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George Sore-Ass

Dubai Apartment Prices On-the-slide

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Information is heavily controlled in the UAE, so don't rely on the local papers to give an accurate view of the dire oversupply of property and the panic selling now under way.

Mrs Sore-Ass is a real estate agent in Dubai, and in the past couple of months she's been staggered by the number of unbelievable offers coming out.

For example, yesterday she was looking for a 2-bed at Jumeirah lakes that is already being built and will be delivered 2008. She was expecting the price to be in the region of 1.4M AED (a bit under 200k GBP). She called a few contacts and ended up speaking to someone at the developer of a particular tower. They said that in a few days time they should be able to offer her the 2-bed for 1M AED. Yes folks, that's nearly a 30% discount.

It turns out that like many off-plans in Dubai, most of the tower was sold off a year or two back with just a 10% deposit and the rest payable in regular instalments. But it seems large numbers of investors who stumped up the deposit are not meeting the instalments. Without the flow of cash, the developer cannot continue the building work. So they're getting tough on overdue payments and cutting loose the investors. Those guys put 10% down in the hope of flipping the apartment, but the market has turned and no one wants to buy. These investors are not willing to continue paying the outstanding 90% when the apartment price is already heading south. So they just bail. All that is left is for the developer to terminate their ownership for failing to meet the instalments so he can try to recover enough money to keep the building work going.

The most amazing thing as you drive past the hundreds of towers of the Marina at night is how few lights are on in the finished towers. There is a lot being kept empty by speculators. With rising interest rates, significant service charges and prices topping out or even falling, they're not going to sit on empty apartments for long, not when they see the various surrounding towers nearing completion that will pour further supply onto the apartment mountain.

Edited by George Sore-Ass

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Information is heavily controlled in the UAE, so don't rely on the local papers to give an accurate view of the dire oversupply of property and the panic selling now under way.

Mrs Sore-Ass is a real estate agent in Dubai, and in the past couple of months she's been staggered by the number of unbelievable offers coming out.

For example, yesterday she was looking for a 2-bed at Jumeirah lakes that is already being built and will be delivered 2008. She was expecting the price to be in the region of 1.4M AED (a bit under 200k GBP). She called a few contacts and ended up speaking to someone at the developer of a particular tower. They said that in a few days time they should be able to offer her the 2-bed for 1M AED. Yes folks, that's nearly a 30% discount.

It turns out that like many off-plans in Dubai, most of the tower was sold off a year or two back with just a 10% deposit and the rest payable in regular instalments. But it seems large numbers of investors who stumped up the deposit are not meeting the instalments. Without the flow of cash, the developer cannot continue the building work. So they're getting tough on overdue payments and cutting loose the investors. Those guys put 10% down in the hope of flipping the apartment, but the market has turned and no one wants to buy. These investors are not willing to continue paying the outstanding 90% when the apartment price is already heading south. So they just bail. All that is left is for the developer to terminate their ownership for failing to meet the instalments so he can try to recover enough money to keep the building work going.

The most amazing thing as you drive past the hundreds of towers of the Marina at night is how few lights are on in the finished towers. There is a lot being kept empty by speculators. With rising interest rates, significant service charges and prices topping out or even falling, they're not going to sit on empty apartments for long, not when they see the various surrounding towers nearing completion that will pour further supply onto the apartment mountain.

Everybody who do not hold their heads in the sand knew that Dubai was going to crash badly. The s**t will hit the fan very soon.

Edited by catara

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It has been on the cards for a while......the place had all the signs of being at the top when I was there a couple of years ago. Besides which, there isn't much there except sand and building sites.

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Looks to me that the only people doing well in Dubai property are the crane drivers!

And the sheikhs of course, they get a % of everything going on there.

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And the sheikhs of course, they get a % of everything going on there.

A little insight into owners in Dubai and some of the problems they face

Actual link : http://www.7days.ae/showstory.php?id=55147

Upset at delay of property

Last Updated : Monday 23 Jul, 2007 - 16 comments

would like to know if there is somebody else in Dubai facing serious delays in the delivery of the properties. I bought off-plan one year ago, already paid the 40 per cent of the total amount and the developer has not started the construction yet and there are no signs that they will start soon. Is anybody else facing a similar situation today? I know that owners of JBR had the same problem and would like to know what actions (or reactions) did they take.

