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Is The Uk Turning Into One Huge Open Prison?

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we have brown bins in Bristol for food waste, it's not difficult to do.

this is what annoys me so much about all the whinging over fortnightly waste collection.

-If people acted as responsible citizens by recycling properly then we won't have over flowing bins which attract vermin!

i recycle everything and i really don't understand why so many people don't make this very small effort to reduce waste.

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Guest Bart of Darkness
Such a scheme could pave the way for 'pay-as-you-throw' rubbish taxes, in which people are charged according to the amount of waste they put out.

Cue massive increases in fly-tipping?

this is what annoys me so much about all the whinging over fortnightly waste collection

I think what people object to (in part at least) is that they are paying more for a less frequent service (council tax certainly went up above inflation again where I am).

Years ago (pre-wheelie bins), the binmen used to come along ahead of the lorry and move everyone's bins to the edge of the road. The lorry would come along and the binmen riding on that would empty the bins. Then other binmin would follow after and return the bins to the houses they came from. A three stage operation taking place once a week.

Today, not only does the public have to do stages 1 and 3 themselves, but collections are being reduced to fortnightly frequency in some areas. For this they pay more each year as council taxes continue to increase above the rate of "inflation".

Even todays compliant, sheep-like public can see through this particular scam.

End of rant. :)

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we have brown bins in Bristol for food waste, it's not difficult to do.

this is what annoys me so much about all the whinging over fortnightly waste collection.

-If people acted as responsible citizens by recycling properly then we won't have over flowing bins which attract vermin!

i recycle everything and i really don't understand why so many people don't make this very small effort to reduce waste.

What attracts vermin? Food stuffs like meat and bones.

I'm all for recycling but the first step is reducing waste - that means consumers and companies.

I take cardboard to the collection point and they collect some other stuff. We are supposed to be getting green bins for garden waste - which I currently compost - although the hedge clippings take up masses of room so the green bins will be helpful.

I don't see why they don't make normal domestic bins smaller and keep to weekly schedules.

I have however picked two bags of rubbish off the field behind my house because the kids have been partying away - would I be charged for putting this rubbish in my bin?

Someone elsewhere has said about the german method working well.

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I can tell you that in warm weather keeping a slop bucket of food waste in your house is going to create a right stink. My kitchen bin smells after just one day with chicken skin in it. Cannot begin to think what it will be like after a week so what people will do is put them outside the house because of the smell. Then the problems really begin!

The smell of food waste attracts rats. Now, the powers that be say that as long as the bin is sealed then the rats will not get at the food. How wrong they are. If, as is proposed, relatively small plastic buckets with lids are provided with relativley thin walls (i.e not like massive wheelie bins) what will happen is the rats will eat straight through the sides of the buckest and or foxes will come and knock them over. Either way the rats will get at the food.

I have been up close and personal with farm rats and believe me they are massively strong and they can eat through concrete and even steel if they have to.

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Guest Skint Academic

The idea that people are complaining about fortnightly collections because they are also paying more council tax doesn't really wash. To be honest, it's a real London attitude. The attitude is that if you afford something then you deserve it. For example, having a chelsea tractor that pollutes the air we all breathe, carries a higher risk to others on the road and pavement and ruins the tarmac is OK because the driver paid more for it. The same attitude is being applied here. So we don't have enough space on this island for all the landfill sites that we need and we don't have the resources either, oh and also the landfill sites destroying the health and quality of life for those living near them, but it's OK as people in cities have paid more council tax and therefore deserve the right to be wasteful.

Sometimes government has to step in, take a bigger view of things and stop people from being greedy at the expense of others. The fact that they haven't with BTL'ers shows the kind of mess that can happen if they don't. So fortnightly collections are a way of enforcing people to be parsimonious with the finite natural resources and to not pollute the environment at the expense of us all. And it's not like they are asking the impossible either.

You can buy kitchen caddies with charcoal filters that stop any form of smell. I keep kitchen waste in my one for weeks at a time and have no problem. In fact it's the main kitchen bin that smells if anything from dirty wrappers that cannot be recycled. I compost everything. Sometimes I have composted meat even though the advice is not to. I have never had a problem with rats as I store them in compost bins that rats cannot get into (rather than ones open to the ground where rats can dig into). I don't even have a problem with flies as I collect carnivorous plants. So more flies means more plants! :)

We take the tiny extra bit of attention to just make sure we rinse packaging and throw into the right bin as we're cooking and we never get to fill up either of our bins before being collected. And compare Britain's recycling habits with the majority of the European countries and you'll discover that actually, we should be ashamed of ourselves.

