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Developers In Trouble


Mr Mephisto
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http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business...s-14017655.html

Doesn't look good for the rest if giant like Taggart falls

I've never read as much crap in all my life.

"But behind the flamboyant image was a serious businessman" No. The serious businessmen were Fraser Estates who sold the land in July 2006 for £100m.

"No-one would bet against the Taggarts rising from the ashes." Really? what odds are you offering?

"Michael Taggart had seen the trouble ahead" When? Most on here saw the top coming in spring 2007, then again none of us have a multimillion pound business model based on ever increasing prices.

"he said: “Locating and identifying opportunities are the biggest challenges facing our industry"". Yeah? It seems that at least two companies indentified the opportunity to offload to 'the greater fool'.

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Me me me. The lands will be packaged as SIV's and parked away "off balance sheet"

Surely the VAT/ Tax man has first claim on a companies assets to pay tax liabilities.

The banks can then go after assets that are collateral on the loans , anything left goes to other creditors (normally very little).

:ph34r:

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I've never read as much crap in all my life.

"But behind the flamboyant image was a serious businessman" No. The serious businessmen were Fraser Estates who sold the land in July 2006 for £100m.

"No-one would bet against the Taggarts rising from the ashes." Really? what odds are you offering?

"Michael Taggart had seen the trouble ahead" When? Most on here saw the top coming in spring 2007, then again none of us have a multimillion pound business model based on ever increasing prices.

"he said: “Locating and identifying opportunities are the biggest challenges facing our industry"". Yeah? It seems that at least two companies indentified the opportunity to offload to 'the greater fool'.

"...But behind the flamboyant image was a serious businessman who built one of the most important construction companies in Ireland...."

Based on a business model of houses only ever go up in price???

"...No-one would bet against the Taggarts rising from the ashes..."

Oh really? And how many people would trust a bankrupt brand name like Taggerts in the future??

Taggerts have gone to the wall and STILL the BT is pom pom waving about how good they were....I despair!

hope you don't mind but I pinched some of your comments Macca ;)

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From the property pin -- looks like NI investors may be caught up in this mess.

Derry construction company Taggart Holdings traded for most of this year after being valued at just £1, The Irish News can reveal. As the true extent of the group's financial state begins to emerge, hundreds of small investors across Ireland now stand to lose the bulk of their cash. As business advisors PricewaterhouseCoopers (PwC) continue the complex unravelling of the Taggart accounts, one of the matters they will look at as a matter of routine is for possible evidence of any civil or criminal wrongdoing.

The once high-flying Taggart Holdings, headed by brothers Michael and John Taggart, sunk spectacularly into administration last Wednesday, apparently a high profile victim of the collapse in land prices. Early indications put the company's debt levels at more than £100 million. But documents seen by The Irish News reveal that the warning bells were sounding as far back as last autumn, by which stage the Taggarts had been actively seeking a rescue investor for their ailing company.

And when a formal due diligence was undertaken in March on behalf of one Dublin developer who had been offered a 50 per cent stake in the company for just £5 million, the accountants' valuation came in at a just £1. Yet despite the directors having pondered their options and continued to try to broker deals with their bankers, the company still continued to trade.

When the administrators were called in last week, Bank of Ireland and Ulster Bank were named as their biggest creditors. But The Irish News has seen evidence that a number of other Irish financial institutions are heavily exposed – including First Trust Bank to the tune of more than £60 million and Anglo-Irish Bank to a larger sum still.

That is because the banks are part of joint venture partnerships – or Special Purpose Vehicles (SPVs) as they are known, between Taggarts and private clients of Goodbody Stockbrokers in Dublin. Although these SPVs are not in receivership or administration, PwC is effectively a shareholder along with Goodbody nominees, made up of hundreds of investors who have put up tens of millions of pounds combined.

]If this debt is eventually crystallised, it is likely to mean that those investors – many from Northern Ireland and some of whom have ploughed in their life savings or pension funds – may end up with just a few pence in the pound. But given the intricacy of the administration and the fact that Taggart has dozens of inter-related companies in different jurisdictions, it could be well into next year before those investors know the full extent of their losses.

PwC said "considerable progress" had been made but added: "We are some way from developing a plan for the future operation of the businesses. "We are working closely with the directors to clarify the assets, including land, buildings and properties, both competed and part-built, that fall within our control," administrator Garth Calow said.

"There is considerable value within the group companies and with the cooperation and support of the directors we will seek to maximise this value over the coming weeks without adversely affecting the already difficult conditions facing the construction industry."

The terms of the administration agreement do not include many of Taggart Holdings' 40 separate companies, although it is expected that the banks may move on certain assets and group companies in the coming weeks. The Taggarts' British and other overseas and commercial portfolios are also unaffected by the administration agreement and speculation of a "fire sale" of many of the company's assets is therefore unfounded.

