Nu Labour Plan To Allow 550,000 Immigrants In Next Year

[neilrich]

Reference the part about growing our economy, my thinking is this...if back in 2006 NET personal borrowing increased by £110 billion and I don't know what the figure shall be for this year, but if next year personal borrowing only increases by £70 billion, due to the credit crunch, surly this shall leave a massive hole in our economy. UK GDP back in 2006 was in the region of £1.3 trillion and the extra £110billion personal debt would have circulated around our economy many times, if the banks continue to restrict their lending, even a £40 billion fall would see more than a £100 billion wiped off GDP. Things could very quickly sprial downwards out of control!! That's my take, continued growth in our economy is dependant upon personal borrowing increasing year on year, and I've not even considered public sector spending/borrowing which may also be about to contract!

[i_godzuki]

Yeah maybe - I guess that could be the case, but why wouldn't you head to somewhere like Sweden, Norway and the like if you could still pick up a labouring job with limited knowledge of the language.

Language is an important barrier, remembering that if you worked in France as a labourer most likely, most of your potential employers could probably speak English anyway. Whereas reverse the situation, I doubt this would be the case.

How many times have you been or seen a Pom walk into a bar or resturant in France / Spain and speak straight away to the waiter in English.

You would never in a million years, see the French doing this in England

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Just because Brits are unable to learn foreign languages it doesn't mean people from other countries are the same. I'm sure if Poles can pick up English they can pick up German or French. It's as much about effort as anything else.

[Bimble]

The problem isn't the thousands of young, slim, attractive, educated, hardworking Slavic immigrants we import. The problems is the that we cannot export or own ugly work-shy under-class.

50 years ago London councils used to export their unemployed to sink estates that they funded in places like Swindon and Slough. I like that concept. As an exercise in cost control, perhaps the government could buy up ex-soviet sink estates in Poland, ring fence them so as not to pollute the surrounding ecosystem, and we could ship our fat lazy work-dodgers over there in cattle trucks. We need only get the Red Cross to chuck some cases of Royals, Super Brew and Sky TV over the pen wall and they'll be happy as pigs in sh*t.

[Benedict]

Immigration is such an emotive subject, isn't it?

On the one hand, we quite like the fact that we can find a bunch of Polish blokes to come round and build a new patio and are quite happy to work weekends and Bank Holidays for bugger all money (cash only, of course) but on the other hand we get very upset if they are sitting in the queue in front of us at the Accident and Emergency Ward.

I get more annoyed by drunks in A&E. If only we could swap our drunken bums for more nice hard working poles, that'd be sweet.

[Benedict]

The problem isn't the thousands of young, slim, attractive, educated, hardworking Slavic immigrants we import. The problems is the that we cannot export or own ugly work-shy under-class.

50 years ago London councils used to export their unemployed to sink estates that they funded in places like Swindon and Slough. I like that concept. As an exercise in cost control, perhaps the government could buy up ex-soviet sink estates in Poland, ring fence them so as not to pollute the surrounding ecosystem, and we could ship our fat lazy work-dodgers over there in cattle trucks. We need only get the Red Cross to chuck some cases of Royals, Super Brew and Sky TV over the pen wall and they'll be happy as pigs in sh*t.

LOL!

Bimble for prime minister! You have my vote.

[iamnumerate]

Immigration is such an emotive subject, isn't it?

The supply and demand argument works in immigration too; if UK PLC takes a nose-dive, your average Pole, Ukrainian, etc. is simply going to pack his hod and shovel and go to the next western European country that can pay for his services, and who can blame them? I doubt many of them have relocated to the UK for the great climate or the sunny disposition of it's natives and their friendly attitude towards foreigners.

Sadly that is not 100% true. The hard working ones might leave (if they become unemployed) the foreign chavs will stay and take a greater % of our taxes than they do now.

The problem is not just the number of immigrants it is the quality - a lot are hard working, a lot however are very lazy and get quite a lot in benefits. I saw a Somali on TV who gets £33 k pa in benefits she will never leave the UK whilst she gets that !

As we hit the bottom of the coming recession, we're going to see something we've not witnessed for quite a few years; British people doing jobs like serving coffee or sweeping the streets.

Hopefully Gordon.

[Guest happy?]

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/busi...icle3097570.ece

From The Times

December 27, 2007

Half a million migrants will boost growth by £3.6bn

James Rossiter

A flow of more than half a million migrants into the UK is expected to boost the economy next year by £3.6 billion, according to research published today.

