Haggle On The Rent

[robbbo]

I'm thinking of selling my house and renting a Manchester city centre flat. When you get the price, does that include the service charge? Who is typically responsible for the service charge? Does this include council tax, or is that another added extra?

Been out of the renting game for 10 years, so not up to speed

[chas]

I'm thinking of selling my house and renting a Manchester city centre flat. When you get the price, does that include the service charge? Who is typically responsible for the service charge? Does this include council tax, or is that another added extra?

Been out of the renting game for 10 years, so not up to speed

Your rent should include any service charges, but exclude water gas council tax.

Worth reading the agreement though!

[DoctorJ]

I've been renting my current flat for 650pcm since November and now the tenancy is up for renewal. I was expecting to go on a month by month rolling contract but the LL (through an agent) wants me to renew for 6 months or 12 months. (£45 fee for renewal )

Mrs J wants to go for 12 months as she likes it here and its cheap for what we have (in our area). So I was wondering about what you guys thought my stance was on asking for a rent reduction for a 12 month contract seeing as we have already been paying 650 for 6 months.

650 is cheap for the area but other flats on this development have recently started dropping to 625pcm. Is it worth trying to negotiate the rent down?

ps the more I think about it, its a no brainer. There are currently 6 flats for rents on this development alone and have been sitting empty for over a month......but I'd still like to share your views. cheers

Edited April 23, 2008 by DoctorJ

[shippers]

I've been renting my current flat for 650pcm since November and now the tenancy is up for renewal. I was expecting to go on a month by month rolling contract but the LL (through an agent) wants me to renew for 6 months or 12 months. (£45 fee for renewal )

Mrs J wants to go for 12 months as she likes it here and its cheap for what we have (in our area). So I was wondering about what you guys thought my stance was on asking for a rent reduction for a 12 month contract seeing as we have already been paying 650 for 6 months.

650 is cheap for the area but other flats on this development have recently started dropping to 625pcm. Is it worth trying to negotiate the rent down?

ps the more I think about it, its a no brainer. There are currently 6 flats for rents on this development alone and have been sitting empty for over a month......but I'd still like to share your views. cheers

10 percent off at least, for providing your landlord security of income in uncertain financial times.

I renewed 6 months end of March £525 2 bed slave box. Looking for a 12 month contract in a house with a garden so I can get a cat around October, will be looking for same price or less. When I first started renting here, rent was £575, but they reduced prices. Most 2-3 bed terraces where £750 (Chester & Wirral), now they're heading towards £600 - £650, very few letting out. We're signing a 2 year contract with our main client in the next few days, so it makes it worthwhile to get somewhere more pleasant for a bit.

I expect by the turn of the year home owners under financial stress will start taking in lodgers, which will depress the rental market, and a lot of our migrant workforce will be heading home after the harvest.

[DoctorJ]

cheers Shippers

and Subby

Edited April 24, 2008 by DoctorJ

[subby]

I've been renting my current flat for 650pcm since November and now the tenancy is up for renewal. I was expecting to go on a month by month rolling contract but the LL (through an agent) wants me to renew for 6 months or 12 months. (£45 fee for renewal )

Mrs J wants to go for 12 months as she likes it here and its cheap for what we have (in our area). So I was wondering about what you guys thought my stance was on asking for a rent reduction for a 12 month contract seeing as we have already been paying 650 for 6 months.

650 is cheap for the area but other flats on this development have recently started dropping to 625pcm. Is it worth trying to negotiate the rent down?

ps the more I think about it, its a no brainer. There are currently 6 flats for rents on this development alone and have been sitting empty for over a month......but I'd still like to share your views. cheers

If you provide evidence of rents for the other flats being less then they should offer you it, if not tell them you'll be moving next door and paying 625 a month so it's in their/and LL's best interests to let you stay for 625 as well. maybe go direct to landlord and run that past him/her??

