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markyh

Moved Into My Rented Ast House Today....but......

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Hi gang.

Need advice. We will complete on our STR tomorrow and we took on our 6 month AST today to make moving easier. After check in I was looking through the post already there for me from BT, sky, broadband etc and I found a letter address to the Landlord from Birmingham Midshires. i recognised her name from the AST I signed at the letting agents on Saturday.

Anyway, as the day went along moving in boxes etc the letter kept coming back to my mind. I started thinking that as BM are the "lie to buy" king shysters and as this letter was coming here, not to the Landlords address where shes living on the AST.

So I really started to think that maybe the house is on a residential mortgage and the AST address is maybe her parents (the Landlord is a "miss"), and that this could be an rate increase, late payment, or even repossesion notice.

So I at 5pm I thought feck it, and I opened it. Guess what? Late payement notice. £177k outstanding on a property that was bought for £185k in 2004, and the £799 monthly payment due on 2/8/07 was in areears with the next £799 due on 2/9/07.

Advice please on what to do. I cant tell the letting agent that I have opened the Landlords post, But I assume that a BTL mortgage the post will go the the owners residntial address not the BTL address? Which makes me think it's not on a BTL mortgage but the Letting Agent assured me that all Landlords are checked for correct BTL mortgages and insurance etc.

What should I do? And what happens if the mortgage in OO not BTL and the bank repossess during the 6 month AST? Do i have any rights to continue to rent from the Bank. Could I sue the letting Agent?

Thanks in advance for your help as i have a wife a 14month old baby girl who need protecting.

Mark

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Think your deposit is guaranteed by new legislation as you have just signed.

You should be safe for six months but I think I would already be planning the next move and checking up on my deposit which should be held by the agents.

Plenty of photographic evidence of the state of all parts of the property - seems like these people are in real trouble cash wise so might start getting grabby in six months time (keep your I know you lot are defrauding the Building Society bit till the very end if needs be)

Always try the citizens advice bureau maybe asking an hypothetical question if my landlord defaulted on my mortgage would my tenancy agreement superseed the Building Societies rite of repossesion

I have two under fives and have STR so I know "just move in six months time" isn't quite what yoou want to hear.

You might have slightly opened your own pandoras box but I'll bet I would have been tempted

Good Luck

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the Letting Agent assured me that all Landlords are checked for correct BTL mortgages and insurance etc.

This probably means the letting agent get the LL to sign a document saying they are free to let the property... I doubt they check with the BS.

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That sounds terrible, have you posted in the renting forum yet?

LOL. I thought of that but have you seen that forum this time of night. A ghostown.

M

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Hi gang.

Need advice. We will complete on our STR tomorrow and we took on our 6 month AST today to make moving easier. After check in I was looking through the post already there for me from BT, sky, broadband etc and I found a letter address to the Landlord from Birmingham Midshires. i recognised her name from the AST I signed at the letting agents on Saturday.

Anyway, as the day went along moving in boxes etc the letter kept coming back to my mind. I started thinking that as BM are the "lie to buy" king shysters and as this letter was coming here, not to the Landlords address where shes living on the AST.

So I really started to think that maybe the house is on a residential mortgage and the AST address is maybe her parents (the Landlord is a "miss"), and that this could be an rate increase, late payment, or even repossesion notice.

So I at 5pm I thought feck it, and I opened it. Guess what? Late payement notice. £177k outstanding on a property that was bought for £185k in 2004, and the £799 monthly payment due on 2/8/07 was in areears with the next £799 due on 2/9/07.

Advice please on what to do. I cant tell the letting agent that I have opened the Landlords post, But I assume that a BTL mortgage the post will go the the owners residntial address not the BTL address? Which makes me think it's not on a BTL mortgage but the Letting Agent assured me that all Landlords are checked for correct BTL mortgages and insurance etc.

What should I do? And what happens if the mortgage in OO not BTL and the bank repossess during the 6 month AST? Do i have any rights to continue to rent from the Bank. Could I sue the letting Agent?

Thanks in advance for your help as i have a wife a 14month old baby girl who need protecting.

Mark

What ever you do, do not admit to opening the post to anyone. It is illegal. I have been in a similar situation myself so I'm not judging you for doing so. It worked out for the best for me.

