Brighton Area

[i wanna house]

Our landlord had our place evaluated last week - our rental agreement running out in May - the letting agency told my partner today that they're sending us the notice letter.

The landlord is in financial difficulty and wnats to sell, so he's giving us two months to free the place. He wants to do some work to the house before selling (surprise surprise), so he wants us out by the end of the 1 year contract.

Incidentally on Friday we received a letter from the same agency asking us whether we wanted to extend our lease for another year, when my partner enquiried about this today she was told that it was a clerical mistake as the letter came automatically from the headquarters rather than the Brighton office...

We could really do with not having to deal with this right now.... We have a son, cats, and my partner is pregnant and we're expecting the baby in July... plus other things to take care of... thanks to Brown!

Do we have to go or do we stand a chance of refusing or asking to extend it? Does the intial letter they sent out mean anything in legal terms? Or notice has been served and tha's it?

Any idea?

have you thought of living on board the Enterprise ?

[Tired of Waiting]

(...) the letting agency told my partner today that they're sending us the notice letter. (...)

Very sorry to hear that. I think Sugarflux advices were very good, and covered most areas. I can't better it.

But the most important point is: Congratulations for the next little one! That is what matters. The rest are lesser details.

I'm sure you will find a suitable home, perhaps even better that the current one.

Maybe you could consider a longer contract, some 2 years? As the market bottom may take a while?

Best of luck Capt.

ToW

[shell]

Our landlord had our place evaluated last week - our rental agreement running out in May - the letting agency told my partner today that they're sending us the notice letter.

The landlord is in financial difficulty and wnats to sell, so he's giving us two months to free the place. He wants to do some work to the house before selling (surprise surprise), so he wants us out by the end of the 1 year contract.

Incidentally on Friday we received a letter from the same agency asking us whether we wanted to extend our lease for another year, when my partner enquiried about this today she was told that it was a clerical mistake as the letter came automatically from the headquarters rather than the Brighton office...

We could really do with not having to deal with this right now.... We have a son, cats, and my partner is pregnant and we're expecting the baby in July... plus other things to take care of... thanks to Brown!

Do we have to go or do we stand a chance of refusing or asking to extend it? Does the intial letter they sent out mean anything in legal terms? Or notice has been served and tha's it?

Any idea?

So sorry Capt. Picard, but I think you have to go, esp if there's a section 21 involved. But perhaps you could negotiate an arrangement whereby you could move as soon as you've found somewhere suitable, without incurring a penalty? So say you found a suitable new place next week, your current landlord might be persuaded to let you move out giving very little notice, without having to pay to the end of the yearly contract. Or if you can't find somewhere until June, then perhaps the landlord might be persuaded to let you stay the extra month? I'm not 100% sure on this but I vaguely remember that you can insist on staying in the property until you've found somewhere suitable because kids are involved and the law is kind of on your side. But the sheer stress of it all might make this option a complete no no.

IMO you should get out asap. The rental market starts getting cheeky come May, and by mid summer prices are a their highest and pretty non negotiable. If you found somewhere suitable right now you'd still be in with a chance of knocking the price down. Best of luck Capt.!

[CviewUK]

Do we have to go or do we stand a chance of refusing or asking to extend it?

If you wanted to you could probably delay this for several months.

Take professional advice:

http://england.shelter.org.uk/get_advice/eviction

Brighton & Hove City Council will want an eviction notice before you can be considered for these:

http://www.homemove.org.uk/uploads/BRHhomemove.pdf

[i wanna house]

while its all quiet on the housing front, i thought you all might find this amusing

Google Maps

Edited March 21, 2010 by i wanna house

[i wanna house]

while its all quiet on the housing front, i thought you all might find this amusing

Google Maps

ooops

try this link

http://maps.google.c...=&sll=50.823577,-0.133577&sspn=0.00122,0.002304&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=&layer=c&cbll=50.823577,-0.133578&panoid=bZ_zx1I3Jno2dGPdkkVZjg&cbp=12,217.62,,1,-0.01&ll=50.823492,-0.133638&spn=0,335.390625&t=h&z=1

humm .. why is not all blue ?..

any one know how to make it work ? its like making the first part of the address into a link and ignoring the rest so it doesn't work

this one

thats it !! check it out its funny

Edited March 24, 2010 by i wanna house

[i wanna house]

this one

works

Edited March 24, 2010 by i wanna house

[Capt. Picard]

this one

works

An excellent find indeed!

