Another Prescott Classic ......

[IMupNorth]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...7/ixportal.html

Looks like another 1 million people heading to the South East then !!!

I tell you this New Labour lot, are all rampant socialists behind a thin veneer of "opportunity for all". They won't be happy until they plan every last single detail of your lives for you. State control over where you live, the design of your pre-fabricated affordable home. ID cards that record every aspect of your life, an education system designed for the lowest common denominator and thereby total state dependancy.

:angry:

[VacantPossession]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...7/ixportal.html

Looks like another 1 million people heading to the South East then !!!

I tell you this New Labour lot, are all rampant socialists behind a thin veneer of "opportunity for all". They won't be happy until they plan every last single detail of your lives for you. State control over where you live, the design of your pre-fabricated affordable home. ID cards that record every aspect of your life, an education system designed for the lowest common denominator and thereby total state dependancy.

:angry:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Using the word socialist to describe New Labour is not a sensible thing. In fact the labour party is much closer to Thatcherism than it is to socialism. The current Labour Party is roughly as far right as Edward Heath's conservative government was. You are confusing the need for this government to control things by labelling it with an inappropriate word. I agree their obsession with controlling everything is awful, but socialism doesn't describe it.

New Labour is further right than almost any past conservative governments have ever been. There is no such thing as "left" politics in Europe anymore. I suggest you look up the meaning of socialism.

VacantPossession

[deano]

I don't believe they are attempting to run a country or society anymore, this is uk plc and business is king. If businesses can't find workers at £4.20 an hour they open the doors and in they come - business loves neo-liberal economics untill it works in favour of the worker, then they change the rules.

The housing situation would obviously bit a lot better if we had 1 million people less, that is obvious. You can see where the goverment is taking us and it ain't nice. They know what we want but we are being ignored, eventually the pressure cooker will blow.

[El Toro]

New Labour is further right than almost any past conservative governments have ever been. There is no such thing as "left" politics in Europe anymore. I suggest you look up the meaning of socialism.

VacantPossession

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

VP Socialist parties have almost always tended towards Fascism, which should not be confused with Capitalism. The Nazi Party, Franco's Facists, Pol Pot, the Soviets..... ALL socialists.....ALL fascitic opressive regiemes.

Animal Farm is an excellent satire which observes the inherently 'right wing' nature of all Socialism. It should come as no suprise that New Labour are acting in this way. What do you expect from a Socialist Party? Personal freedom and an efficient 'Small State Government', if so on what basis????

[Sledgehead]

I don't believe they are attempting to run a country or society anymore, this is uk plc and business is king. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You must be CRAZY if you think this gov is pro business. Pretty much every PPP / PFI deal has lead to losses for business, the goernment has dried up th epool of available workers by creating stupid gov admin jobs, th eprivatised utilities had a windfall tax, the mobile phone companies paid exhorbitant fees for the 3G licences, all listed companies have been stealth taxed to the the tune of £5bn a year for the past 8 years (£40bn) from Gordy's dividend tax credit scam (which has directly resulted in tens of thousands of pensions in deficit - now companies are expected to contribute to a pensions guarantee scheme when he created the problem), not a week goes by without some company coming under investigation for not telling their customers to look elsewhere for cheaper deals. You are clearly out of touch.

As for workers, they get minimum wage, 2 weeks sick, massive increases in maternity leave and paid paternity leave, nursery vouchers. And who has funded all of this : business.

HELLO! ANYONE HOME?

If business was doing better out of this government, rates would be higher and FTBs deposits wouldn't look so blo@dy inadequate.

[Bluelady]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...7/ixportal.html

Looks like another 1 million people heading to the South East then !!!

I tell you this New Labour lot, are all rampant socialists behind a thin veneer of "opportunity for all". They won't be happy until they plan every last single detail of your lives for you. State control over where you live, the design of your pre-fabricated affordable home. ID cards that record every aspect of your life, an education system designed for the lowest common denominator and thereby total state dependancy.

:angry:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The whole point of socialism is opportunity for all. But this government is further right than the Tories, the founding fathers of socialism and the Labour party must be revolving in their graves at what this lot's like.

[Sledgehead]

VP Socialist parties have almost always tended towards Fascism, which should not be confused with Capitalism. The Nazi Party, Franco's Facists, Pol Pot, the Soviets..... ALL socialists.....ALL fascitic opressive regiemes.

Animal Farm is an excellent satire which observes the inherently 'right wing' nature of all Socialism. It should come as no suprise that New Labour are acting in this way. What do you expect from a Socialist Party? Personal freedom and an efficient  'Small State Government', if so on what basis????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Quite right El Toro. People are so politically ill-educated in this chav infested isle they fail to make the distinction between social and economic policy.

I regard myself as socially liberal and capitalist. People often see this as odd. Far from it. Capitalism by its very laissez-faire nature is liberal.

I suggest people visit : http://www.politicalcompass.org/

I'm slap bang on Ghandi & Mandella and thank God I say fo rthat (even if I am agnostic, but that's a different story)

[Gtr London FTB]

I'm slap bang on Ghandi & Mandella and thank God I say fo rthat  (even if I am agnostic, but that's a different story)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Same here, which I must admit surprised me!