I would sit tight and see what turns up next month (not that I am saying you should read some else’s post). Now that she has your rent and deposit she can probably afford the repayments again. If you bail out you’ll probably loose you deposit, same for next month and the next month, so you may as well wait it out.

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http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/ind...showtopic=53082

This thread basically outlines the position with regards to the mortgage element. That said there are a lot of ifs and buts regarding agency accountability but in general if you take them to court the court SHOULD in theory reach a finding that if they hold themselves out to be professionals in this field regardless of qualification or affiliation they will be expected to act as such therefore you may have a case if it goes pete tong-definitely seek CAB advice initially too as it's a free good start point-hope this helps.

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This is a tough one.

You could always pass the mail onto the letting agent, asking them to hold it and give it to the LL when they see her.

Say that you opened one in error (you should already be receiving post at that address?), thinking it was yours etc. and then leave pretending that you have no idea that your LL is potentially in the sh*t. You never know - some nosey goit at the EA office may have a peek.

I guess now the LL has regular rental income from you, it means that the bank may take a little pressure off her - for now.

Alternatively, you come clean, say you opened it in error but had a gander at it and are horrified that you are in the situation that you are in given that the proper checks were done by the EA.

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So many utter numpties flying so close to the wind that they can't even manage a couple of months of voids

You have my sympathies

I do wonder why anyone already on the "ladder" would put themselves and their families in the hands of these idiots, once I'm on, thats it

No more renting for me, job permitting

Edited by DD20

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I'm pretty sure I've read this recently on the forum but its tricky to search for.

If it is a residential mortgage (could be all above board and owner moved out to live somewhere else and the BS know about it - unlikely but possible) and the BS don't know about the rental, you have no rights and if the property is re-possessed you can be kicked out straight away. :(:(

If its a BTL mortgage or the BS know about the letting, your AST stands for the duration although you'll presumably have to move out at the end.

As for the figures, 177K left on a 185K property sound like a 95% LTV I/O mortgage which looks pretty residential to me. :(

I once found a letter from Birm Mids to my neighbours flat which they rent. They left it in the communal area as it wasn't addressed to them. I could tell (without opening it) it was to say your mortgage deal is ending soon, do you want a new one? and I thought to myself, why do the BS send post to the landlord at a rented flat? If my neighbours weren't such nice people I would have contacted the BS anonymously. Its a shame thats its the innocent renters who'll be hardest hit by all this .

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What ever you do, do not admit to opening the post to anyone. It is illegal. I have been in a similar situation myself so I'm not judging you for doing so. It worked out for the best for me.

I would sit tight and see what turns up next month (not that I am saying you should read some else’s post). Now that she has your rent and deposit she can probably afford the repayments again. If you bail out you’ll probably loose you deposit, same for next month and the next month, so you may as well wait it out.

I wont ever admit to openeing the post. Not that daft. I will just say I sent it back to BM as not known at this address. The letting Agents have the £1275 deposit held under the new TDS via a company so the Landlord cant touch it. They have the first months rent @ £850, but the letting agent will deduct their fees for that, and the property is "fully Managed" by the EA. So the Landlord will get maybe £800 or less from my £850.

But, assuming she gets £800, that will cover hers arrears but come the 2/9/07 she will be in the poop again. Will have to sit it out but what worries me the most is if we have no rights of interest to the property as tennnents on a AST if it's not on a BTL mortgage. So the bank repossess and they kick us out in 3 months?

M

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As far as I can see, you've got her over a barrel. The only potentially worrying point is the possibility of a foreclosure during the period of your AST: but as she's only just started getting nasty letters, I'd be surprised if it could get to a repo within six months.

If, however, at the end of that period, there's any mieowing and hissing about returning your deposit, you've got all the information needed to shop her to her lender over letting a place on an OO mortgage. OK, opening someone else's post is illegal, but your line is that you accidentally opened it as one of a pile of letters, the others of which were all addressed to you. No magistrate or jury would take that seriously.

Edit: Your accidentally opening her post led you to uncover evidence of fraud, therefore it was your duty to report it...

Edited by The Ayatollah Bugheri

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So many utter numpties flying so close to the wind that they can't even manage a couple of months of voids

This also worries me....more meat to the story, we took over straight after the exisiting tennents left, apart from about 2 weeks. The exisiting tennents left on the 14th. So their last rent to the EA would have reached her sometime after the 14/7/07. The EA should have passed on the LL share by the the 2/8/07 in time to pay the Bank.