Thanks in advance.

An upset owner in Dubai

Dubai

Posted by shaheen

Although I finally got my studio flat it was delivered late by about 6 months. At the last point it was not being released because the Real Estate Agent who I paid the installments to was delaying the final payments to the actual seller of my unit. When I signed the contract I was told by the M.D. of the Real Estate company that the unit was owned by him, it later turns out he was just an Agent. It is due to this reason that if I decide to buy another investment property I will do more research and maybe save up and buy something which is ready.

Posted by Captain

In February, I signed a lease for an office at Dubai Internet City, to start mid April. It's now 23 July, nearly four months after my company was supposed to move in, and the place is still a virtual building site. DIC are continuing to cash rent cheques, they say they will credit me next year. So I'm having to borrow to pay the rent (since no office = no revenue) on a property that is not ready!? It's a hard lesson to all of us. In this country you have no rights which is why investment here is such a risk. Like so much in Dubai, they promise so much, then use the cheapest low quality labour and contractors they can find. Once they've got your money, they don't care if the quality sucks and delivery is months/years late. They're got your money, that's all they're after.

Posted by Kareem

I have similarly bought off a 1BR in International City last July (2006) and promised delivery by november, december, january, march, july and finally september 2007. People do have a life.. and living in a house is part of it. We plan our life accordingly but then such unexplained delays seem to overrule people's lives. You just have no rights here in Dubai.. where can you go and complain and what do you expect to get... nowhere!! Born, raised & disappointed in Dubai!

Posted by Taner

I do not know if we are speaking about the same project, but my situation with Dubai Lagoon is even worse. I booked the apartment on Feb 2006 with delivery September 2007. Till now I paid 45%, and guess what, construction is not even started yet, and since last 6 months we are hearing the same story, stating that they will start in two weeks time. The delivery date is revised 3rd time to june 2008 where still no single brick laid. By the way in due course the developer is changed to Schon Properties, who is just launched Schon Business Park in DIP after the big success!!!!!!! shown on DUBAI LAGOON Project. I'm calling all the people reading this post to clearly write the name of their developers with the delays. Unless doing so, I do not know how these comments can be effective.

Posted by Ahmed

Taner , I have the same problem with DUBAI LAGOON project which managed currently by SCHON properties ,Im paying my installment since one and half year now , i already paid 50% and 10 days left for the next 10% ,still hearing the same sotry for the last six months everytime i call them 'Construction will start next week" , and last time they told me "sorry we can not tell you when construcition will start , its confidential" , i invested more than 2 million dirham and they are telling me its "confidential" ,we need to know the truth !!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by Ahmed

Taner , I have the same problem with DUBAI LAGOON project which managed currently by SCHON properties ,Im paying my installment since one and half year now , i already paid 50% and 10 days left for the next 10% ,still hearing the same sotry for the last six months everytime i call them 'Construction will start next week" , and last time they told me "sorry we can not tell you when construcition will start , its confidential" , i invested more than 2 million dirham and they are telling me its "confidential" ,we need to know the truth !!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by Oliver

Unfortunately for the reputation of Dubai & all that it promises to stand for - it is very obvious that major property developers like JBR/Estithmaar are above the law & can get away with blatantly lying &cheating its property investors & end-users. Estithmaar promised delivery of its apartments over 18 months ago & are yet to make good! We are the unfortunate owners of a Loft apartment at JBR & despite numerous letters & phone calls , over the past two months, to the Billy Daley a senior member of the Group we have not yet had the courtesy of a return phone call or a reponse to our query. Surely if the Boss(es) in these organisations to not have the courtesy to reply how can you expect a decent response from their junior staff. Perhaps 7Days can attempt to get a response for us! Tnks

Posted by Sai

Since April 2006, I have paid 35% of downpayment for one bedroom flat and the remainder 15% is already being completed by June 2007. Really upset to see that Dubai Lagoon Developer has come up all the way to tell its customers that the disclosing construction date is confidential. Just wanted to mention that we are all being fooled by the developer and an intervention by the relevant governmental bodies well appreciated!

