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Property : The Socialist's Prefered Investment

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So we all know how evil equity investors are. They give money to institutions who them force people to work for wages. As if that wasn't a bad enough fate for people, those same people are then supposed to accept redundency without a fight. Thank goodness for trade unions and shop stewards, eh?

Speaking of which, a former shop steward near me is busy adding to his property portfolio. No dirty dividends for him. No sponsoring employment either. Just straight, clean, honest removal of a sizeable chunk of workers wages in rent.

Of course he's not the only socialst in the property game. Just look at the House of Commons register of members interests for Labour MPs. No company shares for them. But plenty of property interests.

And then there's the good ole lefty Beeb employees. Hardly a day will go by w/o them reminding us of the ridiculous dividends the utilities pay out. How can company investors expect returns of ~6% on their investments when customer bills are rising? All of which reminds them, they best up the rent on their latest aquisition if it is ever going to cover the mortgage.

I guess I've laboured the double standards enough here for even the densest lurker to understand the point I'm making: shares are actually a more justifiably leftist investment than property. And yet trad and new lab voters see it as their preferd choice. Why?

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Property : The Socialist's Prefered Investment

I think there's definitely something in that. The humorous response would be that socialists invest in property because it's understandable whereas if they understood finance then they wouldn't be socialists. (Only joshing.)

In truth I think it's just that the coalition of people who brought New Labour to power have just become so complacent, bloated and self-satisfied that they cannot see how out of touch they have become, not least with any principles they might once have believed in.

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I think there's definitely something in that. The humorous response would be that socialists invest in property because it's understandable whereas if they understood finance then they wouldn't be socialists. (Only joshing.)

In truth I think it's just that the coalition of people who brought New Labour to power have just become so complacent, bloated and self-satisfied that they cannot see how out of touch they have become, not least with any principles they might once have believed in.

Don't forget that Alistair Darling owns a flat that he rents out in London.

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First of all I dont think just because someone is a shop steward, trade unionsist or labour MP

it should be naturally assumed they are socialist. There are for example many right of centre shop stewards

who only do the role as they are wanna be managers. Just like the students who get involved in the Labour

party are career politicians and have lttle ideological belief.

Though there is something in what you say, I think it goes back to corrupt labour councillors being in control of

planning persmission and so the opportunity for abuse.

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Though there is something in what you say, I think it goes back to corrupt labour councillors being in control of

planning permission and so the opportunity for abuse.

I know a thing or two about that. ;) You're from Northampton, aren't you?

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Socialism is demonstrated by how one acts, not how one talks. I would argue that the people you mention aren't socialists.

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The humorous response would be that socialists invest in property because it's understandable whereas if they understood finance then they wouldn't be socialists. (

:lol::lol: PMSL!

I think it's probably that stocks and shares, investments etc are all seen as the preserve of the City elite and have a whiff of the old school tie, pinstripes and bowler hats about them - ie, the enemy. They also tend to be more of a full time job - it's unlikely you could be a hedge fund manager AND work in teaching/charities/NGOs/creative professions or the other jobs beloved of the left, but every primary school teacher or local government worker can do a bit of property developing on the side. Property portfolios also have an easy to understand, glossy, new Labour feel about them, they're not 'elitist', it's a sort of 'everybody can be wealthy' fantasy that appeals to left wing progressives.

That said, I'd argue there are very few socialists around anymore. When Labour abolished Clause Four they effectively de-socialised themselves and became a social democratic, left/liberal party. I bet the real old fashioned lefties don't like BTL.

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Guest An Bearin Bui
Someone I know at work refuses the BUPA package due to political/socialism beliefs and yet is a BTL landlord. Odd.

I've come across this type of person as well - all talk about voting Labour, supporting the NHS, sending kids to a comprehensive etc but then thinks that property speculation is perfectly acceptable. These people seem to mainly be 40+, from "working class" backgrounds (although they now have a very well-paid job in the public sector) and are out of touch with the reality of life for working people now who are younger and non-home owning.

There is a really bizarre perception out there that property is the "working man's asset class" whereas stock market investment is only for those with inherited wealth i.e. snobs. Any time I mention share dealing or the stock market at work, people almost look scared like I'm talking about some arcane cult. Yet if you mention the housing market, they're all ears - until you tell them it's crashing :P . This is definitely a peculiarly British phenomenon too - Americans seem to be more comfortable with stock market investment and regard it as a sensible part of an overall investment strategy.

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Have you discussed it with them? How do they attempt to justify it?

Normally I would challenge this sort of behaviour butin this case I thought better of it. The reason being that this same person also attempted to defend the Northern Rock business model during the early part of the meltdown. I am pretty sure that he either has shares in NR or a mortgage with them although it's quite hard to get info like this without seeming to be a nosey sod.

Apart from these faults he is a great guy, very intelligent and probably the best union rep we could hope for.

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Socialism is demonstrated by how one acts, not how one talks. I would argue that the people you mention aren't socialists.

too true.

hence, new lab are not a socialist party.

they have destroyed communities, despite talking them up.

look at the reality of your social positions ?

posting on some site since you cant afford anything worth the massive financial commitments req.

busting a nut to live in chav town.

not any better than thatcher really.

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So we all know how evil equity investors are. They give money to institutions who them force people to work for wages. As if that wasn't a bad enough fate for people, those same people are then supposed to accept redundency without a fight. Thank goodness for trade unions and shop stewards, eh?

Speaking of which, a former shop steward near me is busy adding to his property portfolio. No dirty dividends for him. No sponsoring employment either. Just straight, clean, honest removal of a sizeable chunk of workers wages in rent.

