Guest muttley Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) "Mickey Mouse" Degrees Cost Taxpayer £40m Taxpayers are shelling out more than £40 million a year to subsidise "Mickey Mouse" degree courses such as equestrian psychology and baking technology, according to a pressure group. Top of their list is a degree in "Oudoor Adventure with Philosophy" I went to University 25 years ago and there were Mickey Mouse courses even then (Peace Studies at Bradford was the worst then) Three years studying Mickey Mouse would seem wortwhile compared to some of the stuff on offer now. I suppose it keeps the unemployment figures down. You can read the full report here Top 5 were Outdoor Adventure with Philosophy Science: Fiction and Culture Equestrian Psychology Fashion Buying Golf Management Edited August 21, 2007 by muttley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry AKA Pod Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Poor you Muttley, having to go to Bradford Uni. It's still a dump incase you wondered/cared. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Charlie The Tramp Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 They reported on BBC News 24 that 1 in 5 Students drop out before completing their courses in these type of subjects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest d23 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 [=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/21/nmickey121.xml]"Mickey Mouse" Degrees Cost Taxpayer £40m[/url]Top of their list is a degree in "Oudoor Adventure with Philosophy" I went to University 25 years ago and there were Mickey Mouse courses even then (Peace Studies at Bradford was the worst then) Three years studying Mickey Mouse would seem wortwhile compared to some of the stuff on offer now. I suppose it keeps the unemployment figures down. You can read the full report here Top 5 were Outdoor Adventure with Philosophy Science: Fiction and Culture Equestrian Psychology Fashion Buying Golf Management i know it's very easy to take the piss but fashion buying is not a mickey mouse job; I work for a clothing company and I know buyers for dept stores on 100k+ and they really have to know what they're doing, as their decisions can potentially cripple multi million pound retail businesses. i think anyone would struggle to find a justification for equestrian pyshology tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest muttley Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Poor you Muttley, having to go to Bradford Uni. It's still a dump incase you wondered/cared. I went to Manchester. I've never been to Bradford, but I understand the curries are excellent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rachman Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 i know it's very easy to take the piss but fashion buying is not a mickey mouse job; I work for a clothing company and I know buyers for dept stores on 100k+ and they really have to know what they're doing, as their decisions can potentially cripple multi million pound retail businesses. And you think that the people who are in these jobs got 2 Ds (or even double Ds) and got into Spunkbridge to read Fashion, innit. Or do you think they got proper degrees from proper places and worked their way up as buyers because they had a) the academic horsepower and the eye for fashion. I doubt the people on these courses will end up (in themain) as anything other than women (and presumably gay men) who dress up shop windows for Christmas - the course is not going to attract the best candidates, is it ? More the good people will be outnumbered massively by the deluded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cogs Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I very much disagree with this. Some of those address fairly large industries. Golf, fashion buying, equestrianism/"outdoor adventure" (call it tourism). They more than make up for 40 million, which isn't so much in the grand scheme of things. Not really my first choice and I don't think they stand as subjects where a degree is the appropriate form of recognition for training but there we go. They are ultimately all about making money, nothing wrong with that. A real "Mickey Mouse degree" is stuff like Classics, PPE, all that Oxbridge cr8polla they never get called on because little Rupert gets a job with his Uncle's firm in the City regardless. Funny how nobody ever says anything about that eh. I think you have to wonder what the real agenda is here. I'd suggest it is class based. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry AKA Pod Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I went to Manchester. I've never been to Bradford, but I understand the curries are excellent. Lucky you. Yes the curries are rather good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AuntJess Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Equestrian Psychology?????? Isn't that "Horse Whispering? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dhpcza Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Yes, have a go at some students costing the tax-payer 40 mil. Those benefit "chav scum" too while we are at it. Nevermind the billions spent for wars of aggression, on behalf of the oil and defence industries. It is the little people that are at fault. Not the ruling class. Repeat this over and over, doff your cap and do well to remember it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solvent Celt Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I very much disagree with this.Some of those address fairly large industries. Golf, fashion buying, equestrianism/"outdoor adventure" (call it tourism). They more than make up for 40 million, which isn't so much in the grand scheme of things. Not really my first choice and I don't think they stand as subjects where a degree is the appropriate form of recognition for training but there we go. They are ultimately all about making money, nothing wrong with that. A real "Mickey Mouse degree" is stuff like Classics, PPE, all that Oxbridge cr8polla they never get called on because little Rupert gets a job with his Uncle's firm in the City regardless. Funny how nobody ever says anything about that eh. I think you have to wonder what the real agenda is here. I'd suggest it is class based. Hmmn... rightly or wrongly the upper classes can afford to pi$$ away 3 years of their lives and loads of cash on a pointless Degree. The working classes don't have that luxury unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2Times Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Lucky you. Yes the curries are rather good. Manchester is better for curries, not Bradford, it has the highest density of curry houses on the planet in Rusholm, check the Guinness book of records. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry AKA Pod Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Manchester is better for curries, not Bradford, it has the highest density of curry houses on the planet in Rusholm, check the Guinness book of records. My Dad's bigger than your Dad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cells Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) we have about 1.4million students at any one time. half of them should not be in university (micky mouse courses, or dropping out before finishing, or failing). Or worse yet studying a course which the nation doesn’t require (for example we have more photography students than the whole of EUOPE needs!) The true cost to the tax payer is more than 5 BILLION PER YEAR If you then take into account that those 700k that shouldn’t be in university would be working and giving tax. That takes the figure up even higher! Edited August 21, 2007 by cells Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 i know it's very easy to take the piss but fashion buying is not a mickey mouse job; I work for a clothing company and I know buyers for dept stores on 100k+ and they really have to know what they're doing, as their decisions can potentially cripple multi million pound retail businesses.i think anyone would struggle to find a justification for equestrian pyshology tho. I bet most good fashion buyers don't have degrees in fashion buying. Alan Sugar doesn't have a degree in business. Bit like the way that most good IT professionals have degree backgrounds in (more difficult) maths, sciences, engineering, economics and NOT computer science. Outgoing chairman of Norwich Union has spent ten years running the company, with a degree background NOT in Corporate Management (or other such jargon) but...mathematcs, from a good well recognised university, Manchester. I have an aquaintance with a degree in Librarianship from Bradford. He has never managed to find work in a library despite trying. I have another friend, far more intelligent, with no degree, works now in management in Leeds University academic library and doing well professionally, off the back of just being brighter and more capable. There really are degrees out there for jobs which require intelligence and aptitude over and above superficial degree skill sets. Universities only sell these degree schemes in order to make money for the separated-from-reality numpty lecturers at the weaker establishments. The suggestion that a degree earns you more money is absurd in most cases, it's just the correlation between talent and degree which is coming out in the statistics, not any causal relationship between your degree and how well you do, except of course in specific technical areas, which are in the minority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy2Times Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) My Dad's bigger than your Dad. If your Dad is 6 foot 4 then yes he is. Edited August 21, 2007 by Jimmy2Times Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 Manchester is better for curries, not Bradford, it has the highest density of curry houses on the planet in Rusholm, check the Guinness book of records. I've done a critical anlysis of both, and, despite being a much nicer city and place to go out in, Manchester definitely has inferior curries, even if it has more curry houses per km. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cogs Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Hmmn... rightly or wrongly the upper classes can afford to pi$$ away 3 years of their lives and loads of cash on a pointless Degree.The working classes don't have that luxury unfortunately. Thats why they are doing a degree in something that relates to making money. At the moment we don't have a system that offers any form of integrity in the area of non-academic training. Its all very well to say they should do something else, but what? The system is broken. The existence of these not-particularly-academic degrees is just the best way of using the present system albeit in a way that wasn't intended. The notion of the "pointless" degree is a difficult one. Usually most of these "Mickey Mousers" will actually have strong links to the industries involved which is more than can be said for most other subjects. There are plenty of people with solid degrees from impressive institutions temping away as we speak, it isn't an easy call to make. Indeed, I would expect, for example, Golf Management to largely have a constituency of aging Club Pros and Head Greenkeepers who want to move upstairs, not spotty 18 year olds. Is a degree the right place for this sort of training? Probably not, roll on an improvement to the system. But to represent it as a terrible hit to the taxpayer is not a very good argument. Particularly when Brideshead Revisited-esque posh timewasting doesn't get a mention, given that the way funding works an hour of Oxbridge ancient greek costs the taxpayer at least four or five times what an hour on keeping the books for a golfcourse does at Chavsville Poly. Edited August 21, 2007 by Cogs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry AKA Pod Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I've done a critical