200,000 'social Homes' Given To Immigrants

[Yerman]

Anyway, thanks for adding to the debate, your contribution is easily forgettable!

Oh, sorry for the sarcasim. I shall spell it out for you as you seemed to have missed it: People here bandy about facts/statistics with no proof of their validity. I thought I would bring this to your attention in a humorous way. Patently you missed that. Perhaps I touched a raw nerve.

How did this contribute? A word comes to mind, hmmm what is it? Oh yes, hypocrite.

Edited July 2, 2007 by Yerman

[brainclamp]

Hold on. I thought it was Polish? So 600,000 Polish, how many Muslims?

What makes me laugh is that you all come out with facts and statisitics that are just utter rubbish.

I'd like to add my facts to this. 60% of the people who post here are lazy scum as they obviously have too much free time during the working day. 30% work at night. 10% only post from home after work.

85% of the people on this site make up statistics, 15% can't work out percentages and so don't bother.

http://www.migrationwatchuk.org/papers/p_D...ph_24aug_06.asp.

btw: I am a bull. Predicted the effects of mass immigration years ago. Surfs like you now work for the idle property rich.

[NoIdea]

Andy Jones you are full of it. On one hand you say that if you earn less that 27000 per year you are

a net drain on the tax payer, and on the other that these low paid Polish workers are paying for our retirement. If by chance they earn more than 27000 and ARE actually contributing then why the **** are they receiving social housing?

You are a troll, cerebally challenged and full of shit.

W*NKER

[Andy Jones]

What I once said is that you have to earn approx £27k a year to pay enough in income tax to cover what the State spends on you and your average family. I found it a suprising statistic and people on less than that income level are often indignant about how "their" tax is wasted without realising that they are actually a net cost to the country in terms of income tax revenue. In the US the top one percent of households pays 19 percent of federal taxes and its worse in the UK. At the time I made the point in an inflammatory way as it makes for a more interesting debate.

Clearly you are still smarting..

Now. As for the Polish workers paying for our retirement. Yes they are because there is more to tax and the economy than PAYE. By being here and by being busy bees they allow our economy to function. They spend on food and services and goods pay VAT and consume. Sure they send money home. But then I have a lot less of a problem with that than I do with the 2.2 million lazy scum who claim there are no jobs to be had and prefer to sit on their backsides grazing their Sky+.

I am not a troll. I am someone, with opinions, posting within the rules of this board. If you feel you can't make a counter argument or hold a debate with called me an onanist then that's up to you my friend.

ANDY

Edited July 3, 2007 by Andy Jones

[Xurbia]

What I once said is that you have to earn approx £27k a year to pay enough in income tax to cover what the State spends on you and your average family. I found it a suprising statistic and people on less than that income level are often indignant about how "their" tax is wasted without realising that they are actually a net cost to the country in terms of income tax revenue. In the US the top one percent of households pays 19 percent of federal taxes and its worse in the UK. At the time I made the point in an inflammatory way as it makes for a more interesting debate.

Clearly you are still smarting..

Now. As for the Polish workers paying for our retirement. Yes they are because there is more to tax and the economy than PAYE. By being here and by being busy bees they allow our economy to function. They spend on food and services and goods pay VAT and consume. Sure they send money home. But then I have a lot less of a problem with that than I do with the 2.2 million lazy scum who claim there are no jobs to be had and prefer to sit on their backsides grazing their Sky+.

I am not a troll. I am someone, with opinions, posting within the rules of this board. If you feel you can't make a counter argument or hold a debate with called me an onanist then that's up to you my friend.

ANDY

I'm not sure how you figure that someone can be a drain on society if they earn less than 27K a year. In order to function your 1% of rich households will probably need to employ a fair few proleteriat to do their chores for them. So it could be argued that the 1% are parasitic scum.

You blow your own argument to pieces. You extol the virtues of the Polish but are you going to tell me the majority earn more than 27k? So, by your own definition, these busy bees are a drain on society and send money home; or in other words they are worse than lazy British scum.

Nice work.

Edited July 3, 2007 by Xurbia

[OnlyMe]

Sure they send money home. But then I have a lot less of a problem with that than I do with the 2.2 million lazy scum who claim there are no jobs to be had and prefer to sit on their backsides grazing their Sky+.

I suspect a growing number of that 2.2 million are people that did have jobs, but now don't; or people that would have a job if it could provide wages that would make a material difference to their life.

