Winchester

[kezzabazza]

Hi there,

Long time lurker on this forum who's finally decided to join in with the conversation. I live in Winchester in Hampshire - some of you may remember that Channel 4 proclaimed it the best place to live in the UK. Not sure about that, but I like it.

Anyway, I've been monitoring house prices quite closely in the area and I would say that the situation remains largely unchanged from a year ago - there may have been a slight slowdown but properties still appear to be selling quickly, with advertised prices gradually creeping up.

As a guide, there are 2 bedroom flats/houses on the market here for between £250,000 and £260,000. This time last year similar properties were on the market for between £225,000 and £240,000.

[TGF?]

Hi there,

Long time lurker on this forum who's finally decided to join in with the conversation. I live in Winchester in Hampshire - some of you may remember that Channel 4 proclaimed it the best place to live in the UK. Not sure about that, but I like it.

Anyway, I've been monitoring house prices quite closely in the area and I would say that the situation remains largely unchanged from a year ago - there may have been a slight slowdown but properties still appear to be selling quickly, with advertised prices gradually creeping up.

As a guide, there are 2 bedroom flats/houses on the market here for between £250,000 and £260,000. This time last year similar properties were on the market for between £225,000 and £240,000.

Hi there and welcome to the forum.

I'm also a Winchester-dweller, but actually hold a 60% share in a Shared Ownerhsip flat. Have a look through my early posts if this seems unlikely/inexplicable.

Anyway, I agree about Winchester - prices certainly don't seem to be on their way down. A recent Hampshire Chronicle headline had the annual hpi at 34% for the city, but I don't believe that for a second.

Personally, I'm interested to see how the forthcoming David Wilson Homes development at 'Abbotts Wood' gets priced up, as I think that will be a good indicator of the current market. A 98-home development is quite substantial for Winchester so we'll have to see whether these fly off the shelf quite as quick as other recent developments have.

I also noticed 2-bed flats on Sleepers Hill for sale recently at £625,000. Now that really is taking the p***!

[tomkeat]

Hi there,

Long time lurker on this forum who's finally decided to join in with the conversation. I live in Winchester in Hampshire - some of you may remember that Channel 4 proclaimed it the best place to live in the UK. Not sure about that, but I like it.

Anyway, I've been monitoring house prices quite closely in the area and I would say that the situation remains largely unchanged from a year ago - there may have been a slight slowdown but properties still appear to be selling quickly, with advertised prices gradually creeping up.

As a guide, there are 2 bedroom flats/houses on the market here for between £250,000 and £260,000. This time last year similar properties were on the market for between £225,000 and £240,000.

Hi and welcome kezzabazza' i am a lurker myself!

There is a wide range of property in Winchester, just look at this. Property for sale in Winchester. I have to say they are all reasonable for what they are each offering.

[Bootsox]

As a guide, there are 2 bedroom flats/houses on the market here for between £250,000 and £260,000. This time last year similar properties were on the market for between £225,000 and £240,000.

Stayed in Winchester a few times on business now, lovely place, especially note the availability of quality eateries.

Just on the subject of affordability though I am curious as to what people do for a living?

With entry prices into the market circa £250k, without doubling up, individuals must be on the region of £50k ish salaries to get on the ladder.

Reasonable BTL returns must be a bit of a non-starter?

Regards

[TGF?]

Just on the subject of affordability though I am curious as to what people do for a living?

With entry prices into the market circa £250k, without doubling up, individuals must be on the region of £50k ish salaries to get on the ladder.

Reasonable BTL returns must be a bit of a non-starter?

A large proportion of the workforce (I've heard mentioned a figure of 20%) work in London.

Although the commute is not great (I frequently make it myself), a fast train takes 58 minutes to Waterloo.

Winchester does also house the county council HQ, a crown court, and a Cat-B prison, which are large employers in the town (particularly the council).

BTL returns must, as you suggest, be appalling, as rental prices are nothing like those of the capital.

[ScaredEitherWay]

With entry prices into the market circa £250k, without doubling up, individuals must be on the region of £50k ish salaries to get on the ladder.

I had a quick look, starting prices seem to be about £160k, with the cheapest property on rightmove at £135k http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-754...=1&tr_t=buy

In my experience, most FTBs of lower income, tend to buy further out. So expanding the radius to only 5 miles (I remember 20-25 years ago FTBs would buy 20-30 miles away from work), then the prices drop to a starting point of a smidge under £100k with this 1-bed flat http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-150...=2&tr_t=buy

P.S. This "superior" (honest, it says that) property is just £65k http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-693...=1&tr_t=buy

These prices make Winchester no different to most towns imho. I suspect those buying the £250k homes are the people who bought these cheaper/further properties in the last 5 years perhaps.

[Guest happy?]

....

P.S. This "superior" (honest, it says that) property is just £65k http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-693...=1&tr_t=buy ...

An excellent example of Countrywide's marketing ********. All their properties are described as 'superior' even if they're a toilet.

