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Sheer Heart Attack

Btl Ghost Blocks & "planning And Compensation Act 1991"

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I remember when I was a mere browser on this forum back in 2005 and coming across the concept that the then current building boom was a government-inspired conspiracy to buy them back later into social housing at much reduced costs. With Labour's stupidity and lack of ability to think past the end of their nose, I would be surprised at such cynical and forward-thinking cunning.

Prices from some of the BTL flats in Newcastle have stalled badly in the last 12 months. The evidence suggests that there is a long way to go to reach the bottom. IMO, it wouldn't surprise me if some of the glittering piled-high shiteboxes sold for as little as £40-50,000 in 3 years' time, particularly if the world economy will tank in the way expected.

Would the costs of nationalising these flats cost less than building from new? Without being a developer, I would imagine so. With no land purchase costs, with the buildings already in place together with the infrastructure, an "enterprising" council backed by a government programme could make this happen.

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I remember when I was a mere browser on this forum back in 2005 and coming across the concept that the then current building boom was a government-inspired conspiracy to buy them back later into social housing at much reduced costs. With Labour's stupidity and lack of ability to think past the end of their nose, I would be surprised at such cynical and forward-thinking cunning.

Prices from some of the BTL flats in Newcastle have stalled badly in the last 12 months. The evidence suggests that there is a long way to go to reach the bottom. IMO, it wouldn't surprise me if some of the glittering piled-high shiteboxes sold for as little as £40-50,000 in 3 years' time, particularly if the world economy will tank in the way expected.

Would the costs of nationalising these flats cost less than building from new? Without being a developer, I would imagine so. With no land purchase costs, with the buildings already in place together with the infrastructure, an "enterprising" council backed by a government programme could make this happen.

Nah, they will licence landlording.

Let Joe Public take the responsibility and get the control via licences and fees, inspections and litigation. It's the new labour way. If by some miracle Joe Public makes a profit, tax him into atoms.

Remember the golden rules of government -

If it moves tax it.

If it still moves regulate it.

If it stops moving, subsidise it.

Edited by Injin

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As someone with experience of the social housing sector I can tell you that no fancy new initiative is needed.

When prices become low and maintenance costs become too high on these blocks a local Registered Social Landlord (council houses aren't generally owned by councils anymore) will make an offer for them. Ditto any development sites.

RSLs work on a useful economic value model as rents are fixed and steadily buy up delapidated sites to do up and rent out to people on the council housing waiting list, housing beenfit going straight to the RSL.

Waiting lists are long so there is plenty of demand but RSLs will only pay what makes sense given their income stream.

For anybody who's wondering tha UEV on a standard two bed "social" house is about £30k. This takes into account government-controlled rents and the maintenance spend needed to keep the property up to the regiulator's (Housing Corporation) standard.

So there's your bottom price for a starter home. Not £0k but £30k.

Whilst I don't think the housing boom was a grand plan by the government to replace the council houses, the side-effect of a lot of new houses being built by the private sector was always going to end up with a decent amount of these falling into the RSL sector.

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As someone with experience of the social housing sector I can tell you that no fancy new initiative is needed.

When prices become low and maintenance costs become too high on these blocks a local Registered Social Landlord (council houses aren't generally owned by councils anymore) will make an offer for them. Ditto any development sites.

RSLs work on a useful economic value model as rents are fixed and steadily buy up delapidated sites to do up and rent out to people on the council housing waiting list, housing beenfit going straight to the RSL.

Waiting lists are long so there is plenty of demand but RSLs will only pay what makes sense given their income stream.

For anybody who's wondering tha UEV on a standard two bed "social" house is about £30k. This takes into account government-controlled rents and the maintenance spend needed to keep the property up to the regiulator's (Housing Corporation) standard.

So there's your bottom price for a starter home. Not £0k but £30k.

Whilst I don't think the housing boom was a grand plan by the government to replace the council houses, the side-effect of a lot of new houses being built by the private sector was always going to end up with a decent amount of these falling into the RSL sector.

Now this is interesting.

In 20 years time, would a future government allow tennants to "buy" their RSL council House?