A wage that will set you up in Poland say is not a wage that will cover NORMAL living costs in the UK. I'm not surprised people don't to compete or take those jobs, a lot are on dreadful terms, short term, contracted out, no stability, no long term future - the sort of job specs a mirgant worker looking for a cash fund to take back home doesn't mind (together with high multiple house shares), it's ok for a while but no way of life.

[Andy Jones]

Well obviously I'm going to have to take this VERY S L O W L Y.

To quote myself from 15 minutes ago "there is more to tax and the economy than PAYE". The UK economy desperately needed 650,000 hard working young Poles becuase we have 2.2 million lazy sods on the dole doing nothing other than consuming tax credits. A Pole in work is buying petrol to get to work, paying tax, VAT and eating food. By being economically active he is contributing more than just his PAYE. And even then he or she is a benefit. They clean better than the lazy arsed Brit they replaced (see my other posting about my Mums delight at the performance of the new Polish cleaner at her place of work). They also put more effort into being behind the bar, loading the luggage, sawing the wood or whatever else they do for a living as they are so pleased to be in work and earning good money.

The whole economy becomes more efficient. A small company making widgets might find it can get the same work out of 10 Poles that it could out of 12 Brits. Thus allowing it to offset the sky-high Sterling/Dollar ratio and remaining in business. Thus keeping trading and employing 20 people in all and paying a whole lot of tax to Alastair Darling.

There is more to UK PLc than your tiny job.

ANDY

[Andy Jones]

I suspect a growing number of that 2.2 million are people that did have jobs, but now don't; or people that would have a job if it could provide wages that would make a material difference to their life.

Umm, newsflash, unemployment has decreased since 2004 when the EU enlargement kicked in.

650,000 Poles rocked up and 99.5% of them are in work. In many many many many cases they have multiple jobs.

One the dole? You're a slacker scumbag. Simple as.

ANDY

[OnlyMe]

The UK economy desperately needed 650,000 hard working young Poles

No it didn't.

It needed 650,000 wages slaves to help prop up the govt and the prevent the BOE looking like a bunch of bent bananas by keeping inflation low.

[chichi]

The UK economy desperately needed 650,000 hard working young Poles

Doles?

Yes we need to get some hard working people off the dole.

[OnlyMe]

I suspect a growing number of that 2.2 million are people that did have jobs, but now don't; or people that would have a job if it could provide wages that would make a material difference to their life.

Umm, newsflash, unemployment has decreased since 2004 when the EU enlargement kicked in.

650,000 Poles rocked up and 99.5% of them are in work. In many many many many cases they have multiple jobs.

One the dole? You're a slacker scumbag. Simple as.

ANDY

You are Digby Jones and I claim my £5.

[Andy Jones]

Well 650,00 of those on the Dole clearly didn't want the jobs the Poles took so good luck to the Poles I say. You could argue that slashing benefits would have been better. I agree. But a Labour government can't do that because they'd alienate 2.2 million Labour voters.

Which is what is boils down to.

ANDY

[ruggedtoast]

So. 600,000 people in Poland under the age of 30 (generally) said - "ooh hang on, there are 2.2 million Unemployed people in Britain, no chance of a job there then, damn!".

Or did they say "Hey lad! I've just been over the Britain and they are crying out for people to come and work and the pay is good - come with me!".

Its just that in the Bank that my Mum works in they used to have a cleaner. She was appalling. The staff used to leave little traps for her such as a feather on top of a door sill or a crisp packet under a waste paper bin. They didn't get moved in 2 years. Indeed when CCTV was put in they were able on a Monday morning to watch her. She came in to clean at 18.00 and was paid to do one hours of cleaning of a bank branch public area. I've watched the footage where she arrived at 18.10 and left, yes left, at 18.16 having moved a few plants by a few inches and bizzarely moved a damp mop over a square meter of carpet for a minute.

They sacked her and employed a Polish cleaner call something hard to pronounce but whom they all now call Roy. He comes in and cleans like a maniac. The branch has never been so spick and span. He does this after doing a shift at a local factory where he packs cosmetics. After he cleans the bank branch he has another cleaning job in the offices of a local roof truss business. Clearely he gets up at 7am and goes to work in the factory. He then cleans the bank then the offices of the roof truss business. Me must finish about 8pm.

He is clean, pleasant and hard working.

I don't give a rats ass if he's made anyone unemployed.

Not least the lazy **** c@w who used to take the money for a slap dashed job even if she was 50 and local.

Its not the immigrants that is the problem it the 2.2 million on the dole, the 1.1 million on disability and the rest of the slacker workforce that we have in this country.

Let them starve.

Mind you, it would take a while in most cases...

ANDY

LMAO!