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The idea that people are complaining about fortnightly collections because they are also paying more council tax doesn't really wash. To be honest, it's a real London attitude. The attitude is that if you afford something then you deserve it. For example, having a chelsea tractor that pollutes the air we all breathe, carries a higher risk to others on the road and pavement and ruins the tarmac is OK because the driver paid more for it. The same attitude is being applied here. So we don't have enough space on this island for all the landfill sites that we need and we don't have the resources either, oh and also the landfill sites destroying the health and quality of life for those living near them, but it's OK as people in cities have paid more council tax and therefore deserve the right to be wasteful.

Sometimes government has to step in, take a bigger view of things and stop people from being greedy at the expense of others. The fact that they haven't with BTL'ers shows the kind of mess that can happen if they don't. So fortnightly collections are a way of enforcing people to be parsimonious with the finite natural resources and to not pollute the environment at the expense of us all. And it's not like they are asking the impossible either.

You can buy kitchen caddies with charcoal filters that stop any form of smell. I keep kitchen waste in my one for weeks at a time and have no problem. In fact it's the main kitchen bin that smells if anything from dirty wrappers that cannot be recycled. I compost everything. Sometimes I have composted meat even though the advice is not to. I have never had a problem with rats as I store them in compost bins that rats cannot get into (rather than ones open to the ground where rats can dig into). I don't even have a problem with flies as I collect carnivorous plants. So more flies means more plants! :)

We take the tiny extra bit of attention to just make sure we rinse packaging and throw into the right bin as we're cooking and we never get to fill up either of our bins before being collected. And compare Britain's recycling habits with the majority of the European countries and you'll discover that actually, we should be ashamed of ourselves.

I think that's the most thoughtful comment I've ever read on the subject.

sc

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So we don't have enough space on this island for all the landfill sites that we need

Look out the window next time you fly over Britain and then tell us we don't have space for a few holes to dump things in.

The councils who _WE_ pay are supposed to use our money to do what _WE_ want, not spend their lives coming up with ******** social engineering schemes to force on us. It's no wonder people are pissed off at getting less and less back in return for their ever-increasing taxes; this was, I believe, one of the reasons why so many Labour councillors were kicked out at the last election.

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Why not pay as you throw?

I buy so few processed, packaged products that I'm doubtless way below the waste average. If there was a choice for a discount for fewer collections I'd probably go for a monthly service.

Edited by CrashedOutAndBurned

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Our council does everything by the fortnight, we have a 'garden cuttings waste food bin' and a normal bin and a green box for newspapers and bottles, they started out with a timetable however within a month or two everything went out of whack and sometimes they will collect one bin 2 weeks running and sometimes not at all, eventualy we havent a clue as to what bin to put out on the street, and if you dont put it out on the street they wont take it of course. Last summer they stuffed up and we got out of sync to the point that the waste food/garden bin was not emptied for 6 weeks and the place stuck like a sewer, this convinced us to leave all the bins out on the pavement perminently, however that is also a crime. What pi**es me off is not that fact that they do apparent recycling but that they demand that your efforts and attention should be spent serving their petty and stupid systems, all these things should be easy and automatic for the punters, not a quagmire of buggering about in order to please some petty w*nker getting paid to jerk off.

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I saw a documentary once (OK it wasn't in the UK, but it was one of those other European countries that is so much better at recycling) where they followed the lorries that collected the plastics from the recycling bins and took them .. to the incinerator. It was all a big con, I think the way it worked was that the manufacturer had paid towards the disposal, but disposal did not necessarily mean recycling.

Possibly some of it does get recycled but a lot of it must be about councils charging more for fewer services.

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Our new council are outstanding.

We have two wheelie bins, a compost bin, and a big box. One wheelie bin is for recyclables, excluding glass, the glass goes in the box. The other wheelie bin is for whatever is left over, except for compostibles.

We bought our own smell proof kitchen caddy for the compostibles to cut down the frequency of the stroll down the garden to the compost bin.

The bins are emptied weekly, with the regular bin being emptied one week, and the recyclables the next.

Having been here for a couple of months now, we're loving it. We landfill a fraction of what we used to and the best part is composting the organics. Having worked in waste water treatment, I was always melancholic about how wasteful it was to just throw away organic matter. Many sewage works generate electricity from the natural methane produced by anaerobic digestion, on an industrial scale.

At least this way we'll be able to grow stuff from it. We're planning to start growing our own veg, once we've properly settled in.

My only lament now is that I'm aware that the compost bin is generating methane that is all going to waste.

(Browsing the net, I saw a scheme in rural Cambodia where a simple digester, made from a plain length of polypro pipe, turned a family's domestic and pig waste into all of their requried cooking and heating gas. Search for 'biogas'.)

So long as the food bin is physically up to the job, this municipal digestion idea is first class.

The "leading the way to pay to throw" scare tactic by the news paper is nonsense, and has nothing to do with the argument about a digestion scheme. As has been rightly remarked, any pay to throw scheme is a licence to fly tip. All rubbish collection has to be funded from taxation for it to work. Basic human nature says that if given an individual choice, many will simply dump their waste, rather than pay someone to take it.

