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29929BlackTuesday

Save The Banks! Don't We Have To?

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I mean - the BOE are doing the right thing... aren't they? If they go down - I mean REALLY go down then a HPC will be like winning the lottery in Zimbabwe.

We want our cake and at least to have a slice of it and for this to happen we want a correction in house prices due to lending reverting to proper levels and for banks to survive, albeit chastened.

Am I right?

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I think they do need to be saved, but they have to be punished at the same time to ensure this would never happen again.

I'm not entirely sure how this could be done though; I'm thinking "We'll give you a few pounds to keep yourselves afloat on the condition that government auditors have access to your books, leading to tighter regulations on how you work." I dunno.. that probably wouldn't work.

But something along those lines.

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When will people learn, its not the banks its the Government.

The Government have been fanning the flames of House Price Inflation and financial ruin by throwing cheap money to the banks prompting to lend it, because that is their business.

If you owned a hairdressers and the Government sent 5,000 people to your shop each day would you turn them away ?

The banks are in the lending business, and the Government have been throwing taxpayers money to them to lend to the taxpayer.

If this Government had not created the money in such massive quantities we would not be in this position today.

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When will people learn, its not the banks its the Government.

The Government have been fanning the flames of House Price Inflation and financial ruin by throwing cheap money to the banks prompting to lend it, because that is their business.

If you owned a hairdressers and the Government sent 5,000 people to your shop each day would you turn them away ?

The banks are in the lending business, and the Government have been throwing taxpayers money to them to lend to the taxpayer.

If this Government had not created the money in such massive quantities we would not be in this position today.

They are both at fall! Wake up!

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Guest vicmac64

Not all of them, and if we do then the fraudsters have got to go to jail and lose all their personal assets.

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Guest vicmac64
I think they do need to be saved, but they have to be punished at the same time to ensure this would never happen again.

I'm not entirely sure how this could be done though; I'm thinking "We'll give you a few pounds to keep yourselves afloat on the condition that government auditors have access to your books, leading to tighter regulations on how you work." I dunno.. that probably wouldn't work.

But something along those lines.

The only way to make sure this does not happen again is to penalise them personally. By this I mean all personal assets gained during reckless lending should be seized from them - on a personal basis - (properties, helicopters, jets, money, stocks - hit them where it hurts). Court action should also be taken against any found to be acting against the interests of the economy and people of the United Kingdom.

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Banking in it's corrupt, greed driven, self obsessed manner has created this mess, the Government is as corrupt to deregulate but give bankers a free reign and their own greed will destroy all manner of systems.

When will people learn, its not the banks its the Government.

The Government have been fanning the flames of House Price Inflation and financial ruin by throwing cheap money to the banks prompting to lend it, because that is their business.

If you owned a hairdressers and the Government sent 5,000 people to your shop each day would you turn them away ?

The banks are in the lending business, and the Government have been throwing taxpayers money to them to lend to the taxpayer.

If this Government had not created the money in such massive quantities we would not be in this position today.

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The only way to make sure this does not happen again is to penalise them personally. By this I mean all personal assets gained during reckless lending should be seized from them - on a personal basis - (properties, helicopters, jets, money, stocks - hit them where it hurts). Court action should also be taken against any found to be acting against the interests of the economy and people of the United Kingdom.

Hmm that sounds a bit extreme, but necessarily so.

What's galling is that, although the banks are pleading poverty, you can be guaranteed that higher management and executive level posts will still be getting their bumper bonuses and perks.

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I mean - the BOE are doing the right thing... aren't they? If they go down - I mean REALLY go down then a HPC will be like winning the lottery in Zimbabwe.

We want our cake and at least to have a slice of it and for this to happen we want a correction in house prices due to lending reverting to proper levels and for banks to survive, albeit chastened.

Am I right?

No.

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Yes, unfortunately, we do have to.

Any one who has even the slightest notion of what a full blown depression means should not wish for it. Those on here who seem to positively wish for one are really quite mad or naive.

The banks always create the mess and the populace always pays the price. But to willingly let the banks fall would be like cheering on the iceberg as you approach it stood on Titanic's deck.

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The financial sector paid out bonuses to the equivalent value of Vietnams GDP. Letting them fail would be a super road to self regulation. Lets not let them all fail. Let one or two of the big ones fail, and then that should be sufficient.

It will cost us all more to save them in the longrun, through high inflation and higher longterm interest rates which will cause a housing slump anyway. Banks have been going bankrupt since the beginning of time, recessions are not a bad thing. However it seems that for political reasons and the feel good factor from this massive credit expansion, and illusion of wealth, that recessions are'nt allowed anymore. Recessions mean a contraction in money supply not an increase in money printing. This clears the balance sheet, people cut back and the savings rate goes up, then a year or 2 down the road growth will start in an orderly way. Look at the savings rate now.

Debt is so high now, and we are trying to cure it with more debt and higher inflation MEANING higher interest rates. So if people cant service that debt now, what chance do they have with interest rates at 8-9%...?

letting them fail will be painful in the short to medium term, but the alternative will be worse in the long run and a more protracted and worse recession/depression

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Yes, unfortunately, we do have to.

Any one who has even the slightest notion of what a full blown depression means should not wish for it. Those on here who seem to positively wish for one are really quite mad or naive.

The banks always create the mess and the populace always pays the price. But to willingly let the banks fall would be like cheering on the iceberg as you approach it stood on Titanic's deck.

They will create a worse depression in the longrun by their actions.

In a few years time measure your pound against gold,oil JPY, AUD, Chinese Yuan, asian currencies in general, basic food stuff....when your money has lost its purchasing power, and interest rates are 12-14% and no one can borrow money at this rate and a severe slump happens anyway...

