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Ebbsfleet Worth A Look?

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Hi,

I'm thinking of moving out of London, and one of the areas I'm considering for a move is Ebbsfleet. It is near Bluewater, currently about 50 minutes from London by train, with a high speed service due around end of 2009, which will bring journey times down to 10 mins to Stratford, and 17mins to Kings Cross. Which would make it good for me to get to work.

I'm looking for a 4/5 bed house, preferrably something nice and modern. There are plenty of new developments around the area. Waterstone Park, Ingress Park and now Springhead Park are full of new build houses. The developers (obviously) have sang the praises about the area. I've driven around and can see the area definitely has potential.

One thing I'm a bit concerned about it that from what I can see, there isn't really much in the way of a community or high street. Also, what are local services like? Doctors, schools etc? - I can see that schools are around national average on paper, but then how much does that mean? - I don't have kids, (but then how can you sell a 4 bed house in 5 years time if it's not near good schools? and also who knows my situation in 5 years too ;) )

If I move, I'm looking to stay for at least 5 years, so by then the house crash should be over, and the new transport should be up and running and hopefully can sell. The issue is, is it going to be a nice place to live in the meantime??

I quite like the style of some of the new builds in waterstone park, though I do question whether 400k is maybe a bit steep for a 4 bed in the area (I'm sure they will budge on price quite a bit though in this climate), also bit worried about it being a bit far from Ebbsfleet and perhaps flooding risk in the area...

I was hoping someone with some local experience could perhaps help bring some views of the area. Any opinions would be most welcome, e.g. crime, gp's, schools, community etc?

As I hope you guys are aware, it's quite a big step to move to a new area and often requires a bit of a leap of faith.

Thanks in advance.

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I think you have posted in the wrong forum!

The new high speed link is going to make London more accessible and within easy commuter distance rather than a trudge into London Bridge. Relatively house prices should improve. There are grammar schools in Kent too.

On the minus side, they are going to build 30,000 new properties in the area to absorb London overspill which will increase supply and flooding is a risk.

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I think you have posted in the wrong forum!

The new high speed link is going to make London more accessible and within easy commuter distance rather than a trudge into London Bridge. Relatively house prices should improve. There are grammar schools in Kent too.

On the minus side, they are going to build 30,000 new properties in the area to absorb London overspill which will increase supply and flooding is a risk.

London would be a great palce to live, if it wasn't for the people that want to live there.... ;)

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The local hospital is bursting at the seams because they built it smaller than the hospitals it replaced.

The grammar schools in Dartford are very good but there is strong competition for places.

Flooding may well be an issue. Buy only on hills not on the floodplain, which is extensive.

Check what the land was used for before you buy. This is and old industrial and quarrying area and old quarries have been extensively tipped, some were methane producing until recently.

The roads are already at capacity and the government wants another 30,000 houses built here.

You are right about Ebbsfleet, an invented name by the way, being up and coming but it is coming from nowhere and how far up it will go is a matter of speculation.

Dont buy new. The new stuff sells at a stupid premium. Its a very varied area. Dont just look at the new estates. Have a look at the places with good bus connections to the new station.

All the best

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It's the industrial **** end of Kent - trust me! It's bang next door to Gravesend and that lives up to it's name.

I shall be interested in the views of other Kentish men/Men of Kent..

We did look a buying a btl shoebox last year near the station but praise de lord we didn't :P

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The local hospital is bursting at the seams because they built it smaller than the hospitals it replaced.

The grammar schools in Dartford are very good but there is strong competition for places.

Flooding may well be an issue. Buy only on hills not on the floodplain, which is extensive.

Check what the land was used for before you buy. This is and old industrial and quarrying area and old quarries have been extensively tipped, some were methane producing until recently.

The roads are already at capacity and the government wants another 30,000 houses built here.

You are right about Ebbsfleet, an invented name by the way, being up and coming but it is coming from nowhere and how far up it will go is a matter of speculation.

Dont buy new. The new stuff sells at a stupid premium. Its a very varied area. Dont just look at the new estates. Have a look at the places with good bus connections to the new station.

All the best

AS I said the buttock end of Kent :lol: (why is a rse censored?!)

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Ashford was full of promise when the Eurostar terminal opened there, but it's still a dump even now.

[opens can of worms]

I suppose Ebbsfleet will also attract the likes of the Fergus and Judith Wilson.

[/loses lid]

Edit: Doffs cap to Crashman.