Posted by jean

I, too, bought a property at Dubai Lagoon in Dec 05 with a promised delivery date of Dec 2007. They haven't laid a single brick yet but send nasty letters from law offices if one is late with the next payment. We have been hearing that construction will start within two weeks for the last 18 months! Shoen Properties, the new development company, has the same people in top positions as Dubai Lagoon. Different name, same game! Buyer beware.

Posted by Mehrdad

I have been fooled also by Dubai lagoon , They have lots of two weeks , thats all i have been hearing two weeks . it is now 6 month since there first two weeks???? can some help us please.

Posted by Marco

I have bought a Apartment at Dubai Lagoon as well, am getting the same answers that " Construction would start in a week or 2 weeks time " . I have paid 35 % till now and they been telling us to pay more payments There isn't a single nail on the site , they have a single shovel layed on the site conveying us that the construction is going on and the company has changed it's name to Schon Properties and not replying to our emails for updates. Plus they don’t even have sign boards on the site stating who’s the contractor , Consultans etc. I would ask the Developer to stop the lies and convey the truth to there Customers.

Posted by jean

I also have bought a 1 bedroom apartment in Dubai Lagoon. I have been led to believe that Dubai Lagoon construction was underway but I have now been told by a friend who lives in Dubai that not one brick has been laid even though I have paid 30% of the cost. I have not even had a reply from Dubai Lagoon too the four e-mails I have sent this fortnight asking for answers to why they have not started construction. I dont think it is unfair of me to expect a answer especially has they have quite a lot of my money

Posted by Taner

At least we, who are living here can see the real situation. The customers who bought from Overseas, they are logically thinking that their homes are under construction, and they will be shocked when they will visit the country next time. I believe the State should be having more authority on these developers, by organizing a Construction Committee, who is posing fines and compensations on this kind of Developers. Developers like Schon Properties are destroying the image of the booming Real Estate Market in UAE. Remember that real estate market here is based on trust, with too many people buying off plan properties. If the trust is destroyed everything will be upside down.

Posted by Irene

As a very disgruntled customer and buyer of property at Dubai Lagoon, Dubai Investment Park, I need to voice my anger, confusion and general disappointment with the Management of Dubai Lagoon. I am sure I am not the only customer who is fed up with paying for something (a building / development) which has taken more than 15 months to get ‘off the ground’. After going in to see the sales team at the Dubai Lagoon Site in May, and after many emails to Dubai Lagoon, I am still in the same position. Having to make payments for something that hasn't started to be built. Then after many months of waiting I receive this from the Dubai Lagoon Team: TO QUOTE: ""To allow the developer to be on time with the delivery schedule an early payment of your dues is advised. Our records indicate the following payments outstanding from your side: Installment No. 5 Amount Due: AED *****.** Due Since: 01/05/07 (Note: the above installment amount was net of adjustments) Please be advised that the Cancellation Committee of Town Center Management Limited (the developers of Dubai Lagoon) is very active and in order to protect your investments kindly do clear your dues in the coming 14 days. Failure to pay on time may advocate your case up to the TCML Cancellation Committee. "" I have tried calling Dubai Lagoon/ Schon Properties to ask either for more time to pay (thank goodness I am not overseas and unable to pay) and have someone explain that if I don't pay on time, will they cancel my contract and I lose all my payments? Also my property has been on the market for 3 months and of course, buyer confidence in this project is low, because the buyer cannot see fruition of the project! I would welcome any other buyers / investors in the same predictament, to write in to Seven Days and to voice their concerns. A lot of money is at stake here ... I Adams

Posted by Sy

I completely agree with Captain - I've bought 8 properties in Dubai, sold 3, and will never buy another in Dubai, period. Pay your taxes and live in the UK or anywhere else where they have civility, recompense, and some integrity. In the end, they won't let you get away from here without lining their pockets first. In fact, soon as I've sold my other 5, I am out of this god-forsaken land of lyers and cheaters who lose any conscience as soon as they have your money. The quality they promise sucks including such 'iconics' as the Palm, 12 out of 14 fronds are put up by the cheapest builders they can find - businesses with no ethics whom I have had the displeasure of having to deal with directly. In the end, these companies are gambling with trust and when they lose that, what have they got?