[Xurbia]

Well obviously I'm going to have to take this VERY S L O W L Y.

To quote myself from 15 minutes ago "there is more to tax and the economy than PAYE". The UK economy desperately needed 650,000 hard working young Poles becuase we have 2.2 million lazy sods on the dole doing nothing other than consuming tax credits. A Pole in work is buying petrol to get to work, paying tax, VAT and eating food. By being economically active he is contributing more than just his PAYE. And even then he or she is a benefit. They clean better than the lazy arsed Brit they replaced (see my other posting about my Mums delight at the performance of the new Polish cleaner at her place of work). They also put more effort into being behind the bar, loading the luggage, sawing the wood or whatever else they do for a living as they are so pleased to be in work and earning good money.

The whole economy becomes more efficient. A small company making widgets might find it can get the same work out of 10 Poles that it could out of 12 Brits. Thus allowing it to offset the sky-high Sterling/Dollar ratio and remaining in business. Thus keeping trading and employing 20 people in all and paying a whole lot of tax to Alastair Darling.

There is more to UK PLc than your tiny job.

ANDY

Andy, thanks for taking things slowly. So what you're saying is that if 650,000 Polish people are buying stuff and working but an English person, or lazy scum, isn't contributing the same even though they are paying PAYE?

Your Mum might get intense pleasure from her Polish cleaner but I don't see how dislodging an English worker benefits the economy.

If your Polish cleaner has 2 children and the English person has 2 children it's hardly economically viable.

Do you work for a small company making widgets Andy? I don't think you're a business owner because you'd be more considerate of the British employees. I reckon you probably try to sell widgets? Are you a salesman?

Unfortunately there will be little more than 'tiny jobs' available in Britain shortly. You might care to think about that.

[Xurbia]

Well 650,00 of those on the Dole clearly didn't want the jobs the Poles took so good luck to the Poles I say. You could argue that slashing benefits would have been better. I agree. But a Labour government can't do that because they'd alienate 2.2 million Labour voters.

Which is what is boils down to.

ANDY

Yes Andy I see your logic. It hasn't alienated anyone by allowing 650,000 in but slashing benefits would.

[Xurbia]

LMAO!

They sacked her and employed a Polish cleaner call something hard to pronounce but whom they all now call Roy. He comes in and cleans like a maniac. The branch has never been so spick and span. He does this after doing a shift at a local factory where he packs cosmetics. After he cleans the bank branch he has another cleaning job in the offices of a local roof truss business. Clearely he gets up at 7am and goes to work in the factory. He then cleans the bank then the offices of the roof truss business. Me must finish about 8pm

This tripe is beyond belief. It turns out that the Polish cleaner is called Roy. Funnily enough Royski Smith is a very common name in Poland. Quite clearly we have Royski to thank for Britain looking like a shiny clean button and he packs cosmetics and makes himself a nice rewarding cup of cocoa at 8PM. He always wears clean underpants and doffs his cap to the vicar.

[Andy Jones]

Your Mum might get intense pleasure from her Polish cleaner but I don't see how dislodging an English worker benefits the economy.

Well you don't see. You don't see higher productivity. You don't see pride in a job well done instead of badly. You don't see an improvement in quality. You don't see the simple virtue of a hard working employee replacing a slack ar5e.

He isn't called Roy. He is called something difficuly to pronounce. So being someone keen to work and fit in and get on he has made an accommodation. Something that millions of work dodgers seem unable to even contemplate. After all, they wouldn't want to miss this mornings Ricky or Kyle show.

Problem is you never hear my, widely held, opinion in the media or elsewhere. The vast majority in this country are hard working well behaved tax paying citizens. The media is a left Liberal leaning cabal of PC evangelists and unfortunately the Government is the same.

My views and examples may come as a rude shock. But I articulate what millions think. I'm all for the Welfare State and NHS. As per 1952.

ANDY

[OnlyMe]

One to watch. What's the betting that the shifted production involves the recruitment of lots of nice cheap labour.

......

Here's a nice little cosy set of employers, labour suppliers and unions - guess who appears on the list!

Temporary Labour Working Group members

http://www.ethicaltrade.org/Z/lib/2004/11/...ndex.shtml#memb

Temporary Labour Working Group members

ASDA, The Co-operative Group (CWS) Ltd, Marks & Spencer, Safeway Stores Plc, J Sainsbury Ltd, Somerfield Stores Ltd, Tesco, Waitrose Retailers

Premier Foods Food manufacturing

Fresh Produce Consortium Packers, wholesalers, importers, retailers

National Farmers’ Union Growers

Trades Union Congress

Transport and General Workers’ Union Trade unions

Agricultural workers

Fusion Personnel

Association of Labour Providers (from May 04) Labour providers Ethical Trading Initiative

......................