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If you fail to tax your car the goverment warns you that it will crush it up but what about the goverment waste and dam right corruption ! Can we crush their legs ? can we do anything at all.

some democracy you have.

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Guest Skint Academic
Look out the window next time you fly over Britain and then tell us we don't have space for a few holes to dump things in.

What, you mean all those green fields that farmers use to FARM and to provide us with food? That green belt that stops urban sprawl and which provides a sanctuary for anyone that needs to escape from the city to relieve stress?

I remember sitting on a plane as we were coming in to land and overhearing someone looking out the window at all the farmed land and just saw it as wasted space and wondering why we couldn't build houses on them. Utterly clueless.

The fact is that we are living outside of our means and dumping rubbish at an incredible rate. Dumping our rubbish in the ground, or in the sea, is unsustainable. We can either start recycling now or we can start recycling after we have ruined the whole country and we no longer have anywhere to dump our rubbish. And don't forget, a landfill site smells awful for miles around. Someone has to live in the vicinity. So it's not just about the few hundred square metres that the landfill site actually occupies. It ruins the surrounding area.

Personally I'd like to see wind turbines and landfill sites built in the city. Keep the consequences local to the culprits.

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The whole idea of recycling and having separate bins is fine. In Germany, where we have friends, it works really well. They have had 'bio' waste bins for years.

BUT in my area we have several bin types. Brown bins for garden rubbish. Green bins for glass (with red bags for plastics), blue bins for newspapers. And big ugly gery bins for everything else. I live in a block of flats. All my bins except my main wheelie bin have 'disappeared' within days of them arriving. Other people regularly dump rubbish in my bin, so even though we usually only have about 1/2 a bin full every week often I have to force the lid down so that it will be collected. All ideas of 'fining' people make no sense to me when the surrounding community use and abuse my bins and I can't do anything about it!

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The whole idea of recycling and having separate bins is fine. In Germany, where we have friends, it works really well. They have had 'bio' waste bins for years.

BUT in my area we have several bin types. Brown bins for garden rubbish. Green bins for glass (with red bags for plastics), blue bins for newspapers. And big ugly gery bins for everything else. I live in a block of flats. All my bins except my main wheelie bin have 'disappeared' within days of them arriving. Other people regularly dump rubbish in my bin, so even though we usually only have about 1/2 a bin full every week often I have to force the lid down so that it will be collected. All ideas of 'fining' people make no sense to me when the surrounding community use and abuse my bins and I can't do anything about it!

Same here. I do recycle and compost and so on but the council charge for large wheelie bins so most people just have a small plastic box that was handed out for free. Then what happens is they come along at night and just dump their surplus in my bin. I have never had it stolen though because I painted my address on the side in white gloss paint. Stops cars running into it as well because the council cannot be bothered to mend the street lights.

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What, you mean all those green fields that farmers use to FARM and to provide us with food? That green belt that stops urban sprawl and which provides a sanctuary for anyone that needs to escape from the city to relieve stress?

I remember sitting on a plane as we were coming in to land and overhearing someone looking out the window at all the farmed land and just saw it as wasted space and wondering why we couldn't build houses on them. Utterly clueless.

The fact is that we are living outside of our means and dumping rubbish at an incredible rate. Dumping our rubbish in the ground, or in the sea, is unsustainable. We can either start recycling now or we can start recycling after we have ruined the whole country and we no longer have anywhere to dump our rubbish. And don't forget, a landfill site smells awful for miles around. Someone has to live in the vicinity. So it's not just about the few hundred square metres that the landfill site actually occupies. It ruins the surrounding area.

Personally I'd like to see wind turbines and landfill sites built in the city. Keep the consequences local to the culprits.

Why do we not look at the causes of waste. Is not one of these excess packaging? Why are we treating the symptoms and not the cause of the problem?

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Why do we not look at the causes of waste. Is not one of these excess packaging? Why are we treating the symptoms and not the cause of the problem?

Exactly, its always the joe public that get lumped with the responsibility and guilt for causing landfill and waste, and to an extent thats true, but wtf do carrots and veg have to be sold at tescos etc wraped in solid plastic containers ffs? Oh that's right, it forces people to buy a certain minimum amount (often more than you need, so yet more waste!) How can we be conscientious about reducing waste if we don't take supermarkets and workplaces to task (I've personally NEVER worked in an office that has ANY recycling in place at all!)