Out of the 550,000 migrants forecast to settle on British soil next year, 275,000 are expected to be workers who will help maintain GDP growth at 1.8 per cent in 2008.

The influx, largely from Eastern Europe, will effectively allow growth to rise by an extra fifth. Without them UK GDP would grow only 1.5 per cent next year.

With Gordon ramping up the immigration numbers and no plans to build homes for them to live in what, exactly, is he expecting to gain by these numbers of new arrivals? Lower wages? If so, is it worth it when you consider the strain on schools, hospitals, housing, and other social services. I think the public have voted on this issue already and they are saying NO. The problem is that Gordon is not listening.

Couldn't they just lodge them all with Daily Mail readers and they make a fly-on-the-wall documentary about it - if nothing else it would certainly make entertaining viewing.

[iamnumerate]

The problem isn't the thousands of young, slim, attractive, educated, hardworking Slavic immigrants we import. The problems is the that we cannot export or own ugly work-shy under-class.

50 years ago London councils used to export their unemployed to sink estates that they funded in places like Swindon and Slough. I like that concept. As an exercise in cost control, perhaps the government could buy up ex-soviet sink estates in Poland, ring fence them so as not to pollute the surrounding ecosystem, and we could ship our fat lazy work-dodgers over there in cattle trucks. We need only get the Red Cross to chuck some cases of Royals, Super Brew and Sky TV over the pen wall and they'll be happy as pigs in sh*t.

Good idea but send the somali layabouts as well we just need to add the Koran to the above list.

[iamnumerate]

Couldn't they just lodge them all with Daily Mail readers and they make a fly-on-the-wall documentary about it - if nothing else it would certainly make entertaining viewing.

Wouldn't Guardian readers be more logical ? After all they want them to come (although not in their backyard if my Guardian reading parents are typical).

[Realistbear]

LOL!

Bimble for prime minister! You have my vote.

I suspect people are not really worried about POLES coming in. Its the peoples who do not like to assimilate or adopt British culture. Lets face it, if we were told that 1 million Kiwis, Aussies, Canadians and super-model quality Slavs were going to arrive next year no one would give a monkeys.

What I believe most fear is an invasion of peoples who have nothing in common with Britain and who will not adapt but form ghettos or no-go areas within the UK. Also included would be the tens of thousands of illegals and those with criminal records who are allowed in to continue their trade. Fake asylum seekers would probably also be included in the list of non-desirables.

I do not like the look of post-Brown Britain and am seriously giving consideration to moving back across t' Atlantic again. I think things could be quite depressed here for a generation or two as we pay back the trillions Brown's economy has "created" out of thin air.

[Guest happy?]

Wouldn't Guardian readers be more logical ? After all they want them to come (although not in their backyard if my Guardian reading parents are typical).

Where's the fun in that?

[iamnumerate]

Where's the fun in that?

Well their views on immigration would change dramatically for one thing.

I don't think realistbear is 100% correct too many people of any type is a mistake. Of course if they are pedo worshippers it is worse than if they are Poles.

[Darkman]

I suspect people are not really worried about POLES coming in. Its the peoples who do not like to assimilate or adopt British culture. Lets face it, if we were told that 1 million Kiwis, Aussies, Canadians and super-model quality Slavs were going to arrive next year no one would give a monkeys.

I disagree actually, though I see your point. Immigrants who don't assimilate cause more problems, but the idea of opening our doors to huge amounts of *any* immigrants is also a major problem. The strain on services, wages flowing outside the country, lack of cheap housing, resentment caused to the locals etc It's all just so unnecessary.

The point is, we *do* have the population available to fulfil these job sectors. Since when was it a better idea to invite in a stranger to work, instead of training up our own?

As we hit the bottom of the coming recession, we're going to see something we've not witnessed for quite a few years; British people doing jobs like serving coffee or sweeping the streets.

And this can only be a good thing. A great thing even for the country. Somehow our own citizens came to believe some jobs were below them, so we imported cheap slave labour from abroad.

But a recession will below those misconceptions right out of the water

[huw]

The welfare state isnt the problem, high level of immigration is.

Benefit arrangements that make idleness preferable to necessary work will inevitably suck labour in from other countries.

[the end is a bit nigher]

Apparently there is an over supply of housing here in the UK anyway.

