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Influenced by another thread, I became really interested in by how much the low paid, and those with kids, can claim in the way of benefits and tax credits.

http://www.entitledto.co.uk/entitlementcalculator.aspx?cid

I warn you now, do not play around with this calculator if you have a short fuse or are in anyway of a dispositional nature. I mean, did you know that a single parent with a £35,000 salary paying £200 a week child minder costs is entitled to another almost £6,000 in tax and child credits!!!!!! This falls to a mere £500 if you were to exclude the £200 child minder costs.

Start playing around with 16 hour weeks and salaries of less than £10,000 and it makes you wonder why you put up with the stress of a higher paid job.

And people say that they can't afford children!

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And people say that they can't afford children!

Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

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Guest Cletus VanDamme

I dunno, seems fair enough to me.

Say I have an accident or illness and am unable to work. My wife gives up full-time work to look after me, but does some part time work and gets say 10K per year. We have no kids.

Having paid into the system all our lives it seems right that we'd get a few grand a year from Tax Credits.

Of course it'd be far better for the chancellor to set the income tax threshold to 10K or so, but what's the chance of that ever happening?

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Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

WTF are you spending it on!

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Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

Did you try the calculator?

How can you not afford kids incidentally, I'm genuinely interested.

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I'm entitled to f*ck all.

From each according to his ability...

To each according to their needs.

So obviously anyone with any ability (and mine is limited enough) pays for all the other needy scroungers.

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Guest d23
Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

???

how do you figure that out?

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I dunno, seems fair enough to me.

Say I have an accident or illness and am unable to work. My wife gives up full-time work to look after me, but does some part time work and gets say 10K per year. We have no kids.

Having paid into the system all our lives it seems right that we'd get a few grand a year from Tax Credits.

Of course it'd be far better for the chancellor to set the income tax threshold to 10K or so, but what's the chance of that ever happening?

I agree with you totally. However, there doesn't appear to be any way of not making the system advantageous to the work shy. I'm not calling low-paid workers work shy btw.

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Influenced by another thread, I became really interested in by how much the low paid, and those with kids, can claim in the way of benefits and tax credits.

http://www.entitledto.co.uk/entitlementcalculator.aspx?cid

I warn you now, do not play around with this calculator if you have a short fuse or are in anyway of a dispositional nature. I mean, did you know that a single parent with a £35,000 salary paying £200 a week child minder costs is entitled to another almost £6,000 in tax and child credits!!!!!! This falls to a mere £500 if you were to exclude the £200 child minder costs.

Start playing around with 16 hour weeks and salaries of less than £10,000 and it makes you wonder why you put up with the stress of a higher paid job.

And people say that they can't afford children!

Interesting. The woman in the other thread was working 17 hours a week (based on minimum wage). This is just enough (by 2 hours) for her to get her grubby hands on the working tax credit.

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i'm off to score around the clock

tsk, and i thought central banks wanted to reduce world population numbers...

Edited by dnd

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Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

I think what you probably mean is that you can afford to have kids and maintain the lifestyle you want.

That's fair enough, but it's not something that you should complain about.

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Me and my missus earn over £50K (before tax) between us, and have no debt whatsoever. We can't afford kids.

Some have challenged this but I don't agree with them.

A couple on a combined income of £50K get £10.43 a week child tax credit and virtually nothing else. After tax they will be left with between £30 and £40K. Subtract food, mortgage/rent, council tax, running a car and they will not have much left. For a responsible parent, bringing up children is frightningly expensive. Just look at the cost of shoes (and how long they last). I know people in this position and they are genuinely poor.

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Guest d23
Some have challenged this but I don't agree with them.

A couple on a combined income of £50K get £10.43 a week child tax credit and virtually nothing else. After tax they will be left with between £30 and £40K. Subtract food, mortgage/rent, council tax, running a car and they will not have much left. For a responsible parent, bringing up children is frightningly expensive. Just look at the cost of shoes (and how long they last). I know people in this position and they are genuinely poor.

i really can't agree with you on that; a couple on a 50K with no debt are not poor by any definition I can think of.

exactly what kind of shoes are we talking about here?

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i really can't agree with you on that; a couple on a 50K with no debt are not poor by any definition I can think of.

exactly what kind of shoes are we talking about here?

You spend £40 or £50 on a pair of sensible shoes and the little swines grow out them two months later.

The other problem is that the peer pressure to have certain clothes and gadgets is phenomenally strong. One can get all moral about it but the reality is that being the only child in the class without a particular toy is not fun. Poverty is a relative thing and children have highly sensitive radars on such matters.

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They could always abolish tax credits and raise tax limits, that might actually encourage people to work, or at least not penalise them so much for doing so.

It would also save a fortune in wages for people to work out entitlements and advertising etc.

They could also raise tax limits for people with children, paid to either parent who chooses instead of child tax credits so parents could decide whether they would like to look after their children themselves or pay someone else to do it whilst they go out to work.

No thats a silly idea.

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I dunno, seems fair enough to me.

Say I have an accident or illness and am unable to work. My wife gives up full-time work to look after me, but does some part time work and gets say 10K per year. We have no kids.

Having paid into the system all our lives it seems right that we'd get a few grand a year from Tax Credits.

Of course it'd be far better for the chancellor to set the income tax threshold to 10K or so, but what's the chance of that ever happening?

As usual Clitoris, you have hold of the stick, but by the wrong end

the tax they take from you ('paying into the system') is your costs to exist within that system NOW - it's not 'insurance' against a 'rainy day', no matter what they call your contributions.