[Modern Day Activist]

If you provide evidence of rents for the other flats being less then they should offer you it, if not tell them you'll be moving next door and paying 625 a month so it's in their/and LL's best interests to let you stay for 625 as well. maybe go direct to landlord and run that past him/her??

I took a print screen of two rightmove flats near me to a viewing yesturday, one was £395 for the same size as the one we viewed. I offered £365 for a £425 flat. The Ea was not happy and said she can't possible get the price down, the viewing was over in seconds.

She just called me two min ago.....and offered £375, I refused and thanked her but I couldn't possibly go higher.

Actually, she doesn't know I was just viewing to view...I have no intention of moving to another box. This make me evil, yeah I know.

This is getting good. But, she didn't seem completely shocked when I offered £365 - now I know it was too high. Damn!!!

[subby]

I took a print screen of two rightmove flats near me to a viewing yesturday, one was £395 for the same size as the one we viewed. I offered £365 for a £425 flat. The Ea was not happy and said she can't possible get the price down, the viewing was over in seconds.

She just called me two min ago.....and offered £375, I refused and thanked her but I couldn't possibly go higher.

Actually, she doesn't know I was just viewing to view...I have no intention of moving to another box. This make me evil, yeah I know.

This is getting good. But, she didn't seem completely shocked when I offered £365 - now I know it was too high. Damn!!!

ha ha

class....evil too

Love it

[paulskin]

can i haggle with estate/letting agents???? viewing my first property tonight, £475,should i offer less?

[manchesterwill]

Is it fair to say i'll be able to get £50 per month off the asking price of most flats?

[kat and andy]

hi all, i am new here, and did use introductions earlier, and sorry if this is the wrong place, but was just wondering, where you are on about haggling on rent is this for private only or oculd it be done with the council? also quick question for my sister in law, could she have a word with the estate agents about a lower rent due to fact that there are problems with the house.

right back to my reason for asking, we are paying rent for a 2 bedroomed first floor flat, with garden, the problem, our garden is half the size of the neighbours downstairs, and i cant exactly use the garden for much any way would like to be able to put the dogs in the garden on nice days so i stopped falling over them lol. and believe it or not ,my garden is not really big enough for 2 dogs, the reason for this is because (being in the heart of wales and no mains gas supply) we have a huge 1000 litre oil tank almost middle of the garden, they refused to put it where i wanted it and put it in a very awkward place and due to health and saftey i cant grow anything round it any way (apparently plants are a fire hazard)

would i be able to ask for a slightly lower rent even if its £20 a month because the way i see it its not a garden its a oil storage and i dont htink the council would agree to move the tank to a more convenient place. are there any suggestions that any one could give that would either get the oil tank moved so that i may have a chance at using the garden or rent lowered because i cant use it the way it us now.

sorry again if this is the wrong place wasnt sure as it was on the same lines if i should start a new thread or not.

and could i be cheeky and ask for pms on this as i dont know my way around the forum properly yet.

thanx all

kat and andy

[renterbob]

can i haggle with estate/letting agents???? viewing my first property tonight, £475,should i offer less?

what happened?

[BarryM]

There's other things apart from just the rent that interest landlords. Length of guaranteed minimum term and how soon you are prepared to move will influence a landlord's decison (usually).

Not all lets are agreed at asking in Central London, but that doesn't mean that it won't be let above asking either if several people want it. If you see something you like my advice is be quick on your feet (after a thorough inspection of the property) to make an offer. If you like it bear in mind so may others.

Most tenants have a pretty thorough grounding on what's available in a particular area that will suit them. If you're seeing alot of choice of course don't be afraid to go in a little low and be prepared to revise your offer upwards if that's what it takes to secure it and you feel it reflects fair value.

On the other hand if you are struggling to find anything that suits your requirements within a budget that works for you I'd recommend going in decisively at asking - any delay on negotiation and you risk losing out to another tenant or ending up in a bidding war.

As for market comment - cheaper one and two bed flats to rent in prime areas are very scarce right now, but there's more mid market property from 500 pw and up. Surprisingly the market at 2000+ pw is very strong too.