(BTW your very first Facebook link did work)

Boldly showing your beak where no other seagull has been before!

By the way,

thanks for everyone's support on the site.

We may have found something similar in a not too dustant area from where we are now.

We'll know more shortly.

Anyone having a laugh at the great budget delivered by the most bullied chancellor ever?

Edited March 25, 2010 by Capt. Picard

[i wanna house]

An excellent find indeed!

(BTW your very first Facebook link did work)

Boldly showing your beak where no other seagull has been before!

By the way,

thanks for everyone's support on the site.

We may have found something similar in a not too dustant area from where we are now.

We'll know more shortly.

Anyone having a laugh at the great budget delivered by the most bullied chancellor ever?

luckily i stocked up on cider..

[Tired of Waiting]

By the way,

thanks for everyone's support on the site.

We may have found something similar in a not too dustant area from where we are now.

We'll know more shortly.

Don't mention it.

Good to hear Capt. Good luck.

Anyone having a laugh at the great budget delivered by the most bullied chancellor ever?

I heard very interesting gossips from Labour. Remember Darling's "forces from hell"? So, that was a "shot across the bow", against Brown, and with it he got some concessions at the time.

Now, After the budget Darling came with that: "we'll cut more than Thatcher", remember? So, look what he got from Brown now:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/mar/26/alistair-darling-gordon-brown

Darling just looks dumb.

.

Edited March 27, 2010 by Tired of Waiting

[5lab]

has anyone looked at the housing exhibition at the brighton museum? I went over the weekend, was quite interesting to see things from a historical point of view - I knew a bit about the slum clearances, growth and decline etc, but it added a lot of context. Interestingly, they commented on the lack of housing being built in recent years (and the fact the last council towerblock was knocked up in the 70s) and suggested that new housing is being built in the towns surrounding brighton (haywards heath, hassocks, burgess hill etc) rather than brighton itself - but due to upwards mobility this is just the way it will be. They also suggested the worst housing was in some of the regency buildings near the sea - personally i've never seen anything grotty that way(?). it was also interesting to read that a lot of brighton's housing stock was built by private builders (Braybon etc) as speculative rental accomodation (build-to-let??), rather than designed for owner occupiers. Perhaps the housing stock is just slowly reverting to whence it came

Its an interesting theory - I mean, brighton's got a lot of scope for a few thousand extra flats - but new family homes will be a peacemeal activity - in anything other than the outskirts, its simply not cost efficient. A quick search on rightmove shows 72 properties in brighton\hove currently for sale with an asking price *over £1m*!

crikey!

[lotus eater]

has anyone looked at the housing exhibition at the brighton museum? I went over the weekend, was quite interesting to see things from a historical point of view - I knew a bit about the slum clearances, growth and decline etc, but it added a lot of context. Interestingly, they commented on the lack of housing being built in recent years (and the fact the last council towerblock was knocked up in the 70s) and suggested that new housing is being built in the towns surrounding brighton (haywards heath, hassocks, burgess hill etc) rather than brighton itself - but due to upwards mobility this is just the way it will be. They also suggested the worst housing was in some of the regency buildings near the sea - personally i've never seen anything grotty that way(?). it was also interesting to read that a lot of brighton's housing stock was built by private builders (Braybon etc) as speculative rental accomodation (build-to-let??), rather than designed for owner occupiers. Perhaps the housing stock is just slowly reverting to whence it came

Its an interesting theory - I mean, brighton's got a lot of scope for a few thousand extra flats - but new family homes will be a peacemeal activity - in anything other than the outskirts, its simply not cost efficient. A quick search on rightmove shows 72 properties in brighton\hove currently for sale with an asking price *over £1m*!

crikey!

".piecemeal..". I was brought up in the so called 'worse housing' near the sea in the 1950s-60s There were many families living there rather than itinerant, benefit claiming occupiers that inhabit the area now.

In fact, St Margarets House is in the footprint of where I went to school and Churchill Square where my father had a shop and we lived above.

I can understand why many families are outpriced by Brighton n Hove and that's because most of the buyers are coming from London London is now awful to live in- I lived there 35 years and was pleased to move back There are many, like me, who have realised high prices on their London properties and just want to get away - Brighton n Hove offer the best alternative outside of the Captital

[brightone]

I can understand why many families are outpriced by Brighton n Hove and that's because most of the buyers are coming from London London is now awful to live in- I lived there 35 years and was pleased to move back There are many, like me, who have realised high prices on their London properties and just want to get away - Brighton n Hove offer the best alternative outside of the Captital

Looks like the influx will not be ending any time soon

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/6419818.Brighton_and_Hove_set_for_population_explosion/

"A population explosion could mean 10,000 more people will be living in Brighton and Hove by 2018.