Posted by Sy

These people don't give a monkeys a***about your welfare. Do not trust them. I have had the displeasure of dealing with them [esp big Blue] for years - they take your $ and don't give a crap about you or your family - when you Q them, app 'it's all in the contract'. But they only give u the contract after you pay a 10% or whatever deposit, by which time they have already 'reeled' you in. Make no mistake, they know exactly what they can getaway with. So play them at their own game. I came here with rose tint glasses and everywhere I see the same discontent from investors. Don't get me wrong, I have made a tremendous amount of $ here from property but I never screwed anybody to make it. Why do they gamble with trust/integrity - surely they cannot win! I'm outta here 2008 thank god!

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Hi

I've been working in the real estate industry, and I've been noticing that prices in good developments are still going up in Dubai, they have already gone up by 15% this year only. However, it is true that investors are no longer making a profit in a couple of months like they used to, but this doesn't mean the market is going down as off yet.

With regards to developers, it is also a fact that the quality of delivered work in nowhere near the "high luxury standards" advertised in all developments, so that's making investor do their homework instead of just buying anything.

Check out restate.ae, it is a new real estate portal in Dubai, that provides listings of available properties, and price average statistics based on their listed properties. For example, the page for the Dubai Marina has average prices for rental and sales per bedrooms, this is very interesting for those interested in buying in Dubai.

http://restate.ae/en/neighborhoods/1-Dubai-Marina

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OMG... the Sheiks have just decreed that a bachelor can't live in a Villa, and any agent letting / selling same will have their license revoked.

FFS... talk about NWO model city!! F*ck this, we're off!!! What a bunch of total tossers. Zeig Heil Dubai.

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Hi

I've been working in the real estate industry, and I've been noticing that prices in good developments are still going up in Dubai, they have already gone up by 15% this year only. However, it is true that investors are no longer making a profit in a couple of months like they used to, but this doesn't mean the market is going down as off yet.

With regards to developers, it is also a fact that the quality of delivered work in nowhere near the "high luxury standards" advertised in all developments, so that's making investor do their homework instead of just buying anything.

Check out restate.ae, it is a new real estate portal in Dubai, that provides listings of available properties, and price average statistics based on their listed properties. For example, the page for the Dubai Marina has average prices for rental and sales per bedrooms, this is very interesting for those interested in buying in Dubai.

http://restate.ae/en/neighborhoods/1-Dubai-Marina

Keep your biased advertising BS on the pages of Gulf News, please. Your "savvy" nod to the fact that the building standards are crap doesn't give you any credibiltiy whatsoever. Transparent as glass.

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Keep your biased advertising BS on the pages of Gulf News, please. Your "savvy" nod to the fact that the building standards are crap doesn't give you any credibiltiy whatsoever. Transparent as glass.

Dude, there's no need for such a tone, you having problems at home?!

The building standards are crap - no questioning that. If you live here, it is a FACT that prices for rent/sale are still increasing, just a FACT, simple, and that's what I stated. Take it easy.

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In relation to DUBAI LAGOONS by SCHON PROPERTIES, I was informed this morning that they are now scrapping all the original plans and re-zoning. My apartment, which should have been ready December 2008 is now scheduled for completion in March 2011. I had a screaming match with a CRM at Schon and she told me that compensation would be decided on handover, the formula for calculating the same had not been decided upon but would be influenced by whether or not I'd paid my installments on time! At which point I resorted to swearing.... I said the very least they could offer was to pay rent on a 1 bed apartment until they gave me what I'd bought from them in good faith, she replied I was not the only person to ask for that - I'm sure I'm not. I promised her that I'd do my best to damage the reputation of Schon Properties, who continue to market developments and take money from people. It is important that the market knows what to expect. She thought I'd be stupid to do that as the value of my apartment would go down, I tend to think it's stupid of her to think that's my concern at the moment. I'm not one to use the word' fight' but I'd like for all of us who are potentially going to suffer from this scam to present themselves at Schon Properties to seek a solution. I have asked journalist friends to run the story in the local papers, but I think it would have a greater impact if we got UK coverage too. Does anyone have contacts that might want to run the story somewhere. I am not in Dubai at the moment, I'll be there next month, I'd like to know if anyone has approached the real estate authority - the female at Schon told me people had already tried and failed.