But while the vultures circle over the brothers' assets – which include helicopters and a private plane – what is certain is that scores, if not hundreds, of small sub-contractors could become associated casualties of the Taggarts collapse.

http://www.irishnews.com

It would appear Pricewaterhouse are struggling to determine just how much money is owed to banks. BOI and Ulster Bank [£150 million] declared their hand with legal action but Anglo Irish Bank [£75 million plus] & First Trust [£60 million?] and others have yet to reveal their total exposure. The Irish "players" in this land game via Goodbodys with the Dundonald land deal have lost near £40 million, so how do their own businesses stand or are they also trading when insolvent?

i wonder if any other developers trading while insolvent ? allegedly ;)

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  • 2 weeks later...
From the property pin -- looks like NI investors may be caught up in this mess.

Derry construction company Taggart Holdings traded for most of this year after being valued at just £1, The Irish News can reveal. As the true extent of the group’s financial state begins to emerge, hundreds of small investors across Ireland now stand to lose the bulk of their cash. As business advisors PricewaterhouseCoopers (PwC) continue the complex unravelling of the Taggart accounts, one of the matters they will look at as a matter of routine is for possible evidence of any civil or criminal wrongdoing.

The once high-flying Taggart Holdings, headed by brothers Michael and John Taggart, sunk spectacularly into administration last Wednesday, apparently a high profile victim of the collapse in land prices. Early indications put the company’s debt levels at more than £100 million. But documents seen by The Irish News reveal that the warning bells were sounding as far back as last autumn, by which stage the Taggarts had been actively seeking a rescue investor for their ailing company.

And when a formal due diligence was undertaken in March on behalf of one Dublin developer who had been offered a 50 per cent stake in the company for just £5 million, the accountants’ valuation came in at a just £1. Yet despite the directors having pondered their options and continued to try to broker deals with their bankers, the company still continued to trade.

When the administrators were called in last week, Bank of Ireland and Ulster Bank were named as their biggest creditors. But The Irish News has seen evidence that a number of other Irish financial institutions are heavily exposed – including First Trust Bank to the tune of more than £60 million and Anglo-Irish Bank to a larger sum still.

That is because the banks are part of joint venture partnerships – or Special Purpose Vehicles (SPVs) as they are known, between Taggarts and private clients of Goodbody Stockbrokers in Dublin. Although these SPVs are not in receivership or administration, PwC is effectively a shareholder along with Goodbody nominees, made up of hundreds of investors who have put up tens of millions of pounds combined.

]If this debt is eventually crystallised, it is likely to mean that those investors – many from Northern Ireland and some of whom have ploughed in their life savings or pension funds – may end up with just a few pence in the pound. But given the intricacy of the administration and the fact that Taggart has dozens of inter-related companies in different jurisdictions, it could be well into next year before those investors know the full extent of their losses.

PwC said “considerable progress” had been made but added: “We are some way from developing a plan for the future operation of the businesses. “We are working closely with the directors to clarify the assets, including land, buildings and properties, both competed and part-built, that fall within our control,” administrator Garth Calow said.

“There is considerable value within the group companies and with the cooperation and support of the directors we will seek to maximise this value over the coming weeks without adversely affecting the already difficult conditions facing the construction industry.”

The terms of the administration agreement do not include many of Taggart Holdings’ 40 separate companies, although it is expected that the banks may move on certain assets and group companies in the coming weeks. The Taggarts’ British and other overseas and commercial portfolios are also unaffected by the administration agreement and speculation of a “fire sale” of many of the company’s assets is therefore unfounded.

But while the vultures circle over the brothers’ assets – which include helicopters and a private plane – what is certain is that scores, if not hundreds, of small sub-contractors could become associated casualties of the Taggarts collapse.

http://www.irishnews.com

It would appear Pricewaterhouse are struggling to determine just how much money is owed to banks. BOI and Ulster Bank [£150 million] declared their hand with legal action but Anglo Irish Bank [£75 million plus] & First Trust [£60 million?] and others have yet to reveal their total exposure. The Irish "players" in this land game via Goodbodys with the Dundonald land deal have lost near £40 million, so how do their own businesses stand or are they also trading when insolvent?

has anybody heard the rumour alledging

that a mutual society connected with a local church

has been caught with its trousers around its ankles in the mess?

rock on!

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"Michael Taggart said: “Locating and identifying opportunities are the biggest challenges facing our industry"". Yeah? It seems that at least two companies indentified the opportunity to offload to 'the greater fool'.