Experts and MPs have warned the boom could have “dire consequences” because of a housing shortage in the city.

"

[i wanna house]

Looks like the influx will not be ending any time soon

http://www.theargus....tion_explosion/

"A population explosion could mean 10,000 more people will be living in Brighton and Hove by 2018.

Experts and MPs have warned the boom could have "dire consequences" because of a housing shortage in the city.

"

i dont care how short of houses we are .. how can this be ?

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-28506122.html?utm_content=ealertspropertylink&utm_medium=email&utm_source=emailupdates&utm_campaign=emailupdates_sep09&utm_term=buying&sc_id=4087517

[brightone]

i dont care how short of houses we are .. how can this be ?

http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-28506122.html?

Bloody hell...I thought that those "only" went for about £250 at the absolute peak of the market

[All Seeing Eye]

I am very familiar with prices in/around Brighton at Peak before the 'pretend crash' as I was looking a lot at that time while trying to sell. Having looked again yesterday, prices in many areas seem to be 10-20% HIGHER than they were then. eg Shoreham beach it was just under the £250k price for one of those horrible new build lego 3 bed terraced houses, I see now they seem to be at £320k. Hove were about £280k, now around £350k, similarly in many other local areas.

---- WARNING!!! POLITICAL RANT BELOW ----

I can only conclude that having made prices totally unaffordable for UK workers, the only way Brown and co could continue to inflate the bubble was to devalue the currency, effectively lowering house prices by 25% for foreign buyers and prices have just risen to absorb this. So your savings (and salaries) have effectively been deflated in line with the currency for nothing. Given the huge support using tax payers money to fund fund the bubble it is no wonder the national debt is headed for 1.3 trillion, Labours own figures which in reality means 2 trillion. I can only assume they are poisoning the wells, trying to leave a trap for the next Tory government to wipe them out.

The problem is though they have gone SO far down the line that were house prices to return to NORMAL 3x salary rates, 70% of mortgaged homes (total guess figure btw) would end up in negative equity as even those who bought before the bubble have re-mortgaged themselves up to the eyeballs. Many will just go bankrupt and walk as it's a far more efficient way to clear 100k of debt. The banks will be left with the debt and again face a crisis but with the UK Government trillions in debt band so no money for a bail out this time so they go to the wall. The idea the government guarantee of 50k protection for savings has any meaning under these circumstances when they have no money is laughable. So the savers lose all their money.

Gordon Brown initially decided to finance the bubble to prevent it crashing which would have destroyed his re-election chances but is now locked in to propping up the bubble by taking on ever increasing debt to prevent this domino effect. Labour have effectively been doubling up on each bet on a roulette table when they lost the previous bet, a pyramid betting scheme which can get out of hand very quickly and has now passed the point of critical mass. Gordon Brown was counting on being able to buy his way out of and so hasten the end of recession in the 3 year window he had and so get re-elected. Brown couldn't care about how much destruction he is stoking up, he is on a personal, totally selfish monomaniacal crusade to get that 4th Labour Term and 8 years in power. It is ALL totally political, all about Brown and Labour with the British economy and it's very future the political football. As a socialist there is no downside, he has already nationalised the banks, if other industries like B.A, Railways crash they too can be taken into government ownership. On the flip side if Brown loses the election then the Tories will have to deal with the mess, and get the blame as Thatcher did and still does for Labours last failure and so and end up in the wilderness for another generation.

Labour seem to be counting on some huge private sector tax influx to pay it all back. But if you say earn £50k, so comfortably inside the supertax bracket you cannot even buy a 1 bed flat in Brighton on a normal 3x salary income let alone a family home which would require the £150k salary of Gordon Brown, so surely you and your supertaxes are going to emigrate, especially if you ever want to start a family. The quality of life in the UK with it's high crime, unaffordable houses , crappy weather and once the cuts kick in ever more social ills, makes this a no brainer. If the talent leaves then so do the companies that employee them and so taxes spiral. I'm surprised there aren't huge posters everywhere from Australia, Canada (who had no banking crisis) to entice these people and their taxes away. With the pound low and taxes rising, foreign alternatives will become increasingly attractive, especially for middle earners. So surely the deficit will just continue, year on year racking up the debt, until Britain is a banana republic without the bananas, either that OR the debt bubble has to crash whereupon the dole, pensions, public sector gets slashed due to a complete lack of money to pay for it.