Let's please come together for the good of all involved, if we are active as a group we may get heard and get the compensation we are after now - when it matters.

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Hi

I've been working in the real estate industry, and I've been noticing that prices in good developments are still going up in Dubai, they have already gone up by 15% this year only. However, it is true that investors are no longer making a profit in a couple of months like they used to, but this doesn't mean the market is going down as off yet.

With regards to developers, it is also a fact that the quality of delivered work in nowhere near the "high luxury standards" advertised in all developments, so that's making investor do their homework instead of just buying anything.

Check out restate.ae, it is a new real estate portal in Dubai, that provides listings of available properties, and price average statistics based on their listed properties. For example, the page for the Dubai Marina has average prices for rental and sales per bedrooms, this is very interesting for those interested in buying in Dubai.

http://restate.ae/en/neighborhoods/1-Dubai-Marina

Yes thats very true and I agree whole heartedly, but it makes me wonder why people get so wound up and angry about Dubai, i mean, if you didn't invest there then whats all the venom and fight about? and if you did invest there, then your making/made money, so hat off to you and round and round we go

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Hi

I've been working in the real estate industry, and I've been noticing that prices in good developments are still going up in Dubai, they have already gone up by 15% this year only. However, it is true that investors are no longer making a profit in a couple of months like they used to, but this doesn't mean the market is going down as off yet.

With regards to developers, it is also a fact that the quality of delivered work in nowhere near the "high luxury standards" advertised in all developments, so that's making investor do their homework instead of just buying anything.

Check out restate.ae, it is a new real estate portal in Dubai, that provides listings of available properties, and price average statistics based on their listed properties. For example, the page for the Dubai Marina has average prices for rental and sales per bedrooms, this is very interesting for those interested in buying in Dubai.

http://restate.ae/en/neighborhoods/1-Dubai-Marina

:rolleyes:

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paul789, I like the way that you mixed some reasonable and down to earth sounding comments with your spam. I very nearly went and bought a property in Dubai until the wife hit me over the head with a saucepan and told me that you are probably yet another estate agent spamming the forum. (& who would have thought it from a first time poster!). Just as well someone in our household is on the ball...

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paul789, I like the way that you mixed some reasonable and down to earth sounding comments with your spam. I very nearly went and bought a property in Dubai until the wife hit me over the head with a saucepan and told me that you are probably yet another estate agent spamming the forum. (& who would have thought it from a first time poster!). Just as well someone in our household is on the ball...

This was probably the same wife that encouraged you to buy a house in the U.K 2 years ago. . . .

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This was probably the same wife that encouraged you to buy a house in the U.K 2 years ago. . . .

Hee, hee, hee........ :lol:

I just stumbled onto this thread from the French property thread just above it. What a hoot. All these Dubai proerty rampers getting their knickers in a twist :P

No doubt many have made money. You can be sure that many will lose money. Tis the nature of the market.

As this site is about PRICE CRASHES, can any of our Dubai experts give me an indication as to when they expect the Dubai bubble to burst ?

(and NEVER is not an acceptable response :rolleyes: )

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Hee, hee, hee........ :lol:

I just stumbled onto this thread from the French property thread just above it. What a hoot. All these Dubai proerty rampers getting their knickers in a twist :P

No doubt many have made money. You can be sure that many will lose money. Tis the nature of the market.

As this site is about PRICE CRASHES, can any of our Dubai experts give me an indication as to when they expect the Dubai bubble to burst ?

(and NEVER is not an acceptable response :rolleyes: )

Its happening as we speak, it will carry on into next year when we will have a clearer picture that how low will it go. My estimate 60% to 70%, from its last year peak.

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Dubai and AD property market 'at standstill'

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/535940-duba...near-standstill

Off-plan prices in Jebel Ali Palm crash 40% in two months

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/537326-prop...bel-ali-fall-40

DAMAC lays off 100 people, other developers following

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/537423-at-l...rty-giant-damac

The developers pretend this is a temporary liquidity problem stalling the market and will be over by December (!). Why lay off 100 staff then? DAMAC also closed their UK sales offices.

