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Home Report In December

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Just been going through the contents of the home report which is to be introduced in December this year.

Single survey with valuation stands out as the biggest potential change to how houses are sold in Scotland.

Will this spell the end of the offers over system? Or will it just mean the figure for which you can get a mortgage on, and offers over this price will be your optional premium to secure the property.

At least I hope it makes everyone think a bit more about how much over the odds they pay when buying in Scotland.

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Just been going through the contents of the home report which is to be introduced in December this year.

Single survey with valuation stands out as the biggest potential change to how houses are sold in Scotland.

Will this spell the end of the offers over system? Or will it just mean the figure for which you can get a mortgage on, and offers over this price will be your optional premium to secure the property.

At least I hope it makes everyone think a bit more about how much over the odds they pay when buying in Scotland.

It'll stop the outrageous way houses are advertised a way below the expected price to generate interest.

And it will stop buyers having to pay for a survey for a house they find they can't actually afford.

RICS are up in arms about it. :lol:

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I registered to ask peoples thoughts on home reports; then discovered there is already a thread albeit a short one!

On the GSPC website there is a report that the GSPC chairman asked for home reports to be delayed due to the current climate (dated May 20), does anyone think this might happen?

I think if introduced not only will it stop EAs advertising at ridiculously low prices (let me count the ways I hate Corum) but it will also give potential buyers a bargaining tool. If the market takes a drops and your are the only potential buyer how will they convince you to pay over the odds?

Does anyone know at what point you will be able to get the report? Will there be a delay in asking for it and receiving it to continue getting people to see houses that in the end they cant afford?

Any info gratefully received.

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If this website is anything to go by, this looks pretty official and like its all going to go ahead.

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Built-En...ing/Home-Report

I've just e-mailed them to say that I support what they are doing and think its great; end of offers over, multiple surveys and hiding things like factoring costs. I suggest that we all e-mail them in support, so they don't water this down like they did with the useless HIPs in England.

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I thought I would bump this thread as I dont think any of you are nearly excited enough about this!!

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Built-En...ing/Home-Report

Starts 1st December!!

Lets see if there is an influx of properties on to the market in the next 2 and a half months in order to try and avoid it.

Or am I too excited, need something to keep the faith. Mrs wants to buy!! I keep explaining that 50k saved is 50k (and the interest!) I dont have to earn in the future!!!!!

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Agreed. Very exciting. Its going to effectively end offers over....which was the exact intent of the government.

The unfairness of the offers over has been debated in parliament. Some prof has been lobbying for change for ages.

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I've not seen any evidence of a flood of houses coming on to avoid this. Any one else?

Is that because no one wants to sell anyway, or they realise that the cost of the home report is peanuts compared with the cost of actually selling a property at this time i.e. price cuts, or is it that most people don't know its going to happen?

Any ideas?

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We put our house on the market in England on Friday Sept 7th last year knowing home packs were going to start on Monday 10th Sept.

The man came and put our for sale sign up on Monday 10th. The next morning I walked 400 yds to the newsagent and saw another 6 houses had gone up for sale on the same day as ours. This was replicated all over the general area. In Scotland it could be different because they have picked a very sensible time to introduce the packs, i.e. close to Christmas when the market will be quieter.

I'm very hopeful that because the pack includes a valuation this will lower prices. It's one thing being given a valuation after you have already agreed a price but surely when people see a valuation before they offer they will be less inclined to offer too much, especially in the current climate.

I like this penalty charge bit. The idea of being able to get some of the estate agents who have messed me about charged £500 appeals a lot to me!

Q8 - What can buyers do if a Home Report is not provided?

Buyers should receive a Home Report within nine working days of requesting it. If a buyer believes that they are being denied a copy of the Home Report unlawfully, local authority trading standards officers are responsible for enforcing these duties. If the Trading Standards Officer deems that the seller or selling agent is in breach of their duties under the Housing (Scotland) Act to possess the Home Report documents and provide them to prospective purchasers, then a penalty charge notice may be issued. The amount of penalty charge is £500 as a debt owed to the local authority.

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Topics/Built-En.../forceupdate/on

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Idealistic vote catching nonsense :ph34r:

If you look at the Estate Agents and Solicitors ads of late you will note they have been encouraging folk to get their houses on the market before Single Seller Survey takes effect. Only cost is initial advertising.

As for the SSS the only effect I predict will be greater financial heartache for sellers in the short to medium term. Not only are many required to release capital now but in addition they will have to pay handsomely for the privilige. Then when the house has not sold after something like six weeks guess what a repeat fee for updating the SSS. Maybe surprisinging for some but most surveyors are hoping this is what keeps them alive for the forseeable future. All major firms have had one or two rounds of redundancies and now live in the hope that the number of surveys holds up to existing levels as the average cost of the SSS is broadly double the average cost of existing standard valuation reports.