According to this thread

Oversupply

there is an massive oversupply of overpriced houses - simple people seem to have difficulty understanding that

[damianlsmith]

there is an massive oversupply of overpriced houses - simple people seem to have difficulty understanding that

the topic of the thread asked "where are they going to live"

My reply was this

[the end is a bit nigher]

the topic of the thread asked "where are they going to live"

My reply was this

no, you said that 'apparently there is a massive oversupply of houses' - i was just helping to clarify for you - of course you will know exactly how many are sitting empty won't you? - what do they count as?

[damianlsmith]

no, you said that 'apparently there is a massive oversupply of houses' - i was just helping to clarify for you - of course you will know exactly how many are sitting empty won't you? - what do they count as?

Yes apparently, which means one of two things.....

1- clearly seen or understood

2- seeming real, but not necessarily so

Therefore using Apparently would seem appropriate.

[laurejon]

The vast majority of the British Public celebrate the influx of immigrants who add a rich diversity to our culture and ensure that wages do not get out of hand to the point whereby the working classes become self sufficient and begin to provide for themselves without government handouts.

Look back through history and the working classes are a real threat to those who are feeding from the trough.

[0q0]

Britain's mainly tertiary in its output.

Brown is hoping the immigrants coming in will fill the vacancies by the low paid immigrants going home who are either fed up sleeping 6 to a room and seeing their minimum wage eroded in spend power, or who have made enough to go and have a better life in their homeland or another EU country.

Frankly, I really don't know how they tolerate the jobs some of them do - up at 5am cutting sandwiches or up all night doing shelves for Sainstesdas and still paying their bills and sending money home. It's amazing.

Of course, many recent EU immigrants are now in better paid public sector work on £20K plus a year - they ain't all packing strawberries or doing your Big Mac.

Very hard working most of them are too, I'm not criticising them. I can foresee Brits competing with newcomers for Big Mac work, I really can. I remember it last time.

Edited December 27, 2007 by The Last Bear

[Kurt Barlow]

Hello MP, yep I'm a paramedic and what you've posted could be a mirror statement across the board in the service i reckon.

I understand why people are frustrated sometimes with response being so long, its just that we have probably just off loaded an O/D in casualty depart then come as quickly as we can when clear at hosp.

Sad thing is that this limited resource is costing lives.

cheers for support MP.

I also thought paramedics should be paid at least as much, if not more than firemen. From what I have seen Paramedics work their a$$es off. In contrast, from what I know firemen play allot of snooker, clean windows or run gardening businesses cash in hand, and occasional watch as buildings burn down.

[Guest Mr Parry]

I also thought paramedics should be paid at least as much, if not more than firemen. From what I have seen Paramedics work their a$$es off. In contrast, from what I know firemen play allot of snooker, clean windows or run gardening businesses cash in hand, and occasional watch as buildings burn down.

Yes, I missed that point, thought about it afterwards. Police get respect through power, firemen through media glorification . . . the poor old Ambulance Service just seems to get taken for granted.

[davidg]

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Just because Brits are unable to learn foreign languages it doesn't mean people from other countries are the same. I'm sure if Poles can pick up English they can pick up German or French. It's as much about effort as anything else.

There are lots of Poles in the French Rhone Alpes region doing jobs like plumbing and electrical installation. They don't need French, just English.

[0q0]

Nurses were not supposed to be paid much because they were fearful it'd attract just the materialistic to the post. Well, there are plenty of nurses who are useless, whatever their pay. But GPs are paid what, £100K. So how does that work? It's okay to attract a materialistic medical doctor but not a nurse or paramedic?!

Paramedics are worth their weight in gold. Fire officers ditto. Police constables ditto. Coastguards ditto.

Division footballers - £5K+ a week?!

Stuffed shirt private sector execs - £2K to £20K a week?!

Idiots on the goggle box £1m+ a season?!

Someone who goes into a burning, smoke-filled building to save a life, deals with hepatitis and disease, deals with violent offenders and guns - yeah you're gonna find ya salary is worked out to the last penny chum.

But man-with-football or total knobcheese who hosts a chat-show, salary goes up in £100K chunks like a fuel pump meter, and it's either our taxes pay for it (licence fee) or private advertisers who pass the costs on to us with higher selling prices at the till.

The world is barking.

Edited December 27, 2007 by The Last Bear

[Kurt Barlow]

There are lots of Poles in the French Rhone Alpes region doing jobs like plumbing and electrical installation. They don't need French, just English.

Ive been recently looking at entry criteria for emigration to Australia and Canada. In both cases the ability to speak fluent english (or French in the case of Quebec) is essential criteria for entry as these two countries have english as their primary language.

It just shows how progressive we are as a nation not imposing such silly and outdated requirements on would be immigrants to the UK.