It's basically the grown up version of the school bully stealing your sweet money. Hand it over, or bad things happen.

PS - hows that house thing working out for you? Still convinced London can never fall?

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With a combined salary (gross) of 40K, my wife and I get bog all. £0.

but if we had two kids we'd get an extra £20 a week on top of the £30 a week child allowance. I wonder if the wife will go for a spot of breeding practice.......that was wrong of me*

* :lol::lol:

Edited by DoctorJ

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Some have challenged this but I don't agree with them.

A couple on a combined income of £50K get £10.43 a week child tax credit and virtually nothing else. After tax they will be left with between £30 and £40K. Subtract food, mortgage/rent, council tax, running a car and they will not have much left. For a responsible parent, bringing up children is frightningly expensive. Just look at the cost of shoes (and how long they last). I know people in this position and they are genuinely poor.

This is an excellent example of how people have become less able to look further than the "retail experience" when consuming.

We have a drawer full of new and nearly new kids shoes, most of them Clarkes, that my wife picks up from car boot sales. Now, when I've mentioned this before, some of the cretins on this forum have come back at me with "I couldn't let my kids wear second hand", "it's all stolen" and other ignorant as U like, utterly crass comments.

The other mums are in envy of my daughter extensive brand name wardrobe and I'm not surprised. What they would pay for a pair of shoes their kid grows though in three months my wife could by a sack full of nearly new clothes.

Sorry but I just can pay through the nose for Chinese sweatshop crap that costs 20p to make!

The same goes for cars. I ran our last one for ten years, it cost £100! The last MOT in failed on a bulb! It's still on the road with a family member! The replacement cost £200 from an auction house, it's mint! A trade in from a main dealer. OK, it's ten years old but it's a Volvo 940 estate the most incredibly comfortable car I've ever been in.

If you can't help yourself don't expect anyone else to! FFS 50% of the world don't have enough to eat.

I blame the parents :P

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This is an excellent example of how people have become less able to look further than the "retail experience" when consuming.

We have a drawer full of new and nearly new kids shoes, most of them Clarkes, that my wife picks up from car boot sales. Now, when I've mentioned this before, some of the cretins on this forum have come back at me with "I couldn't let my kids wear second hand", "it's all stolen" and other ignorant as U like, utterly crass comments.

The other mums are in envy of my daughter extensive brand name wardrobe and I'm not surprised. What they would pay for a pair of shoes their kid grows though in three months my wife could by a sack full of nearly new clothes.

Sorry but I just can pay through the nose for Chinese sweatshop crap that costs 20p to make!

The same goes for cars. I ran our last one for ten years, it cost £100! The last MOT in failed on a bulb! It's still on the road with a family member! The replacement cost £200 from an auction house, it's mint! A trade in from a main dealer. OK, it's ten years old but it's a Volvo 940 estate the most incredibly comfortable car I've ever been in.

If you can't help yourself don't expect anyone else to! FFS 50% of the world don't have enough to eat.

I blame the parents :P

I agree with you about the second hand thing. People are getting far too precious these days. On the question of shoes however maybe I have duped but it has been drummed into me that children's shoes have to be sized carefully for width and length or the feet will be damaged.

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I agree with you about the second hand thing. People are getting far too precious these days. On the question of shoes however maybe I have duped but it has been drummed into me that children's shoes have to be sized carefully for width and length or the feet will be damaged.

You're right, and we do get her measured.

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You're right, and we do get her measured.

If you buy 10 pairs of shoes to get one pair right, doesn't that come out just as expensive?

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By far the most infruriating thing to read on this board is people playing the 'poor joe' when they actually earn quite decent money.

"Oh poor me, I earn 35K a year and can't afford a house."

"Oh poor me, my wife and I earn 50k a year between us and can't afford kids."

What fvcking rubbish. Don't give me all that "But I live in London" load of old pony either. My nan has lived there all her life, never had a pot to p1ss in. She's managed to get to 70-something years of age somehow and doesn't gripe half as some on here. Contrary to what you read on this board, not everybody who raises children are either millionaires or 'chav benefit scum'. Some of you people need a realty check, stop whining and realise how lucky you are. Yes houses are way over-priced and it's a wise decision to avoid getting in loads of debt. But get a fvcking grip!

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I'm with Ozzmoziz (sp?) on this one, and am in a similar situation & happy to give you the hard figures.

I earn £41k gross, my wife £25k gross.

Here is how my finances pan out over the month:

19th PAID £2,553

20th Car Loan £238.00

24th TalkTalk £21.00

24th Student Loans £315.00

1st TV Licence £11.50

6th Mobile Bill £9.50

6th Sky £43.50

9th Rent £600.00

11th Pet Insurance £10.50

14th Council Tax £135.00

16th House Insurance £10.00

---- Gas / Electric £45.00

---- Food £300.00

---- Travel £248.00

TOTAL £1,987.00

AMOUNT LEFT.. £566.00

Now her pay is £1,200 / month clear (after travel). Now consider this:

She is disabled, so would need to stop work to have a baby - leaving £566 / month for kiddie expenses & petrol (which is NOT much!)

Also, I live in the SE, and my rent is WAY under market value for where I live - I should be paying around £900. So all being equal - I would normally only have £266 a month to bring a kid up on.

Go on - pick holes in that, given I'd also need to keep saving for a deposit.

So there you go, I'm 36, renting, professional - & in 4 years time I'm off to the USA if the market doesn't tank.

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Not having a car loan or sky would double the spare money you have to bring up a child. God forbid you get a second hand car and don't have sky telly, I don't know how anyone could cope with that.

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