Either way Britain's very future has been gambled and spent to repay the huge cost of one madman's political ambition. With the polls now so narrow it seems that for one man it will have all been worth it, but for the other 65 million of us, it is disaster waiting to happen.

[LiveAndLetBuy]

Consider this: http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-24905356.html

Note price: £252,500

See comment: "Vendor to pay 1% of the 3% stamp duty."

Now I make 1% of £252,500 to be £2,525

If the vendor dropped the price by £2,500 to £250,000 there wouldn't be any stamp duty to pay at all, and the vendor would be £25 better off! So why waste money just to keep the price at £2,525?

[LiveAndLetBuy]

I am very familiar with prices in/around Brighton at Peak before the 'pretend crash' as I was looking a lot at that time while trying to sell. Having looked again yesterday, prices in many areas seem to be 10-20% HIGHER than they were then. eg Shoreham beach it was just under the £250k price for one of those horrible new build lego 3 bed terraced houses, I see now they seem to be at £320k. Hove were about £280k, now around £350k, similarly in many other local areas.

---- WARNING!!! POLITICAL RANT BELOW ----

I can only conclude that having made prices totally unaffordable for UK workers, the only way Brown and co could continue to inflate the bubble was to devalue the currency, effectively lowering house prices by 25% for foreign buyers and prices have just risen to absorb this. So your savings (and salaries) have effectively been deflated in line with the currency for nothing. Given the huge support using tax payers money to fund fund the bubble it is no wonder the national debt is headed for 1.3 trillion, Labours own figures which in reality means 2 trillion. I can only assume they are poisoning the wells, trying to leave a trap for the next Tory government to wipe them out.

The problem is though they have gone SO far down the line that were house prices to return to NORMAL 3x salary rates, 70% of mortgaged homes (total guess figure btw) would end up in negative equity as even those who bought before the bubble have re-mortgaged themselves up to the eyeballs. Many will just go bankrupt and walk as it's a far more efficient way to clear 100k of debt. The banks will be left with the debt and again face a crisis but with the UK Government trillions in debt band so no money for a bail out this time so they go to the wall. The idea the government guarantee of 50k protection for savings has any meaning under these circumstances when they have no money is laughable. So the savers lose all their money.

Gordon Brown initially decided to finance the bubble to prevent it crashing which would have destroyed his re-election chances but is now locked in to propping up the bubble by taking on ever increasing debt to prevent this domino effect. Labour have effectively been doubling up on each bet on a roulette table when they lost the previous bet, a pyramid betting scheme which can get out of hand very quickly and has now passed the point of critical mass. Gordon Brown was counting on being able to buy his way out of and so hasten the end of recession in the 3 year window he had and so get re-elected. Brown couldn't care about how much destruction he is stoking up, he is on a personal, totally selfish monomaniacal crusade to get that 4th Labour Term and 8 years in power. It is ALL totally political, all about Brown and Labour with the British economy and it's very future the political football. As a socialist there is no downside, he has already nationalised the banks, if other industries like B.A, Railways crash they too can be taken into government ownership. On the flip side if Brown loses the election then the Tories will have to deal with the mess, and get the blame as Thatcher did and still does for Labours last failure and so and end up in the wilderness for another generation.

Labour seem to be counting on some huge private sector tax influx to pay it all back. But if you say earn £50k, so comfortably inside the supertax bracket you cannot even buy a 1 bed flat in Brighton on a normal 3x salary income let alone a family home which would require the £150k salary of Gordon Brown, so surely you and your supertaxes are going to emigrate, especially if you ever want to start a family. The quality of life in the UK with it's high crime, unaffordable houses , crappy weather and once the cuts kick in ever more social ills, makes this a no brainer. If the talent leaves then so do the companies that employee them and so taxes spiral. I'm surprised there aren't huge posters everywhere from Australia, Canada (who had no banking crisis) to entice these people and their taxes away. With the pound low and taxes rising, foreign alternatives will become increasingly attractive, especially for middle earners. So surely the deficit will just continue, year on year racking up the debt, until Britain is a banana republic without the bananas, either that OR the debt bubble has to crash whereupon the dole, pensions, public sector gets slashed due to a complete lack of money to pay for it.

Either way Britain's very future has been gambled and spent to repay the huge cost of one madman's political ambition. With the polls now so narrow it seems that for one man it will have all been worth it, but for the other 65 million of us, it is disaster waiting to happen.