[BarryM]

^ One other thing that influences landlords: You

- What do you do for a living? How long have you been employed there? Can you offer a guarantor? Have you rented before (ideally through a reputable agency that can supply a reference). Can you offer a guarantor (in some circumstances)? Can you pay the rent, say quarterly, rather than monthly?

Make sure the landlord is aware of all the the positives about you as tenants to help his/her decision. It's remarkable how some lettings agents fail to obtain or pass on full details on their applicants.

[shindigger]

^ One other thing that influences landlords: You

- What do you do for a living? How long have you been employed there? Can you offer a guarantor? Have you rented before (ideally through a reputable agency that can supply a reference). Can you offer a guarantor (in some circumstances)? Can you pay the rent, say quarterly, rather than monthly?

Make sure the landlord is aware of all the the positives about you as tenants to help his/her decision. It's remarkable how some lettings agents fail to obtain or pass on full details on their applicants.

To be honest Baz, i'd be more inclined to worry about the LL these days.

Can we interview them and take credit references? Are they likely to be repo'd etc.

Cuts both ways now. Ive seen plenty of ads for flats asking for 6 months up front. No freakin way.

[Chrysalis]

I would say people employed are more risky than unemployed but we do live in a prejudiced society . The only problem with unemployed is the wait for housing benefit (LHA) to start, once its started its generally more secure than most jobs are now days. People reliant on benefits also learn how to budget as they have to so they can survive.

A previous neighbour of mine on 70k a year left on christmas day last year after leaving behind 7 months rent unpaid and owing powergen over a £1000.

[BarryM]

To be honest Baz, i'd be more inclined to worry about the LL these days.

Can we interview them and take credit references? Are they likely to be repo'd etc.

Cuts both ways now. Ive seen plenty of ads for flats asking for 6 months up front. No freakin way.

Good point.

Fortunately I'm personally not yet aware of a problem situation where the property was repossesed where substantial rental monies had been paid in advance. Time will tell if this becomes an issue in Central London. Certainly quarterly payments do help tenants haggle on rents. I agree with you, however I do would point out that the actual rent pw is only one component of what constitutes an acceptable offer to professional landlords. Tenants can do alot to help themselves if they make sure LLs are fully aware of their "good points"

As lettings agents we soon get to know who most of the regularly errant LLs are and there's no point in dealing with people that are likley to have a troublesome and short term tenancy - especially when lettings agents rely on renewal fees and rent collect fees rather than charging a "one off" fee as is currently being proposed by some.

I'd certainly be in favour of having deferred repossession where a tenant can show that he's acted in good faith in paying rents in advance. Particularly in the case of students (often from overseas) who very often do pay have to pay substantial sums up front to secure property to let. This is a market issue in many ways - if LLs were desperate to find a tenant then they'd be more inclined to accept monthly payments from tenants (ie students without evidence of income from employment) they perceive to be a higher risk. The evidence right now in London (Kensington/Chelsea et al) is the reverse. Students starting this acedemic year are finding it really tough to find any affordable studios/one beds under 300 pw or cheaper sharers flats (circa 150 - 200/bedroom).

[old sage]

Good point.

Fortunately I'm personally not yet aware of a problem situation where the property was repossesed where substantial rental monies had been paid in advance. Time will tell if this becomes an issue in Central London. Certainly quarterly payments do help tenants haggle on rents. I agree with you, however I do would point out that the actual rent pw is only one component of what constitutes an acceptable offer to professional landlords. Tenants can do alot to help themselves if they make sure LLs are fully aware of their "good points"

As lettings agents we soon get to know who most of the regularly errant LLs are and there's no point in dealing with people that are likley to have a troublesome and short term tenancy - especially when lettings agents rely on renewal fees and rent collect fees rather than charging a "one off" fee as is currently being proposed by some.