anlysis of both, and, despite being a much nicer city and place to go out in, Manchester definitely has inferior curries, even if it has more curry houses per km. Not had a ruby in Manchester, but I can vouch they are lovely jubbly in Bradistan. Not had a night out in Manchester but I can't imagine a worse place to have a night out than Bradford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) I bet most good fashion buyers don't have degrees in fashion buying. Alan Sugar doesn't have a degree in business. Bit like the way that most good IT professionals have degree backgrounds in (more difficult) maths, sciences, engineering, economics and NOT computer science. Outgoing chairman of Norwich Union has spent ten years running the company, with a degree background NOT in Corporate Management (or other such jargon) but...mathematcs, from a good well recognised university, Manchester.I have an aquaintance with a degree in Librarianship from Bradford. He has never managed to find work in a library despite trying. I have another friend, far more intelligent, with no degree, works now in management in Leeds University academic library and doing well professionally, off the back of just being brighter and more capable. There really are degrees out there for jobs which require intelligence and aptitude over and above superficial degree skill sets. Universities only sell these degree schemes in order to make money for the separated-from-reality numpty lecturers at the weaker establishments. The suggestion that a degree earns you more money is absurd in most cases, it's just the correlation between talent and degree which is coming out in the statistics, not any causal relationship between your degree and how well you do, except of course in specific technical areas, which are in the minority. I understand your first point about worthless degrees...But what's so good about working for Norwich Union? My point is that most mathematics/physics graduates will go on to work in fairly establishment jobs i.e. financial services, global IT firms bidding for ID card contracts and budget-shattering NHS work etc., the global warming industry, pharmaceuticals etc... Few people can claim to be that useful, I'm afraid, even people who have maths or physics degrees. The majority of those fail in life, too. Edited August 21, 2007 by Brett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdc Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I bet most good fashion buyers don't have degrees in fashion buying. Then these days they won't get the job, unless it's in something closely related. My girlfriend would like to be in fashion buying (or selling, or more probably just wearing), but a degree in History and Art (from a good university) doesn't cut it. These complaints always puzzle me mind you, why do they always complain about degrees in big industries (and whatever you say, fashion and golf are huge) and never get so worked up about, for instance, Oxford and Cambridge still offering Latin and Greek? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slurms mackenzie Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) Snobbery who are they to say what constitutes valid study? They could have easily attacked other mainstream courses such as fine art or classic civilisations but oh no thats what little jemima will be doing after her year out touring the world, that simply wouldn't do. As long as the standards on the course are high*, why shouldn't these things be studied, they seem a lot more relevent than the arcane twaddle currently being peddled in our universities. *Erm i spose you do have to wonder. Edited August 21, 2007 by slurms mackenzie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilroy Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 I very much disagree with this.Some of those address fairly large industries. Golf, fashion buying, equestrianism/"outdoor adventure" (call it tourism). They more than make up for 40 million, which isn't so much in the grand scheme of things. Not really my first choice and I don't think they stand as subjects where a degree is the appropriate form of recognition for training but there we go. They are ultimately all about making money, nothing wrong with that. A real "Mickey Mouse degree" is stuff like Classics, PPE, all that Oxbridge cr8polla they never get called on because little Rupert gets a job with his Uncle's firm in the City regardless. Funny how nobody ever says anything about that eh. I think you have to wonder what the real agenda is here. I'd suggest it is class based. Fashion (buying) fades, only style remains.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Farticus Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 i know it's very easy to take the piss but fashion buying is not a mickey mouse job; I work for a clothing company and I know buyers for dept stores on 100k+ and they really have to know what they're doing, as their decisions can potentially cripple multi million pound retail businesses.i think anyone would struggle to find a justification for equestrian pyshology tho. Fair comment, but what about the BNP! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PunK BeaR Posted August 21, 2007 Share Posted August 21, 2007 (edited) I would imagine their is a shortage of equestrian psychologists out there so if there is a demand, people doing this course will probably get a job no probs. Whereas droves of newly graduated solicitors, accountants , normal psychologists etc are flooding out of universities into already saturated jobs markets. Its the govts inistsence on trying to get as many people through uni as possible thats very worrying. I think its 50% of school leavers they are now aiming for. It devalues the degrees people get and also leaves most students with a big wad of debt. Bitter pill for graduates to swalow when they cant get a job afterwards. Edited August 21, 2007 by PunK BeaR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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