Edited by Cold Snail

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Only someone with a fondness for living in a badly-built house (or a luxury executive condom-inium), built in an exhausted quarry/cement works and sandwiched between powerstations, docks and other ugly, dirty heavy industry (although at least the bits which are now closed are not contributing to the dirt anymore) would consider buying in this area. That or someone with family links to the area.

You have to go a long way to find somewhere LESS salubrious than this area (an industrial district in a war zone?).

I hope, along with the other contributors to this post, I have told you all you need to know about this foolhardy idea.

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Only someone with a fondness for living in a badly-built house (or a luxury executive condom-inium), built in an exhausted quarry/cement works and sandwiched between powerstations, docks and other ugly, dirty heavy industry (although at least the bits which are now closed are not contributing to the dirt anymore) would consider buying in this area. That or someone with family links to the area.

You have to go a long way to find somewhere LESS salubrious than this area (an industrial district in a war zone?).

I hope, along with the other contributors to this post, I have told you all you need to know about this foolhardy idea.

Now I see why Surrey is more expensive ;)

Thanks to everyone for their opinions...

But does anyone think this place will turn around in five years? (Though I'm strongly guessing from what people here are saying... probably not! :unsure: )

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The local hospital is bursting at the seams because they built it smaller than the hospitals it replaced.

The grammar schools in Dartford are very good but there is strong competition for places.

Flooding may well be an issue. Buy only on hills not on the floodplain, which is extensive.

Check what the land was used for before you buy. This is and old industrial and quarrying area and old quarries have been extensively tipped, some were methane producing until recently.

The roads are already at capacity and the government wants another 30,000 houses built here.

You are right about Ebbsfleet, an invented name by the way, being up and coming but it is coming from nowhere and how far up it will go is a matter of speculation.

Dont buy new. The new stuff sells at a stupid premium. Its a very varied area. Dont just look at the new estates. Have a look at the places with good bus connections to the new station.

All the best

Thanks, this sounds like if to proceed at all, there are many things to be cautious of! - Incidentally, looked at Park 25 in Redhill, and the developers failed to mention that it's right next to a methane emitting landfill site(!) Wouldn't have minded living around that area too if it weren't for the smell! So definitely will be researching hard...!

Also sounds like the local community and services in Kent are in no position to cope for all these extra people.. :blink:

Whatever happened to government planning? :P

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Thanks, this sounds like if to proceed at all, there are many things to be cautious of! - Incidentally, looked at Park 25 in Redhill, and the developers failed to mention that it's right next to a methane emitting landfill site(!) Wouldn't have minded living around that area too if it weren't for the smell! So definitely will be researching hard...!

Also sounds like the local community and services in Kent are in no position to cope for all these extra people.. :blink:

Whatever happened to government planning? :P

Park 25 - no that really *is* a soul-less place. I used to pass it on the train every day - it's just ghastly, tiny new build house after new build house - it is I'm pretty sure going this sort of place are going to be the new council-estates of the 2000's - just horrid. What's more they're trying to fit more people into the same amount of infrastructure - the trains from Redhill into London have become horrendously over-crowded in the past 24 months alone. I've moved on - I just couldn't stand having to be at the carpark by 7AM in order to get a parking place - let alone a seat...

There are some very nice bits of Redhill - I just don't understand why they can't build *nice* new build houses instead!

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I just don't understand why they can't build *nice* new build houses instead!

Interesting question, this one, for which I wonder if any of our posters know the answer.

For instance, talking to the EA selling a new-build local estate a couple of years back, I asked why all modern estates seem so shoe-horned: Why do you now get 3 big houses shoe-horned into a corner where they would have once built one or two, with shared frontage/parking less than a typical 70's or earlier house in the same area, and surrounded by flats/terraces also with insufficient parking which will only compound the problem. It cant just be about maximising returns, as anyone sane takes one look at the frontage and built-in parking problems of the high-end houses and walks away, devaluing the property. She claimed it was a planning requirement, but how true do you think this is likely to be?

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I feel qualified to speak on this subject, having survived a childhood and adolesence in Strood, Kent - the English equivalent of Cleveland, Ohio.

The Southeren shore of the Thames Estuary Corridor is still pretty post-industrial at present - i.e. there are a lot of abandoned buildings ranging from Napoleonic forts to derelict filing stations. Not even Krusty could ramp this desolate hole and unless David Lynch is planning a sequel to Ereaserhead and needs a good location, there is no need for any sane human to visit.

This land is bad karma; they knocked down the old Darenth mental hospital and threw up a load of new builds - like those 80's horror films when the families discover they're living on top of old Injun burial grounds.

