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Yorkshire Golden Triangle - Harrogate & Around


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just noticing this now, i like that place, inside and out, but, well, it's just the price, isn't it... a classic case of would-be vendor hoping that a couple of tens of thousands of pounds' worth of improvement can add a hundred grand or more to the selling price... being that far into, maybe being into at all, the half million quid/4% stamp duty bracket is just a bridge too far for that particular street.

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It's strange - in some ways I can't make up my mind what's going on.

Certainly, houses are selling, but there are more going up. 'Harrogate, Houses' in Rightmove had 660 today. There were 500 before Christmas, so the market is either very buoyant or there are more coming onto the market than selling.

BNW - I suspect you're right: it depends on the area of town. Between Wetherby Rd across the south & west of town as far as the Duchys - they sell reasonably quickly in the main. But elsewhere, maybe not. A house in Knares near my folks' has been on the market 3 times now - must've fallen through that many times.

I noticed that Spofforth has about 10 houses for sale down the High Street...?

Oh, one other thing. A couple of houses we considered buying last year went to 'Sold', so I expected to see them on Land Registry.. but they never arrived on the Land Registry website at all. I assume they were fall-throughs, and the sellers gave up?

Seems to be a common occurence, certainly when you look at the price comparison section and you see the number of properties that have been on and then not sold.

Even the ones that do sell like this one, originally £229k in Feb, SSTC at £199k - SOLD boards up with the two agents

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-25887979.html?premiumA=true

(Edit - love the way they have updated the SSTC listing to Premium to spread the 'Hurry now things are selling' bull.

yet it is clearly on existing owner purchase given the time it has progressed to a To Let property (2 weeks):

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-15814551.html

Another one on Leeds Road opposite the Co-op, brought for £170k at the end of last year and marketed at a laughable £225k and remarkably sold only a couple of weeks later to appear here:

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-to-rent/property-30215786.html

Edited by Brave New World
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Wow. That Mount Street one is bizarre. SSTC and up for rent too... what does that say? Hmm.

I posted that there were over 600 houses on the market in mid April (harrogate/houses on RM). Two months later and it's up to 660. Now I'm not sure if a new EA has appeared on the site, but that's a remarkable upshot in the number of properties on the market. It was around this level in the middle of 2007 just before the big drop. Not sure if it's indicative, but the level of supply is high again.

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WTF is going on with this one - 106 Leadhall Lane - I pass by this plot/house regularly so have been following its history

A new build (on an existing plot) - IIRC it was for sale during 2008 at asking price of £995,000 or something similar

It went sold on the Land Resgitry at £840,000 on 20/1/2009

It is now up for sale again at £1,225,000!!! the flippers asking for a mere 45% increase on the price they bought it for 18 months ago

106 Leadhall Lane

If you click on the Street View - you can see when the Google map car took its pictures it still had its SOLD sign up from the previous occasion

street view of 106 Leadhall Lane

I always had a sneaking suspicion that no-one actully lived in the house - and the photos seem to still show it in "show room" condition

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Some aggresive price reduction in Glebe Avenue, Harrogate finally gets a sale - £100k (28%) of original asking price

I bet the neighbours won't be pleased!

link rightmove - Glebe Avenue

via property-bee

15 June 2010 * Status changed: from 'Available' to 'Under offer'

08 June 2010 * Price changed: from '£299,950' to '£250,000'

29 March 2010 * Price changed: from '£349,950' to '£299,950'

06 November 2009 * Initial entry found.

will try and track this one through to when it hits the Land Registry to see actual sales cost

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Some aggresive price reduction in Glebe Avenue, Harrogate finally gets a sale - £100k (28%) of original asking price

I bet the neighbours won't be pleased!

link rightmove - Glebe Avenue

via property-bee

15 June 2010 * Status changed: from 'Available' to 'Under offer'

08 June 2010 * Price changed: from '£299,950' to '£250,000'

29 March 2010 * Price changed: from '£349,950' to '£299,950'

06 November 2009 * Initial entry found.

will try and track this one through to when it hits the Land Registry to see actual sales cost

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nice. that ad is for number 17, number 21, two doors away and presumably identical, sold for £395k in autumn 2007

definitely a sign that values have fallen somewhat but i'd also suspect that the £395k buyer was a borderline lobotomy case. either that or maybe the previous owner had managed to add £50k or so in value via the old 'sticks in a vase' trick...