That aside two other areas of concern that appear to have been overlooked. Firstly I have heard on the grapevine that some sellers agents have already been phoning around a number of the surveyors asking for an indicative verbal figure and guess what the highest number gets appointed (not sure how that works in favour of the buyer) and secondly interesting to see that everyone is assuming that the buyers bank/building society will rely on the report - afraid not as many have already stated they will require the lender to commision their own report as they are not sure they can trust the sellers valuation!

All of the above has already been experienced down south. What disappoints is the unseemly rush by the powers that be north of the border to push the button without at least trying to resolve the teething problems.

As a potential buyer with nothing to sell I am none to bothered as I only see the SSS as creating further grief in the market.

Edited by The Next Pele

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Not only are many required to release capital now but in addition they will have to pay handsomely for the privilige. Then when the house has not sold after something like six weeks guess what a repeat fee for updating the SSS.

As a buyer myself with nothing to sell I can't see how this is a problem in any way. If anything it will encourage sellers to drop their prices so as to sell quickly.

Firstly I have heard on the grapevine that some sellers agents have already been phoning around a number of the surveyors asking for an indicative verbal figure and guess what the highest number gets appointed, secondly interesting to see that everyone is assuming that the buyers bank/building society will rely on the report

Both of these are obvious and unavoidable. It is the nature of humanity and the nature of business. Of course, the VIs are doing to try and keep the prices high, of course the banks are going to want their own evaulations.

The post-Christmas layoffs from the banking sector should help nudge everything along. It is very sticky, but I have no doubt Edinburgh will come down over time.

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The SSS valuation is a bit of a farce.

No surveyor is going to bite the hand that feeds him by putting in a figure that displeases the ea or solicitor who hires him. At least, he won't do that twice to the same firm.

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"The idea of being able to get some of the estate agents who have messed me about charged £500 appeals a lot to me!"

What are you hoping to do? Ask for loads of home reports until you find an EA who won't supply you with one?

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By way of bumping this thread because the kickoff date for SSS is this Monday morning, I've got a few observations.

An article in The Herald says:

A fresh row has broken out over the cost of Scotland's new single survey system after the Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors (Rics) in Scotland confirmed that Home Reports will average between £585 and £820.

The fee for the reports - between £500 to £700 plus VAT - will assess a property's value, environmental impact and energy efficiency and provide information for buyers. They will be compulsory for all sellers after December 1.

Here's my first question:

If the fine for declining to hire a Surveyor is £500 and if the lowest fee for one of these damned things is £585+, then am I missing something? If a stroppy potential buyer demands to see the report then a seller can simply tell them to piss off. The fine is less than the cost of the unwanted (by the seller) survey.

Next question:

In a market which is declining at something like 1.5% per month clearly any valuation has a shelf life. What pressure is on a seller to update the valuation and after what period of time? A property which is valued at £200,000 sure as hell won't be worth that in three or four months time.

Next question:

Is there any kind of feedback loop planned to act as a quality control on the valuations? Should we perhaps be keeping a log of SSS valuations and then checking them against RoS listings of actual obtained price? It might be interesting to see if a pattern emerges. If one particular firm appears to be fiddling the valuations more than most then perhaps we nebby sods might perform a useful service by naming and shaming. We're never going to keep Embra lawyers honest, that can't be done, but we can at least show the bastards up for what they are.

Perhaps forwarding the results to the local Trading Standards office might be socially useful too!

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No surveyor is going to bite the hand that feeds him by putting in a figure that displeases the ea or solicitor who hires him. At least, he won't do that twice to the same firm.

So how is that different from before.

With the SSS all buyers get a feel for the true value of the property.

I would suspect only the final purchaser will need to get a bank survey. And why not.

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"If the fine for declining to hire a Surveyor is £500 and if the lowest fee for one of these damned things is £585+, then am I missing something? If a stroppy potential buyer demands to see the report then a seller can simply tell them to piss off. The fine is less than the cost of the unwanted (by the seller) survey."

Is any EA going to want to be the first to NOT have a report in place, and risk the attendant publicity..... nah. Isn't the fine for EVERY offence? So if person A gets stroppy on Monday, B gets stroppy on Tuesday, C gets stroppy on Wednesday, then the EA has accumulated £1500 worth of fines - IF trading standards get called in.

"In a market which is declining at something like 1.5% per month clearly any valuation has a shelf life. What pressure is on a seller to update the valuation and after what period of time? A property which is valued at £200,000 sure as hell won't be worth that in three or four months time."

Like another poster just said; a serious buyer will rely on the report for everything in the report but the valuation, and get their own lender's valuation anyways.... maybe

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With the SSS all buyers get a feel for the true value of the property.