Then they have ours today so again in time to pay the Bank by the 2/9/07 so something is certainly amiss with the LL finances to me.

M

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If it were me, I think I would also pass the letter onto the letting agent, but if you can tear just a thumb hole and pritstick the rest down so you can't be held liable for opening it.

This raises a very interesting question about credit checks being done on Landlord's on behalf of tenants and not just on tenants on hehalf of LLs. Does this routinely happen?

I guess you could write to the letting agent and request confirmation of the landlord's situation. Try and get them to commit something on paper in case things go t*ts up.

At least you know that your rent should more or less cover the mortgage repayments and therefore repossession seems highly unlikely in the next 6 months. It may be worth while trying to find a longer-term LL for your next let though.

In fact, I shall definately be asking far more questions about future LLs now, including doing my own research into their main residence, family circumstances etc via electoral roll register and land registry and maybe get a bank credit check. Jeez, you can't trust anyone these days, not even a BTLer.... :rolleyes:

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Keep the trivia in the boxes for now. If the LL survives on your rent, then you'll be in a very good position to negotiate away any rental increase for the next term. Remember that the LL will be paying insurance and maintenance as well. Also, if they prove slow to respond to your needs, then you could drop a "are you sure this is on a BTL mortgage?" into the conversation with the EA to turn up the heat.

Edited by dellboy

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Hi gang.

Need advice. We will complete on our STR tomorrow and we took on our 6 month AST today to make moving easier. After check in I was looking through the post already there for me from BT, sky, broadband etc and I found a letter address to the Landlord from Birmingham Midshires. i recognised her name from the AST I signed at the letting agents on Saturday.

Anyway, as the day went along moving in boxes etc the letter kept coming back to my mind. I started thinking that as BM are the "lie to buy" king shysters and as this letter was coming here, not to the Landlords address where shes living on the AST.

So I really started to think that maybe the house is on a residential mortgage and the AST address is maybe her parents (the Landlord is a "miss"), and that this could be an rate increase, late payment, or even repossesion notice.

So I at 5pm I thought feck it, and I opened it. Guess what? Late payement notice. £177k outstanding on a property that was bought for £185k in 2004, and the £799 monthly payment due on 2/8/07 was in areears with the next £799 due on 2/9/07.

Advice please on what to do. I cant tell the letting agent that I have opened the Landlords post, But I assume that a BTL mortgage the post will go the the owners residntial address not the BTL address? Which makes me think it's not on a BTL mortgage but the Letting Agent assured me that all Landlords are checked for correct BTL mortgages and insurance etc.

What should I do? And what happens if the mortgage in OO not BTL and the bank repossess during the 6 month AST? Do i have any rights to continue to rent from the Bank. Could I sue the letting Agent?

Thanks in advance for your help as i have a wife a 14month old baby girl who need protecting.

Mark

Found this on the shelter web site:

http://england.shelter.org.uk/advice/advice-7504.cfm

Fixed term tenants

If you are being evicted within the fixed term your landlord will have to provide evidence to the court of the reason you are being evicted. Depending on the reason your landlord is using the court will either:

* have to make a possession order

* have to decide whether it is reasonable to make a possession order

If you have over eight weeks rent arrears or if the property is being repossessed by your landlord's mortgage lender it is likely that the court will have no choice but make a possession order. In other cases the court will probably only make a possession order if it is reasonable to do so. In deciding whether it is reasonable for a possession order to be made the court can take your circumstances (such as your health and income) into account.

So you'll get at least a month's notice by the looks of it - i.e. 2 weeks notice of the hearing, then 2 weeks to get out. Of course, if you continued to accidentally open your shyster landlord's letters, you'd get more like 3 months notice in total. I'd stay put but plan to move as soon as the tenancy was up if it doesn't look like the arrears are going to get paid (break clause after 6 months possibly?)

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The mortgage lender may put the house on auction as an "Investment Property" with your tenancy agreement to back it up. If you've got the cash, you could even take a punt there. Personally, I'd keep the riding leathers on, the safety off and ride it with a smile.

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It’s a bit more worrying that there was no real void between you and the last tenants. I’d assumed the place to be empty for a couple of months before you’d arrived and therefore your rent would have made the difference.