I go along with most of that. HPI has been a global phenomenon over the last decade (combination of cheap credit, China keeping inflation down, and the ruling classes duping the masses into thinking HPI is a good thing). Brown didn't cause all of that, but he certainly has manipulated the circumstances for his own political advantage. I don't consider myself a Tory, but sometimes I feel that Labour are far more cynical and would go to far more extreme measures to keep hold of power.

[christhpc]

Either way Britain's very future has been gambled and spent to repay the huge cost of one madman's political ambition. With the polls now so narrow it seems that for one man it will have all been worth it, but for the other 65 million of us, it is disaster waiting to happen.

IMF TBH.

[shell]

I can only conclude that having made prices totally unaffordable for UK workers, the only way Brown and co could continue to inflate the bubble was to devalue the currency, effectively lowering house prices by 25% for foreign buyers and prices have just risen to absorb this. So your savings (and salaries) have effectively been deflated in line with the currency for nothing. Given the huge support using tax payers money to fund fund the bubble it is no wonder the national debt is headed for 1.3 trillion, Labours own figures which in reality means 2 trillion. I can only assume they are poisoning the wells, trying to leave a trap for the next Tory government to wipe them out.

The problem is though they have gone SO far down the line that were house prices to return to NORMAL 3x salary rates, 70% of mortgaged homes (total guess figure btw) would end up in negative equity as even those who bought before the bubble have re-mortgaged themselves up to the eyeballs. Many will just go bankrupt and walk as it's a far more efficient way to clear 100k of debt. The banks will be left with the debt and again face a crisis but with the UK Government trillions in debt band so no money for a bail out this time so they go to the wall. The idea the government guarantee of 50k protection for savings has any meaning under these circumstances when they have no money is laughable. So the savers lose all their money.

Gordon Brown initially decided to finance the bubble to prevent it crashing which would have destroyed his re-election chances but is now locked in to propping up the bubble by taking on ever increasing debt to prevent this domino effect. Labour have effectively been doubling up on each bet on a roulette table when they lost the previous bet, a pyramid betting scheme which can get out of hand very quickly and has now passed the point of critical mass. Gordon Brown was counting on being able to buy his way out of and so hasten the end of recession in the 3 year window he had and so get re-elected. Brown couldn't care about how much destruction he is stoking up, he is on a personal, totally selfish monomaniacal crusade to get that 4th Labour Term and 8 years in power. It is ALL totally political, all about Brown and Labour with the British economy and it's very future the political football. As a socialist there is no downside, he has already nationalised the banks, if other industries like B.A, Railways crash they too can be taken into government ownership. On the flip side if Brown loses the election then the Tories will have to deal with the mess, and get the blame as Thatcher did and still does for Labours last failure and so and end up in the wilderness for another generation.

Labour seem to be counting on some huge private sector tax influx to pay it all back. But if you say earn £50k, so comfortably inside the supertax bracket you cannot even buy a 1 bed flat in Brighton on a normal 3x salary income let alone a family home which would require the £150k salary of Gordon Brown, so surely you and your supertaxes are going to emigrate, especially if you ever want to start a family. The quality of life in the UK with it's high crime, unaffordable houses , crappy weather and once the cuts kick in ever more social ills, makes this a no brainer. If the talent leaves then so do the companies that employee them and so taxes spiral. I'm surprised there aren't huge posters everywhere from Australia, Canada (who had no banking crisis) to entice these people and their taxes away. With the pound low and taxes rising, foreign alternatives will become increasingly attractive, especially for middle earners. So surely the deficit will just continue, year on year racking up the debt, until Britain is a banana republic without the bananas, either that OR the debt bubble has to crash whereupon the dole, pensions, public sector gets slashed due to a complete lack of money to pay for it.

Either way Britain's very future has been gambled and spent to repay the huge cost of one madman's political ambition. With the polls now so narrow it seems that for one man it will have all been worth it, but for the other 65 million of us, it is disaster waiting to happen.

Yes. Good post.

D'you reckon the guvmen could ever stop people leaving the country?

[lotus eater]

I go along with most of that. HPI has been a global phenomenon over the last decade (combination of cheap credit, China keeping inflation down, and the ruling classes duping the masses into thinking HPI is a good thing). Brown didn't cause all of that, but he certainly has manipulated the circumstances for his own political advantage. I don't consider myself a Tory, but sometimes I feel that Labour are far more cynical and would go to far more extreme measures to keep hold of power.