The greatest fool was not Michael Taggart, far from it. It was the investors and banks who flocked to his altar. This company played with other people’s money and ultimately cared only for their own gain. Their/his assets and past dividends are ring-fenced under a complex limited company structure that can not be touched.

The less flash brother has gone from being a foreman to Uber-rich in less than ten years. He's enough to life a comfortable life for his and many of his generations spawn.

This market clearly needs regulation, along with many other vested interest groups including estates agents and banks etc. Will it be regulated - probably not?

has anybody heard the rumour alledging

that a mutual society connected with a local church

has been caught with its trousers around its ankles in the mess? rock on!

Heard this one yesterday.

The original post of this thread which quoted me, referred to Taggarts back in January. The trouble was first announced on the 28th of December and it shows the power of the vested interests how this was disguised or kept quiet until October.

But here's one for the rumor mill whilst we're on it - one of the Taggarts got a fat lip from a creditor at the weekend of course allegedly.

Edited by md23040
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The Presbyterian Mutual Society in Belfast has said it is stopping repayments to members because it cannot meet demand for withdrawals.
"It is simply a matter of the society having insufficient cash to meet the demands for withdrawals - the funds are now sitting in the commercial property that we own and in loans that we have made."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7725208.stm

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http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business...n-14069421.html

"Taggart Estates, a subsidiary of Taggart Homes, was put into administration last night at the request of its directors."

Do the administrators have to disclose the price they achieve for assets ?

Imo a fire sale of building land will the the final piece of the HPC jigsaw , allowing starter homes for £60 to £70k :blink:

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http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/business...n-14069421.html

"Taggart Estates, a subsidiary of Taggart Homes, was put into administration last night at the request of its directors."

Do the administrators have to disclose the price they achieve for assets ?

Imo a fire sale of building land will the the final piece of the HPC jigsaw , allowing starter homes for £60 to £70k :blink:

I can just see the ad right now ......

Coming to an auction house near you ..... five sites (with full planning permission) of development land and a part share in a sixth, totalling 87 acres, of which 84 are within seven miles of Belfast city centre.

TIMBERRRRRRRRR

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I can just see the ad right now ......

Coming to an auction house near you ..... five sites (with full planning permission) of development land and a part share in a sixth, totalling 87 acres, of which 84 are within seven miles of Belfast city centre.

TIMBERRRRRRRRR

The sooner this is sold and building starts, the better.

BUT, will anyone actually build on it? Unless building takes place, there won't be any impact on housing supply. As long as investors see the general shortage of development land continuing, they will view the land as an investment and not an input cost such as labour or materials.

The Planning Service needs to make it clear that supply of land with planning permission will keep up with demand, so there can never be any bubble in land prices again. (Discuss!)

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The sooner this is sold and building starts, the better.

BUT, will anyone actually build on it? Unless building takes place, there won't be any impact on housing supply. As long as investors see the general shortage of development land continuing, they will view the land as an investment and not an input cost such as labour or materials.

The Planning Service needs to make it clear that supply of land with planning permission will keep up with demand, so there can never be any bubble in land prices again. (Discuss!)

Planning constrains land supply only in the very broadest sense - there remained ample development land to meet actual housing needs throughout the boom period. The problem was excess credit. Take a look at ROI which has very generous allocations of housing land. It didn't stop them having a mega-boom all of their own.

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More on Taggarts land going up for sale:

http://www.irishnews.com/appnews/530/5849/...0Primeland.html

THE land at the centre of the north's biggest ever property deal is to be put on the market. PricewaterhouseCoopers' (PwC) business recovery services yesterday confirmed that it is to sell off 87 acres of prime residential development land belonging to Taggart Estates.

Can anybody get access to the full story though?

How will this land be sold?

Auction? :o

Edited by MrFox
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  • 1 month later...

I have heard on the grapevine that one of the big players is just about to be declared bankrupt owing the banks a very, very large sum of money - allegedly in the region of £600 - £800 million - quite a staggering amount of money - what will that do to the already battered Irish Banking sector ?

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I have heard on the grapevine that one of the big players is just about to be declared bankrupt owing the banks a very, very large sum of money - allegedly in the region of £600 - £800 million - quite a staggering amount of money - what will that do to the already battered Irish Banking sector ?

From NI or RoI?

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I have heard on the grapevine that one of the big players is just about to be declared bankrupt owing the banks a very, very large sum of money - allegedly in the region of £600 - £800 million - quite a staggering amount of money - what will that do to the already battered Irish Banking sector ?

they won't be able to sit down for weeks

:lol:

this in the south?

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I have heard on the grapevine that one of the big players is just about to be declared bankrupt owing the banks a very, very large sum of money - allegedly in the region of £600 - £800 million - quite a staggering amount of money - what will that do to the already battered Irish Banking sector

Tease . ...

Begins with? K?

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