Presumably some halfwit, semi-literate brassica in their marketing department came up with this wheeze. I'm guessing it's something to do with branding - they probably learnt it on a three-day course somewhere and brown-nosed their way to the boss - who 'green-lighted' it.

I did start a thread on 'Superior' properties - the best I found was a brown-field site i.e. derelict piece of land behind some average looking houses in Chandlers Ford - described as a 'superior development site' but all contributions welcome as they keep me amused.

[Bootsox]

In my experience, most FTBs of lower income, tend to buy further out. So expanding the radius to only 5 miles (I remember 20-25 years ago FTBs would buy 20-30 miles away from work), then the prices drop to a starting point of a smidge under £100k with this 1-bed flat http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-150...=2&tr_t=buy

This is the bit I struggle with (the £100k that is).

Assuming they take out a 4x salary mortgage with a 5% deposit. Their annual salary would have to be in the region of £23,750 (say £18,000 after stoppages). I know this is not a fortune but is this what young people earn these days (I think it might be nearer £15/18k)?

Even assuming the higher figure, on a 25 year 6% repayment mortgage their monthly payments would be £612, leaving £888 (£205/wk) to cater for all living costs.

Is this do-able?

What if they need to run a car to get to work?

Regards

Edited August 21, 2007 by Bootsox

[RichB]

I did start a thread on 'Superior' properties - the best I found was a brown-field site i.e. derelict piece of land behind some average looking houses in Chandlers Ford - described as a 'superior development site' but all contributions welcome as they keep me amused.

Have you read freakonomics? He has some interesting things to say about estate agents and their terminology.

[RichB]

I did start a thread on 'Superior' properties - the best I found was a brown-field site i.e. derelict piece of land behind some average looking houses in Chandlers Ford - described as a 'superior development site' but all contributions welcome as they keep me amused.

Have you read freakonomics? He has some interesting things to say about estate agents and their terminology.

[kezzabazza]

Just coming back to this, I'd be interested to hear whether you've noticed any significant shifts recently TGF? I was just browsing on the Belgarum estate agents website and I notice that they seem to have a number of new instructions.

This time last year (almost to the day) I was looking at 2 bed properties - mainly terraced, Victorian houses. Those advertised in East City (which I believe is basically Bar End) were available for about £240k. I now see that they are on sale for up to £295,000.

What it's hard to see is whether they are actually fetching anything near that price. If they are, then house price inflation seems to be steaming ahead here. I'll try and include a link (hope this works):

Belgarum - estate agents in Winchester

[davidg]

A large proportion of the workforce (I've heard mentioned a figure of 20%) work in London.

Although the commute is not great (I frequently make it myself), a fast train takes 58 minutes to Waterloo.

Winchester does also house the county council HQ, a crown court, and a Cat-B prison, which are large employers in the town (particularly the council).

IBM Hursley is a big employer and the salaries are around the 50k mark for a lot of the staff.

[simonp]

I'm sure I'm seeing more "for sales" up and I can think of about three flats that have been up for grabs for over 3 months now.

[TGF?]

Just coming back to this, I'd be interested to hear whether you've noticed any significant shifts recently TGF?

This time last year (almost to the day) I was looking at 2 bed properties - mainly terraced, Victorian houses. Those advertised in East City (which I believe is basically Bar End) were available for about £240k. I now see that they are on sale for up to £295,000.

What it's hard to see is whether they are actually fetching anything near that price. If they are, then house price inflation seems to be steaming ahead here.

Hi again, sorry for the delay in responding - just back today from two weeks in the States.

Anyway, not many HPC signs Winchester-way as far as I can see AT THE MOMENT. As another poster mentioned, a few flats seem to be sticking for a few months, but this is hardly that unusual and, for the most part, the properties in question are not in the best nick/area/both.

Still waiting for further details on Abbotts Wood, and keeping my eyes on the market generally. Will keep this thread moving...

[ca-uk]

IBM Hursley is a big employer and the salaries are around the 50k mark for a lot of the staff.

nah, not really. that'd put them in band 9 category and given most at hursley are normal techies they'll be 6's and 7's, with a lesser number of 8's and 9's.

i'd say average salary in hursley is about £30k.. i'll get my buddy in HR to slip us some info

[justAnotherFTB]

Another Winchester dweller here - as previously mentioned, not evidence of crashing prices around here *yet*

IMO with all the city money around here, it will take significant reductions in city pay, employment levels and bonuses before Winchester town centre (ie walking distance to the station) prices get affected.

I find 250-300k asking prices for a small 2bed terrace totally mind-boggling. Even starter homes in badger farm seem to be fetching 200k nowadays, crazy.

We rent a nice 2bed in a pretty nice area near the town for £850pcm - probably 1/2 of the cost to buy something similar. A no brainer really!

There do seem to be lots more for sale signs popping up recently, so perhaps we could see the market softening here into the autumn.

[maxD]

Another Winchester dweller here - as previously mentioned, not evidence of crashing prices around here *yet*

IMO with all the city money around here, it will take significant reductions in city pay, employment levels and bonuses before Winchester town centre (ie walking distance to the station) prices get affected.