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I think Tattoo'ed Lady had it right - WTF is going on?! It seems like HG is in a 'crazy mix' of house prices, not quite knowing which way to go - I suspect it's the same across the board, only maybe exacerbated by HG's daft house prices anyway.

My guess is that Harrogate's 'old money' is still prepared to pay top dollar as it's not yet been affected by the recession. Whereas the lower end of the market is being affected now. My 'Harrogate, Houses' query is up to 678 this morning. It was as low as 500 not so long ago (granted, with a couple more EAs joined in) - but whichever, there are a lot of houses on the market.

I reckon that it will be a matter of time before we start to see wholescale reductions again - it will be in a number of weeks when a large number of these just aren't selling. Kind of, 'point in time of vast increase supply, plus ten weeks' or so - certainly on the sub-400k properties.

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Another Oddity from the Harrogate housing market

I saw an unusual For Sale sign go up on West End Avenue about a month ago. It was not one of the local estate agents but was for a web-based agency.

http://www.emoves.me

The business has been started by a local Harrogate "entrepreneur" who used to sell Triumph bras. The USP is low cost.

Anyway when I looked a month ago there was only 1 house for sale on the web site and there still is only one. 35 West End Avenue, HG2 9BX

And what a price! On possibly the most over-priced street in Harrogate this property manages to be significantly more over priced than any house on the street.

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nice. that ad is for number 17, number 21, two doors away and presumably identical, sold for £395k in autumn 2007

definitely a sign that values have fallen somewhat but i'd also suspect that the £395k buyer was a borderline lobotomy case. either that or maybe the previous owner had managed to add £50k or so in value via the old 'sticks in a vase' trick...

well spotted - (although you got the house numbers the wrong way round <_< )

so on Glebe AVenue we have 3 terraced houses all in a row next to each other:

no. 17 last sold 19th Oct 2007 for £395,000

no.19 last sold 16th Dec 2009 for £360,000

no. 21 sellers started at £350,000 in November 2009 had to reduce asking price to £250,000

neighbours will definitely not be happy. As they are no sold price records on no. 21 one (ie not sold since 1995) we could think it is a wreck - but the pictures seem to show an empty property but in reasonable nick (although no photos of any of the 3 bathrooms)

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...Anyway when I looked a month ago there was only 1 house for sale on the web site and there still is only one. 35 West End Avenue, HG2 9BX

And what a price! On possibly the most over-priced street in Harrogate this property manages to be significantly more over priced than any house on the street...

i dunno, whilst the price is preposterous, clearly, that is still a nice place.

i don't think it's anywhere near as overpriced as [still, for some reason, unsold after 9-10 months on the market - i wonder if it's had any viewings?] this half million pound jennyfields pwoperdee that i may have mentioned once already on this thread...

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i dunno, whilst the price is preposterous, clearly, that is still a nice place.

i don't think it's anywhere near as overpriced as [still, for some reason, unsold after 9-10 months on the market - i wonder if it's had any viewings?] this half million pound jennyfields pwoperdee that i may have mentioned once already on this thread...

OK - cannot argue with that one :D

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It'd be really interesting to get the real figure on the number of houses selling in Harrogate. Rightmove has Harrogate/Houses standing at 693 right now. That's a massive leap up from what it was. They're either coming on at the same rate before and not selling, or they're coming onto the market in droves, and some of them are selling.

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I think prices are finally coming down in HG3 (I don't count Jennyfields as HG3 even when it's called Killinghall Moor). Bits are being quietly nibbled off prices. Latest example is this development Darley. It came on the market about 6 months ago. We looked at two units but were not impressed at all and thought them overpriced. A few weeks ago the agent relaunched the whole thing and has now lobbed £30k off each unit.

The prices are still too high, there are unfinished aspects to the development, very variable quality to the finishes, no outside storage or garages and insufficient parking. I think there are five units in all, none sold so far. Lovely.

This is another fallen through a sale - went as SSTC about a year ago and has now come back on Glasshouses. Ditto this after 6 months or so, Glasshouses2. The last one has been touted around the agents for more than two years now as has the barn right next to it.

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@Refugee - I hope so. There are more coming onto the market at a quick rate now, and I have noticed a number coming back onto the market having been SSTC previously - but with some 'weird stuff' going on.