Hypocricy, don't you just love it.

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So we all know how evil equity investors are. They give money to institutions who them force people to work for wages. As if that wasn't a bad enough fate for people, those same people are then supposed to accept redundency without a fight. Thank goodness for trade unions and shop stewards, eh?

Speaking of which, a former shop steward near me is busy adding to his property portfolio. No dirty dividends for him. No sponsoring employment either. Just straight, clean, honest removal of a sizeable chunk of workers wages in rent.

Of course he's not the only socialst in the property game. Just look at the House of Commons register of members interests for Labour MPs. No company shares for them. But plenty of property interests.

And then there's the good ole lefty Beeb employees. Hardly a day will go by w/o them reminding us of the ridiculous dividends the utilities pay out. How can company investors expect returns of ~6% on their investments when customer bills are rising? All of which reminds them, they best up the rent on their latest aquisition if it is ever going to cover the mortgage.

I guess I've laboured the double standards enough here for even the densest lurker to understand the point I'm making: shares are actually a more justifiably leftist investment than property. And yet trad and new lab voters see it as their preferd choice. Why?

It's because lefties usually share two key attributes: laziness and stupidity.

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I have always suspected this link: in particular in Brighton where prices have been soaring since around the time Nu Labwhore got in in 1997. Brighton has much more than its fair share of champagne socialists and bleeding hearts and was, for a long time, the favoured location for their wretched conferences. During conference season, which would represent an invasion if there weren't already so many of them here, it is difficult to avoid grotesque union bosses taking young female aparatchiks to the many dodgy and overpriced restuarants with what lurid intention one can only guess. I remember distinctly on one occasion in Donatello's being unable to avoid the boorish, northern working class tones of one particular 'socialist', twenty years older than his subdued victim, describing in detail his villa in Portugal prior to inviting her to stay there, and being surprised that such a person had invested so wisely. I am no longer surprised with any of this as it is the norm.

I have read many times in the press that Ken Livingstone has a house in Brighton - a logical place, in fact, for a London politician to escape the milieu of the somewhat stressful clamours of the capital city. I often imagine him strolling along the beach whilst his denizens in London try to cope with the latest round of nonsense he has imposed on them. However, I have never been as unfortunate as to actually see him there.

As to how many 'socialists', and in particular 'socialist' politicians have BTL portfolios in Brighton, I have no evidence. However, it is that sort of place; the opportunity was there for conference visitors to witness in the 90's the opportunities the property market was clearly beginning to represent and I have no doubt they did so.

Brighton still has New Labour stamped all over it, even though it is now under Tory control. A combination of outrageous prices (for everything, not just property) and a wall of hype behind which a crumbling reality persists in its depressing effect. The ideal environment for sociaists, one would think? My guess is they will get fed up with it and move on somewhere better.

Edited by Last Avenue

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I've rarely met a self-described socialist who wasn't a hypocrite. Most are theoretically "compassionate" with other people's money, but only too eager to make and keep as much as they can for themselves. Socialism, and a lot of fellow traveling ideologies and fads (like the increasingly nutty and obnoxious Greenies), is primarily an ego-trip for people with a need to feel morally superior to the rest of us, and/or assuage their middle class guilt.

So, no surprise that so many of them want to join the ranks of black-hat wearing, waxed-moustache-twirling landlords. I wonder how "from each according to his ability to each according to his need" goes down when the rent's due? :rolleyes:

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I think perhaps the "socialist" label is just that, a label, and that the vermin that have been elected for the last decade or so, used their insider knowledge to invest in cheap property (while it was still cheap), in the knowledge that their crony chancellor would hand control of interest rates to the BofE with a remit to target inflation. Of course they also knew that the government would also cook the inflation figures. This is no different from the tories using their insider knowledge of thatcher's privatisations to ensure they got themselves nice little earners in terms of dividends and capital appreciation of their share portfolios. You see, the political class are tools of the elite and contrary to popular opinion, they are working for themselves, not for us, the electorate.

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I know a thing or two about that. ;) You're from Northampton, aren't you?

Yes, but I was thinking mainly about Newcastle area, although you will find corupt councillors all over the

country, and not just labour. There is a tory councillor who owns an estate agency in Northamptonshire, and I am not sure which is worse, being a Tory, being a councillor or being an EA.

I agree with what someone said earlier, if they dont act like a socialist, then they aint one.

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Some other theories:

The left see property investment as 'investment with a human face'. It's providing a service for people, putting a roof over their heads etc. Not just making those fat cats rich. (not realising its them who are the fat cats).

Lefties often like to think of themselves as arty, creative types (read the architectural press to see the prevailing political viewpoint) and so investing in property allows them to get all gooey about 'living spaces', 'sustainable communities' and think that they're funding works of art.

Lefties often work in areas closely connected with houses: architecture, town planning, the environment, the numerous NGOs dealing with housing and green issues etc, so property is more of a known quantity for them.

Edited by Austin Allegro

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Some other theories:

The left see property investment as 'investment with a human face'. It's providing a service for people, putting a roof over their heads etc. Not just making those fat cats rich. (not realising its them who are the fat cats).

Lefties often like to think of themselves as arty, creative types (read the architectural press to see the prevailing political viewpoint) and so investing in property allows them to get all gooey about 'living spaces', 'sustainable communities' and think that they're funding works of art.

Lefties often work in areas closely connected with houses: architecture, town planning, the environment, the numerous NGOs dealing with housing and green issues etc, so property is more of a known quantity for them.

All very true. But then why are they against those of other political persuasions who do the same? At the heart of so-called socialism is a huge state of denial.

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  • 298 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

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