I agree. Labour, and especially Brown, did everything to keep themselves in power. They are not the altruistic social democrat party they once were and I hope people will see Brown for the opportunist he really is.

I can't believe the amount of debt we've racked up and how many jobless people are not being helped into work. What are all these young adults and teenagers with kids I see wandering around Brighton living on........very adequate benefits at the expense of the working suckers? Many of these jobless are his electorate, if they could be bothered to vote.

[skomer]

I agree. Labour, and especially Brown, did everything to keep themselves in power. They are not the altruistic social democrat party they once were and I hope people will see Brown for the opportunist he really is.

I can't believe the amount of debt we've racked up and how many jobless people are not being helped into work. What are all these young adults and teenagers with kids I see wandering around Brighton living on........very adequate benefits at the expense of the working suckers? Many of these jobless are his electorate, if they could be bothered to vote.

Its going to be interesting too see how Brighton & Hove votes in this election.

The last local poll i saw had the Greens in the lead in Brighton Kemptown with the Tories a dead cert to regain Hove. Heard nothing about Brighton Pavillion.

Brighton has always had a large transient population who presumable dont register to vote locally but i wonder how the wall of London money that has descended on B&H these past 5 years will vote? My guess is that they tend to be more conservative than the local population (only because they tend to be wealthier). Plus i know so many Brightonians that have left to go and live in other neighbouring districts in Sussex since being priced out of Brighton.

Could we see Labour loosing all 3 B&H constituencies this time?

Edited April 7, 2010 by skomer

[All Seeing Eye]

Could we see Labour loosing all 3 B&H constituencies this time?

"I have a dream"

Labour cannot run an economy to save their lives, they have always left Britain with huge debts and have never staged a recovery, the conservatives have twice. However as long as Labour can convince enough people that all the countries ill's are someone else's fault (America, bankers) and the Tories can't be trusted they are hoping to pull through. Outrageous that Labour having nearly bankrupt the country are now trying to turn that to their advantage, warning of Tory cuts, given there wouldn't need to be any cuts if it weren't for Labour in the first place!

This election is a barometer of the gullibility of the British Electorate. The fear mongering by Labour that any party could do worse than Labour under Gordon Brown, or cannot be trusted compared to New Labour who lied for war is laughable. But can propaganda and lies secure Labour a 4th term? It doesn't really matter to me what Tory or LibDem will or won't do, I for one will not reward total failure with re-election (ex-labour voter - never ever again!)

Edited April 8, 2010 by All Seeing Eye

[i wanna house]

"I have a dream"

Labour cannot run an economy to save their lives, they have always left Britain with huge debts and have never staged a recovery, the conservatives have twice. However as long as Labour can convince enough people that all the countries ill's are someone else's fault (America, bankers) and the Tories can't be trusted they are hoping to pull through. Outrageous that Labour having nearly bankrupt the country are now trying to turn that to their advantage, warning of Tory cuts, given there wouldn't need to be any cuts if it weren't for Labour in the first place!

This election is a barometer of the gullibility of the British Electorate. The fear mongering by Labour that any party could do worse than Labour under Gordon Brown, or cannot be trusted compared to New Labour who lied for war is laughable. But can propaganda and lies secure Labour a 4th term? It doesn't really matter to me what Tory or LibDem will or won't do, I for one will not reward total failure with re-election (ex-labour voter - never ever again!)

And Mr Brown has promised to serve full term himself should labour win!.. i shudder at the thought

[LiveAndLetBuy]

"I have a dream"

Labour cannot run an economy to save their lives, they have always left Britain with huge debts and have never staged a recovery, the conservatives have twice. However as long as Labour can convince enough people that all the countries ill's are someone else's fault (America, bankers) and the Tories can't be trusted they are hoping to pull through. Outrageous that Labour having nearly bankrupt the country are now trying to turn that to their advantage, warning of Tory cuts, given there wouldn't need to be any cuts if it weren't for Labour in the first place!

This election is a barometer of the gullibility of the British Electorate. The fear mongering by Labour that any party could do worse than Labour under Gordon Brown, or cannot be trusted compared to New Labour who lied for war is laughable. But can propaganda and lies secure Labour a 4th term? It doesn't really matter to me what Tory or LibDem will or won't do, I for one will not reward total failure with re-election (ex-labour voter - never ever again!)

Labour's tactics are simple really: get 51% of the population working for the state and you you have 51% of the population voting Labour for fear of losing their jobs under the Tories. It's cynical and destructive, but it's effective.