A "Thatcher" trick and the rich pay!!

:lol:

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Only if the tenant decides to do so. 2-minute googling shows that the tenant has a discretion

Manchester City Council webpage

Also application from from from London Borough of Camden website

Urban legend, huh? :rolleyes:

Nope.

This change to housing benefit payment happened end of 2007 but RSLs were specifically exempted.

Edit - see under Exemptions:

http://www.powys.gov.uk/index.php?id=4171

Edited by Frank Hovis

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Now this is interesting.

In 20 years time, would a future government allow tennants to "buy" their RSL council House?

A "Thatcher" trick and the rich pay!!

:lol:

Most of the sales were of council HOUSES - relatively few flats, especially in high rises were sold. Even fewr would be bought in any future sell-off - too much experience of horrendous maintenance / upgrading bills.

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As someone with experience of the social housing sector I can tell you that no fancy new initiative is needed.

When prices become low and maintenance costs become too high on these blocks a local Registered Social Landlord (council houses aren't generally owned by councils anymore) will make an offer for them. Ditto any development sites.

RSLs work on a useful economic value model as rents are fixed and steadily buy up delapidated sites to do up and rent out to people on the council housing waiting list, housing beenfit going straight to the RSL.

Waiting lists are long so there is plenty of demand but RSLs will only pay what makes sense given their income stream.

For anybody who's wondering tha UEV on a standard two bed "social" house is about £30k. This takes into account government-controlled rents and the maintenance spend needed to keep the property up to the regiulator's (Housing Corporation) standard.

So there's your bottom price for a starter home. Not £0k but £30k.

Whilst I don't think the housing boom was a grand plan by the government to replace the council houses, the side-effect of a lot of new houses being built by the private sector was always going to end up with a decent amount of these falling into the RSL sector.

Can you clear up something I've been wondering about: - the Peabody Trust in London seems to have been selling off a lot of flats. Is that because of the disproportionate cost of upgrading? Nice if replacements fall neatly into their laps!

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Now this is interesting.

In 20 years time, would a future government allow tennants to "buy" their RSL council House?

A "Thatcher" trick and the rich pay!!

:lol:

20 years to the next boom? I thought we were on a 18 year cycle.

The profit goes to the developer, the loss to the mug BTLer.

I never really saw the point of RTB. If you're happy where you are why do you feel the need to own it? Why not pay a cheap rent and have someone look after it for you?

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Can you clear up something I've been wondering about: - the Peabody Trust in London seems to have been selling off a lot of flats. Is that because of the disproportionate cost of upgrading? Nice if replacements fall neatly into their laps!

RSLs aren't there for profit. They will have been selling these off under "Sale and Invest" to have segregated funds to buy or develop new properties.

The government has imposed "Decent Homes" standards for 2010 which means a lot of upgrading. If this will cost too much, or if ongoing maintanenance barely covers the rent, it makes sense to sell off these properties and buy something that will be cheaper to maintain. Old flats, anything with "concrete cancer" would fall into this category. Sell it for money in the bank to a loonie who's watched too much property porn and buy something that will cost less to maintain than it brings in in rent.

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RSLs aren't there for profit. They will have been selling these off under "Sale and Invest" to have segregated funds to buy or develop new properties.

The government has imposed "Decent Homes" standards for 2010 which means a lot of upgrading. If this will cost too much, or if ongoing maintanenance barely covers the rent, it makes sense to sell off these properties and buy something that will be cheaper to maintain. Old flats, anything with "concrete cancer" would fall into this category. Sell it for money in the bank to a loonie who's watched too much property porn and buy something that will cost less to maintain than it brings in in rent.

Makes sense. I was thinking particularly of the sprawling 1890s-ish (?) blocks on the Old Kent Road which had tiny kitchens and awkward layouts.

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  • 294 Brexit, House prices and Summer 2020

    1. 1. Including the effects Brexit, where do you think average UK house prices will be relative to now in June 2020?


      • down 5% +
      • down 2.5%
      • Even
      • up 2.5%
      • up 5%



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