[firetruck]

VP Socialist parties have almost always tended towards Fascism, which should not be confused with Capitalism. The Nazi Party, Franco's Facists, Pol Pot, the Soviets..... ALL socialists.....ALL fascitic opressive regiemes.

Animal Farm is an excellent satire which observes the inherently 'right wing' nature of all Socialism.

SOCIALIST parties have historically tended to the LEFT, and FASCIST parties have traditionally tended to the RIGHT. This does not however disallow any mixing of the two (e.g. right leaning socialists, left leaning fascists). Socialism (and I means true MARXIST socialism, not "New Labour") is the Ideological opposite to Fascism.

From 1923 "The Doctrine of Fascism" (wrongly attributed to Mussolini - it was actually ghostwritten by Fascist Philosopher Giovanni Gentile)

... Fascism [is] the complete opposite of... Marxian Socialism, the materialist conception of the history of human civilization can be explained simply through the conflict of interests among the various social groups and by the change and development in the means and instruments of production....

Most socialists are not fascists, and Most fascists are not socialists. Unfortunately our current government (and most of it's would-be replacements) have more in common with fascists than socialists. The Nazis & Stalinists were good examples of corrupt tyranny, and dont really reflect their "claimed" political beginings. Fascism vs Tyranny - nitpicking? Maybe, but an important political distinction. As for Franco (A nationalist), he actually drove the then socialist government out of spain.

Also, Animal Farm was actually a comment of how the Russian Revolution (something Orwell was sympathetic to) fell into tyranny at the hands of the minority Bolsheviks, and not a comment of Socialism as a whole (indeed Orwell was a socialist)

European socialists like "New Labour" have long since lost any basis in marxist socialism, since we live in capitalist societies. However only in the last few years, has it sadly lost it's dedication to social justice.

[VacantPossession]

VP Socialist parties have almost always tended towards Fascism, which should not be confused with Capitalism. The Nazi Party, Franco's Facists, Pol Pot, the Soviets..... ALL socialists.....ALL fascitic opressive regiemes.

Animal Farm is an excellent satire which observes the inherently 'right wing' nature of all Socialism. It should come as no suprise that New Labour are acting in this way. What do you expect from a Socialist Party? Personal freedom and an efficient  'Small State Government', if so on what basis????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks for attempting to explain what socialism is in a couple of sentences. In fact it's a bit more two dimensional than your simplistic explanation which confuses the National Socialism of Russia, or even Hitler's Germany for instance, with the original meaning of the word. The pure meaning of Socialism, unencumbered by the corrupted meaning you are using to describe any old government which has fascist intent, is as follows:

A political movement whose aim is to achieve social organisation through the redistribution of wealth.

The current labour party is as far from that principle as it could possibly be, so I stand by my assertion.

You might gain more insight into the meaning of Socialism and its many different forms by having a look at some material which goes a little beyond your somewhat uniformed response. Try these for starters:

www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/TUglasier.htm

http://www.spgb.org.uk/Q-whatsocmeans.htm

www.imprint.co.uk/books/diamond.html

www.marxist.net/ireland/connolly/socialism/ch2.htm

VP

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

To call New Labour socialist is an insult to English language, let alone political philosophy.

Are they facist? Well, their assault on civil liberties, the introduction of ID cards, etc. tends toward that direction, but ultimately that's a childish statement.

What they are are Technocrats, surrounding themselves with a clan of spurious experts - everyhting from neo-liberal voodoo economists, to megabusiness frankenstein science, waffling education gurus, shady intelligence types, labour-bashing business leaders and basket-weaving think tanks obsessed with trying to prove 'social markets' are more than just privatising the state and handing it over to monopoly capital.

So NuLabour speak for a schizophrenic assortment of elites, some broadly in agreement, some utterly at odds with one another. That's how they can spout fluffy PC drivel one minute, while coming out with 'law and order' policies far to the right of even Michael Howard's reign the next. it's the ultimate valueless government for hire, whoring itself to whichever vested interest has the most money or influence at the time.

No wonder 90% of the population, that are not part of one or other elite are confused shouting, 'Commies!', 'Capitalist Extremists!', 'Facists!', 'Liberal social engineers!', 'Anti-labour thugs!'.

[Michael]

VP Socialist parties have almost always tended towards Fascism, which should not be confused with Capitalism. The Nazi Party, Franco's Facists, Pol Pot, the Soviets..... ALL socialists.....ALL fascitic opressive regiemes.

Animal Farm is an excellent satire which observes the inherently 'right wing' nature of all Socialism. It should come as no suprise that New Labour are acting in this way. What do you expect from a Socialist Party? Personal freedom and an efficient  'Small State Government', if so on what basis????

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

yes, it's far too simplistic to say we need migrant workers to fill jobs us Brits won't do............Where are all these people going to live?...............and they'll drive cars too of course.....Our infrastructure isn't up to it!