I wonder about that. Surely the selling solicitors will winnow out the surveyors who give an honest valuation and tend to favour those who talk the market up. I suspect that what they'll do is phone around three or four surveyors, asking for an informal non-binding estimated valuation and before deciding who to give the job to.

If one surveyor gives a guesstimate of £180k; another £200k; and a third gives £220k: guess which surveyor wins the job.

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Isn't the fine for EVERY offence? So if person A gets stroppy on Monday, B gets stroppy on Tuesday, C gets stroppy on Wednesday, then the EA has accumulated £1500 worth of fines - IF trading standards get called in.

I can see that being challenged all the way to the Supreme Court. The first Sheriff to convict a single defender multiple times on the same charge, just because there are multiple complainants, is going to have his judgement appealed pdq.

My point about the fine being less than the fee is quite separate from the likely overinflated valuations. It's because a seller who knows or suspects that his place has got woodworm or dry rot or a planning complication is not going to want to shell out hundreds of Pounds to make his place unsellable. He'll take the tradition view of Caveat Emptor.

Anyway, as has already been pointed out, a buyer who's buying with borrowed money is going to have to pay for a new survey and valuation to the lender's satisfaction, so the "single" survey is a misnomer.

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I can see that being challenged all the way to the Supreme Court. The first Sheriff to convict a single defender multiple times on the same charge, just because there are multiple complainants, is going to have his judgement appealed pdq.

My point about the fine being less than the fee is quite separate from the likely overinflated valuations. It's because a seller who knows or suspects that his place has got woodworm or dry rot or a planning complication is not going to want to shell out hundreds of Pounds to make his place unsellable. He'll take the tradition view of Caveat Emptor.

Anyway, as has already been pointed out, a buyer who's buying with borrowed money is going to have to pay for a new survey and valuation to the lender's satisfaction, so the "single" survey is a misnomer.

What if the Surveyor doesn't pick up woodworm or dry rot which is discovered a month or so later? Can the buyer claim back the cash for fixing something which should have been picked up?

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I wonder about that. Surely the selling solicitors will winnow out the surveyors who give an honest valuation and tend to favour those who talk the market up. I suspect that what they'll do is phone around three or four surveyors, asking for an informal non-binding estimated valuation and before deciding who to give the job to.

If one surveyor gives a guesstimate of £180k; another £200k; and a third gives £220k: guess which surveyor wins the job.

A year ago ? The one that gives £220k.

Now ? The one that gives £180k. Perhaps the one at £200k.

Times have changed. Agents need sales - at any price. As was discussed on this site about 2 years ago - agents will move firmly from talking the market up to talking it down. They want this over and done with quicker than anyone else. Yes there will be the dumb ones who think they can hold out for higher prices. They shouldn't last long though. The EA's that actually manage to get sales in, no matter the price, will be the ones that survive.

I know a few people who have overpriced flats sitting on agents books for almost a year. If their agent was smart they would be doing everything possible to lower the price.

EXAMPLE:

(1)

You get commision at 1.5%

Flat overpriced at 150k

No sale in one year

Income for marketing/hassle/comms with vendor for that flat for one year = £ZERO

(2)

You get commision at 1.5%

Flat market price at 120k

Sale in one month

Income for marketing/hassle/comms with vendor for that flat for one month = £2250

If I owned an EA I know which option I would be FORCING on my agents. :)

Why else would uber bulls like the ESPC be talking about being sensible with asking prices etc. ?................

They know the game is up. FFS even the front page of their weekly paper this week has the headline:

"Home ownership - affordability is the key"

:)

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1st December 2008.

Say hello to the scottish buyers new best friend: Single seller survey.

The VI shills were on the bbc bleating this morning.

Seem to have changed their tune though. Previously the Single Seller Survey was going to cause a HPC by bringing a glut of properties onto the market,

so punters selling £250000 1 bedroom flats (which they paid £70K for) could save an extra £500. :lol:

Now that this hasn't transpired, well its still going to be equally devestating, for some undisclosed reason.

The SSS will be as "hated as the poll tax" for some undisclosed reason.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7756443.stm

EA Calls for action were met with a wave of apathy. :P

Edited by geneer

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Surely if a £500 fine is applied then they would also have to buy a Home Report as well or take the property off the market? So the penalty is paying twice or not being allowed to try sell.

On Newsnight Scotland last night they said Edinburgh Property Centre had 400 new properties on the market last week in a "stampede" to beat Home Reports.

Regarding valuations going out of date a couple of weeks ago on Newsnight a Chartered Surveyor said that the vendor can obtain a "refresh" to a report at a reduced price.

Edited by Redhat Sly

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In my watch area I got the impression there was a 'rush' of 50 or so added up to the weekend, but none in the usual Monday night batch upload at 5 or 6pm.....

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