This picture is beginning to change as developers move in and sh*t rabbit hutches all over the place. Ironically they used to moore the Prison Hulks around here - so no change in use then. There is no infrastucture to speak of (unless you urgently need to buy £150 Diesel in which case you can pop to Bluewater) and as for 'Ebbsfleet' (a marketing w*nker rebranding of Greenhythe), the station will shut within the decade just like Ashford 'International'.

Local sites:

The slip road where Kennith Noye shivved Road Rager Stephen Cameron in front of his girlfriend in '96.

The statue of syphilitic princess Pocahontas in Gravesend.

Err.. the quarry where the bus went over the cliff un that Young Ones episode

Oh, it gets visciously cold when the winds scream in from the North Sea.

And the term ‘Chav’ is widely believed to have originated here (we used it in the early ‘80’s as a generic often affectionate term for any male person)

I pop back to see my mum and pops and notice that they've started putting housing estates actually IN the old chalk quarries.... WTF??

Basically it's a sh*thole and someone is trying to scam you into living there. :lol:

North of the A2 is a sound rule (just avoid Cuxton as well though)

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In Kent the rules are simple. Don't live anywhere north of the A2/M2.

I have said the same on here before, however it extends all the way up to the Blackwall Tunnel, Woolwhich, Plumpstead, Abbey Wood, Thamesmead all of them total shit holes.

In terms of the great train lines, 10 minutes to Kings Cross my ****, as mentioned before the same things were said of Ashford, however nothing has ever been done, you still can't get a domestic train on the CTRL line and it's been open (in some form) for about 3 years. The whole point of the line is to give fast access the continent they won't be messing around putting commuter services on it IMO. That's regardless of the cost of such a service which will no doubt add a significant premium.

In short the area is IMO a total shit hole.

Edit : Just to add don't buy all this great transport links to London either, the train services in South East London are in my opinion very good however they are Dartford services and Ebbsfleet is the wrong side of Dartford, The A2 goes straight into London however that makes it one of the worst roads for Traffic, just listen to the traffic reports for London in the morning the A2 always gets a mention and it ain't about how clear it is.

Edited by gilf

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Avoid like the plague!

I remember friends living in Greenhithe blabbing about how Bluewater was going to transform the area and make it "up and coming" (WTF?).

It doesn't matter how shiny and new the shopping centre or railway station is - It's the same fecking people living in the area!!! Friend of mine had a house in Wheatley Close (I think) a few years ago. Like living in a cement pit and he had horrendous neg equity for years (just like 80's fashions, it comes round again!).

Ebbsfleet is really just Northfleet and NO-ONE wants to live there!

If you can afford it New Barn/Longfield are better areas.

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Interesting question, this one, for which I wonder if any of our posters know the answer.

For instance, talking to the EA selling a new-build local estate a couple of years back, I asked why all modern estates seem so shoe-horned: Why do you now get 3 big houses shoe-horned into a corner where they would have once built one or two, with shared frontage/parking less than a typical 70's or earlier house in the same area, and surrounded by flats/terraces also with insufficient parking which will only compound the problem. It cant just be about maximising returns, as anyone sane takes one look at the frontage and built-in parking problems of the high-end houses and walks away, devaluing the property. She claimed it was a planning requirement, but how true do you think this is likely to be?

One reason, the old elephant in the room that the government wont talk about, population growth in UK especially in the SouthEast ...

1971 - 55million

2005 - 60million

2015 - 65million

2020 - 68million???

Your condemned to a future of 1 & 2 Bed Flats or high density new developments with minimal gardens. There was just more space in the 1930's thru 1970's hence bigger plot sizes ...... :(

Edited by skomer

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Avoid like the plague!

I remember friends living in Greenhithe blabbing about how Bluewater was going to transform the area and make it "up and coming" (WTF?).

It doesn't matter how shiny and new the shopping centre or railway station is - It's the same fecking people living in the area!!! Friend of mine had a house in Wheatley Close (I think) a few years ago. Like living in a cement pit and he had horrendous neg equity for years (just like 80's fashions, it comes round again!).

Ebbsfleet is really just Northfleet and NO-ONE wants to live there!

If you can afford it New Barn/Longfield are better areas.

Hmmm, thanks to everyone who has given advice. Sounds like I best not put my deposit down just yet then. innit?

Looks like I should be concentrating my efforts more around the Surrey area (South Croydon-Sutton-RedHill). Though maybe Orpington as a wildcard?

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