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/new...m_jobs_axe.html

Fury over jam firm jobs axe

3/ 7/2007

THE historic Robertson's jam factory is one of three earmarked for closure by their new owner - with plans to axe hundreds of jobs in the food industry.

Families across Greater Manchester have been left reeling as Premier Foods said up to 655 jobs would go from the factories - in Droylsden, Wythenshawe and Middlewich.

[Yerman]

No, that's called humour.

Rich is a very intelligent poster. Hang around newbie and enjoy!

Got you. So you are funny, I'm not. You're experienced, I'm not. If I hang around I'll have enough post counts that I'll be allowed to make facetious posts. Understood.

[wickywackywoo]

Well obviously I'm going to have to take this VERY S L O W L Y.

To quote myself from 15 minutes ago "there is more to tax and the economy than PAYE". The UK economy desperately needed 650,000 hard working young Poles becuase we have 2.2 million lazy sods on the dole doing nothing other than consuming tax credits. A Pole in work is buying petrol to get to work, paying tax, VAT and eating food. By being economically active he is contributing more than just his PAYE. And even then he or she is a benefit. They clean better than the lazy arsed Brit they replaced (see my other posting about my Mums delight at the performance of the new Polish cleaner at her place of work). They also put more effort into being behind the bar, loading the luggage, sawing the wood or whatever else they do for a living as they are so pleased to be in work and earning good money.

The whole economy becomes more efficient. A small company making widgets might find it can get the same work out of 10 Poles that it could out of 12 Brits. Thus allowing it to offset the sky-high Sterling/Dollar ratio and remaining in business. Thus keeping trading and employing 20 people in all and paying a whole lot of tax to Alastair Darling.

There is more to UK PLc than your tiny job.

ANDY

You talk some absolute sh1t, you really do.

Basically, what you are trying to say is that Poles earning under £27k (and sending lots of it home) are making a net contribution to the country but a Brit earning under £27k with all his money remaining and spent in the UK is not contributing but is a drain.

Apparently, Poles eat but Brits don't

99.5% of Poles in work? B0llocks. Make that up or get it from the Guardian, did you?

200,000 homes have gone to foreign poncers, none of these were of course Poles and houses cost nothing

The millions of people not working will now remain that way and I don't blame them. If it's a choice between working your b0llocks off for a sh1tty company for an absolute pittance that you cannot possibly live on, I'd do the same.

We managed without all these immigrants before. I see no reason whatsoever why we couldn't have continued to do so, just wouldn't be such massive profits for the greedy bosses in this country slowly turning us all into peasant slaves with no chance of a decent standard of living.

Yes the GDP of the country may grow. So what? There will be new schools/hospitals/infrastructure required for an increased population. The current f*ckwits claiming to govern us are hoping not to have to bother with all this stuff as the net affect will probably be zero or less if they do. All that counts is capita per head which I expect to head rapidly south in the coming years.

There is more to UK PLc than your tiny company and the gains you claim to make by exploiting immigrants on minimum wage. Like to see you live on a fiver an hour yet you expect Brits to work their b0llocks off for that in a country where a shoebox costs a quarter of a million pounds. I think the workshy in this country are smarter than you give them credit for. Pay them a wage that allows them to buy a house and they might suddenly develop some work ethic.

PS You have to work a minimum of 16 hours per week to qualify for tax credits.

[wickywackywoo]

I did indicate to you yesterday that he's a trolling 15 year old didn't I?

I don't believe he's that old. Your average 15 year old could see the gaping flaws in his posts.

[Justice]

Giving social house to immigrants ahead of local british people is nothing new but the Leicester City Council goes much better.

Back into the 80's and well into the 90's immigrants would buy a real crap house for well under £20k and as low as £4k and then set about painting the windows but not with gloss paint they used emultion and slapped it all over he glass to make the house to a bigger mess than it was and then they moved on to destroying the tolet.

Next thing you know they get a housing renovation grant and the house is gutted from top to bottom and everything from new windows, doors, plaster, central heating that is installed by companies like Sutton Builders.

Next you know the house is handed back to the immigrant and as long as it is not sold for 2 yearsthen he gets to keep the profit but often they use the house a colatral to buy another house for the son who then nips off to india to imort a wife and the cycle starts again.

This is a money for votes scam by the Council since most immigrants vote labour and it's strange that poor white estates never came under a houseing action area.

it's common to walk around Belgrave or Highfields and see house that have had this treatment more than once but you can gurantee it's white trash that are doing the work.