The local currency is pegged to the dollar, which means in the last couple of months not only has Dubai been hit by the credit crunch (90% mortages are history, now 65% is the best you can get) but Brits and Europeans get 20% less for their money than 2 months back.

And things will only get worse. Oil has fallen from 147 bucks to around 60 in the space of 3 months, so even the supposed bottomless pit of money is evaporating. And tourism? Maintaining even present levels will be tough with the biggest markets (UK and Europe) in deep recessions, and the plunging UK/Eur currencies makes matters even worse.

Oh, and the stock market has absolutely cratered over the past couple of months by around 40%, led largely by developers and banks. Emaar (biggest developer) is down to around a 10th of its price from 3-4 years ago. The stock market is already signalling the expectation that the Dubai property market will fall sharply.

The Dubai story is really no different to the US or UK story. Cheap borrowing, speculative bubble forcing up prices and a widespread belief that 'this time is different' and 'this place is different'. We saw this even 6 months ago before YoY figures for the UK turned negative. They were still talking it up and some were still saying no crash imminent when if you looked at 6 month figures you would see prices falling fast already.

Of course, in Dubai we are told that property is 'in short supply' and the population is 'set to grow hugely'. Most of the population growth of the past few years has been driven by construction, and to a less extent, tourism. When that stalls, you suddenly have a ton of people having to leave and suddenly your population growth turns into an exodus. Look at the Poles leaving Britain and then imagine 90% of the UK resident population was expats from eastern Europe and you get an idea how big this is going to get.

Total wipeout.

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Dubai and AD property market 'at standstill'

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/535940-duba...near-standstill

Off-plan prices in Jebel Ali Palm crash 40% in two months

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/537326-prop...bel-ali-fall-40

DAMAC lays off 100 people, other developers following

http://www.arabianbusiness.com/537423-at-l...rty-giant-damac

The developers pretend this is a temporary liquidity problem stalling the market and will be over by December (!). Why lay off 100 staff then? DAMAC also closed their UK sales offices.

The local currency is pegged to the dollar, which means in the last couple of months not only has Dubai been hit by the credit crunch (90% mortages are history, now 65% is the best you can get) but Brits and Europeans get 20% less for their money than 2 months back.

And things will only get worse. Oil has fallen from 147 bucks to around 60 in the space of 3 months, so even the supposed bottomless pit of money is evaporating. And tourism? Maintaining even present levels will be tough with the biggest markets (UK and Europe) in deep recessions, and the plunging UK/Eur currencies makes matters even worse.

Oh, and the stock market has absolutely cratered over the past couple of months by around 40%, led largely by developers and banks. Emaar (biggest developer) is down to around a 10th of its price from 3-4 years ago. The stock market is already signalling the expectation that the Dubai property market will fall sharply.

The Dubai story is really no different to the US or UK story. Cheap borrowing, speculative bubble forcing up prices and a widespread belief that 'this time is different' and 'this place is different'. We saw this even 6 months ago before YoY figures for the UK turned negative. They were still talking it up and some were still saying no crash imminent when if you looked at 6 month figures you would see prices falling fast already.

Of course, in Dubai we are told that property is 'in short supply' and the population is 'set to grow hugely'. Most of the population growth of the past few years has been driven by construction, and to a less extent, tourism. When that stalls, you suddenly have a ton of people having to leave and suddenly your population growth turns into an exodus. Look at the Poles leaving Britain and then imagine 90% of the UK resident population was expats from eastern Europe and you get an idea how big this is going to get.

Total wipeout.

Good post

why some people think that Dubai is going to be different than UK/ USA is beyond me! I think it will be worse off due to oil running out & too much reliance on "properties" for growth.

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Dude, there's no need for such a tone, you having problems at home?!

The building standards are crap - no questioning that. If you live here, it is a FACT that prices for rent/sale are still increasing, just a FACT, simple, and that's what I stated. Take it easy.

In case you haven't noticed, this isn't SingingPig. Perhaps people would be more receptive your your ramping there.

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