I'd certainly be in favour of having deferred repossession where a tenant can show that he's acted in good faith in paying rents in advance. Particularly in the case of students (often from overseas) who very often do pay have to pay substantial sums up front to secure property to let. This is a market issue in many ways - if LLs were desperate to find a tenant then they'd be more inclined to accept monthly payments from tenants (ie students without evidence of income from employment) they perceive to be a higher risk. The evidence right now in London (Kensington/Chelsea et al) is the reverse. Students starting this acedemic year are finding it really tough to find any affordable studios/one beds under 300 pw or cheaper sharers flats (circa 150 - 200/bedroom).

[Sof]

If there's just two people in a 4-bed house would that be attractive to a LL and help them consider a reduction?

Also, can signing a 12 month tenancy agreement rather than a 6 month really help?

I'm wanting to go in with a really cheeky offer (around 30% off) and want to make sure I use all the ammunition I can for justifying it.

[Matt Henson]

If there's just two people in a 4-bed house would that be attractive to a LL and help them consider a reduction?

Also, can signing a 12 month tenancy agreement rather than a 6 month really help?

I'm wanting to go in with a really cheeky offer (around 30% off) and want to make sure I use all the ammunition I can for justifying it.

Doubt it will make the slighest difference if you are 2 people or 4 people, 4 in a house tend to be families which are often considered to be more reliable, a 12 month tenancy is attractive but the LL pays twice the finders fee to the LA upfront so not as great a bonus as you would think. A six month that switchs to a long term SPT is much more attractive as the LL can increase the rent more easily.

A 30% reduction would depend on the market rate and time the house has been on the market, do some research first to justify your request, either way it does not stop you from bartering to an agreed price, it depends how much you want it

[BarryM]

In some cases properties in the areas we cover as lettings agents will be let at a discount on asking - and others at a premium.

I've posted a snapshot of asking prices vs acheived for September move-ins agreed to date for our South Kensington & Chelsea lettings office.

It's difficult to spot a trend as we often don't set asking prices - we can only advise on them! What is clear is that family flats at around 800 - 1500 per week are still being let but at less money than landlords would like to see, and generally around 10% less than a year ago. Alot of the better spec'd, smaller flats are in demand and this is reflected in above asking prices on some.

[BarryM]

London Lettings Prices:

Asking Prices Vs Acheived Prices - Notting Hill & Kensington Lettings - link here

[West Hampstead]

I have never paid the rent they have asked for. If it is £650 I always offer £550 if its £800 i offered £700 and more recently it was on for £1500 and i got it for the £1300 I offered. Nowadays depending on where you live it really is a tenants market. What I do is watch the websites every two days. If you notice a property that has been on there for over 4 weeks then strike. Usually they will prefer to rent rather than risk waiting further months and lose the rent. So in other words you either take my £600 now and lose £100 a month or you decline and your property could take a further 2 months to rent and you lose £1200+£100 council tax...your call

I have renogotiated with current tenants and landlords when their circumstances have changed, they have already proved themselves as good tenants/landlords, and when to replace them/or move after a year would cost money. A proven good tenant is worth a renegotiation.

[Chrysalis]

It seems on more expensive properties haggling is easy but at the bottom of the market landlords are unwilling to lower the rent.

[matchmade]

I would say people employed are more risky than unemployed but we do live in a prejudiced society . The only problem with unemployed is the wait for housing benefit (LHA) to start, once its started its generally more secure than most jobs are now days. People reliant on benefits also learn how to budget as they have to so they can survive.

A previous neighbour of mine on 70k a year left on christmas day last year after leaving behind 7 months rent unpaid and owing powergen over a £1000.

The worst tenant from a landlord's perspective is a self-employed person, because you cannot trust their statements of income (equivalent of liar loans, but tenants do it to landlords too). I once let to one of them - never again without six months up front. This one made exagerrated claims about his income, backed up by an accountant with the last accounts posted 2 years ago, and then failed to pay rent, or delayed it, for months and months, always promsiing funds were "in the mail". Some tenants are just evil and completely cavalier, but of course you never hear about them - it's always the landlord who is blamed, sometimes simply it seems for existing.