cursing mummy and daddy when you try that!

[jaay]

ive been browsing this site for about the last 6 months - it has certaintly made me think, although i wouldnt be confident enough to take a firm view either way re a potential crash.

one thing i am sure of is that current house prices have reached a ridiculous level.

i am 25 - working and living in london and could afford to buy with reasonable comfort - however, i refuse to pay the over-inflated prices that we are currently seeing. i strongly disagree with those who say that ftbs such as myself are expecting too much: i work extremely hard for a fairly decent wage and think that it is reasonable to aim higher than a one bed flat in an ex-la block. [it would be interesting to see a comparison of owners salaries v. house value for those who have been lucky enough to enjoy the recent rises in property value over the last 10 years - many wouldnt stand a chance in todays climate]

i suppose that i am siding with the bears in that i agree that it doesnt seem like the best time to buy - i dont necessarily envisage a crash but, to be honest, if prices stay consistently high i would rather just rent and enjoy a higher quality of living [whilst keeping some cash in reserve just in case!]

like many, i am struggling to hide my bitterness regarding the ease with which a lot of 'investors' have got 'rich' simply by virtue of being alive during a certain period. this said, i am sure most people here would be more than happy to do the same in the future should a crash occur.

maybe i am cutting off my nose to spite my face.