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The financial sector paid out bonuses to the equivalent value of Vietnams GDP. Letting them fail would be a super road to self regulation. Lets not let them all fail. Let one or two of the big ones fail, and then that should be sufficient.

I am starting to see banks as a utility model. This means tight regulation with controlled profitability. I also believe it is now clear that many of banking financial results over the past few years have been in reality false. They may say we made x from fee income etc, but it is clear they have been creating and holding assets that are not worth what they said they were. Effectively a lot of people have got paid bonuses on profits that never existed, this is close to being a fraud or negligence against the bank itself and its shareholders.

Personally I feel many of the bankers should have their personal assets stripped and returned to the bank that paid them. This siutation has arisen due to the silly renumeration policies put in place. Wall St is obsessed with quarterly reporting, and frankly commissions and bonuses are driven on similarly short time scales. Frankly, that is not how you build a sustainable and long term business. If short term decisions are allowed to trump long term stability then that is not creating shareholder value, but destroying it. The banks seem to have been hijacked by a bunch of crooks are charlottens and these people need to be replaced and humiliated in the courts.

Edited by mikelivingstone

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They will create a worse depression in the longrun by their actions.

In a few years time measure your pound against gold,oil JPY, AUD, Chinese Yuan, asian currencies in general, basic food stuff....when your money has lost its purchasing power, and interest rates are 12-14% and no one can borrow money at this rate and a severe slump happens anyway...

There is no easy solution. If anyone has done some research into the Great Depression - where the Fed stood by - they will see the catastrophic results.

Truth is - no one really knows the answer. Not even HPCers.

All I am sure of is that if we get a depression noone will give a fook about house prices because we will all be trying too hard to survive.

It seems that some of the more learned members of this forum have some kind of flame proof form of income. Could they enlighten me so I can get into it before the bomb shell.

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This is precisely the scenario I envisage, I fear we have gone too long without pulling the banks reigns a recession should have happened in 2001 the more we put this off the worse the potential consequences become and now I fear there is no way out, depression is looking inevitable sooner or later.

They will create a worse depression in the longrun by their actions.

In a few years time measure your pound against gold,oil JPY, AUD, Chinese Yuan, asian currencies in general, basic food stuff....when your money has lost its purchasing power, and interest rates are 12-14% and no one can borrow money at this rate and a severe slump happens anyway...

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Dstars - good to hear from you - a few pearls of wisdom and elaboration would be much appreciated!!

This is a regulatory failure. A regulatory failure. That is where the story is. That is where the truth is.

Yesterday's confirmation that the Bank of England is going to follow Bernanke's lead and support the banking system to the end means we will see mirages containing recovery.

But we cannot recover until the regulations are fixed and the banking system is cut loose.

Pumping yet more liquidity will make the eventual outcome, and the road to it, even worse.

By the way, the editors of Newsnight should be working at the Beano if they think their 'rogue trader' story makes sense.

Indeed,'they' are not doing the 'right thing' if the right thing is that which has a chance of fixing things.

They are small boys playing with their winkies while the rest of us get to suffer.

The world seemed to think that nationalizing Northern Rock was inevitable, now the world thinks that how fast we copy Bernanke is the only issue.

This is insanity.

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I am starting to see banks as a utility model. This means tight regulation with controlled profitability. I also believe it is now clear that many of banking financial results over the past few years have been in reality false. They may say we made x from fee income etc, but it is clear they have been creating and holding assets that are not worth what they said they were. Effectively a lot of people have got paid bonuses on profits that never existed, this is close to being a fraud or negligence against the bank itself and its shareholders.

Personally I feel many of the bankers should have their personal assets stripped and returned to the bank that paid them. This siutation has arisen due to the silly renumeration policies put in place. Wall St is obsessed with quarterly reporting, and frankly commissions and bonuses are driven on similarly short time scales. Frankly that is not how you build a sustainable and long term business. If short term decisions, are allowed to trump long term stability then that is not creating shareholder value, but destroying. Basically the banks seem to have been hijacked by a bunch of crooks are charlottens and these people need to be replaced.

The Cbs are now getting a MUCH bigger problem than a mre credit crunch.

Banks sole means of survival is a CONFIDENCE that they are prudent and that they can pay on demand.

They MUST acheive this because they cant pay everybody on demand, indeed, they could only pay a fraction of demand if everybody wanted paying.

The press are starting to bang on about this. The clamour is getting louder. Sheeple are starting to look up from their grazing and wondering about the wolves in the next field.

Soon, discussing these issues will be banned or censored.

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To be honest, I dont mind admitting it, I am genuinely afraid.

I know I have enough savings to pay off my mortgage or at least survive 3-4 years if need be - which puts me in a better position than most, but the thought of having no work long term scares me. I was a victim of the early 90's recession (Im in construction consulting) and that was awful. Most people who have never experienced redundancy cannot comprehend the financial and emotional damage it causes.

No matter how pudent you are - if your a family man and you lose you job through no fault of your own, then you are in a desperate situation.

It really is terrible.

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No matter how pudent you are - if your a family man and you lose you job through no fault of your own, then you are in a desperate situation.

It really is terrible.

Prudence is being penalized. Recklessness, greed, fraud, are being rewarded.

Thank goodness I got out of the UK. I think having to pay, through taxes, for this might have made my head spin around.

My advice would be to borrow well above your means, buy a big house and a nice car. Then go on the dole.

There is way too much pressure on the taxpayer now.

The only policy move that would make sense (outside of actually regulating the banking system) would be tax cuts. But that ain't gonna happen.

The world financial system is not going to break down, but the UK is. And people such as yourself get to pay for the fixing.

Edited by dstars

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  • 294 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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