Yes ladies and gentelmen this is how your taxes are being spent and for all i know is still going on as i speak

[Justice]

Giving social house to immigrants ahead of local british people is nothing new but the Leicester City Council goes much better.

Back into the 80's and well into the 90's immigrants would buy a real crap house for well under £20k and as low as £4k and then set about painting the windows but not with gloss paint they used emultion and slapped it all over the glass to make the house to a bigger mess than it was and then they moved on to destroying the tolet.

Next thing you know they get a housing renovation grant and the house is gutted from top to bottom and everything from new windows, doors, plaster, central heating that is installed by companies like Sutton Builders.

Next you know the house is handed back to the immigrant and as long as it is not sold for 2 yearsthen he gets to keep the profit but often they use the house a colatral to buy another house for the son who then nips off to india to imort a wife and the cycle starts again.

This is a money for votes scam by the Council since most immigrants vote labour and it's strange that poor white estates never came under a houseing action area.

it's common to walk around Belgrave or Highfields and see house that have had this treatment more than once but you can just about gurantee it's white people that are doing the work come rain or shine.

Yes ladies and gentelmen this is how your taxes are being spent and for all i know is still going on as i speak

[Andy Jones]

Sigh. The point about earning £27k to break even on your PAYE contributions for a person with 2.4 children is a very easy one to grasp yet seems beyond you.

Mr or Mrs 22yr old Pole didn't need NHS ante natel or childbirth support. They didn't use an NHS dentist or doctor as they grew up nor did they need a place in a state funded classroom and nor did they take a space at a British university. They just rocked up at the age of 22, spoke English and got straight down to work.

They then continue to pay income tax and VAT and cosume in the economy and help it function. In general most of them sod off back to Poland and they certainly won't qualify for the UK State pension which won't exist in 30 years time.

So they have cost the country very little. Worked hard. And left.

Which is is stark contrast to the festering pools of depravity one can find on a council estate in virtually any town in the country who have barely worked a day in the fat indolent life having cost the country a fortune in NHS, Education and Police expenditure only to sit on their nasty sofas banging on about foreigners nicking all their jobs and pontificating about how the country has gone to the dogs.

Now if we could just find some way of deporting the 2.2 million on the rock and roll in exchange for another 2.2 million hard working young grafters the country would be all the richer and all the happier.

ANDY

ps I wish I was 15 again, it was a long time ago now.

[wickywackywoo]

Sigh. The point about earning £27k to break even on your PAYE contributions for a person with 2.4 children is a very easy one to grasp yet seems beyond you.

Mr or Mrs 22yr old Pole didn't need NHS ante natel or childbirth support. They didn't use an NHS dentist or doctor as they grew up nor did they need a place in a state funded classroom and nor did they take a space at a British university. They just rocked up at the age of 22, spoke English and got straight down to work.

They then continue to pay income tax and VAT and cosume in the economy and help it function. In general most of them sod off back to Poland and they certainly won't qualify for the UK State pension which won't exist in 30 years time.

So they have cost the country very little. Worked hard. And left.

Which is is stark contrast to the festering pools of depravity one can find on a council estate in virtually any town in the country who have barely worked a day in the fat indolent life having cost the country a fortune in NHS, Education and Police expenditure only to sit on their nasty sofas banging on about foreigners nicking all their jobs and pontificating about how the country has gone to the dogs.

Now if we could just find some way of deporting the 2.2 million on the rock and roll in exchange for another 2.2 million hard working young grafters the country would be all the richer and all the happier.

ANDY

ps I wish I was 15 again, it was a long time ago now.

Much of what you say is flawed. Plenty of Poles come over here with kids who take up resources the same as British kids, schools, hospitals, etc. They also sometimes require additional resources at school because English is not their first language.

They didn't need to use the NHS as they grew up? What's that got to do with anything? They weren't paying any taxes then, that is a totally neutral statement and hence meaningless. They are just as likely to need them NOW though as any British person. There's little difference if it's looked at logically.

A common thread of people arguing in favour of immigration is to rant on about all the feckless idle in this country and compare them to the incoming immigrants. Total nonsense. When are people going to actually see this has no bearing on immigration whatsoever for the simple bl00dy fact that we cannot get rid of the workshy? I agree it would be nice to exchange them all for hardworkers, but we can't, end of. So, instead of making that group larger (with all the expense and increased crime that entails) and removing all hope from them altogether we should be forcing them to work; this would obviously require ensuring there are jobs available for them though. Hardly rocket science is it?