I find 250-300k asking prices for a small 2bed terrace totally mind-boggling. Even starter homes in badger farm seem to be fetching 200k nowadays, crazy.

We rent a nice 2bed in a pretty nice area near the town for £850pcm - probably 1/2 of the cost to buy something similar. A no brainer really!

There do seem to be lots more for sale signs popping up recently, so perhaps we could see the market softening here into the autumn.

Heh, I am from Winch although I left about 18 years ago but my parents are still there. I can remeber when house went up in Badger farm they were 19-40k GBP. 40K was a biggie. I guess that would have been about 1981?

My parents are selling a place in town, 1 minute frm the high street. It is under offer now but I am surprised it took so 3 or 4 months to get this far. The location is great and from what I see from the previous links the price seems competitive for such a good location.

[TGF?]

My parents are selling a place in town, 1 minute frm the high street. It is under offer now but I am surprised it took so 3 or 4 months to get this far. The location is great and from what I see from the previous links the price seems competitive for such a good location.

This backs up my opinion that really not a lot is happening in Winchester yet, bearish, bullish, or any which way. Places are still being marketed at (often) high prices and most, although sometimes after a pause, seem to sell. That being said, some of the more optimistically-priced recent builds seem to be sticking for increasingly long periods - search for the 'Racquets' development for a good example.

As I mentioned previously, I am still waiting for any signs of action at 'Abbotts Wood'. Although the yellow roadsigns have been up for many weeks, there is simply nothing happening on site and the first completions, mooted for Spring 2008, seem a LONG way off at the mo. As this is just around the corner from me, and on my walk to the station in the morning, I have a strong interest in this one, and will keep you posted...

[TGF?]

A small bump. Well, 'Abbotts Wood' is finally seeing some action - demolition of the old council office buildings is underway, but nothing else. No development details on-site or on the david wilson homes (= 'posh' barratts) website.

Good to see Winchester still topping Phil and Kirsty's top 20 (at least for England and Wales anyway), but OBVIOUSLY, that means nothing. All of the HP indices are still positive however, notably the ones on the Beeb, which show an overall annual gain of ~12% (to August I think) for Winchester.

I would like to think (with no real basis) that Winchester would be one of the last places to suffer from a serious market downturn, and at the mo there is little evidence of downward pressure. It will come.

[TGF?]

Thought I'd get this one moving again.

'Abbotts Wood' continues to progress - all traces of the sturdy, not unattractive early-20th century office buildings and the former special needs school have been removed, the land has been flattened, and everything appears primed for the appearance of the latest Barrats toytown.

Winchester appears to be continuing in its steady, quietly-affluent way for now.

Any opinions on the future prospects of our little town?

[justAnotherFTB]

As I mentioned previously in this thread, I think it'll take some more city shocks to really get the Winch prices sliding.

There certainly appears to be a number of properties which have been on the market for a long while near us, but checking rightmove regularly appears to indicate this is primarily due to sellers failing to reduce prices. 2bed places with no parking are still going on at 250-300k (or more), no real evidence of prices moving yet. Two terraced properties I drive by have been advertised for sale for 6+months...

Also there have been a number of repeated sales taking place of the flats/town houses near the monument at the bottom of town - looks like some BTL repossessions in this area, several went to auction, apparently unoccupied for months judging by their appearance.

IMHO, next years bonus season will be the time to watch - if there are significant city cutbacks next year and the London flow of wages/bonuses slows surely it will eventually start to have an effect?

There are a lot of people on high wages around here, but there are also a lot of people with really bonkers huge mortgages too - maybe the mortgage resets next year will start to have some effect?

Sigh...Really I've given up worrying about it. Renting is cheaper, when something breaks the landlord fixes it, buying can wait, particularly at these crazy prices.

[TGF?]

IMHO, next years bonus season will be the time to watch - if there are significant city cutbacks next year and the London flow of wages/bonuses slows surely it will eventually start to have an effect?

There are a lot of people on high wages around here, but there are also a lot of people with really bonkers huge mortgages too - maybe the mortgage resets next year will start to have some effect?

Sigh...Really I've given up worrying about it. Renting is cheaper, when something breaks the landlord fixes it, buying can wait, particularly at these crazy prices.

Hmm, not much to report here really. Something is keeping Winchester prices sky high - can only be "generational wealth" or desperate optimism. That family money's got to run out sometime though, doesn't it?!

My favourite development - Abbotts Wood - continues to be marketed (poorly) and built (incredibly slowly). One side of Andover Road seems to be complete and perhaps 50% occupied, the other side of the road it's half-built and (as far as I can tell) no-one is living there at all. David Wilson Homes (posh Barratts) losing money hand over fist here.

Meanwhile, Barton Farm development rears its head again. Looks inevitable to me that I'll be losing my nice rolling views in the next few years. Just one problem though, who on earth is going to buy any of the mooted 2,000 properties? Even more crucially, who on earth can afford to finance and build them?