This one was on the market for £295 originally, then dropped to £279k at the end of March. The sale fell through, but it's back on the market now at £295k! Needs a lot of work doing on it too...

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@Refugee - I hope so. There are more coming onto the market at a quick rate now, and I have noticed a number coming back onto the market having been SSTC previously - but with some 'weird stuff' going on.

This one was on the market for £295 originally, then dropped to £279k at the end of March. The sale fell through, but it's back on the market now at £295k! Needs a lot of work doing on it too...

As long as this remains unsold you'll be alright ;)

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As long as this remains unsold you'll be alright ;)

@ Jaspers; Now that does look overpriced. It's not exactly the best part of town, constant traffic on Karesborough Road and those streets are the hospital overflow carpark.

I think my first Glasshouses example has disappeared again so it may just have been a lapse of competence on behalf of the agent.

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As long as this remains unsold you'll be alright ;)

I used to live very, *very* close to that house. I think I'm right in saying it's been on the market for over 3 years. @refugee: it's not bad parking-wise, but it's on a cut through from town to the Broad Acres area.

Over 700 Harrogate/Houses on market now on Right Move.

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Was looking at home.co.ukand their stats for total property sales in Harrogate

April 2010 was an appalling month for the estate agents in Harrogate! - remember this is TOTAL sales in the month (ie includes flats, terraced houses, semis and detached)

Between 2000 and 2007 the average monthly sales for April was 159, this reduced by more than 50% in both 2008 & 2009 and then collapsed to only 24 sales in April 2010 - approx 15% of the pre-crash average

Any thoughts on what is happening? Is it a blip? is it a trend? May's figures not available yet - but definitely one to watch!

2qtc18o.jpg

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...Any thoughts on what is happening? Is it a blip? is it a trend? May's figures not available yet - but definitely one to watch!

2qtc18o.jpg

at a guess:

(1) Prices are still too high for people to be able to comfortably afford anything they even half like the look of; and

(2) The fact that prices are nonetheless a little lower than they were this time a whole three years ago is probably enough to pretty much knock out of the public's mindset the possibility of people being panicked into buying because they're worried about being 'priced out', 'left behind', or whatever, or indeed just buying property randomly even if you already owned one because it would go up massively in value etc.

so all in all people are only even trying to buy in very small numbers?

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Very interesting reading, but I'm wondering if it's because April's figures aren't complete yet? There may be more sales registered over the course of time.

But I think you're right, yes, it's too expensive as a rule, so only a few people are buying. Which amazes me that supply and demand mean they don't come down - though, given the number of houses on the market now, I'm pretty sure it's a matter of time before they start to reduce across the board.

Of course, it's interesting that there are the same number of estate agents in Harrogate, despite dwindling sales. Makes you wonder how they all still survive.

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I've now extracted all the data and I think there may be another factor at play.

If you look at the end of the year there was a significant rise in no of sales during Oct, Nov & Dec 2009. (caused by end of stamp duty holiday). In fact December 2009 was comparable with pre-credit crunch Decembers.

Then Jan & Feb 2010 were comparable to Jan & Feb 2008. So perhaps the April sales figures (which allowing for the 6-8 week cycle from offer to completeion were for offers made in Feb 2009) are because a lot of demand was brought forward to December to avoid stamp duty.

I have also estimated the May monthly figure - (I counted the number of Harrogate sales on Zoopla) - you can see that this is also well down and starts to look like a trend.

One to keep monitoring - I haven't seen another source for these figures and home.co.uk say they make them available 2 months in arrears.

r87d6o.jpg

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@Refugee:

Same house, 3 doors down...?

Check this out

Hmm, a lot less and it has a garage. It looks like a 1950s timewarp though. The more expensive example is at least up to date but so much more money. That terrace does at least have some character unlike some of the surrounding streets.

I've never lived there so have to bow to your superior knowledge.

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a new one [to me at any rate] from Nicholls Tyreman

this lovely pwoperdee, which has been up for sale for over two years now, now has a little red sticker in the corner of the ad proclaiming it a 'star buy'.

of slightly more interest is the price, £165k, far from bargain territory for a relatively small place in jennyfields, but a fair old cut [21.4% down whilst i've been looking at it] from an initial listing at a slightly shameful £210k...

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