“I opened it my mistake in a pile of my mail” is plausible as people have said. And it’s really unlikely that the LL will bother to do anything about it even if you did it on purpose. I don’t think the lender can chuck you out if they want to repo the property. That’s why lenders don’t like rental properties. After all, I don’t think they can even chuck a squatter out unless they have someone else to move in straight away.

Speak to the Law Centre. I used them for advice with a LL. They were very good with me. They’ll give you some advice for free but I don’t think they fight your corner unless you are on benefits.

http://www.lawcentres.org.uk/lawcentres/detail/find/

Either way it’s not a nice position to be in. Good luck

BTW, there are two types of TDS. One of them does allow the LL to use the deposit however they want to. Are you sure your TDS is one where the LL cannot touch the money.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TenancyDeposit/DG_066383

Edited by ziknik

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Found this on the shelter web site:

http://england.shelter.org.uk/advice/advice-7504.cfm

I'd stay put but plan to move as soon as the tenancy was up if it doesn't look like the arrears are going to get paid (break clause after 6 months possibly?)

6 month break clause not needed. AST is only for 6 months, expires 28/2/08. I wanted a 12 month AST but the EA refused saying they only give 6 months AST at a time to give the LL "Options". Was a nightmare trying to get a 3 nice 3 bed property as all new ones went within weeks and no letting agent would proceed with us until we had exchaged on our STR. So 1 week before exhange date I did a deal with EA and LL on this house and paid an extra £150 "marketing loss" deposit refundable upon my signing the AST incase my exchange fell through.

Rental market is very boyant in Aylesbury for nice properties. They go like hot cakes.

M

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I haven't read all the replies but

1) send the post back to midshires, you won't even need to explain it being opened, if you want to speed things along give the forwarding address.

2) look for somewhre else at the end of your 6 months, you are safe, in a repo they wont want you there and will not kick you out so they will not look to market the house until they know you are out.

You don't need to worry about what kind of mortgage she has or anything this is her issue, could be many reasons why the post has come to you but this way it's all out in the open.

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BTW, there are two types of TDS. One of them does allow the LL to use the deposit however they want to. Are you sure your TDS is one where the LL cannot touch the money.

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TenancyDeposit/DG_066383

Yep sure the deposit is safe. Is held by a local company called the "Deposit Helders Ltd" or something on behalf of the EA as the property is "fully managed" by the EA. So the LL or the EA don't have the cash.

Even had a 3rd party "independent" check in clerk who bills the EA. She made loads of note changes to the EA check out clerks list of faults and took digital photos of bad stuff so top avoid any deposit disputes. much different from the last time I rented in 1995.

M

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Rubbish.

Absolutely!!! Im sure there are a good few legitimate reasons not least the small matter of if this landlord is in fact collecting rent with no intention of paying off the mortgage and pocketting the dosh instead-it happens more than you think and I reckon it's set to increase as things get worse-which would probably be fraud. Then there's the whole ethical issue legal or not of Mark's right to know about irregular landlord activity which could affect his security of tenure which I believe overrides the issue of opening mail by a long chalk! Mark you can always blame it on the dog/kids/granny without glasses on (delete as appropriate) for opening it by accident ;)

Edited by stonethecrows

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I'm in a very similar situation..My LL was receiving loads of mail from wht appeared to be her mortgage lender & finally curiosity got the better of me so I opened one.It made me realise that she had missed 2x 1040 payments on wht appears to be a 200000 I/O mortgage.The letters have continued 2 come & although I havent opened anymore,I managed 2 read a subsequent letter(by holding the envelope against the sun)tht a cheque my LL had sent her lender had bounced & she was even more in arrears.The envelopes since have grown thicker & I wonder if it means a repo might be looming.As with the OP,there seems 2 be something dodgy abt the details my LL has provided her lender with as I am fairly positive she doesnt live at the address on the tenency agmt & the BS seems 2 think tht she lives at my current address.Now my tenency ends this week & I'm worried she might be a bit funny with the deposit although the property is in fairly good nick.My tenency commenced in the pre TDS days & the EA isnt particularly helpful either.Wht r the chances I would b able 2 recover the money if I go dwn the small claims route?Wht if the LL has no funds to pay me,despite a ruling in my favour?Would I be bottom of the pile if she goes for an IVA,for instance PS-Sorry for the SMS speak..I'm posting this from my mobile

Edited by thirdwave

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