That being said, why does EVERYTHING in this country have to be punitive? If you do/don't do this or that you'll be fined for anything and everything. Has community dissolved that badly that fines are the only thing we respond to now? In other countries i've lived in everyone recycles as a matter of course. We do it because its part of our social responsibility and want for lack of waste. I think it falls down in this country because noone believes that anything is actually recycled. My council has been caught out time and time again sending recycling to Chinese Landfill sites rather than recycling. Why don't THEY get fined for a change? :angry:

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rinse packaging and throw

And here in lies the problem. how much additional water and detergent will be used by people aiming to ensure their bins don't stink?

There've been water shortages in the UK but that's ok if you need to wash stuff before you throw it away.

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The row of terraces I live on have brown bins... these bins are labelled as "not for food waste" and are for garden waste only. We all have small back yards.

We have green (recyclables) and black bins as well, the green ones collected every 2 weeks, black every week. I'd much prefer to have the green one collected every week and sack the black one off to two.

You can recycle a fairly high percentage of household waste.

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Why do we not look at the causes of waste. Is not one of these excess packaging? Why are we treating the symptoms and not the cause of the problem?

Its not really waste, Its growth. Waste and recycling just more ways to keep the wheel turning. Excess packaging, consumer tat, chinese widgets recycling trucks, unecessary journeys to bottle banks, in our fcuked up economic system it is all GROWTH. Build more houses, make more shite, throw away more, breed more people, buy more tat recycle more, on and on and on. Where does it end? For the love of god I hope it comes to an end soon. IMO there is very little difference betweeen the crap thats in the package and the package itself. ( Infact in someof my purchasing the boxes and polystyrene(insulation) have proven to be more useful for longer than the original contents).

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Guest Skint Academic
All my bins except my main wheelie bin have 'disappeared' within days of them arriving. Other people regularly dump rubbish in my bin, so even though we usually only have about 1/2 a bin full every week often I have to force the lid down so that it will be collected. All ideas of 'fining' people make no sense to me when the surrounding community use and abuse my bins and I can't do anything about it!

Personally I'd paint your flat number on the bin in large letters so you can find it and nick it back again. And maybe even consider drilling a hole in it and padlocking the lid shut.

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The idea that people are complaining about fortnightly collections because they are also paying more council tax doesn't really wash. To be honest, it's a real London attitude. The attitude is that if you afford something then you deserve it. For example, having a chelsea tractor that pollutes the air we all breathe, carries a higher risk to others on the road and pavement and ruins the tarmac is OK because the driver paid more for it. The same attitude is being applied here. So we don't have enough space on this island for all the landfill sites that we need and we don't have the resources either, oh and also the landfill sites destroying the health and quality of life for those living near them, but it's OK as people in cities have paid more council tax and therefore deserve the right to be wasteful.

Sometimes government has to step in, take a bigger view of things and stop people from being greedy at the expense of others. The fact that they haven't with BTL'ers shows the kind of mess that can happen if they don't. So fortnightly collections are a way of enforcing people to be parsimonious with the finite natural resources and to not pollute the environment at the expense of us all. And it's not like they are asking the impossible either.

You can buy kitchen caddies with charcoal filters that stop any form of smell. I keep kitchen waste in my one for weeks at a time and have no problem. In fact it's the main kitchen bin that smells if anything from dirty wrappers that cannot be recycled. I compost everything. Sometimes I have composted meat even though the advice is not to. I have never had a problem with rats as I store them in compost bins that rats cannot get into (rather than ones open to the ground where rats can dig into). I don't even have a problem with flies as I collect carnivorous plants. So more flies means more plants! :)

We take the tiny extra bit of attention to just make sure we rinse packaging and throw into the right bin as we're cooking and we never get to fill up either of our bins before being collected. And compare Britain's recycling habits with the majority of the European countries and you'll discover that actually, we should be ashamed of ourselves.

Spot on. Well said!

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Exactly, its always the joe public that get lumped with the responsibility and guilt for causing landfill and waste, and to an extent thats true, but wtf do carrots and veg have to be sold at tescos etc wraped in solid plastic containers ffs? Oh that's right, it forces people to buy a certain minimum amount (often more than you need, so yet more waste!) How can we be conscientious about reducing waste if we don't take supermarkets and workplaces to task (I've personally NEVER worked in an office that has ANY recycling in place at all!)

That being said, why does EVERYTHING in this country have to be punitive? If you do/don't do this or that you'll be fined for anything and everything. Has community dissolved that badly that fines are the only thing we respond to now? In other countries i've lived in everyone recycles as a matter of course. We do it because its part of our social responsibility and want for lack of waste. I think it falls down in this country because noone believes that anything is actually recycled. My council has been caught out time and time again sending recycling to Chinese Landfill sites rather than recycling. Why don't THEY get fined for a change? :angry:

was discussing this with friends the other day, as i love straberries but they only ever come in plastic boxes :( i think the supermarkets should a) have a scheme for re-using plastic boxes and/or b ) stop putting vegetables in plastic boxes

Edited by Rachel

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